The plan I'm cooking...of course I always have a plan

[formflier]

Honestly this plan is less about "making something work" as "clearing my conscience". 

It's been obvious to me and to most of you guys for a while, that the current trajectory is likely not sustainable.  Certainly not for 14 more years... .until my youngest is 18.

Plus... .add in "the end" of a joint financial relationship and a legitimate question of "where do you go from here"... .?

I don't want to "stalemate" for a long time.  On the other hand... sometimes "winding the clock" is a good thing... .let time pass to clarify things.  Wisdom is needed to discern the difference.

Big picture issues to be resolved.

1.  As you guys know, "biblical counseling" didn't work out well.  Perhaps due to an individual (the number 2 pastor at church) or perhaps due to church policy/culture.  Basically, as it stands now.  I would never join this church.  Yet we still attend.  BC is big negative, there are significant good things there... for real.

So... .moving on from a stalemate, one way or another, would seem a wise move.  The church claims to be all about problem solving, and I believe they are.  Said another way, I need to know if the church is part of any potential "stabilization" of my household or if they are going to feed dysfunction (without knowing it).

I'll end by saying I've had some private e-mail exchanges with BC... yeah... that guy. That have been productive.  Perhaps 50% of the way to something usable.

I don't see any "fix" at the church.  Honestly... "fix" is fading from my "goal list".

2. I've got a letter (that I will post below) that I'm working on.  My goal would be to have my wife read it... .and actually "hear" it.  (Much like Cat Familiar in another post).

3. In another post Skip had made a comment about involving (family, friends, authorities... sort of "light of day" stuff) in an effort to get rid of bullying.  As i look back over the history of dysfunction in my r/s... ."the light of day" has almost always helped.  There is another couple which I'm considering involving to "help" with the listening. 

There is some "bullying light" or parental alienation going on around finances.  Basically telling/instructing kids a dramatically skewed version of things.  They need to be kids... .they don't need a "correct" or "skewed" version. 

Basically... .I know the husband well enough and trust him enough to ask him.  And I respect him enough (think him wise enough) to accept him saying no... .or yes.  So... perhaps we all get together and read the letter, perhaps... going forward... .they are a couple that asks "how is it going?".  No interest in having them be Pseudo counselors or anything.  Just people that know us, like us as a couple and individuals.

Note:  When I envision my life staying married... .or divorcing... .I certainly see myself having contact with the husband... either way.


Anyway... .this is really just a sketch.  I'm hoping you guys can challenge some details... .point out sticky places... who knows.

Will post the letter below in a bit.

FF

[formflier]

Yeah... .there is a concept of writing a letter for her... and really it's for me.  Perhaps I never give her this... who knows.  I'd like to ... .I'd really like her to hear and understand this.

If she thinks I'm (fill in the blank)... .well... .I'm ok.  I'd like her to hear this.

I'd like to "hear" her response as well.  

Oh... .last thing.  I really didn't want to do gymnastics when writing the letter... .as in trying to manipulate words so she would "hear"... I wanted it to sound like I really think.  If she hears... fine... .if not.  I was authentic to me.

Letter below


FFw,

We seem to have “heard” the same sermon on Sunday, yet interpreted it quite differently.  That’s ok.  I do want to understand how you approach the cross and how God’s word touches your heart, even if it is dramatically different from my view.

I heard a message about people trying to “prevail upon” others.  How Paul stuck around when he didn’t have to, for the express purpose to “prevail upon” his persecutors.

Frankly, for a long time I have perceived you as my persecutor.  Trying to “prevail upon me” a notion that I think and feel things, that I have never considered... .until you “tell” me I have these thoughts and feelings.  (such as hatred towards your sister).  Basically arguing about my reality.

Pause... deep breath.  

I have no intention of arguing with you about my reality.  I do have an intention of “prevailing upon” you that we are on different paths, and one of those paths likely leads to the destruction of our relationship.  I pray we come together, listen to each other about our own path and find a way forward together.

Please understand the path I’m on and why I continue in our relationship.  In my typical style... I’m going to have to ramble a bit.

Given the events of Sunday evening (the end of our joint financial relationship), Monday was a melancholy and reflective day.  I journaled and reflected for most of the day.  Towards the end of the day I reached out to  (insert friends name).  As you know, he has literally been next to me as I thought my life was ending (in an E2).  It seemed appropriate to discuss with him the end of our financial relationship.

Sometimes your friends see things you are blind to yourself.  I believe this again proves this adage out.  I asked him who he saw when he looked at me.  I presumed he would tell me I was unhappy and I should divorce... move on ... etc etc, especially given his divorce.  I was surprised by his actual observation of me.

He said over the past couple years I’ve become a more relaxed, happier and better person.  That I especially seem to enjoy being a Dad and he hadn’t a clue what I should do about my relationship with you “because we used to be such good friends”.  He further remarked that he and his first wife (insert name) never had a friendship, certainly not one like he saw between you and I.

Well... .what I thought would be a conversation to “wrap up” my melancholy day just got me started with “reflecting upon our friendship”.

  
I spent a long time lingering over a sweet memory of our best conversation ever.  Those were the favorite part of our friendship.  We had the best conversations.  Please share this memory with me.
 
Summer 2008.   Our farmhouse was close to the river, lots of nice shade trees.  We would slip away from the kids and sit by the river and just enjoy hanging out.  I usually talked (ffw) into being the one to lean against the tree so I could put my head in her lap and she would scratch and pet my head while we talked.

Anyway, the day of our best conversation ever started as a talk about how well kids were doing with chores, driving the tractor and stuff like that.  I remarked how happy the kids seemed when they earned their “tractor qual” and Daddy let them drive and do things without Daddy around.

FFw then remarked that she knew a big kid that was happy on the farm (me) and I got to relive my memories of operating a little skid steer during summers at my Dad’s farm.  Here is the thing... .I hadn’t told FFw that story in years... perhaps only once or twice ever.

The skidder was a little dinky gas powered thing, likely the smallest made at the time, but it was the “biggest” thing my Dad would turn me loose on and leave.  I was king of the farm... cleaning out hog pens.

To me, that conversation meant my wife had really listened the once or twice I told the skid steer story.  She understood the power those moments had in my life and how I was passing those moments... in a deliberate fashion, onto our kids.  Just like my Dad passed them to me.

FFw got who I was and what I was about.  FFw was proud of me.  FFw liked what she saw enough to have a gazillion kids with me and let me fill them with my quite particular ways of raising kids on a farm.

But at the heart of it... we were friends that enjoyed each other's company sitting there by that lazy river.

I stay because I keep thinking I can figure out a way to get my friend back….

Sadly... .now it appears that when my wife see’s what I’m offering she leaves that river bank and goes to a place of broken relationships (her sister FFw SIL name) for advice.  I can read a map and I know the pathway towards our river bank doesn’t go through any relationship advice from those with repeated relationship failures.

I’ve been back (literally) to that river bank several times... alone... .since the state tore down our farmhouse.  Each time I have a long cry and miss my friend.  Perhaps the flood washed away our friendship as well as our farm.  Given that 2019 will be 10 years since that awful flood and given that I tend to be stubborn and hardheaded... .perhaps I need to consider that our friendship is really over.  That possibility saddens me... .I’ve been avoiding that thought for a long time.

I’ll be “sitting by the river” for a while longer.  If you want to have a conversation about our friendship.  I’d like to talk.

FF

[flourdust]

I recall seeing a number of these "conscience-clearing" exercises you've attempted with your wife over the last year or so, ff.

I hate to rain on your hopes but... .nothing has come of them. There's some temporary discomfort, or increase in conflict, or a weird sort of not-talking-about-it-but-she's-being-nicer for a bit. Then your relationship resumes its trajectory.

Why would this be any different?

[Sunfl0wer]

This whole letter makes me so sad.
To me, it reads as a man who is grieving/accepting loss of something, once so special, now gone... .coming to his terms with that truth.

Sort of like you are trying to make peace to yourself by articulating these thoughts.

Sometimes I have wondered if I speak something, be just that much more vulnerable and honest and coming from my best place possible, ... .will he finally hear in some way?  What affect will it have?  Never know until I give it my best shot right?

On the other hand, sometimes my past therapist has "caught" me on what he calls "magical thinking."  

... I'd really like her to hear and understand this.

Seems to me your letter is a way of you getting closure for your hope on what is in this letter, who you two were.

My thoughts... .likely better kept to yourself, historically, yea like FD says, not much good has come of this in past.

However, if you are determined to try to be heard... .start with one paragraph at a time, see if the conversation gets heard in snippets... .then piece it together... .as she seems receptive  Or see if she shuts it down, denies stuff, etc.  Cause for me, sharing all this, then getting a huge fallout, would feel devastating to me all at once.  Obviously tho, a personal choice here, for you to make.  

... .
After thought... .
One way she could take it besides feeling blamed etc... .
 It could feel like a "set up" to her for yet another failure as she fails to have "the right" response and feeling blamed that you are saying she crushed your dream.  Or like you set her up by "proving" she once liked you, etc.  (my ex literally felt he was being gaslighted when I reminded him of how he felt in the beginning of us! How sad!)
... .

Side side note... .
I wonder how she would feel if she came across a picture that represented what you are speaking?
I wonder if she is more inclined to a positive emotional flashback with a picture, or other memorabelia?  Idk, just wondering if you wanted another aproach to attempt at triggering a glimpse at who she was.

I used to send my ex snippets of our lovely emails, and it had pet names and our love language throughout, etc.  He seemed shooken up initially by this... .which was a nice disarming affect that helped if I had a way to the reach him.  Eventually, the method wore off and he rewrote history as seeing those emails as him being naive to "my ways... ." or such.

[formflier]

I recall seeing a number of these "conscience-clearing" exercises you've attempted with your wife over the last year or so, ff.

I hate to rain on your hopes but... .nothing has come of them. There's some temporary discomfort, or increase in conflict, or a weird sort of not-talking-about-it-but-she's-being-nicer for a bit. Then your relationship resumes its trajectory.

Why would this be any different?

If I recall correctly... .and I may not... .most of those exercises were some sort of "turning point" or "door closing".  Mostly financial if I remember right.

This would be different... I suppose... because there are no more financial ties to sever.  I'll start down a new path towards... .?

Perhaps a separate issue for others to consider, since I can't go back in time, is whether or not I should have done "small boundary things" (this account and that account) versus "big boundary" and just whacked off the entire concept of joint money... .all at once.

The only "money boundary" thing that I could remotely construe as having "worked" is the "wallet incident" where I would hand over cash during disrespect.

She seems nice now when asking.  Granted that's small stuff and doesn't alter the "trajectory".


FF

[formflier]

I suppose I should define being heard.

That would be no overtalk.  There is history of her listening to letters.  I've done it rarely.  At the moment I can't think of a time when it went badly... .in the moment.

I have no expectation that 6 weeks or 6 months later she will "remember" the letter the same way.  I will... that's what matters... .to me.

FF

[JoyfulOne777]

I'm new to learning about BPD, but I'm convinced my husband has it. He's always done better when I write him emails to discuss things because it gives him time to process it and he doesn't get as angry as when I try to talk to him in person. I know for him, he wouldn't want other people involved though. He'd like to just read the email alone.

[formflier]

Sort of like you are trying to make peace to yourself by articulating these thoughts.

 

Yeah... .I journal some.  In last weeks P session she pushed me pretty hard to really write about my feelings... .up my journaling game so to speak.


I suppose this was kind a result of that, although we couldn't have predicted the finance thing would really come to an end.

FF

[ozmatoz]

FF, I too have tried the letter approach over the years.  About 3 years ago when she first started talking about divorce and she had her affair she would listen to the letters and I could tell they had some impact but as time went on they were quickly forgotten.  Now the few that I have tried get taken out of context, twisted, turned re-written and shoved back in my face before I even finish.

I can caution you like Sunfl0wer said putting your heart out there and having trashed while that vulnerable hurts.  A lot.  In fact I feel that it is these times when I really question staying in the r/s.  I can change how I handle conversations, I can learn the tools but if I open up and you shred me... .that's not really a way to live.

I will say though even after getting shredded I still write letters and I still try to read them.  Perhaps it is more for me than for her.

If reading this letter helps put you in a better place then go for it.  You need to look out for yourself too.

Best of luck, we're all rooting for you.

-Oz  

[flourdust]

If I recall correctly... .and I may not... .most of those exercises were some sort of "turning point" or "door closing".  Mostly financial if I remember right.

This would be different... I suppose... because there are no more financial ties to sever.  I'll start down a new path towards... .?

I think that some of your big communications attempts involved finances, some were about parenting, some about FOO issues ... .my overall impression was that they didn't really open the door to dialogue. Sunfl0wer makes a smart suggestion that a letter like this can be flooding, and it might be worthwhile to release it in chunks, like a trail of breadcrumbs... .maybe even starting with the positive memories and compliments as a way to get her to engage. Will it make a difference... .? If we had a shrug emoji, I'd insert it here.

[Skip]

Don't write a letters to be heard... .that mostly creates drama and makes things worse. Write letters to be open regular modes of communication. Your letter above is the former.

Just for fun, think of a lawnmower company placing an ad on youtube telling the viewer all the reasons how it helps the owner of the company if the viewer buys the lawnmower. If we sell 10,000,000 movers our stock will go up and it will raise the value of my options and I can buy a nicer house in Prairie Village. Please buy one now!

Silly? Yes. Get my point?

[SamwizeGamgee]

I liked the letter.  It seemed to come from the heart, and a place that you can hold onto for a happy feeling and memory.  That's the point of writing things down.  you capture feelings, your feelings.  You may want to just read it, keep it to yourself, and reflect on it later in time. 

I have concluded that my uBPDw has facts based on her feelings.  Even if I wrote something down to be as thoughtful, and accurate, and honest, as possible, she will only read what she feels.  She can twist and interpret based on her state of mind.  I believe that if I write anything personal, it will have an unpredictable result - and worse, be at her bidding any time in the future.  If I could write her a disappearing letter, that would be better. 

If you felt good reading the letter you drafted, keep reading it.  Unless you want it used against you, keep it to yourself.  This game isn't fair.

[formflier]

 Will it make a difference... .?  

I think I kinda remember.

One of the things that I've "hidden" in the past, perhaps trying to, do "rules" or something is the concept of speaking directly and succinctly... .especially about simple things.

FFw FOO is a mess of indirect passing of messages.  I own 1 property (for hopefully not much longer) with FIL.  I only communicate directly with him now about it.  He often chooses not to respond.  

In the past, there would be me and others sniffing around trying to figure out why he wouldn't respond, what did you hear, I heard this... someone would FB someone else.  

I now refer all "sniffs" back to FIL and I don't send any out.  From little snippets I've heard... .it's another reason for my "blackness"... .that I won't "let others know" or "be part of it".

FF