Why is it so common for pwBPD to alienate extended family?

[DaddyBear77]

A very difficult and on-going situation with my pwBPD is the fact that she opposes ANY contact I have with my family of origin.

I have a reasonably sized extended family - both my parents are alive, I have two younger brothers each with a wife, and one niece. I have several aunts and uncles, and many cousins. I wouldn't say I had a CLOSE relationship with any one except my parents and brothers, but in the past I've at least had a casual relationship, visited on certain holidays, etc.

In previous threads I've posted on this subject, the suggestion was made that I simply state, mater of factly, that I WILL be having a relationship with these people. I use SET or other tools to manage the blow back, and just proceed. I have no doubt that this is probably the only path that will allow me to have the relationships with them and not compromise what's important to me.

But my question is - why is this such a HUGE thing for a pwBPD to keep their SO isolated like this?

BTW, I'm posting this on Conflicted because I"m really not sure I can stand to live in a situation where my SO / pwBPD wants me to stay in isolation, regardless of whether I have the tools to deal with it. I respect and will support anyone's choice to "stick it out" but for me, I have to honestly say, I am truly Conflicted.

[Notwendy]

Posting where you feel is fine.

I think the reasons for the different categories is that people who wish to stay and work on the relationship need that kind of support, while others need support for their decisions.

Posting "run" "leave" or "stay at all costs and try harder" are not helpful as a big part of dealing with this situation is for the individual person to make up their own minds. Telling someone what to do can take away from this. Each decision has its own challenges and it is the person who is making it who will be dealing with it, not anyone else.

Every situation is different. BPD is on a spectrum and so are many of the issues their partners may deal with. The tools we have are the ones we have. We can each make our own decisions with the situations we have.

So why is it a big deal? IMHO a pwBPD is in victim mode a lot of the time. Close relationships with others may feel threatening- trigger abandonment. But one aspect of them is when the pwBPD feels others may be "on" to them. The pwBPD seems to have a social mask. Their issues are more evident with the people most intimate with them. In some cases close family and friends may see some of the issues and this can feel threatening.

I also think they may feel that "love" is limited and see someone their SO loves as taking something away from them. Or with black and white thinking, if their loved one loves them, they can't love someone else. To me, the marital/intimate relationship is a special kind of exclusive. But someone can be married and also love their parents, children, relatives and friends in a different way at the same time. However, if there is black and white thinking, maybe this affects the ability to realize this.

Regardless of their view of this, if you wish to have a relationship with others that you care about, then you can not share this view. We can't change anyone else's feelings or way of seeing this, but we have to be secure in our boundaries and let the other person deal with their discomfort.

[Lucky Jim]

Hey DB77, I can appreciate your quandary because I was once extremely isolated from family and friends, which put me in a precarious emotional state.  I think it's crucial to keep in contact with those close to you, because otherwise you can lose all perspective, which is what happened to me.  To put your emotional well-being in the hands of a pwBPD is fraught with peril because a pwBPD has an inconsistent sense of self and is constantly shifting his/her allegiances, which leads to frequent conflicts with the outside world.  For this reason, it's important for you to take control of who you interact with, particularly family and friends.

As notwendy suggests, there are a number of reasons why a pwBPD seeks to isolate the Non: fear of abandonment; fear that there is not enough love to go around; fear that others will see behind the mask; fear that marriage is an all-or-nothing proposition in their black and white thinking, etc.  To me, the reasons are less important than the decision to keep in touch with family and friends.  It requires firmness and a willingness to say ":)amn the torpedoes!"

LuckyJim

[byfaith]

But one aspect of them is when the pwBPD feels others may be "on" to them. The pwBPD seems to have a social mask. Their issues are more evident with the people most intimate with them. In some cases close family and friends may see some of the issues and this can feel threatening.

that sounds pretty much right. I never really posted here over the almost 4 years I have been on these boards about how my wife alienated my extended family my mom, my daughters, my ex wife (not that I wanted a close relation but it was difficult to communicate with her. My wife even made issues with my ex wife husbands. people in my family thought she was nuts.)

My mom , per my request, read an anonymous letter that was sent to her by my wife about 3 1/2 years ago. My wife admitted it to me eventually. It was horrible. She told my mom if there was a hell that she was going there, amongst other things. I was so friggin' brainwashed I covered it up. My wife harassed my daughters via text and email. My mom told me that my wife would text her in the middle of the night wanting to do battle.

I think some of it could be jealousy? OR when someone would say something back it would be perceived as a hurt and my wife would lash out even more.

They have to control their own little world

[Notwendy]

There is some jealousy but I think to a real phenomenon.

I have mentioned similar dynamics in my marriage, but in comparison to my BPD mom, it is not as difficult an issue as what I observed in my parents' marriage. My H had no issue with my relationship to family members, but even talking on the phone to a female friend caused issues. He didn't like it. We don't socialize as a couple and eventually I became socially isolated. It is hard to socialize as a "single" female with married friends- even if I am married too. But my H wouldn't go with me or come up with some reason for why I shouldn't go.

On the other hand, he has no trouble pursuing his interests and hobbies and leaving me alone with the kids all day. He also would refuse to watch them if I wanted to do something.

It got lonely. It was a MC who suggested I start going to 12 step co-dependency groups. My H didn't like it but the T suggested it.

I can relate some of his fears. One is that I will "meet someone" I like better than him. (so that is abandonment).  FWIW I have not ever cheated or given him reason to think I was.

Eventually I had the courage to attend a get together with some old friends. Some of them were guys- who I think of as brothers and some of them were female friends. Even though we got together as families, with spouses and kids, my H got very agitated and angry afterwards. Clearly there was not anything romantic going on but something was going on and he was rightfully jealous of it.

I was not walking on eggshells with these friends. I was relaxed. I was laughing and telling jokes. I wasn't  flirting but I was clearly happy to see old friends that I haven't seen in years.

But over time, I was  WOE, subdued, solemn, and guarded with my H. He notices. He wanted the "person" I was with my friends. But instead of making the connection that it was the issues between us that caused this, he thought I was being that way with him on purpose, as a sort of rejection and keeping that from him.

It was the worst with the guys, but he doesn't like it with women, or family members who I am relaxed with.

I think sometimes we are different with other people and this causes jealousy.

[Grey Kitty]

But my question is - why is this such a HUGE thing for a pwBPD to keep their SO isolated like this?

You cannot ask your wife "why" she does the abusive things she does to you, and get a valid and useful answer from her. Most likely, she doesn't even know why she's doing it.

There is a pattern of abusive behavior which beats you down and reforms you as somebody more dependent and compliant. If you look at what military basic training does, or what cults do to indoctrinate members, you will find that there is a similar pattern, and the isolation from outside influences is part of the way you are kept/made compliant, because outsiders will look at what you are going through and ask you "WTH? Why are you putting up with that?"

I don't think your wife read any manuals on how to brainwash people, nor do I think she set out to do it to you. But if you were to look it up, you would see that her pattern of actions match disturbingly well.

I'm going to guess that her motivation is her own fear of abandonment, or jealousy, similar to Notwendy's husband.

What is more important than "why" is that giving in to it brings bad results.

[Lucky Jim]

I don't think your wife read any manuals on how to brainwash people, nor do I think she set out to do it to you. But if you were to look it up, you would see that her pattern of actions match disturbingly well.

Agree, GK.  Isolation is a classic way to break someone down, which is why it's so important to maintain lines of communication with family & friends.  Hey, I was brainwashed by my BPDxW for a while there, and it's not fun, believe me.  Those w/BPD may not be trained at brainwashing, but they are quite skilled at manipulation because they've been doing it all their lives.  My BPDxW's methods (verbal and physical abuse, sleep deprivation, isolation, trapping me in a room) worked on me, sad to say, and I became compliant -- a shadow of my former self -- like a zombie.  Fortunately I had some kind friends and a family member who helped me to snap out of it, which was like getting someone out of a cult, as you describe.  I get anxious just writing about that dark time in my life.

LuckyJim