Intro: On the verge of divorce

[WantToBeFree]

Hi everyone, I'm new and wanted to give a brief intro.  I've been with my husband for 11 years and married for 7.5.  We have two daughters, one of them living... .she is 4.  If I am being honest, I've been thinking about leaving him since before we were even married.  We broke up once when we were dating, he cheated on me.  I clearly remember viewing the cheating as almost an excuse to get me to finally leave him, but for reasons that are still unclear to me, I took him back.  

I began seriously thinking about divorce about 2 years ago.  One day it just clicked, and I went from knowing I should leave, to actually wanting to leave.  I'd been threatening divorce since we got married, but he could feel the change in me.  He knew I had reached the end of my rope, and he was terrified.  He begged me not to leave him, he'd swear he would do better.  Over the next year we would have the "I want a divorce" talk about 7 times, and it always ended with him crying and begging me not to leave him and me agreeing to keep trying, despite not really wanting to.  Last October I finally did it, I stuck to my guns and told him I wanted a separation (it happaned during a fight and I was so mad, I couldn't not end it), and I would attempt to work on things if he moved out (I wasn't ready to file RIGHT then, but the separation stuff was mostly a lie just to get him to be agreeable to moving out).

I was sad, I cried every day, but I knew I did the right thing.  Then we went on a big family vacation that had been booked and paid for, for months... .I thought nothing would change, we'd just give our daughter one last family trip.  But he was everything that I love about him that week, and when we got home, I wanted him around.  I wasn't just caving like I'd done in the past, I actually wanted to try to work things out.  He stayed with his parents for the next three months, but we "dated" and tried to re-build things.  Right after Christmas I asked him to move back home.

In the last 6 months, I have seen many times that our marriage cannot survive.  It's like he literally cannot help himself when he does the ___ he does.  I wrote about our relationship on another site and a fellow poster suggested his behavior sounded a lot like BPD, and upon reading up on it, it's the only thing that has ever truly fit how he is.  He has been both emotionally and physically abusive to me... .he has not put his hands on me in well over a year, and he claims he never will again.  That is by far THE longest the abuse has ever stopped for.  In the past the longest was maybe a couple months, and that was often just because nothing came up to fight about, not that he was trying hard to control himself.  

So I give him credit for that, but unfortunately, after 11 years of abuse, the damage is done.  :)uring fights, I wait for it... .and I fear telling him again that it is over, worried about what he may do, either to me or himself (he's banged his head into the wall on several occasions when mad or frustrated).  He does not respect me... .we've been having money issues for a while now, and I've tried telling him to stop spending so much before it gets really bad, but he acts as though it is my fault one cannot spend more money than they make.  For the first 7 years together, I always made more money than he did.  But after our daughter was born, I quit my job and became a stay at home mom for a couple years.  I now work part-time from home, while my daughter is napping or in bed for the night.  In two years I went from working 10 hours to now 25 and soon 30/week, but he will never view my work as being hard or stressful.  

He told me last week that he should get to spend more money because he works more.  :)espite working full time since we met (and for a couple years also being in grad school) he always felt all the housework should always fall to me, while he sat around doing the bare minimum.  His moods can go from insanely happy, to screaming mad, and back to happy again in a matter of minutes (though not always quite that severe).  There seems to be no rhyme or reason to his bad moods or when he is angry.  He's never helped or even been around for our daughter very much, and now blames me and says I coddle her because she and I are close and she is not with him.  He's done mean, to downright despicable things to me... .I once called him from my bike ride, stranded miles from home in a downpour with cars whizzing by me, but he refused to come pick me up and in fact accused me of trying to interfere with his plans with a friend by wanting him to come pick me up (I had NO issue with him going out with his friend).  He's thrown food at me, he's called me horrible names, and often most of this stuff in front of our daughter.  

But, other times he is the kindest, most fun person who is nothing but supportive.  When our first daughter was stillborn, he was AMAZING, pushing his own grief back to take care of me and be there for me.  He also has a huge soft spot for anything involving my mom who passed away a few years before I met him.  We can have so much fun together, we have similar senses of humor and he just gets my humor when most others don't.  :)uring the good times, we agree on many big, life things like the basics of how we want to raise our daughter, and home improvements are a snap.  "I don't like that color paint... .me neither.  I like that one, ok me too".  :)one.  Registering for our wedding, picking our honeymoon destination, all stuff like that comes so easily for us.  A few weeks ago we were on speakerphone with our insurance because we were leasing a new car, and the agent laughed and pointed out the fact that he and I took turns answering questions without any hesitation or prompt from the other to do so.  In so many ways, we just click.

But he is literally like living with two different people.  I hate the one side of him, and want to leave NOW.  But I also fear him, and pity him at the same time (feeling like if I could just be more understanding, or find the magic thing that will fix our marriage).  I often find myself feeling sorry for him, despite the fact that HE has brought this on himself.  But I also love the good side of him, and I am deeply saddened by the idea of our marriage ending and breaking up our family.  But our daughter is only getting older and more aware.  I cannot keep putting her through this, and I need her to see her mom as a strong woman who does not have to stay in a bad marriage.  Sorry this got so long, probably too long for an intro, but I am looking forward to posting here, and speaking with others that may know what I am going through.  Thanks for listening!

[loyalwife]

 
   WantToBeFree,
   You are in the right place! Welcome I totally understand your predicament of loving the kind person and hating the other. As you read more here, you will see that you aren't alone. I'm in the same spot, and can't decide whether it's worth staying and enduring the abuse or ending it and leaving behind someone you love, for the most part. Your daughter as you mentioned is getting older and is aware of the situation and the difficulties. I can imagine that this makes it doubly hard.
   11 years is a long time. It sounds as though you have been through many cycles of dysregulation in the past with your pwBPD including separation. It is like living with two different people, I couldn't agree more. My husband is the nicest person to be around when he isn't in an episode; otherwise, he yells and makes life miserable for me.  I've been close to leaving too, and he cried and didn't want me to go, although he was the one that initiated it. 
    Although you mentioned that it has been six months since you have experienced any physical abuse, unless he is getting help, do not be complacent. Unfortunately it can lie dormant. I say this as just a precaution so that you stay safe. Fear and pity can make all this confusing. I like to think of it like a snake. Just because the snake is calm, it doesn't mean it won't strike.
    Just stay on alert, have a safety plan and be prepared. If things continue to be smooth, that's a plus, but at least you won't be caught off guard.
    Wishing you peace and calmness.
    Loyalwife

[pearlsw]

But he is literally like living with two different people.  I hate the one side of him, and want to leave NOW.  But I also fear him, and pity him at the same time (feeling like if I could just be more understanding, or find the magic thing that will fix our marriage).  I often find myself feeling sorry for him, despite the fact that HE has brought this on himself.  But I also love the good side of him, and I am deeply saddened by the idea of our marriage ending and breaking up our family. But our daughter is only getting older and more aware.  I cannot keep putting her through this, and I need her to see her mom as a strong woman who does not have to stay in a bad marriage.  Sorry this got so long, probably too long for an intro, but I am looking forward to posting here, and speaking with others that may know what I am going through.  Thanks for listening!

Hi WantToBeFree,

Let me join loyalwife in welcoming you! There are many of us dealing with really tough predicaments at home! I am sorry for your pain, but glad you are here with us now!

Your mention that he is "literally like being with two different people" struck a chord with me. I feel that way sometimes. It starts to bend reality. When the more friendly, loving character shows up, in time, I start to want to let my guard down. But when the other, meaner one shows up I think why I am putting up with this? It's not even easy to see the difference any more on some days... .they just both cause me pain... .

It's hard. Sounds you like you are pretty ready for things to end, despite the good part of him, is that correct?  I can imagine how wanting to be a "role model" for your daughter could be a bit motivation in making this transition.

How do you think he will take it if you try to break with him?

compassionately, pearl.

[WantToBeFree]

Thank you Loyalwife for the warm welcome.  It's like a breath of fresh air to be here and to be understood.  I'm so sorry that you're in the same situation.  Yes I am still absolutely on guard for the abuse.  I never thought he could go this long, so he has surprised me, but I would never believe he could go the rest of his life.  In a recent fight, I saw this look in his eyes, and that is when he would have in the past, pushed me or grabbed me or something.  So I know it was basically all he could do, to not do that right then, but it wasn't far off.  In fact I wouldn't doubt that the longer he goes, the more probability that the abuse could come out again, because he's been holding back for so long, he's liable to explode one day. 

During that same fight, I turned my back to him to walk away, and in that instant my whole body tensed up, bracing for "impact"... .so I know I will never stop expecting it.  The sad thing is, he is the only man who has ever been physically abusive to me, but I could see this affecting any future relationships (though I am not concerned with being with anyone new for a very long time) even though I have known plenty of good men who have not even raised their voice to me, let along their hand.  I had reasons to break up with past boyfriends, but I often dwell on the fact that I somehow had the courage to leave most of them (some did the leaving) but then went on to marry the one guy that treated me worse than all my ex's combined.  Somedays I am utterly overwhelmed with how many emotions go into loving someone with possible BPD.  Thank you for the warning though, it's definitely on my mind.  Thanks for the welcome and I'm wishing for peace for you as well <3

Thank you Pearl for welcoming me as well!  I can definitely relate to my guard being up and going down like a vicious cycle.  When I decided I was done two years ago, even though he always talked me into staying, I kept that guard up.  Even on good days, I enjoyed the good days, but I still knew it was over.  But now since I decided to give it another try since our separation, I am now not only dealing with the stress of leaving, but also the fact that some days I don't want to leave, and I'm struggling again with knowing I should, but still trying to hold out for the happy marriage and happy family fantasy. 

I'm very scared to tell him it's done.  Last time he did not get violent or very angry, mostly just sad and upset and crying.  But I know this time has to be different... .I have to know for sure I am ready, and it cannot be on a whim during a fight.  I have to approach him when we are both calm and not fighting, which is hard because when we aren't fighting, we get along great.  But it's also scary knowing that I HAVE to stick to my decision this time no matter what.  Our daughter was very confused by his coming and going last time, so for her sake, when he moves out next time, it has to be for good.  I've never come to him in a calm manner before.  So I think he will see that I am serious and I'm not sure how he will react to that. 

My lawyer advised that I have car keys in hand, and not to let myself get cornered in any way.  So if need be, I plan to just run out the door and leave if things get bad.  Thinking of this literally makes my stomach knot up, so I don't think I am ready just yet.  But hopefully before the end of summer.  Thank you again for the welcome!

[mama-wolf]

I'm very scared to tell him it's done.

I have to know for sure I am ready, and it cannot be on a whim during a fight.  I have to approach him when we are both calm and not fighting, which is hard because when we aren't fighting, we get along great.  But it's also scary knowing that I HAVE to stick to my decision this time no matter what.

Hi WantToBeFree and welcome!  By coming here, you really are in the right place to be heard, validated, and supported through what is clearly a very difficult time.

I just told my wife yesterday that our 11-year marriage is over. It took a lot of planning and caused me an extreme amount of anxiety to determine the right time, place, and words to do this.  It sucked, but with the support of my therapist, the cooperation of our marriage counselor, and a wonderful network of family and friends around me, I managed to get through that step.  The next few steps will be difficult, but that by far was the biggest and most daunting. Thankfully, (so far) she has been able to focus on what’s right for our two kids and has managed to keep herself in check as we figure out how to even begin discussing long term arrangements.

I will provide the disclaimer that the dynamic with my wife has not been nearly as extreme an many of the situations found on these boards.  But no matter the intensity or form(s) of abuse, and no matter the intent behind it, it’s still abuse.  And it is not ok.

There is a lot of great information available here, and on the family law board that may help you.  Are you seeing a therapist by any chance? I have found mine to be an incredible resource, in addition to the attorney I have consulted.  A therapist may be able to help you through some potential scenarios and help support you emotionally with some of the tough decisions and doubts you may face along the way... .

Wishing you peace and safety on this journey. You are not alone... .

mw

[WantToBeFree]

I just told my wife yesterday that our 11-year marriage is over. It took a lot of planning and caused me an extreme amount of anxiety to determine the right time, place, and words to do this.  It sucked, but with the support of my therapist, the cooperation of our marriage counselor, and a wonderful network of family and friends around me, I managed to get through that step.  The next few steps will be difficult, but that by far was the biggest and most daunting. Thankfully, (so far) she has been able to focus on what’s right for our two kids and has managed to keep herself in check as we figure out how to even begin discussing long term arrangements.

Hi Mama Wolf, thank you for the welcome and sharing your story about breaking the news to your wife.  I'm so sorry you had to go through that, but I am so glad that hard part is done (albeit followed by equally hard stuff) but I agree, that is the part I am dreading the most.  My husband has been a huge part of my life, as I am sure your wife has been, for 11 years and while I cannot and do not want to stay married to him, I do still love him and in many ways, I wish we could still hang out and talk afterward, but I know that very likely cannot happen.  I wish you well in the days and weeks to come, and I hope I can find the same courage you found.  To answer your question, yes I am seeing a therapist.  He has been a huge help, and he does know my husband (he's come to a handful of sessions here and there) so it's helpful that he at least has met him and know some about him. 

<3

[Gemsforeyes]

Dear WantToBeFree-

I am so so sorry for what you're going through.  This brand of love is extremely painful, and we spend countless late hours questioning ourselves and everything we've come to know, only to find no easy answers.

When we endure abuse, both verbal and physical, our tendency is to isolate ourselves to hide our shame and in some odd way to "protect" our abuser.  That shame doesn't actually belong to us.  So please, if you've become isolated, try your best to open up to close friends, trusted family, a therapist or an attorney. 

The physical abuse needs to be documented, so that in the event you DO leave, that is not the first time anyone is ever hearing that you've been physically abused.  I understand that's very difficult, but you have to tell someone about his history of doing these things to you... .the what and when.  It may be easiest to write it down when you're with the trusted person.

Another thing, the advice about having "your car keys ready" in case he gets angry... .well, yes.  But if you are moving toward the point of leaving,  your "escape plan" should probably be more complete.  You can perhaps consider placing some clothing for you and your daughter at another location; and maybe put some money in a safe deposit box.  And if you sense any danger, you can call your local domestic violence hotline for advice.  They may advise you to obtain a police escort when you're ready to leave.

Since you say your H's escalations to rage are unpredictable, even approaching him in a calm manner to discuss your decision to leave may trigger an explosive outburst.  We never know with pwBPD.  We never know... .and the safety and wellbeing of you and your child are paramount.

I say all of this with an understanding and open heart.  I know that every day, every single day we pray for our beloved to BE the man we love.  Sadly, for most people with this disorder, they cannot, or they will not.  Sometimes it's hard to tell if it's an inability or an unwillingness, at least for me.  And we cannot "fix" them. 

But one thing I've learned is this, I can speak the most profound heartfelt words to him, and their meaning stops at his ears.  He hears them at that moment, loves me deeply, and then repeats the cruelty next time he feels like it.  Simple as that.  There will NEVER be closure for what's been broken.  And that is a sadness that has to be accepted.  You will heal from that in time.  And perhaps raising your daughter in a more serene, less anxiety-riddled environment will more than make up for the lack of closure.

Please keep posting so that you can get all the support you need and want.

Warmly,
Gemsforeyes

[WantToBeFree]

Dear WantToBeFree-

I am so so sorry for what you're going through.  This brand of love is extremely painful, and we spend countless late hours questioning ourselves and everything we've come to know, only to find no easy answers.

When we endure abuse, both verbal and physical, our tendency is to isolate ourselves to hide our shame and in some odd way to "protect" our abuser.  That shame doesn't actually belong to us.  So please, if you've become isolated, try your best to open up to close friends, trusted family, a therapist or an attorney. 

The physical abuse needs to be documented, so that in the event you DO leave, that is not the first time anyone is ever hearing that you've been physically abused.  I understand that's very difficult, but you have to tell someone about his history of doing these things to you... .the what and when.  It may be easiest to write it down when you're with the trusted person.

Another thing, the advice about having "your car keys ready" in case he gets angry... .well, yes.  But if you are moving toward the point of leaving,  your "escape plan" should probably be more complete.  You can perhaps consider placing some clothing for you and your daughter at another location; and maybe put some money in a safe deposit box.  And if you sense any danger, you can call your local domestic violence hotline for advice.  They may advise you to obtain a police escort when you're ready to leave.

Since you say your H's escalations to rage are unpredictable, even approaching him in a calm manner to discuss your decision to leave may trigger an explosive outburst.  We never know with pwBPD.  We never know... .and the safety and wellbeing of you and your child are paramount.

I say all of this with an understanding and open heart.  I know that every day, every single day we pray for our beloved to BE the man we love.  Sadly, for most people with this disorder, they cannot, or they will not.  Sometimes it's hard to tell if it's an inability or an unwillingness, at least for me.  And we cannot "fix" them. 

But one thing I've learned is this, I can speak the most profound heartfelt words to him, and their meaning stops at his ears.  He hears them at that moment, loves me deeply, and then repeats the cruelty next time he feels like it.  Simple as that.  There will NEVER be closure for what's been broken.  And that is a sadness that has to be accepted.  You will heal from that in time.  And perhaps raising your daughter in a more serene, less anxiety-riddled environment will more than make up for the lack of closure.

Please keep posting so that you can get all the support you need and want.

Warmly,
Gemsforeyes

Thank you for your kind words.  Everything you said resonates with me so much.  It's like you literally took the words out of my mouth.  The shame is a big one I can relate to.  I do have support from family in friends, they know everything, except for the abuse.  I am trying to work up the courage to tell someone, but as you know, it's hard.  I feel shame for allowing myself to get into this situation, and for staying in it, and for willingly having kids with someone that I knew could be a monster at times.  That will forever be the single-handed most selfish thing I have ever done... .but my D4 is my world and I will never regret having her, even though I chose a bad man for her father. 

I don't want my loved ones and my friends, some of whom have told me how much they look up to me and how strong they think I am, to know what I live with.  I know they won't judge and they will be supportive, but I worry their view of me may fall some once they know.  And while protecting my image does protect him as well, a part of me DOES protect him willingly, because I don't want them to hate him, even though they should.

I am working on the courage to tell my best friend, and my T knows as well... .about me at least, I have been too scared, and too fearful of him reporting to CPS about my D4 (I wrote about the beginning signs of abuse with her on the family law board, "abusive parent and custody".  Sorry, I am not sure how to link it).  My BF is also trying to work up the courage to leave her husband, though it's a slightly different situation.  Unlike me who just never mentions it, she has come out and said that her H is NOT physically abusive, though she has admitted to verbal abuse (why is it so much easier to admit to that?  Every notice that?  Barring cases where someone is seriously injured or even killed, the physical wounds at least heal, but the emotional trauma of my husband, my supposed protector, love of my life, and partner, doing those things, saying those things and breaking my heart so badly is the hardest part, for me anyway). 

But, I and many others are living proof that some people keep DV from even their best friends.  So if there is any DV in her relationship, maybe by confiding in her about mine, along with getting support, maybe that would give her the courage to divulge hers, if in fact there is any. 

The one good thing about my uBPD H is he is very clueless when it comes to money and such.  He has no idea how many accounts we have, and couldn't access them even if he did.  I do already have a separate account in my name only with a decent amount of money if I should need it, so at least I am set there.  I'll definitely try to solidify my plan a little better in the coming weeks.  But I am lucky that I have lots of close family nearby, so I know if I need to take off and run, I can go there, and just go back to the house to pack a bag when he's at work. 

Your description of your H is so so relatable.  I cannot even describe how amazing it is to be here, and be understood by everyone.  I am sure he will never be diagnosed, but I can relate to almost everything others have said to describe their BPD love in their life.  My H is the same.  I have had so many heart to hearts with him, to the point where I KNOW I am getting through to him, I know I have touched a nerve, and he hears me, and he's got tears in his eyes and I know he is so sorry for everything he has done.  But that will never stop him from doing those hurtful things again and again and again. 

I've often said that despite the hurt he has caused, the bruises, the tears, the utter devastation, the worst, cruelest thing he has ever done to me was make me fall in love with him.  If only he could be a monster all the time, it would be so much easier to leave. 

I'm so sorry you're going through this too.  Thank you so much for the welcome!