How do you get 100% physical custody?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Hi all,

What was the information you provided the court that got you to 100% or close to it?  What were the various steps along the way?

Each situation is obviously different, but I'm trying to get a sense of what I should realistically be aiming for now.  I'm currently at 30/70 (me with 30) and just started a custody evaluation, which I requested.  I'm finalizing the CE questionnaire and am spinning on the question that asks what I want the physical custody arrangement to be.  Everything in me says to ask for 100% to keep my child away from the demonstrated terror, but my attorney is telling me that I shouldn't ask for more than 70/30 and that because our kiddo is so young (25 months), I'll likely end up with 50/50.

Thanks, masters, for your wisdom :-).

[Aiming4Kindness]

Hi all,

What was the information you provided the court that got you to 100% or close to it?  What were the various steps along the way?

Each situation is obviously different, but I'm trying to get a sense of what I should realistically be aiming for now.  I'm currently at 30/70 (me with 30) and just started a custody evaluation, which I requested.  I'm finalizing the CE questionnaire and am spinning on the question that asks what I want the physical custody arrangement to be.  Everything in me says to ask for 100% to keep my child away from the demonstrated terror, but my attorney is telling me that I shouldn't ask for more than 70/30 and that because our kiddo is so young (25 months), I'll likely end up with 50/50.

Thanks, masters, for your wisdom :-).

[livednlearned]

You may find that getting to 100 percent happens incrementally. For example, you ask for 70/30, court awards you award you 50/50. When you have 50/50, you continue to document. Then ask for 100, so you get 70.

I ended up with full custody, but it took a ton of documentation and many trips to court over a period of 4 years.

We started with 60/40 (me with 60).

I noticed two things with court. One was my case against ex, which was pretty solid and had lots of documentation. Two was exes behavior toward court orders.

I think the latter was more persuasive than the former. When I realized that, I started to work with my L to create more conditions and consequences and for lack of a better word, tests, so that there was lots of light shining on ex's inability to comply with court orders.

My ex had a very strong narcissistic streak, and routinely defied even minor things in the court orders.

How does legal custody work where you live? What is your L proposing when it comes to legal custody?

[Nope]

I agree with L&L that this is something that will have to happen in increments. Your lawyer is correct that asking for 70/30 (in your direction) is the best way to get 50/50 to start.

But the more pressing question is how exactly to do that. You are on a tight rope here because what you say now will matter later. You will be asked to justify why 70/30 is in your child's best interests and why 50/50 is not, and why 100/0 is not.

What it comes down to is that you need to be able to voice your grave concern about her parenting while also showing a willingness to give her a chance to try to do better. That's why 70/30. Then when you get 50/50 and nothing changes and you can document that nothing has changed you can go back to court and say this isn't working and ask for 100/0 because you feel she was given a chance and has proved repeatedly that she cannot act in the child's best interests.

Unfortunately, it's a marathon, not a sprint.

[Panda39]

Yes, it will be incremental and always focus on the best for your child and how mom's behaviors effect your child.

Document everything, if that means saving emails and text messages, keeping a journal or keeping notes on a calendar.

Besides more time you might look at getting decision making for various things.

My SO was able to document that his ex was unable to get his daughters to the dentist or the doctor in a timely manner when they needed it. (was neglectful) He had emails documenting all of this that he provided the court.

He was also able to document high absenteeism from school (his older daughter failed 9th grade) He provided the court with emails, attendance records, and grades.

When his divorce was final he was awarded Medical, Dental & Education decision making.

So more time is one thing to focus on but so is having more control, just something to keep in mind too.

Panda39

[Newyoungfather]

I agree with everyone, it has to be incremental sections.  I know how hard that may sound but trust me it's worth it. I started at only 4 hours per week when my son was born, now I have him majority of the parenting time.  If you live in the state of Pennsylvania there are 16 factors of custody they go by.

[Turkish]

What are your criteria for going for 100% custody? Is your toddler unsafe with her?

[ForeverDad]

The general approach is to seek what you believe is appropriate and best for your child, then accept and work with what you walk out with.  Sadly or gladly, depending on how you look at it, you'll likely be back in court again and again at which times you can update your case and ask again.

Getting 100% is very, very rare and would require her to be considered actionably and substantively abusive, neglectful or dangerous to the child, probably after repeated tries to gain her compliance.  Courts are remarkably, um, forgiving and tolerant of lesser poor behaviors.  The court doesn't want either parent to feel totally shut out.  Even if you got 100% your Ex might still get supervised visitation.

Just because your child is stressed by his other parent probably will not be seen as enough reason to side 100% with you.  In my case I lived under temp orders that gave her temp custody and temp majority time — for over two years.  :)uring that entire time at exchanges our son would come running to me with a big smile, yet be sobbing to stay with me when I returned him.  Lawyers and court ignored it.  I concluded they ignored the issues they didn't consider actionable and didn't try to protect the children from every tear or distress.

Don't be timid.  If you are told you'll only get less, that is no reason to ask for a lesser amount.  I am a firm believer in... .Ask and you might get it, don't ask and you won't get it.  If you think 80% is best (short alternate weekends for her and maybe a couple evenings in between) then ask for it and document why.  Then, if you get less you can work with it and do the best you can.  If it still doesn't work you can go back to court and try again.

My temp orders had me with 22% (2 years).  Final decree had me with 50% (3 years).  :)idn't work, she was still entitled, so I sought custody and majority time, I only got custody (3 years).  :)idn't work, she was still entitled, so I sought majority time yet again and got 75% (past 4 years).

[Aiming4Kindness]

Thanks so much to each of you.  I really wish somebody had the time to interview all of the folks on here who have had victories in protecting themselves and the kiddos, and then compile their legal processes in a book.  Can you imagine the number of people it would help?  Just the stories from those of you who started with very little time and ended up getting substantially more after pushing and pushing... .so inspiring and motivating.

I'll be submitting my questionnaire tomorrow, along with 99 pages of journal entries from the year leading up to the end of our relationship that document domestic violence, harm to our daughter, etc.  The next batch of files to share will be audio and video that support some of the events in the journal, followed by a doc that documents all of the craziness that has occurred since the relationship's end last year, mostly documented through Our Family Wizard messages.

Per Panda39's comments, I'm definitely asking for education and healthcare decisionmaking.  The judge awarded me healthcare decision-making earlier this year when my ex tried to block the flu vaccine.  That decision-making, however, only covered the flu shot, so I'm hoping to build on that success.

My evaluator told me that she appreciates how organized I am, and that my organization will make her report writing process easier... .whatever that means.  I know she has to play to both sides, so we'll see.  Who knows what she's saying to my ex.

Thanks again.

[livednlearned]

I'll be submitting my questionnaire tomorrow, along with 99 pages of journal entries from the year leading up to the end of our relationship that document domestic violence, harm to our daughter, etc.  The next batch of files to share will be audio and video that support some of the events in the journal, followed by a doc that documents all of the craziness that has occurred since the relationship's end last year, mostly documented through Our Family Wizard messages.

Not sure if it's already been submitted, but another approach given your situation (e.g. having documentation of harm to daughter) is to ask for what you think is best, and then suggest solutions.

So, if you did ask for 100 percent, then suggest going to 70/30 after your ex submits to anger management classes, parenting classes, substance abuse treatment (if that's an issue). In other words: 1) show that you understand the danger to your daughter, and 2) that you also recognize her relationship with mom is important, and 3) some kind of intervention could improve things.   

The goal is to demonstrate that you have a realistic view of the situation (mom is violent toward the child) while also recognizing the therapeutic stance of court toward misbehaving parents.

It's also ok to admit that you are royally conflicted  

I did this with the parenting coordinator involved in my case. She asked me what kind of arrangement I thought was best for my son and I told her I have never felt so conflicted in my life to know what was best. I also said the best-case scenario would be for ex to seek treatment for anger, substance abuse, and help from skilled therapists not just for himself, but for his relationship with our son.

I think that was the prize answer behind door number 3 because I identified what I suspect many of these professionals feel. How does anyone know what the best arrangement is when the most primary bond between parent and child is abusive.

[Aiming4Kindness]

So, if you did ask for 100 percent, then suggest going to 70/30 after your ex submits to anger management classes, parenting classes, substance abuse treatment (if that's an issue). In other words: 1) show that you understand the danger to your daughter, and 2) that you also recognize her relationship with mom is important, and 3) some kind of intervention could improve things.   

The goal is to demonstrate that you have a realistic view of the situation (mom is violent toward the child) while also recognizing the therapeutic stance of court toward misbehaving parents.

It's also ok to admit that you are royally conflicted  

I did this with the parenting coordinator involved in my case. She asked me what kind of arrangement I thought was best for my son and I told her I have never felt so conflicted in my life to know what was best. I also said the best-case scenario would be for ex to seek treatment for anger, substance abuse, and help from skilled therapists not just for himself, but for his relationship with our son.

I think that was the prize answer behind door number 3 because I identified what I suspect many of these professionals feel. How does anyone know what the best arrangement is when the most primary bond between parent and child is abusive.

This is exactly what I've done.  Hoping Door Number 3 still works!