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Author Topic: Help to set boundary about staying out all night  (Read 625 times)
Yepanotherone
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« on: May 19, 2017, 11:22:46 PM »

Hi all , so the most recent behavior that is driving me insane is my BPDDD17 staying out into the early hours or staying out all night , with little to no communication about her intent to do so. I'm losing night over nights of sleep as I lie awake worrying about what she's doing , who she's with and if she's safe .
I'm positively reinforcing when she does  come home for curfew, saying " thankyou for coming home on time because I worry and im unable to sleep until you are home safe and sound ", but other nights she doesn't give a toss eg last night she went to work , is normally home by 11 but simply didn't come home! I didn't hear from her until 3:30am where I got a simple " I'm safe " message . I messaged  her back saying that I was still awake because I was worrying about her, that I feel hurt and disappointed that she keeps pushing this boundary as it means we take three steps backwards again in learning to trust her , that staying out all night is not okay , and this needs to change . Her response was " well you need to change " and "wow why are you freaking out , chill the f***k out ! I'm literally snug and safe , just leave me alone ! And stop texting my friends asking where I am, that's really annoying me now !"
I had  confiscated her beloved iPhone and she lost car driving privilege some months ago so I've nothing to really " take " from her ( and I know " punishment " doesn't work with BPD anyway ).
I didn't go off on one today when she eventually came home because I want to think about my next step.

How do I word this boundary to get her to come home by curfew and what consequence can I put in place if she doesn't that might be effective ?
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Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders
Lollypop
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« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2017, 02:30:30 AM »

Hi Yep

Just in case you thought you were being ignored - you're not!  I read your post and thought ooh that's a toughie and I need to think about that one. I've been away and got caught up (sadly) in the latest drama.

I'd like to give a magic pill for this one but I haven't got it. It's just very very hard in those late teenager years. They push, it's normal for kids to do that at that age but BPD thrown in makes it a bit of a nightmare doesn't it. You must be very worried and it's understandable that you're losing sleep.

Boundaries are your own personal boundaries (you will not hit me) - they are your own core values and morals and your boundaries must be 6ft thick concrete and always with a consequence.  Limits are household stuff, they are flexible and make life more bearable when abided by for everyone.

I'm throwing out a suggestion here. It's the inconsistency of your daughter's behaviour that curious to me and of course this could just be the BPD. I wonder if the times she doesn't call is because she's doing Something that you just wouldn't agree with. She finds it emotionally easier to not call or text you and also she already knows you'll not allow her to do what she wants to do.

I know you want her home after work.  She chooses to go out.  She also sometimes chooses not to tell you. Is it ok that she goes out late after work? Is the real problem that she must text you?  I can't answer these difficult questions as we are all different.

This is about you decided what you want to happen first before deciding on a simple plan (so she understands). I know you know that already!

I encourage you to think about what sort of limit would work for you first of all. I insisted on a text, when my DS didn't text then I called him - every time. It wasn't ideal, he resented it, I was emotional - this was before his mental health issues were evident.

I hope other parents with teenage girls have got some suggestions. Meantime I'll think some more.

How far away from home does she work?
How often is this happening?
Is she seeing the bf?

LP
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Gorges
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« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2017, 06:35:17 AM »

Hello,
First of all, I am impressed that she is working and holding down a job.  Also, I feel for your.  My daughter would "sneak out" thank goodness because I went to bed thinking she was home and in her own bed.  She displayed the type of behavior you are talking about after she turned 18 for about a month or so before she left for college and it was upsetting because we felt responsible for her and we didn't know where she was.

I would say that consequences (iPhone and car) lose their effectiveness with any child if they are taken away forever.  For safety reasons sometimes we need to do this.  My daughter still does not have a driver's license because of her drug use.  We would say "3 months" without any evidence of drug use for her to use our car.

I think after our daughter turned 18 we decided on no curfew but that she just needed to let us know that she was safe.  I also think that maybe (believe it or not I can't remember) her phone got turned off to the outside world if she did not communicate this to us... .

Anyway, is there some kind of privilege you could tie to curfew? I wouldn't necessarily concentrate on "fixing" this problem because if your kid is stubborn enough it won't get fixed and they will spite your effort to control. I guess I would just focus on using consequences to express your own boundaries.   Right now it might change her but the message gets sent about where you stand and this might help in situations when she is older.

Also, what are her plans for next year? Once my daughter left our house and went to college and then dropped out and lived on her own, I was able to sleep more consistently and did not worry as much about her.  If gave me a space to take care of myself.

Ironically, as I write this she spent the night in our house last night! We had a birthday dinner for her (19 years) and she went to take a nap after dinner and then didn't want to get up and asked if she could just spend the night.  She has had a rough year because we let her go and figure it out.  She has initiated therapy on her own.  She said the therapist recommended that she go live with her grandparents in a different town so that she can leave our town where she has made so many mistakes, "burned so many bridges" as my daughter says.   My husband and I think it is strange, and my daughter noticed as well too, that she might be running away from her problems.  On the other hand, I think it might be a good idea if she goes at least this summer to try it out. 

I think that I mentioned in some post somewhere that as soon as I catch myself wanting to influence her, I need to stop myself.  You are at the worst time of it,  Yep.  She is under 18 and you are still responsible for her.  I understand that you can't give up.  I have just found that once my daughter left our house, we found that the problems weren't just with me or other family members.  Once my daughter saw that she was having problems with multiple people outside our home (college, jobs) she began to own her problem.  I don't think she has found a solution and I am not sure she ever will.  I am learning to accept this.  Both of us are trying to break the habit of having our conversations always turn to her problems and me trying to fix them.

Some things that she has said lately and realized:
Drugs (marijuana) make things worse and she says she has given this up.
Social media makes things worse and she does not have certain accounts anymore
She has burned bridges
She needs to be the one to change

Some things that I realize:
I am not a perfect parent but I am not longer beating myself up for my mistakes. 
I deserve to be happy and free from figuring out her problems

She still says stupid things, like last night she kept talking about "living in the moment" and "live like its your last day" to my son who was talking about studying for his final exams... .Again, I am not sure she will ever change but I am trying to change.
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Yepanotherone
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« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2017, 11:50:53 PM »

Hello ladies and thankyou for your replies . My apologies for my late response , it's been quite the week so far ! Urgh !
Anyway , after Sunday's events , the staying out late seems so mediocre ! My DD decided to try a " benzo trippie "by overdosing on 15 Benadryl and ended up having a seizure while in a restaurant with her friend so a trip to ER via paramedics etc was quite the ticket . The staff in there are getting to know us all by our first names these days  Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post)
So anyway , this week has involved dealing with the side effects after her massive pschedelic trip that her body reacted to very strongly and did not go down as the fun afternoon she had planned !  She's felt pretty rough all week ! The therapist told her that with all her overdoses in the last 18 months , she may have damaged her liver and it sounds like her body is no longer metabolizing drugs well at all , I'm hoping this might have given her a scare . She's also got a UTI now so she's worried that she might well have done some damage to her kidneys ( I didn't mention it might be sexually transmitted ) . Fingers crossed the bottle has dropped that actually she might well end up doing major damage to her organs of she carries on like this .
Anyways I digress . LP to answer your questions , I do believe you might be onto something in regards she won't text me when she's doing something she'll know I won't like . She normally comes straight home after work , finishes at 10:30pm and I normally pick her up but sometimes she'll get a lift home from a workmate who lives close to us . She knows full well she's expected to come straight home .
We spoke about this curfew and staying out all night with the family therapist earlier this week , so with another pending party this weekend , we agreed she will text me every couple of hours and curfew is 1am . We'll see if she sticks to this or not . Regarding the ex  boyfriend, he's no longer in the picture , still waiting on his court case to come up . I want the protection/ restraining order to be made permanent . Here's hoping . I think she still misses him/ being in a relationship and he hurt her terribly with the cruel Nasty vicious things he said , so I think her emotional pain is also causing her to be on the constant search for a replacement , looking to feel attractive and desirable by another guy ( anyone will do !) hence the promiscuity right now and acting out behaviors . 
Gorges , I agree the phone and car removal no longer seems to have much effect . She's not bothered about not having her car right now because I tend to taxi her around anyway ( I know I know ! I shouldn't ! But if I don't , she'll simply not make any attempt to go to her therapy meetings , probation meetings, school or work !) and her best friend has recently obtained a car so she's not missing the car so much now . At least I have some peace of mind though that she's not wrapping a car around a street lamp or getting into car accidents as a driver !
Regarding her plans for next year , right now we are dragging her through her online classes to finish high school , it'll be a miracle if she graduates. I can't see college being a part of her future now to be honest unless there's some dramatic improvements . She's just not academically motivated in any way now . She used to be and its so sad to see such a smart cookie let her academics go down the plug hole  she says she's like to get into college for marketing but just doesn't do the work and shows little enthusiasm for anything right now except hanging out with friends .  We too have considered sending her to live with family back in Scotland but in all honesty she's such a handful , I couldn't ask anyone to take on this responsibility and also I'd worry that she would  see this as an act of rejection and just "sending her away "
She's holding down her job Gorges and has done for the last 20 months but in truth it's only because they are very lenient with her ( and possibly worried about employment disability discrimination law ?) she's been hospitalized 7 times now and each time I call a manager to let them know she'll be off work until further notice and each manager is always very nice and worried for her . She is actually quite likeable at work I think . It's just when she's at home , she's an absolute horror .
I spoke with her therapist a couple of times last week and this week and while my DD has definitely made some progress with her self harm and cutting ( and up until Sunday , seemed to have the substance abuse under control too ), and I told the therapist that my most pressing concerns right now is her promiscuity , staying out past curfew /out all night , and her sleeping pattern is all out of whack again , sleeping through the day and up milling around all night . Interestingly the therapist said that for the first time since working with my DD , she's seeing some mania symptoms creeping in and she's a bit worried about this , particularly given my DD remains absolutely Adament she will not try any medications at all now . Therapist is seeing her twice weekly starting this week , just because of recent events and increased risky behaviors. It looks like bipolar 2 is still well up there in her list of diagnosis right now , I was beginning to rule that one out but nope ! It's still there !  .
My DD has refused to return to the DBT therapist I found for her , stating "!i don't like her , she makes me feel uncomfortable ", so that was a bit of a blow . The therapist my DD does agree to see though is skilled in DBT even though her speciality is substance abuse , and my DD really likes her and has formed a good bond , so I'm just having to go along with this plan so far . The therapist says she has been using DBT elements for years so while not certified and while not the ideal I was hoping for , it's all my DD is prepared to do right now so I'll just have to accept it !
Just as an aside , my DD said something that surprised me today . She is normally loud and proud with her self harm scars ( and believe me , she's like a zebra !) but we were taking about visiting family at home and how she misses her two young cousins who she adores . She asked me what she should say when her cousins see her scars and asks " what are they ?"  . I didn't wire know how to answer and we have some time to figure out an appropriate response as we won't be visiting home until next year . She then said " well I'll probably have covered up the worst of them with tattoos by then so I might now need to explain myself ". So she DOES worry about them and how they look . Contrary to her arrogant haughty " I don't care what people think of them " attitude . Kind of humanised her for me again even if only for a little while .
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Yepanotherone
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Posts: 282


« Reply #4 on: May 26, 2017, 12:14:57 AM »

Ps I'm really impressed gorges with your DD's recent realizations ! Wow ! She seems to be headed in the right direction  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)
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Lollypop
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« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2017, 03:25:00 AM »

Hi Yep

I'm really sorry to learn of the latest incident with your daughter. It's heart rendering and you're doing an amazing job keeping your cool and on plan.

Those side balls come in quick and hard. They need us to not fall apart and goodness knows how but we find the strength.

So, your daughter is engaged in therapy and really likes the therapist. This is good and I just want to say I dream of this!  Your daughter is making decisions herself and expressing her wishes. This is taking responsibility and shows she's at least thinking about her well-being. It's also good news she's cutting less.

Inching forwards, one step at a time. Accepting that there's some backward steps sometimes but onwards you go.

I'm wondering how you're managing Yep, hope you're taking care of yourself.

LP
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     I did my best. He told me I wasn’t good enough. White
Gorges
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« Reply #6 on: May 29, 2017, 08:43:39 AM »

Sorry about all that you are going through. I do sense from your posts that you are strong and coping.  I am taking a break from this board for awhile because I have a busy month at work.  I will be back at the end of June barring any crises that I need support for, but I think we are headed in a good direction.  My daughter took a driver's exam and failed so will continue to practice this summer while my husband drivers her to a community college. She just found a job too.  She wants to be estranged a bit from me and blames me for her problems.  I am giving her space to do this.   My response will continue to be that I am sorry for my role in her problems and tumultuous childhood, I wish I had been a calmer, better parent.  How can I help now?
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