Can’t help but wonder...

[snowglobe]

This topic isn’t about my uBPDh, it’s about me.
After the latest split, which is still continuing btw, I completely lost touch with myself. It’s very frightening experience. I’m still in my own body, with all my senses, but I’ve lost all the joy, zest, self esteem and touch with who I’m am and what I want.
I no longer believe I’m attractive. Intelligently, I know I’m looking after myself, and I should probably attract other people, I am no longer certain of that.
I no longer believe in my innate and/or learnt intelligence, after repeatedly being told by him “ keep your mouth shut, maybe you can pass off as a smart one this way”. Intellectually I know that I’ve spent many more years in school then him, but suddenly, I’m no longer sure I have anything interesting to share with the world.
I no longer believe I’m kind or compassionate. He’d Been telling me:
 “Once I stop paying for the bills (not my personal spendings, house, car, therapy for s11 and expenses for d15), we shall see wht kind of tune you will sing. You love for me will evaporate, you will be your true authentic self”.
I no longer trust anyone. I have been let down by the closest people in my life, my parent, my spouse.
I feel numb and dead inside. I want to write him a card :”you have won”, and leave.
Everything he has been saying to me all this time, feels real... .
I have cold sweat fantasies where I’m making so little, that I’m forced to sell myself to the highest bidder... .
my spirit is broken, I’m no longer the light for my children, I’m a woman who had sold all of her most precision’s beliefs for the sake of emotional security.
He had successfully broken me.
I fantasize about a strong father figure like man, who will come and sweep me off of my feet, protect me, let me relax, unwind, even for a moment.
I find this to be the hardest part, to convince myself that I have to be my own Munchausen. Take myself out of this situation. As long as I chase after extraneous to fulfill me, make me believe I’m beautiful, kind, compassionate, smart, kind... .my uBPDh is too ill to see that, he is also intimidated and hates it when people say nice things about me. He is the only person who needs to be in the spot light.
This message isn’t about my uBPDh, it’s about me, being masochist with my uBPDh hands, words and actions.

[Notwendy]

I can understand how you feel. You were so young when you started to date your H. You were still very impressionable.

I read somewhere that 7 years of marital verbal abuse has the same impact on a person as childhood abuse.

My own marital situation ( which was not as extreme as yours) left me feeling similar feelings as you have. One reason I think it made such an impact on me is because I also had experienced childhood verbal and emotional abuse and so even though it was less severe than some, it didn't take as much. Not that any verbal abuse is acceptable- it was just that- I didn't see it as abuse at first- it was familiar to me and my own self esteem was low to begin with so what my H said to me resonated with me somehow. It was my mother who called me unlovable and when you are young, you believe it. You were young when you started to hear these messages from your H. It is also confusing when the abusive person blames you. I was blamed for my mother's issues and so when my H blamed me, I believed it.

I don't believe it now.

I also wonder if you haven't developed a bit of Stockholm Syndrome with your H. It seemed to me that my father had done this with my BPD mother.

I believe you can overcome this- you have endured a lot and you are strong, even if you don't know it yet. An inspiring person is Elizabeth Smart- who overcame a nightmare and prevailed, happy and not bitter. I know it took hard work on her part and you will need to do some work on this too- with counseling and support.

If I could make a suggestion - whether or not you stay with your H or leave- please do not look to someone else to assure you that you are attractive. It's important to find your own confidence- your own attractiveness as a human being. Yes, it feels nice to have someone attracted to us but looking to others to fulfill something in us is - especially when feeling down in or after a relationship is a recipe for trouble. In the state you are in you are not likely to attract a person who is good for you. Please love yourself enough to heal completely emotionally as the person you are. You don't lack for anything. It is nice to imagine being swept off your feet- but you have all you need to feel loved- just as you are.

You have mentioned God in your posts and your Jewish background. Perhaps a stronger connection to your own tradition could help you gain some self love. If you feel a connection to it, then it is a part of you that you may want to explore.  I don't know if there is a community near you to make a connection with, but you might explore any options near you- it can be a source of social connection for you. Your H has been the main voice in your head, and it needs to not be the only voice. Most religious communities are also sources of social connection that do volunteer work, have social activities ,and other activities you might enjoy. It is about reclaiming who you are- what makes you YOU. God made you as you are, and you can love who you are.

Also keep posting here. You are not alone. I think many members here could relate. You can reclaim yourself - please do not lose hope  It is good to see that you are focusing on you- now, because you are worth it.

[snowglobe]

I can understand how you feel. You were so young when you started to date your H. You were still very impressionable.

I read somewhere that 7 years of marital verbal abuse has the same impact on a person as childhood abuse.

My own marital situation ( which was not as extreme as yours) left me feeling similar feelings as you have. One reason I think it made such an impact on me is because I also had experienced childhood verbal and emotional abuse and so even though it was less severe than some, it didn't take as much. Not that any verbal abuse is acceptable- it was just that- I didn't see it as abuse at first- it was familiar to me and my own self esteem was low to begin with so what my H said to me resonated with me somehow. It was my mother who called me unlovable and when you are young, you believe it. You were young when you started to hear these messages from your H. It is also confusing when the abusive person blames you. I was blamed for my mother's issues and so when my H blamed me, I believed it.

I don't believe it now.

I also wonder if you haven't developed a bit of Stockholm Syndrome with your H. It seemed to me that my father had done this with my BPD mother.

I believe you can overcome this- you have endured a lot and you are strong, even if you don't know it yet. An inspiring person is Elizabeth Smart- who overcame a nightmare and prevailed, happy and not bitter. I know it took hard work on her part and you will need to do some work on this too- with counseling and support.

If I could make a suggestion - whether or not you stay with your H or leave- please do not look to someone else to assure you that you are attractive. It's important to find your own confidence- your own attractiveness as a human being. Yes, it feels nice to have someone attracted to us but looking to others to fulfill something in us is - especially when feeling down in or after a relationship is a recipe for trouble. In the state you are in you are not likely to attract a person who is good for you. Please love yourself enough to heal completely emotionally as the person you are. You don't lack for anything. It is nice to imagine being swept off your feet- but you have all you need to feel loved- just as you are.

You have mentioned God in your posts and your Jewish background. Perhaps a stronger connection to your own tradition could help you gain some self love. If you feel a connection to it, then it is a part of you that you may want to explore.  I don't know if there is a community near you to make a connection with, but you might explore any options near you- it can be a source of social connection for you. Your H has been the main voice in your head, and it needs to not be the only voice. Most religious communities are also sources of social connection that do volunteer work, have social activities ,and other activities you might enjoy. It is about reclaiming who you are- what makes you YOU. God made you as you are, and you can love who you are.

Also keep posting here. You are not alone. I think many members here could relate. You can reclaim yourself - please do not lose hope  It is good to see that you are focusing on you- now, because you are worth it.

Thank you @BotWendy,
I would have probably made a mistake or disregulated if it wasn’t for this forum. I though of it, regarding the community, many times. We had a pack, many years back- he wasn’t gonna force Christianity on to the children, and I kept my beliefs to myself. My Judaism is limited to the red Kabbalah bracelet, Star if David my parents given me many years ago, and only if uBPDh isn’t around. He cringes when I wear it around him. He even went as far as to buy me a huge diamond pendant, just so I don’t wear my Magen David. I wish happy holidays to the ones around me, but I have not been to the service for as long as I’ve been with him. It’s not so much as explicit forbidding, more of covert disapproval, that trained me to stay away from the land mines. After all, if him and I bleed the same way, and have kidneys in the same spot, we couldn’t be created by two different entities.
I long for that sense of belonging that coming from my community. The sense of unity, family values, traditions and life’s rules. I tried explaining that Judaism is only telling us to lead the way for other people to follow, and to uphold our believes irrelevant of anything else. He only chooses to see that “Jews view themselves as superior to other nations and people”?. Really?.
I can’t be objective, as It’s not a matter of choice, I was born a Jew, and I will die a Jew. Embracing this part of myself will only separate it further more. Yet, it’s that safety net, that if I manage to get my life I order, I will always have my place in my community. It’s complicated by the fact that I’m married to someone outside of the commute. I’ve tried to make friends and get emotional support from women at the Shul. As soon as I become more open, vulnerable, and uBPDh issues rise to the surface, I hear that “oh (insert frown and cringing face here) goim! I have a nice Jewish guy for you”.
It’s not a problem with him being an outsider (well, maybe the cultures and traditions are different) it’s fhe fact that my uBPDh isn’t stable and emotionally unstable. He isn’t a pair of shoes I can hop out off, he is a man that I chose due to my own pattern.
I guess I just need to keep on looking for “my community” and hope that people will see it beyond just a cultural difference

[Notwendy]

Embracing this part of myself will only separate it further more.

And yet, it may save you- you as an individual whether or not the two of you remain a couple- because it is the one thing about yourself that you have not given up for him. It's one thing he can not take away from you and this may be one reason why he hates it.

A good explanation about why a controlling person reacts to someone being different from themselves is in the book "Controlling People" by Patricia Evans.

Every community has it's culture- and while a tendency to "matchmake" you with a nice Jewish man may happen, all you would need to say is no thank you. While it makes sense that a community that is a small minority and has been so persecuted would be wary of intermarriage- and it is, the fact is that intermarriage is not uncommon and there are accepting denominations out there. Nobody can take your spiritual identity from you. I don't believe it is possible ( or even right)  to impose a religion on someone else when they truly are committed to their own religion and identity in their heart. I know you would not ever impose yours on him, but he also doesn't get to take yours from you.

Whatever religion your H was raised in, at the moment, drugs are his god. This is the meaning of the 12 step "Higher Power" - even though someone may intellectually think there is a God or not believe in one, when they make the focus of their lives something else- when it becomes the reason for what they do and most of what they think about, that becomes their god. When we change that focus to letting our own values - what we treasure about ourselves guide us- taking back who we are- we are turning towards our Higher Power and embracing who we really are. By embracing your own religion, you are taking back your identity and if you don't feel this is a safe time to do it overtly you can do this on your own through your own reading and learning. You also can't control your H's choices or behaviors, he has to do this on his own. Trying to get him to see your religion in a different light is probably futile. That's between him and his own Higher Power and yes, you are both made by the same Creator but you can't make him see that. He will have to find his own way of connecting on his own, if it is to happen. That is not in your hands.

The problem isn't cultural differences,  and it isn't because he isn't Jewish- no matter if he makes that the excuse.  The problem is that he is addicted and has a mental illness. This is not restricted to any culture- all people and cultures include kind and loving people and also people who are too ill or addicted to be kind and loving.

[Cat Familiar]

You’re enmeshed in a trauma bond with your husband and he discourages you from having outside friends and cultural influences which might weaken his power over you.

For years you’ve been compliant with that limitation that he’s imposed upon you, but now you’re wanting to reach out for likeminded community.

You’ve been allowing a mentally ill person to make decisions and choose directions for you and your family. Perhaps it’s time to reclaim your own personal power and make choices that are more in keeping with your own values.

[AskingWhy]

You’re enmeshed in a trauma bond with your husband and he discourages you from having outside friends and cultural influences which might weaken his power over you.

For years you’ve been compliant with that limitation that he’s imposed upon you, but now you’re wanting to reach out for likeminded community.

You’ve been allowing a mentally ill person to make decisions and choose directions for you and your family. Perhaps it’s time to reclaim your own personal power and make choices that are more in keeping with your own values.

Snowglobe, I agree with Cat on this.  What you discribe seems like dissociation, a feeling in which one splits off from reality.

Dealing with a BPD for so long makes us question our own sanity.  It's distressing, to say the least.   "The Essential Family Guide" by Randi Kreger talks about staying in an unhealthy relationship for so long that you're stuck before you know it.   The proverbial boiled frog metaphor.

Your experiences echo what I was feeling for so many years.  uBPD/uNPD H whittled me down to a hollow shell of what I used to be.  It took me years to rebuild my self esteem and who I was underneath.  Yes, my H broke my spirit.

I am still not totally rebuilt, but I am stronger than I have been for years.  

What are you planning to do now with this new awareness?

 

[snowglobe]

@Cat, @NotWendy, @Askingwhy
Thank you for reflecting back at my experience.
In all honesty, I don’t know what “normal, independent, strong” are... .I know wht “compliant, obidient, flexible, enduring” looks like.
Even without considering the financial support, I don’t know how to stand on my own, it’s scary.
I’m also petrified that allowing time and distance between us, will shine the light on just how mentally unwell we both are. We are two addicts trying to be sober. I’m afraid that there would not be a way back to each other, once we are apart. He isn’t motivated or mentally fit to ask or change, and I couldn’t go through this tearing up one more time, given the childhood trauma from my childhood’s ugly divorces.
I’m profoundly depressed and distressed. Any way I turn to look at our lives, I don’t see a happy ending. If I stay, he won’t change, this ugliness will repeat itself time after time.
If I leave, I will loose the only family I knew, that was stable... .

[Cat Familiar]

In all honesty, I don’t know what “normal, independent, strong” are... .I know wht “compliant, obidient, flexible, enduring” looks like.

I understand, Snowglobe, as I felt the same way after I divorced my first husband. He took it upon himself to undermine my self esteem and did a very good job of it, even if it wasn't intentional. I remember my wonderful therapist saying, "We're going to have to build you a self."

I’m also petrified that allowing time and distance between us, will shine the light on just how mentally unwell we both are. We are two addicts trying to be sober. I’m afraid that there would not be a way back to each other, once we are apart. He isn’t motivated or mentally fit to ask or change, and I couldn’t go through this tearing up one more time, given the childhood trauma from my childhood’s ugly divorces.

So it's rather intolerable living with the current reality, yet you're afraid about losing some form of stability and family that you currently have. But do you? Is the current situation stable? And wouldn't you still have your mother and stepfather in your life?

Hence, trauma bond. You're afraid to face the unknown and what you might experience, yet you know what is likely to recur with your husband. But can you count on him being "stable" with his gambling addiction and desire to up and leave you and the children and move back to his home country?

I'm not trying to elicit fear, but rather have you contemplate your options. Still, I think it's important to consult with an attorney so that you can understand your legal rights, particularly since you don't trust your husband to do the right thing and provide for you and your children, should he decide to pull up stakes and leave the country.

[formflier]

   

Extra kindness to yourself!  Hang in there!

FF

[snowglobe]

@Cat and @Ff,
He is dangerous to be around. As soon as he comes home to me, which is early, around 5-6pm, I feed him dinner he begins to dysregulate. Right away he starts talking about cuttting me off financially and cutting me out of his life. According to him, his greatest desire is to never see me again. He curses and yells so loud, that I’m fearful. He also makes loud banging noises, and jumps up suddenly and abruptly. Every time he does that, I feel that he is going to charge at me. I can no longer contain the fact that he is physically and emotionally dangerous/abusive individual. How do I prepare mine and the children’s exit?
At this point, given his addiction to cocaine, gambling on stocks, involvement with crypto currencies where he hides the money, I fear for mine and the children’s safety. Last Friday, while dropping me at university he was cut off by the ambulance rushing to the call. He went flying with rage, yelling inside of the car at the ambulance driver. That humanity doesn’t deserve to live. That if he had the black box with the button, he would eliminate all of the humanity. He also explicitly stated that he would not spare even his own children. I’m afraid that once I seek help and protection of the law enforcements he will try to hurt:intimidate or even kill me, or our children. I’m coming back home on Friday, and plan to go seek legal counseling for my options. At this point, I just want to live through this nightmare and make sure that the children are unharmed. If I have to give up the financial aspect, I will. I’m ready to make the deal with him to save the kids.

[formflier]

What if... .what if... .he says something bad, bangs... .and you leave. 

"I'll be back when things are calmer"  (don't aim at him and say "you"... .just announce that you are taking a break... and do so)

 Can you do this?

FF

[snowglobe]

What if... .what if... .he says something bad, bangs... .and you leave. 

"I'll be back when things are calmer"  (don't aim at him and say "you"... .just announce that you are taking a break... and do so)

 Can you do this?

FF

I took a break walking the dog, I have not seen him that bad in a while- he is cussing and condemning G-d. “___ you G-d, I f ing hate you, you have let me down, I dinnounce you, I want to burn in hell. I f ing hatevliving

[Notwendy]

How are you today? It sounds like a difficult evening.

[snowglobe]

I need to pick your brains about something, as I’m sure there is a mirror behind this, and a right way of behaving as to not exacerbate my uBPDh condition further.
Last night was exceptionally difficult- as I described before, he went on the rant about hating G-d, that G-d let him down, that he hates G-d, and wants to bring in hell. He also said “I hate living”. After, he said that he wants to burn in hell, as he broke all connection to Allmighty, and will now start living amoral life. He said that deceit, nausea, repulsion and disgust are now his anthems and goals. When he said he hates living, I couldn’t not react, I looked at him to take a reading at just how bad he is. He misinterpreted it as “ooh, you are scared, aren’t you? You are scared now because I broke all relationships with G-d, I have no moral code now. I will show you the lowest of the low.”
I quietly went to bed, as I was drifting off, he came to bed, sat down and said “you will leave, you will see, I will run you off! I know what you are doing with all psychology sh$t. You won’t be able to last long.”
What’s happening?

[Notwendy]

in a nutshell- verbal abuse.

For now, it's all talk but it is ugly words. Somehow he seems to be escalating the verbal abuse/threats. He may be threatened by your pursuing your degree. It wouldn't surprise me if he sabotages your studying. He may complain about you being financially dependent on him but it is also his security blanket- so long as you are dependent on him, you are unlikely to leave. So long as he can use what is precious to you- your son's therapy to control you- he feels secure. Steps towards your independence- and even your differentiation ( being your own person) are a threat to his own self image.

It is puzzling that an abusive person holds on so tightly to the person they claim to hate ( in the moment) but they do. They need to have someone to treat like that. It comes from their own self hatred and negative emotions. They need a "Teddy" ( the term used in the book Controlling People by Patricia Evans) to soothe themselves with ( like a child uses a Teddy Bear) and to project their negative feelings on to. Your H isn't going to let go of his Teddy easily but there may be few limits on how he could mistreat Teddy.

Something is agitating him ( and it is NOT your job to calm him down- this is his own issue). I don't know if it is the financial loss, or you pursuing your degree, but he is feeling negative feelings and can't handle them- so he uses various things to self soothe- drugs, sex and hurting you ( projecting his own hurts). He knows what hurts you and so he is choosing words and actions that hurt  by aiming at things that are important to you- your children, your religion, your course of study.

Are these words or will they be followed by action? As to words, you don't have to listen to him- stay out of earshot. If he chooses to live an amoral life- that is his problem and if it affects you or breaks the law, then your choice is how to react to that. You can not control his choices. If he brings drugs into the house- call the police. If he endangers someone or himself, call 911. If he wants to curse at God, let God deal with him. You aren't his Higher Power and he can choose whatever he wants to choose when it comes to his own moral and spiritual core. What you need to do is stay safe. Drugs- not in the house,  causing harm- call 911.

A word of warning, if you do consider leaving, that is the most dangerous time for an abusive person. The threat of losing his Teddy could completely disregulate him. People are in most danger of serious harm at this time. Please consult a DV specialist- there are hotlines. There is a way to do this. There are hidden DV shelters in many communities for people escaping abusive spouses. Your H has already physically assaulted you and so you are at risk for this. If he is hopped up on drugs and feels he has no reason to behave morally, you could be at serious risk. Please get yourself informed on how to keep yourself and the children safe.

[Notwendy]

There may be a DV shelter in your area and you may not know it. There is one near me and I have no idea where it is. This is done for a reason- to protect the people there from a partner who is angry and may try to reach them or harm them. While there, they have counseling and support to help them transition to being on their own.

The only reason I know about this is that it is the recipient of charitable donations. They are sent to a local office building that manages this. Prospective residents may contact them for information about how to meet with them to get help. The location is not ever given out unless the person has been screened for need and safety.

Many of the women in the shelter leave with just the clothes on their backs and their children. They arrive with nothing. So the organization accepts clothing, new underwear, and financial help. People just drop these things off at the office that processes them.

Calling a DV hotline may lead you to someone who can inform you about how to manage this if you were to choose to leave and needed a shelter.

Information is not making a decision. It is about knowing your options. I also think it is good for you to go through with your plan to speak to a lawyer and know what your rights and options are. Decisions can come later- after you have information.

[formflier]

I'll second what Notwendy said about secret locations.

I was a government official for a while.  We went to great lengths to keep location of shelters non-descript... .and secret. 

FF

[snowglobe]

@noteendy,
Thank you for replying, I have reached out to local crisis prevention center. They asked me questions at the intake and gave me a few resources, including involvement of children’s aid for the kids. What I’m concerned about, is it seems that all of the words and actions so far are directed at breaking my spirit and leaving him. Yet, he comes home early and dysregulates. If he is so miserable and hates me so much, why not limit our contact? He also hasn’t given me any extra money for cars or therapies this month, staying true to what he said he will do. He has the money and the resources, it’s a choice and punishment, not sure for what?. He usually regulates himself through sex, he isn’t able to be emotionally intimate, only after being studying psychology for 4 years I realized that he isn’t able to progress to sexual intimacy gradually. He stays away, until I’m almost asleep, or in fact asleep, then makes sexual advances. If I don’t go along, because my central nervous system is off, he feels rejected. It used to be easier when I was younger, hormones and all, I was ready to be intimate at any given moment. Now that I’m older, I need that connection. Where as he is still stuck in the teenage phase, where sex is like masturbation, only purpose is to feel better. It isn’t form of connection with another human. I now believe him, when he says that he is bored. Vanilla doesn’t excite him. He needs a circus de solei, or me withdrawn and sad, then he can approach me. We haven’t been intimate since the retreat in the begging of the month... .
In addition, he is in fact triggered by my studies and I do believe he is trying to make it unbearable for me to finish. It’s that much more secure when he knows that I can only get a low paying job, as service or help, for his self esteem and self image. As long as I’m nobody, he is somebody. At the retreat, the community and the people I spoke to were amazing. We talked about mental health, he stayed quiet, now he is “showing me my place” so to say.

[snowglobe]

I'll second what Notwendy said about secret locations.

I was a government official for a while.  We went to great lengths to keep location of shelters non-descript... .and secret. 

FF

@ff,
My only option in the worst case would be facing it on, with the help of local enforcements. With 5 people including myself, two children and my parents, it’s hard to qualify for shelter. My parents are in their mid 50s, when I mentioned it to intake coordintor, she said that they won’t be able to take my dad in. He has nowhere to go, their property is rented out. If I leave with the children, and my parents stay, I don’t know what he might do. It’s unlikely he would try to hurt me physically in front of them. I think he is kind of afraid of my mother.

[Notwendy]

It  may appear to be a paradox that your H keeps you around but he needs someone to abuse.

It takes a great deal of effort to find and secure a new "Teddy" ( person to use to self soothe for sex, to abuse whatever ).  If he has a steady source of supply, he's going to go to it.

Think about this- he wants sex- if you weren't there, he'd have to seek it out- pay for it, meet someone and at least be nice enough for her to have sex with him.  He'd have to find someone who will let him do to her what he does to you. That would take some work on his part.  He thinks in the moment- he has someone at home right there who he knows is going to be available to him. In the case of a narcissists, they both abuse and hold on to their narcissistic supply.

I know you love your parents, but they are adults and they can fend for themselves. It may not be easy for them, but their room and board are not your responsibility- if you can not provide for yourself even. If you had a home and your parents had no place to go- then of course, you would have the ability to help them with a place to stay. However, you don't have this ability. Their comfort relies on you putting yourself in an abusive situation. Would you offer your daughter to someone to abuse so you could have a place to live? If your daughter was in your situation - what would you say to her? Would you tell her- oh put up with this dear so I can have a place to live?

You are responsible for you, your children and if you were on your feet, you would be in a position to provide help for your parents, but without this, you first have to meet the needs for shelter for you and your children. Your parents have income from a rental- they can also then use this to rent a smaller place for themselves.