Can a BPD wife not be consciously aware of their own lies?

[Help_WifeIsCrazy]

RE: Can a BPD wife not be consciously aware of their own lies?

Is this possible?
To think that you are telling the truth, but not know it?
I know that she is aware of some because these things were exposed as lies.
Could there be certain areas of her life that she is so ashamed of that she created another story and now believes it?

My wife has actually had a false memory also.  She contacted family members and found out that it wasn't true.

Thanks for any insight into this issue.

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[Cat Familiar]

This is a very good question. I have experience in this as an adult with my mother--which causes me now to reexamine much of my childhood and wonder what else was she lying about/misrepresenting?  

But the lie she told me several years ago boggled my mind because it was about something that I had experienced with her and my perspective was far different. In a nutshell, I didn't have any emotional investment and she did. So she shaped her "truth" in a way that supported her narrative of being a victim. While I was just---"Whaaaaaat?"

Absolutely, I believe it's possible that your wife is so ashamed of things that she's created an alternative story. Definitely puts you in an awkward position--trying to discern truth from lies.

[isilme]

Yes. 


BPD is a disorder that is highly adverse to accepting blame or shame.

One way to avoid blame is to invent a new reality that matches a pwBPD's FEELINGS and not any facts others have observed.  They will engage in all manner of mental gymnastics if it means something, anything, can absolve them of the need to accept guilt or shame.  Even for silly things, like who forgot something on a grocery list.  Imagine how important it is for big things? 

Could there be certain areas of her life that she is so ashamed of that she created another story and now believes it?

Yes.  I don't think we can ever quite understand the depth of feelings of embarrassment or shame they seem to feel.  And how they feel avoiding them through a fantasy or gaslighting us is more important than trying to do what we find possible - accept it happened and move on. 

And yes, if you tell a lie often enough, you CAN start to believe it.  This is true for anyone.  H "gets confused" over who said what, when, and who had a great idea, when.  Somehow, things are always his ideas, unless something goes wrong, then they are all my ideas. 

[flyguy]

Thank you for asking this question. I had a situation with my wife yesterday where I know what I said to her, but she repeated my statement in a twisted way to make it seem more judgmental and condescending than what it wasn’t. It tied to convince her that was not what I said, but she was adamant that it was! I honestly felt like I was losing it.

I look at this as her being very disingenuous. Is she being deceitful on purpose or is that truly what she “hears?”

[Enabler]

Without a shadow of a doubt YES.

In fact I would go so far as to say this for me is one of the most damaging elements of my W behaviour. The lies are designed to protect their core (ego)... .similar to that of a narcissist but for opposite reasons. The lies can range from as little as “I didn’t have time, I’ve been so busy” when in fact they did have time they just prioritised their own personal needs, to I have never self harmed. Faced with irrefutable evidence the borderline will rather call the evidence fraudulent or the source incorrect (that could be the entire population of a country) rather than accept they lied... .and is it deceit when you believe everything you say? They have incredibly selective memories and memory distortions, take for example a very old memory, we think of memory like a book in a libruary, we pick it up, read it and pop it back in the same place in exactly the same way... .apparently not. Every time we access a memory we distort it in some way shape or form, applying current ‘knowledge’ and current emotions to that memory. So, if you’re a pwBPD whom is prone to rumination (thinking about the past) and highly volatile and extreme emotions and black and white thinking... .guess what, you can monkey around with your memories of the past quite a lot... .especially about really emotional events. Eg,

“you never come on to me and you use sex as a weapon” (in 21yrs of knowing my W I have never once turned down the proposition of sex, not once. I have lost count of the number of times I have been pushed away).

“I have never self harmed”, despite multiple sources and personal experience saying she did regularly... .no scars... .no self harm.

“I have not had an inappropriate relationship”... .the communication, details of secret dates and other lies exposed would suggest otherwise.

“I was raped”... .dig into the detail and it was a little bit less rape and lot more regret

“I spend all my time doing housework” yes, we all do this a little bit, but pushed on that statement and you’d be calling her a liar if you suggested she spent even a minute doing her own thing... .next breath she’ll tell you about the great bike ride or run she went on for 4 hours that morning... .

I could go on for some time. Critism or being wrong is not seen as a ‘thing’ it is seen as a whole... .I AM WRONG, I AM BAD.

This is why JADE is so important. Arguing against someone’s delusional thoughts about the past (and any details or facts you argue about are typically in the past by their very nature) is in direct conflict with their own certain understanding of facts and threatens their very being. Every time you do so you are saying they are crazy and that’s pretty uncomfortable and hurtful to anybody regardless of it’s truth.

Hope that’s helpful,

Enabler

[once removed]

can you tell us more about these exchanges between you and your wife? some of the back and forth and details in these discussions?

[AskingWhy]

RE: Can a BPD wife not be consciously aware of their own lies?

Is this possible?
To think that you are telling the truth, but not know it?
I know that she is aware of some because these things were exposed as lies.
Could there be certain areas of her life that she is so ashamed of that she created another story and now believes it?

My wife has actually had a false memory also.  She contacted family members and found out that it wasn't true.

Thanks for any insight into this issue.

Dear Help, I know what you are referring to and understand.

What you are describing is called "dissociative amnesia."  They may or may not be deliberate, made-up "lies."

It is common in pwBPD when they split.  You already know about the Jekyll and Hyde nature of BPD.  When BPDs split, they have no recollection of what they did or said when they were in their other "persona."

For instance, my uBPD/NPD H will dysregulate and rage, and in a few day will be pleasant and, for a while, happy.  He has no recollection (or at least vaguely) of the recent time he punched holes in walls, threatened to divorce me, or smashed ceramic dishes.

BPDs have no sense of a past or future, and only the moment.  That is why one day you are loved, and the next day you are hated.

https://www.verywellmind.com/dissociation-in-borderline-personality-disorder-425482

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/conditions/dissociative-amnesia