How do you handle rage incidents?

[ozmatoz]

Thank you everyone for sharing your stories and I have already learned a lot.  One thing that I am having a hard time finding advice on is when my uBPDw starts splitting sometimes she drops into what I would call "rage".  Clenched teeth and fists, coming at me aggressively, getting into my face and seething so bad I'm covered in spit, the occasional punches to the shoulder, verbal threats, and clothes thrown out of the closet all over the room... .

A little background, been together for 17 years, married 11, daughters 16 and 10.  Three years ago she asked for divorce because she felt I checked out on the marriage (I do take some responsibility for not creating a good balance with work).  She entered into a year long emotional and physical affair.  Tried to bargain for an open relationship which ultimately failed.  We seemed to be getting slightly better but I was burning out from trying to meet all of the criteria she wanted in the relationship (yes some of it was valid and warranted, I was not a perfect husband).  I started hanging out with friends and co-workers more and she did not like this.  Eventually my friendships blossomed and were heading into dangerous territory.  I believe it was the normalcy of these relationships that I was attracted to.  I have since severed the relationships and cut the time away from home. 

Fast forward two months and there have been a slew of threats, of having me arrested for fraud, threatening to make me lose my job, calling my co-workers at the office.  I have felt like I am doing a million point shuffle just trying to follow the next point of anger.  I believe we are headed for a divorce but strangely have started having sex again... .  There are points in the conversation where I am trying to stay a few steps ahead of her and feel like we are making progress and then without provocation the "rage" I described comes back full force.

Frankly its scary, usually when it starts happening I literally sit down on my hands or put them behind my back lest she tries to claim I was the abuser (she has threatened false claims already).  At some points I feel like I need to run for the hills and duck for cover but I have my children at home.  She has snapped at them but never raged.

If the relationship isn't meant to be well then so be it, but as we all know detaching from this is so hard. I am very guilty of trying to rehab the relationship on many occasions.  Her take is that since I caused all the problems in our 17 years together I get to leave and live with my parents while she and the kids get the house and I continue to pay all of their bills and lifestyle at whatever costs to me and my life.

Anyone have any advice for dealing with such extremes?

Thanks,
-Oz

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[WhataLife]

Thank you everyone for sharing your stories and I have already learned a lot.  One thing that I am having a hard time finding advice on is when my uBPDw starts splitting sometimes she drops into what I would call "rage".  Clenched teeth and fists, coming at me aggressively, getting into my face and seething so bad I'm covered in spit, the occasional punches to the shoulder, verbal threats, and clothes thrown out of the closet all over the room... .

A little background, been together for 17 years, married 11, daughters 16 and 10.  Three years ago she asked for divorce because she felt I checked out on the marriage (I do take some responsibility for not creating a good balance with work).  She entered into a year long emotional and physical affair.  Tried to bargain for an open relationship which ultimately failed.  We seemed to be getting slightly better but I was burning out from trying to meet all of the criteria she wanted in the relationship (yes some of it was valid and warranted, I was not a perfect husband).  I started hanging out with friends and co-workers more and she did not like this.  Eventually my friendships blossomed and were heading into dangerous territory.  I believe it was the normalcy of these relationships that I was attracted to.  I have since severed the relationships and cut the time away from home. 

Fast forward two months and there have been a slew of threats, of having me arrested for fraud, threatening to make me lose my job, calling my co-workers at the office.  I have felt like I am doing a million point shuffle just trying to follow the next point of anger.  I believe we are headed for a divorce but strangely have started having sex again... .  There are points in the conversation where I am trying to stay a few steps ahead of her and feel like we are making progress and then without provocation the "rage" I described comes back full force.

Frankly its scary, usually when it starts happening I literally sit down on my hands or put them behind my back lest she tries to claim I was the abuser (she has threatened false claims already).  At some points I feel like I need to run for the hills and duck for cover but I have my children at home.  She has snapped at them but never raged.

If the relationship isn't meant to be well then so be it, but as we all know detaching from this is so hard. I am very guilty of trying to rehab the relationship on many occasions.  Her take is that since I caused all the problems in our 17 years together I get to leave and live with my parents while she and the kids get the house and I continue to pay all of their bills and lifestyle at whatever costs to me and my life.

Anyone have any advice for dealing with such extremes?

Thanks,
-Oz

Oz, I'm sorry for your pain.

I'm new here and am still learning the in's and out's of BPD myself, but when my wife "rages" (She does it the opposite, by screaming at me and then withdrawing for 3-4 days at a time) I find it best to just shut up and take it.  Mentally, there's some good exercises to the right you can click on and read up on. 

The biggest thing I'm learning, is to just not respond.  I used to try reason, and that didn't work.  Denial just fans the flames even hotter!

Mentally understand that she has a disorder, and it's not you, it's her.  Just don't say that

I'm sure someone with much more experience in this will be along shortly to assist.  In the meantime, bite that tongue, and realize that the "Rage" will subside soon.

[JoyfulOne777]

I've been married almost 18 years, and just one year ago I finally researched mental illness and found BPD and it has helped me to understand my husband's behavior for the first time. When we first got married, he raged and threw things and punched walls. I had a happy childhood home and had never seen a grown person behave like this before. I eventually drew a boundary and said I wouldn't allow him to call me names or throw things. I would calmly tell him and then leave the room or go for a drive etc. it worked, but now he sometimes still rages in the sense that he gets the crazy eyes and goes into basically a tantrum. Raising his voice and saying things that are not rational.  I have only recently realized that it's really just like when our kids throw tantrums and the best way to deal with it is the same way. Saying something like, I'm going to take a break and we can discuss this later when we're both calm is so helpful. Later he is back to his reasonable self and I can talk to him about the issue. I can't make him change, but I can choose when I will or will not give him my attention, and I've chosen to only engage in a conversation with him when he's being respectful to me. Reading the stop walking on eggshells book was really helpful too in learning how to detach and not take the rages personally, and also how to not be invalidating. It's also really important to me that my kids learn how to deal with these kinds of rages because I don't want to model for them that it's okay to just let someone treat you badly. I want them to know how to politely stand up for themselves and not allow verbal abuse from their future spouses.

[MrRight]

Hello Ozmatoz

Sorry you are going through this.

my situation is not too different. I also get the - you go - you pay - deal. That would be ok - but the sums she talks about are unrealistic - makes me think she's just bluffing. And would I leave my S14 with a woman with her issues - no.

I also get attacked - cups of water thrown at me - punches here and there - kicks. I actually cover my testicles with a hand when I get into bed as she is capable of lashing out if I try to arrange the duvet on my side to my own comfort. It has to be the way she wants it.

Just try to protect yourself - wait for the storm to pass. Do the girls see these rage episodes?

[Tattered Heart]

ozmatoz,

I would not suggest just tolerating itwhen someone rages. That puts you at risk and is exposing yourself to unnecessary psychological harm through fear and often times verbal assaults. When someone is in a rage they are usually out of control of themselves, their behavior, and their emotions. Keeping yourself safe should be your priority.The safest thing to do when someone is raging, is to leave.

Does your W show signs that she is beginning to ramp up? Maybe she starts to pace or yell first? That's the point of action, before it gets to rage. This is where you can set a boundary. What kind of boundary do you think you could set? What part of the behavior do you not want to allow yourself to be subjected to? The yelling, the throwing, name calling, etc?

For myself I determine that my boundary in regards to my H extreme anger is name calling and out of control yelling. When he calls me a name or begins to yell to the point that I am uncomfortable, then I just say, "I don't like to be called names" and I leave the house. I do not tell him to stop. I don't tell him that if he doesn't quit, I'm leaving. I just state MY fact (not trying to change his behavior) and I take care of myself. He can stay inside and yell or name call all he wants. My boundary is that I'm going to allow myself to hear name calling or yelling. Since I began using this, his rages have significantly decreased from once every few days to maybe once every 2-3 months. Once I leave the house, I do not respond to his texts until I am calmed and until I can see that he has calmed.

[ozmatoz]

Thank you everyone for replying, again good (unfortunately however) to know that I'm not alone.  Sorry for the long reply, I would have done it sooner but I'm clinging on to threads, she's been trying to kick me out of the house to say I left her and the kids and its ramping up.  The threats I still take seriously and it is under these threats that she usually has me start packing a bag.  As soon as I put it in the car she starts in with the fact that she didn't pack it, she didn't put it in the car... .It was my decision to leave the family.  At which point I refuse to leave and the rage cycle starts all over again... .  Neither one of us are completely innocent of being perfect spouses but I have worked with her and on myself to get beyond and forgive the things she has done and find a way to work with what we have.  It is so frustrating and damaging to hear the verbal junk that is thrown at me and realize that there may never be a way for her to come to terms with the fact it takes two in the relationship to make it work.

MrRight, Do you also have to deal with everything being your fault?  Have you been successful at all getting your wife to take some ownership?  The way mine is going right now, I'm the "enemy" and horrible because for 17 years I have been all wrong.  Me only, and she only sees divorce as her best option because I am that "terrible".  She typical tries to hide the really crazy stuff from the kids.  There have been two occasions where she raged and my D16 overheard and it created a very painful situation and she backed off and wanted to go in and talk to the kids.  She gets upset when the bags shes asked me to pack are visible and she wants me to keep them out of sight.  Usually the screaming is over the phone when shes in her car alone.  I just cant even begin to understand how a grown person yells and screams like that... .

WhataLife, I've been trying not to get into justification situations (JADE) but all of the conversations tend to come with questions and accusations.  Some of them are completely baseless and I'm just at a loss on how to respond to irrational nonsense.  However like most there is a tiny grain of truth but it gets twisted into Mt Everest leaving me between a rock and a hard place.  She "dares me" to "deny it" and isn't interested in what she considers excuses.  Even last night when I texted her I would be home around 6:05 it wasn't good enough because she was planning for dinner at 6:00 and I should have known there was an accident (that hadn't happened yet when I left the office) and adjusted my schedule.  When trying to reason with this, I was met with a bunch of irrational nonsense and that there was no way I was going to be home at 6:05.  I walked into the kitchen at exactly 6:05 and she still couldn't let it go... .

JoyfulOne777, My therapist told me to read walking on eggshells and it was like it was written about my own life.  I can only imagine that you had the same reaction.  I would like to be able to "walk away" or "take a break" but when she ramps up if I ignore her calls/texts she keeps going and only whips into a frenzy.  There have been times when a simple non-emergency question went unanswered via text for 7 minutes (I was cleaning the pool with D10 and she knew we were doing this while she was at work) and all hell broke loose.  If I try to leave the room she follows me, or comes in rages then leaves... .repeat... .repeat... .  I've tried to leave the house and things get even worse, almost too hard to even describe in writing.  As I said she does not really rage in front of the kids but the arguments do crop up and I have been trying to use the techniques in the book and have even sat down with D16 and tried to explain (without telling her I think her mom is BPD) how to "argue" with her mother... .

TatteredHeart, The psychological harm has really already taken its toll, at times I feel like a shell of myself.  I know there are plenty of things I could have done different or tried to create a better relationship but to hear things like "I wish you never fathered my children" or "I can't believe how much of a loser you are, you are such a failure at everything in life", "My life is perfect if I could just replace you, or bury you and never hear from you again", "Its too bad I have children with you, at least I only have to talk to you when I decide its ok for you to see them"... .  the list goes on.  I've attempted to leave but the rage just gets worse and frankly I'm wondering what to do about the kids.  Sometimes I wonder if removing myself from the situation would be best where I can rebuild with whatever little she leaves me with to be stronger for my kids but man I can't imagine leaving them with her full time.  She does show signs of ramping up but it is literally seconds before she flips and gets out of control.  There is almost no way to set a boundary with her.  Any attempts have been flipped into me being the person driving the wedge and distance between us.  I'm constantly being accused of being the one with a PD.  I usually just try my best to hang on and avoid invalidating her.

Thank you all for the responses.  Just the fact that someone replied at all is a big help, fighting through these issues really is a lonely place.

Peace and love,
-Oz

[MrRight]

Hi Ozmatoz

yes - everything is always all my fault.

she will sometimes - after a spell of blame, ridicule, insults and violence  - come to me and say sorry - do i forgive. What else to say, I just shrug and say don't worry - let's move forward.

then 10 seconds later I will forget to do something as she likes it to be done (eg - not enough soap on the sponge when washing dishes) and her apology is laid bare for the b/s it is.

I would say next time she goads you to pack - try to resist - you know she will only come out to the car and say "so, you're leaving me and the kids - you snake!" - and you will creep back in and eat humble pie.

so what's the point in that charade?

another option would be to go and stay at a hotel for a couple of days and return, perhaps it will teach her not to goad you out as the temporary abandonment will stick in belly.

[Highlander]

Hi,

When my DH used to have BPD, I was subject to these rages.

His T's helped us to make a rage plan.

As his BPD was life threatening at the time he was prescribed valium.

Our rage plan included:

Getting him a valium,
Putting some calming music on,
Trying to get him to lie down on the bed and cuddle our little dog and have a little cry.

And the biggest help was for me to validate his emotions and remind him that he didn't want to do anything that he'd only regret later (self harm).

Its been so many years now since his BPD rages but I remember those moments all to well.

Nowadays we are working on laughter therapy when he gets upset.  We were painting a wall the other day and he accidentally began painting it the wrong colour.  He got slightly frustrated at himself and I reminded him that these are the times we are supposed to laugh.  And we did! 

[MrRight]

Hi,

When my DH used to have BPD, I was subject to these rages.

His T's helped us to make a rage plan.

As his BPD was life threatening at the time he was prescribed valium.

Our rage plan included:

Getting him a valium,
Putting some calming music on,
Trying to get him to lie down on the bed and cuddle our little dog and have a little cry.

And the biggest help was for me to validate his emotions and remind him that he didn't want to do anything that he'd only regret later (self harm).

Its been so many years now since his BPD rages but I remember those moments all to well.

Nowadays we are working on laughter therapy when he gets upset.  We were painting a wall the other day and he accidentally began painting it the wrong colour.  He got slightly frustrated at himself and I reminded him that these are the times we are supposed to laugh.  And we did! 

That's great that he was so compliant and accepted the diagnosis.

many of us are not so fortunate

[ozmatoz]

MrRight, I can only think of a few apologies over the course of years... .  It seems for me while she may come down out of rage, she never completely gets back to baseline.  At least I don't have to put up with the b/s apology though.  And yes I also deal with the "you did it wrong" over the simplest of things... .She doesn't like it when I have my phone on me when I go into the bathroom (trust issues).  Last night it was in my shorts pocket and I went into the bathroom to take a shower.  Door was open to the bedroom, shorts were on the counter in plain sight.  I still caught hell that I was "protecting my phone".

I did try two things to escape the rage but she has now turned them against me.  During a particular tough time I moved to the guest room, now it is my fault that I created this space, and she has learned to move on and not have me in our bed.  Its now "her bed".  I also left to stay with my parents about 20 minutes away for a couple of days and she had a complete breakdown, her friends almost brought her to the hospital.  Now "I did this to her" and I left and abandoned the family and her when she needed me most and will now never forgive me.

So I'm not really sure if these are charades or if she really means them... .I've been living out of suitcases for about a month.  Sigh.
Best of luck to you.  Sounds like we deal with pretty similar issues, I'm here if you need to vent.

Highlander, I'm glad to hear that you had some success in creating a plan to get through this.  I always believe that laughter can help just about anything.  Keep on being strong, I wish I could get my W back to see a therapist.

-Oz

[MrRight]

MrRight, I can only think of a few apologies over the course of years... . It seems for me while she may come down out of rage, she never completely gets back to baseline.  At least I don't have to put up with the b/s apology though.  And yes I also deal with the "you did it wrong" over the simplest of things... .She doesn't like it when I have my phone on me when I go into the bathroom (trust issues).  Last night it was in my shorts pocket and I went into the bathroom to take a shower.  :)oor was open to the bedroom, shorts were on the counter in plain sight.  I still caught hell that I was "protecting my phone".

I did try two things to escape the rage but she has now turned them against me.  :)uring a particular tough time I moved to the guest room, now it is my fault that I created this space, and she has learned to move on and not have me in our bed.  Its now "her bed".  I also left to stay with my parents about 20 minutes away for a couple of days and she had a complete breakdown, her friends almost brought her to the hospital.  Now "I did this to her" and I left and abandoned the family and her when she needed me most and will now never forgive me.

So I'm not really sure if these are charades or if she really means them... .I've been living out of suitcases for about a month.  Sigh.
Best of luck to you.  Sounds like we deal with pretty similar issues, I'm here if you need to vent.

Highlander, I'm glad to hear that you had some success in creating a plan to get through this.  I always believe that laughter can help just about anything.  Keep on being strong, I wish I could get my W back to see a therapist.

-Oz

Thanks Oz. well - we dont quite have the same situation. what I wouldn't give to sleep solo. I haven't really slept well in 17 years.
Mine would be a wreck too if I vanished for 2 days. I would expect her to extract full revenge if I pulled a similar stunt.

it's funny - but on occasions when she is happy and comes to me telling me how good I am etc and I think - maybe things are not as bad as I have been imagining. I kick myself inside - she's only happy now because I am complying with life on her terms. Now if I was living my life the way I want ... .