Part 2: Order of Protection. No Contact, No 500 feet of my child, her, work, YMCA and I was removed

[Lost in Desert]

Ok it has been awhile, but this week we had court and well, so came a few shockers.

First of all, I completed a Drug and Alcohol Evaluation, as you have read, I had admitted to smoking pot in May, but none since.  So I completed the process and the clinic gave me a letter, which was presented in court that outlines I do not have an issue with marijuana nor do they deem me needing further assistance.  What is funny, my soon to be ex-wife insists that she be a collateral.  I declined, this woman has known me for less than 5 years and so far from my perspective, she has lied and embellished to better her stance vs me.  She is claiming I smoke pot morning, afternoon and night.  What is hilarious, I work in an office setting, so I have three ladies who all sit with me, near me and all would happily state the opposite!  It is just crazy.  My collaterals have known me a combined 58 years and I am only 44 years old.

So during court, my lawyer presented all sides this Document, her side went silent!  Until the judge asked my wife's lawyer for a statement.  All she could muster up and say, was the document did not disclose much just that I was a nice guy.  When it clearly states I do not have an issue with that substance.  I choose my child over anything this life can offer!  What is odd, I last smoked on a Friday night either May 19th or May 12 and as of August 4th, I was still testing positive.  Now, I am about 55lbs overweight in large part the marriage.  But how in the world is it still in my system is baffling!  But the blessing is my score in June and in August have shown decreasing levels.  But like the Clinician said, he has not seen this in 25 years.  But he sparked a fear in me, I need to see a doctor there could be underlining issues with my body.  Now I advised him, I have never been this overweight.  So that is a factor.

Also, what is noted, her side is seeking me to pay her lawyer fee, maintenance and her claim is during our marriage our arrangement was she would be a stay at home mom.  She went so far to call herself a homemaker; mind you, rarely cooked dinner, rarely cleaned the apartment, we had not slept together in nearly 2 years being married about 4.  Just sad!  Yet she carries her bible with her as if she is some TRUTH bearing soul at all times.   

She even tried to state I need to pay for Pre-School, the judge caught this, stated that he is only 2 1/2 years old, what Pre-School.  She attempted to say YMCA and the judge squashed that, saying he would not call the YMCA a Pre School to her side.  She also went for Sole Custody, Final Say in everything.  Just listening to her side, it was sad!  My mind is telling me one thing, the heart the other.  This is one major obstacle to overcome when involved with a BPD spouse.  Logic must overcome the feelings, emotions tied to the BPD Spouse.  She is of course now angry with me, our first exchange I could tell she is mad.  Her whole case vs me revolved around Marijuana.  Which is a joke.  I do not even drink, so what if I smoked a little herb from time to time to help myself relax and sleep, when her and my son was well asleep and I did it outside.

Any how, our case of course was adjourned, her side wants more clarity from the evaluation. 

This divorce should be easy and fast, instead my ex wife is trying to drag this out.  I could not help but think she basks in this light, she feels like it helps make her important and maybe she can win over the likes of the judge, etc. 

[Skip]

What was the hearing about? What decision was made?

Minor point: Marijuana will test positive for up to twelve weeks for a frequent user. Judge knows this. Attorneys, too.

[Lost in Desert]

Skip it was our first instance in Supreme Court in front of an actual judge.  We were finally able to see her side, with her paperwork and exactly what she was going for. 

1: Sole Custody
2: Primary Residence
3: Maintenance
4: Pay her lawyer fee
5: Final say in all matters with our son
6: That I am a raging pot head, morning, day and night.

So the judge was presented our paperwork from the Counselor, it was given to my wife's side.  he basically extended the Order of Protection while the case is unfolding.  My wifes side wants more clarity from the evaluation, which my lawyer and I are left wondering, since the letter was pretty clear.  We squashed my wives entire line of attack.  Mind you, she is playing off that she is this wonderful person, she was a homemaker, etc.  We are licking at our chops for our time to have the light finally shown on her character.

The Child Lawyer called and we had a nearly 2 hour conversation, interview.  One thing that really stuck out, is my wife wants me to pick up our son on Saturday Mornings at 7am, instead of 830am.  She is playing the card, ":)on't you want that extra hour with your son"!  I explained to the lawyer, this woman is using my son as a weapon to cause me harm.  I explained how I have spoken with her and advised does it not make more sense for me to get him Friday night, so he can wake up with me two mornings instead of just one?  Then you can have all the time you need to get ready for work both Saturday and Sunday.  The lawyer asked me why do you think she is not granting that?  I explained the whole BPD thing going on.  The lawyer agreed, she thinks it would make more sense for him to be with me Friday night.  At the end, she confirmed what I been saying all along.  I told her, I have not changed my story, I been honest from the get go.  I also added, if I for one second thought my wife was abusive to my son, do you think I would ever change my mind and say yeah she is good to go!  She has changed her stance more than once.  NOT IN A MILLION YEARS would I.  So why did she?  Why did she say in court that I am a good father.  I explained to the child's lawyer, this woman, my ex wife is using this whole platform to showcase she is a good person, she is a good mom, a good wife, etc.  The lawyer agreed, she said speaking with you, I can get the sense you are a good father, that you want an active role in your son's life.  My job it to recommend what I feel is best for your child.  She ended it by saying she does feel it makes more sense, easier on the boy for him to come with me after work on Fridays.

The Court in all honesty is a drag, I feel like it is all tied together to help generate as much income as possible.  In our example, our case should be handled rather quickly. 

My lawyer is attempted to locate her first husband, for he did opposite of me.  He instead of coming home, started going out to the bars and did not come home in a time manner.  She went after him claiming he was a Coke Head.  She also went after him in manners I do not need to repeat.  We also want to discuss in court her habit of getting orders of protection.  We want to raise the issue of why she is not close to her own mother, father, etc.  My wife is angry at me now.  I believe also, my lawyer mentioned in court, that she has to get a full time job.

[formflier]

It's natural to want to "get" her or "shine the light" on extreme BPDish behavior in court.  I've certainly felt that way before.

I think it is likely to be more productive to try to "assist" the court in making a good decision for the child.

So... .there is an allegation of drug use and some supporting test results.

Perhaps you can ask your lawyer if you "lean into" the problem and volunteer for drug monitoring (weekly... .bi-weekly)... would that help.

Perhaps have your lawyer put in for parenting or "custody" evaluations.

Perhaps have your lawyer ask for court ordered counseling for the child and perhaps court ordered joint parenting counseling for you and your stbex.

Courts like counseling and therapy.

Courts like records and openness.  Courts like people that are pushing for better welfare for the child, vice appearing to want to "win in court"  over their spouse. 

Over time, pwBPD will have issues with compliance and nons generally won't.

FF

[Skip]

I agree.

Focus on "this is why I'm a good parent". Show that your are "reasonable and more concerned about establishing respect and calm for the child than winning a "who sucks more" contest with your wife", and admit the drug use (rather than lay it off to body fat, or exercise, or eating the wrong food - no one is buying that) and prove that it is not abuse or addiction by submitting for regular testing and testing negative time after time. You are coming up on twelve weeks so you should go negative, soon.

[formflier]

Hey... .about the "arguments" about why drugs are still in your system.  If you are going to go down that road... .you need to, through your L, retain medical professionals to sort that kind of thing out.

There are... .from time to time, really weird circumstances, which can be scientifically proven (vice guessed at) as to why the levels stay high in YOUR body.

And... .there very well may be a good reason... .  I AM going to agree with Skip that this line of argument go either one of two ways.

1.  I've used more than I said... .and now that I'm on weekly monitoring, counseling... etc etc etc... .I'm going to stay away

or

2.  Prove out what is actually going on in your body.

I suppose if your never again test positive... .and that holds true over time... .that it could be an acceptable 3rd option, with regular testing.

Be wary of going down this line and make sure it is through your lawyer... .so it remains privileged.  Otherwise, you could embarrass yourself or worse.

I'll attempt to lighten the mood and share some personal experience.  I'm retired Navy and was in charge of the "pee program" for a long time in my commands.  We had a rigorous testing regime.

ONLY ONCE, did we find a valid reason for a positive... .in my 20 years.  A sailor forgot to put down he recently started ADHD medication... .and it triggered a positive.

OK... .truth is stranger than fiction... .

The most interesting claim... .that I thought was actually going to work, was from a female Sailor.  She swore (and seemed believable) that she NEVER smoked or used the drug (I wish I could remember the drug for sure). 

Anyway... through internet research she figured out that this drug was present in measurable quantities in semen.  Yeah... .I said it... .spooge. 

Her claim was that her civilian boyfriend was an exceptionally heavy user... .and she like to give head and... .     you can't make this up... .swallow.

Bless her heart... .     Yeah... .I called all my fellow Naval Aviators with a "you're not going to believe it but... ." story.

Then... I got back to the serious business of actually adjudicating the claim.  Navy Commanding Officers are part of the legal process in the Navy and have to sit as "judges" for certain levels of things.

So... .I needed an expert and the Navy has those kinds of things.  PhD level scientists.  They said her argument had merit (and yes... .I never looked at her the same way again... .sorry... .I'm not THAT professional... .), yet... .the scientists wanted to actually do the science on this.

So... .they did some calculations and it turns out that yes... .a girl can get measurable levels of this in her system from spooge.  However, she couldn't get as much as she had in her system.

I kid you not, they figured out how much she would have had to swallow in order to get to the level she had in her system, then they consulted with medical doctors and figured out that no man produces that much... .you know... .fluid... .

Therefore, the vast majority of the drug in her system came from being a user and not from putting a smile on her boyfriends face.

Like I said... .you can't make this stuff up


FF

[ForeverDad]

Wow, I think that I swallowed tops everything I've ever heard.  The typical Believe It Or Not one is the mother who claims the husband is not the father of her child.  It's spiteful but then it also means that if her claim is true then she was unfaithful.  Ak.  Of course, today the labs can compare DNA and prove whether the husband was father or not.

The result from court is to give you more time to get your lab results closer to normal.  That's good.  What is your parenting schedule like?  Is it relatively close to what a typical father is assigned?  Hopefully the court will see you're not a danger to your child and will have issued a relatively normal schedule even if not as much as you want.

[Lost in Desert]

My current schedule is the following:

Wednesday Dinner 5 to 7, but the wife tells me to bring him back at 745pm.

Saturday Morning 830am until Sunday 6pm. 

So she recently had the nerve to say this to me; ":)o you want to spend an extra hour with your son?  Then come pick him up at 7am on Saturday Morning"?  I declined, cause this benefits ONLY her, she needs two hours to get ready for work.  I advised he wakes up at 630am, goes to bed at 8pm, why not just agree to drop him off at my office at 5pm on Friday's so him and I can have two morning together in which we wake up together?  Her claim is she wants him to sleep in his own bed.  Well, I mentioned he will have two homes in the near future.  The Child Lawyer agreed with me, this offer makes no sense and she asked why would my wife say that?  Weapon, my kid is a weapon in her life and she knows it is one way to cause me harm.

There are not arguments why herb was found in my system, I said and admitted and have stuck to my story I smoked herb to help relax with a friend in Mid May.  Now my own personal concern is that it is still in my system, hence why I need to get a physical and make sure there are no underlying issues with my body.  I do notice my vision sometimes is blurry, dizzy spells, but I associate them with fatigue or aging.  But the counselor said I should have a physical.

My focus has and always will be the same.  I have no other desire but to be a great father and be heavily involved in my sons life.  Hence I will never accept my wifes wishes.  For example, final say in everything with him.  I have filed a Hippa Release, requesting info on him; progress reports and to make sure he is up to date with his vaccinations.

My lawyer said it best, there is not a lot to fight about here.  So her side must come to grips.  Her free ride is over.  She wants to be like her mother, is acting out just like her mother and hopes to win this case or I quit like what happened to her own parents.  Her father quit in the divorce and it happens to be his biggest regret in his life, cause he now knows and understands the pain and suffering his daughter, my wife endured.

So as for further evaluations, nope, we are not seeking them.  I have spent nearly $1000 out of pocket and these drug counselors are not the best of people.  They are very rude to be truthful, but I also understand with the opiates, cocaine and alcohol problem in this country their hands are tied.  Most of the clinics where I am at, YOU CAN NOT GET an appointment for months! 

So our next court date is in 3 weeks, my evaluation they want further details, so not sure what more they want.  The Counselor stated no further action is needed.  My lawyer said that was their game plan to go after me and claim I am a raging pot head, which is a contradiction in itself.  My wife has shown her hand, and soon the light will be set on her.  Multiple orders of protection, previous marriage ended with her claims he was a drug user, alienation of me and my son, alienation of her own family, manipulation and of course, we will bring into court her very own family and ask the tough questions.  Why are you not close to your mother?  Why do you not let your son go to your own mother and step fathers home?  Why did you not speak with your fathers side of the family for over 10 years?  My lawyer is very aggressive, but we are waiting our turn as she puts it.

[Skip]

My lawyer is very aggressive, but we are waiting our turn as she puts it.

Just a word of caution - aggressive lawyers are often about fueling the anger and getting the fees up. Centering lawyers tend to be more about getting the job done and steering away from the emotional tension of family court.

I declined, cause this benefits ONLY her, she needs two hours to get ready for work.

It will really help to drop this thinking (about what benefits her). Its natural to want to win and be vindicated. Unfortunately the family court system doesn't do this and people who try often pay a lot of money for nothing. I've seen many folks her very sorry after all the dust settles.

I advised he wakes up at 630am, goes to bed at 8pm, why not just agree to drop him off at my office at 5pm on Friday's so him and I can have two morning together in which we wake up together?  Her claim is she wants him to sleep in his own bed.  Well, I mentioned he will have two homes in the near future.  The Child Lawyer agreed with me, this offer makes no sense and she asked why would my wife say that?  Weapon, my kid is a weapon in her life and she knows it is one way to cause me harm.

I really encourage you to let this go (the emotional battle). You will likely get Friday night in the end, anyway. Here's the deal, if the judge sees that the two of you can't compromise or work out little things for the benefit of the child, it will work against the person (s) doing it.

If you want Friday night, ask the judge to do it. Bring the child's attorney in to testify. Be all business.

[ForeverDad]

Judges or magistrates prefer to be referees rather than adjudicators.  Settlements can't be appealed, objected or contested.  Trials take so much of the court's time that they prefer having a series of pre-trial hearings and then continuing again and again a few weeks or months later.  It's almost like they're hoping the parents will have a moment of insight and decide to Let Go the emotions and abysmally slow court pace and "work it out".  Well, our type of cases with obstructive or controlling spouses doesn't fit that scenario.

This is not to say we don't reach settlements sometimes.  In my divorce I had spent nearly two years fulfilling every step required by the court.  The first step after getting the temp order was mediation.  In our xPD cases mediation usually fails because the ex is still too entitled.  My mediation (with mediator) failed spectacularly, as well as the ordered settlement conference (with lawyers).  But I arrived for the eventual trial and wow I was greeted with the news she was ready to settle.  I found out later that her lawyer told her she would lose in the trial.  When it came down to The Defining Moment, she blinked.

The others are right.  You need solid strategies.  Being "right" doesn't mean as much as you imagine in court.  If you're expecting a huge declaration how good you are and how bad she is, you'll probably be let down.  Based on what judges order it is evident court believes declaring "winner" versus "loser" doesn't help much to reduce the conflict.  A truism I sometimes quote is:  The person behaving poorly seldom gets much in the way of consequences and the person behaving well seldom gets much in the way of credit.

This is not to say court totally ignores valid reasons for change, however my conclusion is that court prefers to make changes as small as possible.  And so we kept ending up back in court when each minimal change didn't resolve things.  So do the best you can, don't expect vindication, seek improvements.  We've notice court generally gives less concern to adult behavior complaints but does pay more attention to valid parenting behavior issues including obstruction of parenting.

In a couple years your son will be heading to pre-school or kindergarten.  (Maybe you have daycare currently?)  Anyway, it won't be long and he'll be attending school of some sort.  It will make exchanges much simpler if you do weekend exchanges after school on Fridays and back at school on Mondays.  Try to get the weekend schedule now as close to that as possible, don't wait until school is looming, it can take up to a year or more to get schedule changes ordered.  My typical time in court to get significant changes was about 17 months.

[takingandsending]

So she recently had the nerve to say this to me; ":)o you want to spend an extra hour with your son?  Then come pick him up at 7am on Saturday Morning"?  I declined, cause this benefits ONLY her, she needs two hours to get ready for work. 

LiD,
Going to agree with Skip on this. You state that you are only interested in the welfare of your son. If BPDm is unstable presence in your son's life, then in his best interest, take any extra time that she offers you. It doesn't ONLY benefit her - it benefits your son, and probably you as well.

One very common experience on the boards here is that the BPD parent will, regardless of what the courts or parent plan state, often struggle with actually being responsible for the children during their custody time and will seek to off load that responsibility on to the nonBPD parent. Take it. Do it. Keep a record of that time like the extra 45 minutes for Wednesday dinner she requested to suit her life. Do all of that. And present that as precedent to the courts to establish that in fact, you are a reasonable parent, care about your son, and work toward solutions that benefit YOUR SON.

Or you can go the route you are going, contest, resist, seek vindication. More often than not, that approach often leads to higher conflict which can be a no win, harmful situation for your son. Put another way, if she is seeking to use your son as a weapon to harm you, will you resort to using your son as a weapon to harm her? Can that ever be the right answer?

Sorry to be blunt. I believe that you love your son. Try your best to keep him front and center in all of your communication, actions and thoughts.

[formflier]

Hey... .all of us here are on your side.  There is a lot of "fight" in you... .and that is a good thing.  Make no mistake about it, there is a big potential here for a big fight.

Frankly... .you need to get the "fight" in you under control and focus it.  Not every battle needs to be won... .or even fought. 

Literally... .I've turned tail and ran from military fights that I likely would have won. 

Fight smarter... .not harder.  Focus your energy on the center of gravity to this entire thing.  We don't know the center of gravity at the moment, but it is likely the mental and emotional stability of the mother.

Accusations aren't going to help this.  "Evaluations" and "shining the light" (over time) will show a better picture of the true character of both of you.  Having you "put yourself out there" to be evaluated and (potentially) having her "hiding" or "running" from them and the questions you raise about her... .will be very telling to the court.

Very very important that you react well to the light of day being shined on you.   She will react... .however she reacts. 

Back to my main point.  Need to get the "fight" in you under control

 I declined, cause this benefits ONLY her

Hey man... .I'm throwing the Dad flag on this (football analogy... just in case you are not sports fan). 

You were offered a couple extra hours with your kid and the "fight" in you "won out" over the "dad" in you.

Bad move dude... .

Take some time to reflect on this... .

Her claim is she wants him to sleep in his own bed.  Well, I mentioned he will have two homes in the near future.

Seems reasonable to me.  Kids like familiar things.  Different things can bring anxiety.  This was one morning... .one night.

"Fighting smart" could have been to accept and venture "perhaps we do it this way for a few weeks and then discuss how junior is doing with this arrangement"

Make it about "junior"... .not about the fight.

  The Child Lawyer agreed with me, this offer makes no sense and she asked why would my wife say that?  Weapon, my kid is a weapon in her life and she knows it is one way to cause me harm.

The Child is a weapon with two handles on it... .  I'm interested in making sure your hand is NOT on those handles.  That will be very difficult when she grabs the handle and uses the kid as weapon.  Document... .make sure "evaluators" know this... .

Make sure it is "over obvious" that you are putting the kids needs ahead of yours...

Let your lawyer make that point and argument for you... .

  Now my own personal concern is that it is still in my system

Many reasons this needs to be figured out.  It is a "known unknown"... .hopefully you can make this a "known known"

, hence why I need to get a physical and make sure there are no underlying issues with my body.  I do notice my vision sometimes is blurry, dizzy spells, but I associate them with fatigue or aging.  But the counselor said I should have a physical.

Yes... .physical and yes to working with a family therapist so you can "show to the court" that you are taking steps to be the best Dad possible.

  I have no other desire but to be a great father and be heavily involved in my sons life. 

Sorry dude... .Dad flag... .again.

If that is your only desire... .explain again YOUR decision to not spend time with your kid... .when offered... on a Saturday morning.

 Hence I will never accept my wifes wishes. 

Dad flag... .you can fill in the rest of my response...

For example, final say in everything with him.  I have filed a Hippa Release, requesting info on him; progress reports and to make sure he is up to date with his vaccinations.

Reasonable.  The "procedure" to handle scheduling medical appointments and medical decisions need to be crystal clear in your agreements.

 

So as for further evaluations, nope, we are not seeking them.

Big mistake... .big

  Why are you not close to your mother?  Why do you not let your son go to your own mother and step fathers home?  Why did you not speak with your fathers side of the family for over 10 years?  My lawyer is very aggressive, but we are waiting our turn as she puts it.

Very good questions to have answered by and evaluator and to be presented to the court.


Last thought:  Fortunately or unfortunately... .I've dealt with lots of lawyers.  The best ones are "grounded", but have lots of tools in their tool belt.  There are legal versions of "knives and shanks" that you definitely want to make sure your lawyer "can use", but more importantly that the lawyer has the wisdom of "when to" or "if" they will use.

Please don't "argue" with some of the posts that are on here.  My hope for you is time to reflect... to strategize... .

FF

[ForeverDad]

One very common experience on the boards here is that the BPD parent will, regardless of what the courts or parent plan state, often struggle with actually being responsible for the children during their custody time and will seek to off load that responsibility on to the nonBPD parent. Take it. Do it. Keep a record of that time like the extra 45 minutes for Wednesday dinner she requested to suit her life. Do all of that. And present that as precedent to the courts to establish that in fact, you are a reasonable parent, care about your son, and work toward solutions that benefit YOUR SON.

And taking the extra time she offered ought to demonstrate to the court that by doing that she can't also say you're a bad or abusive dad.

I can see your thought that if she's willing to give up most of the Saturday morning time then maybe you can get the whole overnight.  Or refuse to have a longer evening, for what purpose, to make it an overnight?  Maybe it will work but what if it doesn't?  What if the court or your son's lawyer doesn't favor your "more or none" approach?

Maybe you can state your position, I will take the additional hour you offered but I will still seek Friday overnight.  Could that work?

[Skip]

Drugs.

Please don't be offended by this. We are your support group and sometime support is a glass of cold water. 

Everytime you repeat to the judge, and the evaluaters that the drug tests are wrong, then are thinking, this guy is not honest or humble and he thinks we're dumb. Being honest and humble and respecting the court and its service is really important.

There is a saying used by attorneys - "bad facts". It means that things are present that look worse than they are in the eyes of the court.

In your case, the bad facts are multiple, high scores on a drug test over time. Everyone believes the tests. They have heard every excuse in the past cases they are involved in - and the drug test are virtually foolproof - especially on multiple tests over time.

Every time you say the test are wrong, what the judge and the agents of the court hear is that you are not in denial, not credible, telling the truth, ego issues, etc. And by extension, they will apply this to others things that you say. For example, they judge may think, well if this guy can't deal with a drug test and get caught red handed, what is he going to do if his daughter has difficult medical situation - maybe I should give mom sole custody.

You don't want this, right?

As you say, they are making a really big deal out of the drugs. You are saying, they are lying and you only smoked on May 15. The judge has to decide who is telling the truth. Look at the choice he has.

The same goes with fighting over child issues. Judges wants the parents to check the baggage at the door and pay attention to the kid. The more fighting there is, the more he is likely to award one side more control. The mother already has a higher standing in the courts eyes - so be careful how you respond to her about anything (and do it by email so you have a record).

Right now, it sounds like the case is the equivalent of "my husbands drives recklessly and I think he will hurt the child" and she has a stack of speeding tickets.  You defense seems to be "no, she is a nut job" and "the radar detectors were broken".

Certainly follow your lawyer - but I would think a position for this is "yes I smoked pot for relaxation, probably not the best decision I've made,  but I don't need it and I've given it up - feel free to test me".  And now you have the stack of papers that support this (the future tests, and the rehabs evaluation).

Flip it!
 

[Lost in Desert]

I know I am not perfect and I have made mistakes and I own up to them.  For example, I am not denying my test results, the results speak for themselves.  I tested positive in early June and still in early August, but the number or the NG count has decreased so there is no suspicion. 

Trust me, I am not offended, I come from a Euro family, so this is all uncharted travel for me. 

So I take it all in, I learn and I try to get better.  Looking at it from the perspective on here, I should have taken the child, but my lawyer is pushing for Friday's and says the EX will give us Fridays very, very soon.  I have not said they were lying, I basically said that is baffles me it is somehow still in my system.  I have already made that claim as well, my choice is my son, over anything in this life, including herb, family, ANYTHING.  I just want to have an active role in my sons life and not one of them twice a month dads!

Part of my fight is that I am so disappointed I fell into this trap, I should have seen it coming.  Her uncle who is a client of mine, shared recently she is doing exactly what her mother did 37 years ago to his brother, her father.  Sad. 

The thing that concerns me is her anger, she is some reason very angry right now. My lawyer tends to believe her whole argument vs me was based on marijuana and when we have a professional dismiss this, it really throws a wrench in their entire game plan.  My two lawyers have stated that I have done everything asked of me and I have done it well.  I have shown respect to the courts, I have taken the CO Parent class before it was issued, I have taken the seriousness of my failed drug test, I also have not violated my order, I have continued to pay all the bills on time, her child support on time, submitted all my financial papers, etc. 

One thing I have learned about BPD, they have usually suffered greatly as children, so they take it to almost and OCD level to provide care for the child.  So I am not saying she is an unfit mother, or bad, etc.  I just know, she needs HER TIME.   The Child Lawyer is going to make that recommendation I get my son Friday after work, she asked what I wanted, I said, Friday night to Monday Morning.  Then as he transitions into school we can work out a very smooth transition process with limited interactions and it allows my wife to head back to her main money making job; BARTENDING. 

My two lawyers, the one I have now is very well known, the judge I noticed even mentioned her by first name basis where he mentioned a more formal aspect with my wifes lawyer, I take notes and pay attention to the judge.  Like I mentioned, it was odd, after my lawyer stated her legal jargon and handed everyone a copy of my evaluation, there was an uneasy silence for well over 10 minutes before he asked for a statement.  Which he squashed parts of it and then granted more info about my evaluation. 

I am confident in myself handling this pressure.  It is not easy, but I am handling it, saving money, etc.  Preparing to get my own place shortly after.  I just wish I could speak with my wife and try to settle this between us.  Instead of trying to milk me and the system. 

Like my lawyer said, she believes my wife is getting horrible advice, for starters it is just marijuana and I have never lost a job, been arrested, etc. 

I appreciate all of you taking time and helping me, it means a lot, as I stated, I am not perfect and I see the error in my ways, so thank you.

[Skip]

Looking at it from the perspective on here, I should have taken the child, but my lawyer is pushing for Friday's and says the EX will give us Fridays very, very soon. 

I don't think anyone is second guessing your decision for Saturday morning. What was second guessed was the reason for the decision. In the greater scheme of things, this incident won't matter. The suggestion is to get you to adjust your miindset.

I have not said they were lying

I think you are missing the point here. This stuff is not intuitive. You case depends on you saying that they are lying that your are an intoxicated abusive father.

Someone has to be lying here.

The judge has to make that call.

Do you think when you say the drug test are high because of working out, body fat, etc., that you are helping or hurting your case/credibility?

[Lost in Desert]

Well the original order of protection stated that I was abusive towards my son, but the wife has admitted in court that I am a very good father.  The two child lawyers also stated the same and that based on what they have learned of my situation it likely is best for me to not be involved with this type of woman. 

The Child Lawyer I was interviewed with this week, she said each body metabolized differently and having extra weight and working out, the judge knows this does impact the levels in my body.  BUT as long as the levels show what has been shown in me, decreased greatly. 

My lawyer said so far during court, we have won our mini battles.  My wife is not looking good in certain elements, as if she is reaching.  The judge declined her notion that the Y represents a PRE School. 

We believe the judge and referees thus far have seen thru.  If I was such a bad person, or bad father, then why this and that.  Like I mentioned, if there was truth in abuse, never bend the knee.  I wouldn't! 

The Child guardian also said law is not fair, but it is just.  One thing that is clear, I have no contradicted myself, truth is always easier to notice. 

[livednlearned]

LiD,

Do you know if you will be testifying before the judge?

Or will your L be doing all the talking.

[Lost in Desert]

We go back early Sept, so my lawyer is hoping the case is settled by then, problem is I technically can not speak with my wife, only my kid.   But I have noticed her anger and she said she does not want to talk about it.

That means she knows her case is lost with my Evaluation proving I am not a drug abuser or need further action.  Or that my lawyer said to her, that she was not a homemaker and that it is time for her to either get two jobs or a full time job.

Again, as I told my lawyer, my story is the truth, I have no problems speaking, we have countless emails, stories, connections that will show a history from my wifes side that is unstable, previous arrests, previous orders used as a means of a tool, etc.  Manipulation, alienation, my lawyer said it best: I have never had a client in my 30 years as organized as you.  But I told her, I knew something was off, almost from the get go, thus why I saved my attempts to connect with my wife, via email, etc.   

My lawyer said her intention has been to get their side to have the judge focus on them, and she said he did just that.  he noticed she has reached for me to pay her legal fees, her gym membership, her maintenance, bills, etc...    Yet, her initial claim that I was abusive at this stage appears to be made up.  Also I have not violated my order and that I have done everything asked of me and then some.

[takingandsending]

Hey, LiD.

It sounds like you are doing the right things in court. I guess we all are just wanting you to have enough space/time to not react to your situation, but continue to calmly respond to it - easier said than done, particularly with the protective orders and your wife keeping you from seeing your son for a period of time.

I really do recommend always taking any extra time offered by your wife, unless it is not possible for you. In my own case, I have taken vacation days from work when I could not arrange child care on my wife's custody days that I assumed responsibility for, simply because: a) I want to spend time with my sons, and b) I want to demonstrate that I am a consistent reliable father in unassailable fashion. And when I have had to pay for child care on my wife's custody days where she has asked me to take the children, I never assert the costs to her. Why? Because those days are recorded on a calendar as my custody days, not hers. If I asked her to pay half the child care cost, do you think she would contest that I had custody on those days? Probably.  I want to establish the precedence that I am a competent, caring and flexible parent working toward solutions. And, this approach aligns with what is in the best interest of my sons.

I assure you, I would dearly love to point to my wife's parenting behaviors, her lack of availability for the children, her anger issues and her putting her own needs before theirs. But I don't. I just count on the fact that her habits of relying on me to take care of the children to relieve her of being around them too much will continue unabated, and I intend to record each and every incident so that I can let the calendar make the case without me having to use words that might appear as stirring up conflict. Case in point: xw has always hated the summer months because I work and there is no school, and she is "on" for the kids until I would get home from work. In this first summer of our separation, how many custody days do you think she requested that I take over from her? It's been around 15 - basically tilting our 39% / 61% arrangement to 56% / 44%. Can you see how this will be more compelling than anything that you can say in court?

[ForeverDad]

It took me a long time to get a grasp on the mindset of domestic or family court, the judges, magistrates, lawyers, children's lawyers (Guardian ad Litems), etc.  Some aspects that I considered so important, so obvious, were not issues to the court, sometimes even being studiously ignored.  Their perspective didn't mesh or match our understanding of common sense.

For that reason it is good to have an experienced lawyer.  However, even many of those are so used to having to lead their mystified clients by the hand through the maze of court logic and procedures.  So it is good you have lawyers who will explain to you what they're doing and why.  They'll still try to do everything by the book, usually that means the case takes far longer than you think necessary.  That's not such a bad thing.  From the court's perspective, it is overworked and would prefer to have the parents get fed up waiting on the court and set aside their differences to work out their own settlement.  But with BPD in the mix, that's not likely to happen.  So as time passes, generally the BPD makes missteps.  In my case, just a few months before our trial, my then-stbEx raged at the pediatrician's staff (because they let me make an appointment) and they "withdrew services".  That made her look very, very bad, I mean, how often does a pediatrician withdraw services to a child?  She did it to herself.  I couldn't predict what would happen but I knew that eventually she might do something that would impact how the court saw her.

One comment, I noticed you mentioned the job she does best is bartender.  Be careful not to give a critical impression to court about that.  She is an adult and can choose her own lifestyle and work environment.  Court will just be content that she works and it's not illegal.  If that's what she wants to do, so be it.  Remember, court won't pay much attention to her adult behaviors, it's parenting behaviors that count.  "Parenting behaviors" does include whether she trying to block or unreasonably obstruct your parenting.

However, even some things I was sure would vindicate me were essentially ignored.  I recall when a couple months after I filed for divorce I finally had the temp order hearing.  The magistrate confirmed from her that she had not allowed me any in-person contact with my son for 3 entire months.  Was he aghast, shocked or determined to teach her not to ever do it again?  No, all he said was a mild "I'll fix that."  He had previously issued a parenting schedule when we had TPOs against each other, it had since ended.  That was when she decided to keep 'possession' of our preschooler and so I had been forced to file for divorce.  The magistrate merely made a new temp order similar to the prior one, that was all he did.  I didn't get make up parenting time.  She wasn't even lectured.  I couldn't believe there were no consequences.  The court decided a new temp order was all the consequences needed.  I just had to accept that and move on to the next steps.

What I'm saying is that this isn't the first time the court has faced cases like yours.  They won't overreact and you shouldn't either.  Accept that they may never lecture her, or give you make up time with your children, or whatever.  That is a perspective hard to adjust to but it may be one you'll have to learn.

[Lost in Desert]

Thanks everyone.  So let me add some more fuel to all of this.

So yesterday, she decides to swing by my office to drop my son off, which is preferred since I have several people working with me in my office.

So as I am taking my son out of his car seat, she opens the door to discussion about the previous week Court Date.  She mentioned that she thought we had an agreement based on custody and that I changed my mind.  I corrected her and stated, my side, we waited to hear from you, we did not, once court came into play, your lawyer basically hit us with the following: I pay her legal fee, I pay her maintenance, We can alternate claiming the child with taxes, She has final say in the child. 

I showed her my lawyer document as well as her side.  She was NOT EVEN aware the lawyer made the offer about the tax credit.  I went further to explain her lawyer has a very bad reputation as well as being very disorganized.  She admitted that her lawyer is very disorganized.  Her lawyer is trying to earn the entire retainer, this is clear as day! 

So I basically put it out there, I want this over.  You and I can settle this now.  She feels my son has a routine, so it is best I take him Saturday until Sunday.  But I insisted it would benefit him better to wake with me two days a week, vs just one.  She is hesitant on this.  I went further to explain, I know your Saturday Mornings are difficult to tend to him as well to get ready for your job, so the benefit would be all parties, MAINLY our son who would have my attention completely.  I also stated I will never give her final say in all things.  That is not even on the table for discussion.  Her thought is that she is his mommy and someone should have final say, I countered and stated NO, we are both the parent, his life is decided with both of our input, not just yours.  I agree to let her get the tax credit as long as she invests some of it into a 529 for his future.  She is so MONEY hungry, once she learned this, it was SOLELY her focus that she would never agree to alternating his credit for taxes.  I explained since you are currently a 1099 employee, it may benefit us to allow me to claim him, and thus I may be able to get us back more for him.  But she is adamantly against this.

SO I left it alone, I advised her to contact her lawyer, get on the same page at this woman, cause she had nothing from her lawyer.  Now is this truthful, I am not 100% but I have a good sense it was cause she was caught off guard.  I also shared with her my Co-Parenting Book so she can read and understand how the divorce affects a toddler.  He does not cry when leaving her, but he cries when I drop him off with her, it breaks my heart.

So I am going to email my lawyer today, and state I am willing to accept Custody as the following: Saturday Thru Sunday for now, and that Wednesday Dinner visits with the idea our relationship will become more fluid with respect to our shared time with our child.  AS long as she removes her other BS aspects:  The Order of Protection, the Fact I pay her legal fee, maintenance and in return she can claim the child each and every year.

We shall see.

[formflier]

 
I would caution you against having these discussions without lawyers and WITH your son being present.

These are adult discussions.

Perhaps: "That's important to me as well.  Send me your thoughts via email, let's come together now and focus on our son" 

Then... stop discussing it.

Email will help you slow down and ignore sideshows (like lawyer being disorganized) and focus on what matters to YOU and YOUR CHILD.

for instance... let your wife select her lawyers... .you aren't involved at all... .

   

FF

[Lost in Desert]

Well it is over!  Nobody wins in divorce and honestly this is bittersweet for me, since I do care about this woman, but in the end, my sanity and health far outweigh the weight of this type of relationship!  She needs help, and sadly at age 38 she feels she does not.  She feels Jesus Christ all she needs, but I have argued till I was blue, he is a tool not a means of fixing.  Nobody with the abuse she endured can walk this earth and be ok.  She is very beautiful, so she will go back to what she does best: Manipulation.  Shockingly, this past Saturday when I went to pick up my son, she was driving a Cadillac.  Now, the guy she was renting a room from, when we met, owns a small dealership which he sells autos.  So she didn't take long to look him up again.  But she is no longer my deal.  I have to do what is best for my son.

So for those who are entering court, stay the course, fight thru the emotions, fight thru the anger, the angst, the unknown, there is hope.

She went for the following:

To pay her legal fees: Judge rejected it.
To pay maintenance: Judge rejected it.
Sole Custody: Judge rejected it.
Final decision making with our son: Judge rejected it.
Another drug evaluation with her as collateral: Judge rejected it.
Child Tax Credit just her: Judge rejected it, we alternate.
I do have to pay for half of my paycheck I cleared a few days after she filed the Order of Protection.

My lawyer went to her lawyer and advised, you do not want this to go to trial.  Your client has a history, you do not want to come out.  Her lawyer tried to say nothing wrong with my ex wife, but my lawyer interrupted her and advised, trust me, there is stuff that you are not aware of.

See my lawyer thinks my wife did more than just manipulate men.  She went so far to accuse her of horrible things, I told my lawyer, I hope and pray she did not do them things, but in all honesty I have no idea, plus I tend to try and think positive and healthy.  Plus I do not want to taint the mental image of this woman any more than I have.

I also have to be mindful, my ex went so far to lie, and get an order based on false info.  My lawyer said background checks were ran, also they checked the date bases for crimes and other orders of protection, all of this likely played in the judges ruling.

I will maintain the same schedule for our son, but once I have my own residence it will be up to us parents to handle visits, etc.

I feel a sense of relief, but it was not easy getting here.

[formflier]

I'm glad you seem satisfied with the outcome of this round of court proceedings.

What does your lawyer see as the next steps?  The schedule?

FF

[Lost in Desert]

Schedule is in place, with the hope mom and dad can sort it out ourselves.  Like I mentioned to her, if she is tired, not feeling well, in the near future he can stay over with me on Sunday nights and she can pick our son up at my office on Mondays.

Yeah, I feel it was a fair deal towards me, honestly, I feel it was much better than I had anticipated.  I am sure she is very angry.  But that is her way.

So today I am kind of nervous how she will be with the exchange of our son.

I have asked a few text messages about bills to be moved into her name and have not received a response.  I also could tell in court, she was upset with the outcome.  But had she simply sought counseling or went thru with the counseling she was involved in, our life would be shared.  But honestly, being married to someone like that, this BPD, it is a very draining and life altering experience.  Sad.

[formflier]

I was asking about next steps with L and schedule with court and L.

Such as, trial schedule in a month.

I don't believe what just happened was "final"... was it?

FF

[Lost in Desert]

There is no more court dates.  The Divorce documents are being drawn up by my lawyer, I will sign and things are final.  As for the schedule of the child, it will remain in place.  Mainly due the fact I have had to stay at my parents, I did not want to offset them too much, but in the near future, when I have my own place.  Likely I will get my son on Friday nights heading into Sunday Night, maybe Monday Mornings.  Time will tell.

But yes, it is final. 

[ForeverDad]

Be aware that she can make new allegations at any future time she gets triggered.  And the agencies will let her do it.  (I think it is a variation on the whistleblower principle, future allegations can't be blocked in case they might have a little truth in there somewhere.)

You may think this is Over.  Maybe it is, maybe it isn't.  Time will tell.  However, with her history of being litigious... .

Will you have to go back to court when you want the schedule modified for a schedule more favorable to you?  If I recall correctly you get every weekend now?  Be aware you may want the schedule tweaked when your child gets to school age.  Who decides where he attends school?  Will it be your school district, hers or not determined yet?

[Lost in Desert]

We make the decisions together; school, medical, main issues dealing with our son.  If we can not come to an agreement, then it is left up to an expert.  At this stage, no.  We should work out our own schedule when he starts school.  When he does, we may end up back in court if we can not come to a compromise!

Im not combative, so if her wealthy grandparents want to put him in a private school, fine by me.  But one thing I have fought is a 3 year old Pre School.  I rather he wait until 4 years old, let us the parents and family be involved in his daily life.  No reason to rush school.  He can accomplish the same fun activities at the YMCA as their class. 

I think she realizes, I am not a bad man, she did not win in court!  So why pursue, but I also know, I must be mindful of what she has done, what she tried and what she is capable of. 

I also pray, she can see some sense in all of this and eventually seek help.  As my lawyer pointed out to me, I have no idea how far in her past she took this manipulation of men.  I tend to stay positive, so not to think negative or dark.  I want to keep my opinion slightly positive, for the benefit she is our sons mom.

Part of me is sad, but I also have to guard my compassion.  It is what it is.  Now I must build my life again.