Pressure cooker tactic

[snowglobe]

Hello all,
I started a new thread as I suspect this will turn out to be a long one as well...
Updates: we came back “home” on Thursday, he “poofed” and magically decided to leave “work place” a day early. I’m not going to go into the last few days, as there is nothing significant to share, except today when he took financial abuse to the next level. Telling me:” you are now living in the salary alone” wasn’t a threat. He actually meant it. When today rollled out and I got a small fraction of what we monthly require for spendings, which is only 60% of what we need as a family I panicked. He barked out :”call the lease busters and get rid of the car”, and xyz... .chore. I tried to speak in a set method: “ I understand you feel like you lost 60% of your assets, I know how hard you worked for it, I also understand that the car is a very expensive liability, but the matter of fact is, we need another vehicle to get around when, or more reasonably when you go to work”. To which Re replied:
“Get rid of the car, everyone can take a bus (d15, me, my mother and our child with disability s11). I calmly asked him, what is the purpose of him doing this to his family, what’s the end goal. His reply:
“I am teaching you obidience. I promise you, you will crawl on your knees with the whole amount of the same from the house, begging me. Even then I am not sure if I will want you, you have lost my trust because you have waited with the sale for two weeks”.
I panicked and called our business accountant, she shared private info, and I hope she won’t be fired. Her and I were friendly, as I would validate her frustrations with ubldh ways of handling finances and expecting other people to read his mind. She said that the money on the account are in abundance! And she will be happy to write me a cheque in lieu of shareholders loan repayment (I took money out earlier to invest into uBPDh’s business from our mutual line of credit for the house). I then called uBPDh’s partner and asked him if it was an ok for him and us to get a cheque so I could stay afloat financially. He gladly agreed.
As I went to pick up the cheque I wanted to speak to uBPDh and inform him, that things aren’t as bad as he thought threy are. That they still have money on the account. What happened next is a blur. As I came to the office and I asked him to come down so we could talk, he stormed downstairs and started yelling at me. “You will pay for this” (swinging in the cheque in my face, “you went behind my back, like a f-being slut that you are, asked my partner for money”. I tried to explain that I didn’t know that the cheque was going to be issued so quickly and promptly, and that I knew that he had money on the business account. He started threatening divorce, saying that he has nothing in common with me, that he lost all respect for me. When I tried to insert that 1.he has money, 2. That I’m not spending on me, I need to pay for bills, therapy and d15, he said with a sinister look on his face, you see, I told you, you will beg.
I then completely lost my mind, there, I asked if the cheque that he can afford to take from the company is a big deal for him, he replied yes. I ripped the cheque in front of him and begged him to speak to me. He stayed in the car, laughing, yelling or smiling, at the tears streaming down my face while I begged him to spare the children. He walked out with a satisfied look on his face, saying that I need to get rid of the car. I don’t remember getting home, I remember almost collapsing in stomach pain on the floor and my mom picking me up. I have colonoscopy and endoscopy scheduled for Thursday as I have blood in my stool. I was finally able to tell my mom most of the truth, sparing her from telling about cocaine and physical abuse. Still, it was enough for her to say: “enough, I can’t want you do this any longer, you need to get out, we are here to help, don’t you dare selling the house”.
So here is my plan, very specifically:
1. Find a counseling through university to deal with abuse
2. While a have access to his crypto wallets, take it in secret to a crypto lawyer for them to officiate the account number, and the amounts on it. I’m sure he will try to stash it, I need proof that it existed
3. Family lawyer
4. Codependent anonymous on Wednesday’s
5. Seek help from women who went through similar ordeal, support groups? Do they exist
6. Lc with him
My parents want me to finish with the bachelors, which is only realistic in April, I don’t think I should wait and should I find a job?
7. I plan to take him for spousal and child support, what do I need to prepare?
8. I need you guys here to know that I’m not going insane
Thank you whoever read this

[snowglobe]

I’m not sure why this post was moved to this board, I’m exploring all options and avenues, but I’m not making a decision yet... shouldn’t I be in conflicted?

[snowglobe]

I don’t have any more strength to fight for, or which him. I’m so devastated by everything, it’s kind of ptsd rolling out, the “Jews don’t deserve to live, the you are so unattractive for me, I have no feelings for you, the I will teach you obidience, the you will crawl on your knees with the keys in your teeth begging me to stop”. I’m petrified. I hid out in my d15 bedroom all evening and night, didn’t come out, I know it’s juvenile behaviour, but I just can’t take any more pain or assaults coming my way. I know what is happening is real, cognitively, but my emotional state refuses to accept this is reality. I’m still waiting for him to snap out of this and realize what he had done. It won’t happen. He never was sorry for any damage he had done, especially he had never went as far as this. My rubbing feet and apologizing tactic had not worked.
I am a coward who was hiding in a teenagers bedroom to avoid a person I thought I will grow old with, the person I nursed back to health many times, the person I was devoted to, the person I travelled after to places I should have never gone to, why is it so difficult and painful to let go of him. I feel like I’m cutting off an arm.

[snowglobe]

Dear Admins,
This is not my board, I don’t have any members here to support me, can you please move me to conflicted?

[Coastered]

I’m still waiting for him to snap out of this and realize what he had done. It won’t happen. He never was sorry for any damage he had done, especially he had never went as far as this. My rubbing feet and apologizing tactic had not worked.

I am happy that you have realised this, it is half the battle.  You know that they will not accept any responsibly or blame - expecting it will make you insane.  I know how you feel about apologising, I did that all the time.  It also does not work, it just validates the abuse (in their minds) that you feel you should apologise for.  After all if they are wrong, why are you saying sorry?  Understand if you can, never say sorry for unreasonable behaviour.

It is like the abuser hitting you and making you say sorry because their knuckles are now hurting.  You can understand, but that is not the same as apologising, I learnt that the hard way.

What are you doing about yourself and your own well being?

[snowglobe]

I am happy that you have realised this, it is half the battle.  You know that they will not accept any responsibly or blame - expecting it will make you insane.  I know how you feel about apologising, I did that all the time.  It also does not work, it just validates the abuse (in their minds) that you feel you should apologise for.  After all if they are wrong, why are you saying sorry?  Understand if you can, never say sorry for unreasonable behaviour.

It is like the abuser hitting you and making you say sorry because their knuckles are now hurting.  You can understand, but that is not the same as apologising, I learnt that the hard way.

What are you doing about yourself and your own well being?

I don’t know what to do, I feel like a deer in headlights.

[Panda39]

So here is my plan, very specifically:
1. Find a counseling through university to deal with abuse
2. While a have access to his crypto wallets, take it in secret to a crypto lawyer for them to officiate the account number, and the amounts on it. I’m sure he will try to stash it, I need proof that it existed
3. Family lawyer
4. Codependent anonymous on Wednesday’s
5. Seek help from women who went through similar ordeal, support groups? Do they exist
6. Lc with him
My parents want me to finish with the bachelors, which is only realistic in April, I don’t think I should wait and should I find a job?
7. I plan to take him for spousal and child support, what do I need to prepare?
8. I need you guys here to know that I’m not going insane
Thank you whoever read this

Hi Snowglobe,

I think you ended up on this board because of the above.  The folks here can help you plan, strategize, and protect yourself if you are in the place where you want to work/act on your list above.

I'm not familiar with your story but from what you've posted above it it terribly abusive, your husband is a bully and using a lot of fear to control. I'm so sorry you are experiencing this. 

If you are thinking about leaving there is a book that is helpful... .
Splitting: Protecting Yourself While Divorcing Someone with Borderline Or Narcissistic Personality Disorder by Bill Eddy (Obviously, keep this on the down low) 

Maybe we start with number 1, finding Counseling? I assume for yourself. It sounds like you have some direction there... .going through your local University.  Have you considered what to look for in your Counselor?  I would certainly look for someone familiar with BPD, it sounds like finances are a concern (aren't they for everyone ) so someone covered by insurance maybe? Do you work? Some employers have "Employee Assistance Programs" (EAP) where you can get some free Counseling visits. 

Have you considered reaching out to your local DV agency?  They might be a good resources to connect you with several of the items you list above.

How do you think your husband would react to you starting Therapy?

Panda39

[snowglobe]

Hi Dkanddyk,

I think you ended up on this board because of the above.  The folks here can help you plan, strategize, and protect yourself if you are in the place where you want to work/act on your list above.

I'm not familiar with your story but from what you've posted above it it terribly abusive, your husband is a bully and using a lot of fear to control. I'm so sorry you are experiencing this. 

If you are thinking about leaving there is a book that is helpful... .
Splitting: Protecting Yourself While Divorcing Someone with Borderline Or Narcissistic Personality Disorder by Bill Eddy (Obviously, keep this on the down low) 

Maybe we start with number 1, finding Counseling? I assume for yourself. It sounds like you have some direction there... .going through your local University.  Have you considered what to look for in your Counselor?  I would certainly look for someone familiar with BPD, it sounds like finances are a concern (aren't they for everyone ) so someone covered by insurance maybe? Do you work? Some employers have "Employee Assistance Programs" (EAP) where you can get some free Counseling visits. 

Have you considered reaching out to your local DV agency?  They might be a good resources to connect you with several of the items you list above.

How do you think your husband would react to you starting Therapy?

Panda39

He is projecting already, calling me crazy and schizophrenic.last night, when I tried to speak to him, “you said that trust is important... .”, looking straight him in the eye, he started laughing, saying that (normal saccadian eye movement which everyone has when they fixated on one object)”your eyes are moving, you are schizophrenic.
I just walked away. He will make fun of me and ridicule me for that, mocking “ooh, you are being abused, you poor thing, ho tel mommy about that”.

[Coastered]

I don’t know what to do, I feel like a deer in headlights.

Everyone here feels like that. You are not alone.

You are not to blame, say that over and over to yourself.  Look after yourself, it is not narcissistic to care more about your well being than his especially if it is so abusive as it seems.  You are more important than him, especially if you are being damaged by his behaviour.  What could you do to look after yourself?

He is projecting already, calling me crazy and schizophrenic.last night,

Yes he is projecting, this is probably what he feels about himself.  Some partners with BPD CAN make you feel crazy but you are not.

He will make fun of me and ridicule me for that, mocking “ooh, you are being abused, you poor thing, ho tel mommy about that”.

Been there, heard that.  My heart goes out to you.  In a rage, or moment they can say the most disgusting things.  IGNORE IT!  (I know it is hard).

My advice you need to be safe, that is paramount.

[livednlearned]

he took financial abuse to the next level

He made a verbal threat (intimidation), and like you said -- you panicked.

I panicked and called our business accountant ... .she will be happy to write me a cheque in lieu of shareholders loan repayment ... .I then called uBPDh’s partner and asked him if it was an ok for him and us to get a cheque so I could stay afloat financially. He gladly agreed.

This is a one-up. He threatened financial abuse, and cutting a check without his knowledge/permission escalated it further.

He started threatening divorce

Has he done this before? Have either of you talked about divorce?

I then completely lost my mind

I can only imagine. You are financially dependent, he threatens to cut you off, you find a way to get money without his knowledge, he threatens divorce. It's a lot.

How do these kinds of escalations typically resolve for you two?

[snowglobe]

He made a verbal threat (intimidation), and like you said -- you panicked.

This is a one-up. He threatened financial abuse, and cutting a check without his knowledge/permission escalated it further.

Has he done this before? Have either of you talked about divorce?

I can only imagine. You are financially dependent, he threatens to cut you off, you find a way to get money without his knowledge, he threatens divorce. It's a lot.

How do these kinds of escalations typically resolve for you two?

I radically accept the break up, he snorts enough cocaine to kill a horse, comes to me, “we need to talk, you did xyz, it’s your fault. Why did you leave me? So looked so composed, you lived your life.”

[livednlearned]

I radically accept the break up, he snorts enough cocaine to kill a horse, comes to me, “we need to talk, you did xyz, it’s your fault. Why did you leave me? So looked so composed, you lived your life.”

Radical acceptance is the way we talk about accepting the challenging characteristics of these special needs relationships, both in having empathy (not easy) and protecting ourselves (boundaries). Is that what you mean by radically accepting?

Or do you mean that you accept this is headed for divorce, and it's done and done.

What's happening in the home now?

[Skip]

As I came to the office and I asked him to come down so we could talk, he stormed downstairs and started yelling at me. “You will pay for this” (swinging in the cheque in my face, “you went behind my back, like a f-being slut that you are, asked my partner for money”.

I tried to explain that I didn’t know that the cheque was going to be issued so quickly and promptly, and that I knew that he had money on the business account. He started threatening divorce, saying that he has nothing in common with me, that he lost all respect for me. When I tried to insert that 1.he has money, 2. That I’m not spending on me, I need to pay for bills, therapy and d15, he said with a sinister look on his face, you see, I told you, you will beg.

I then completely lost my mind, there, I asked if the cheque that he can afford to take from the company is a big deal for him, he replied yes. I ripped the cheque in front of him and begged him to speak to me.

He stayed in the car, laughing, yelling or smiling, at the tears streaming down my face while I begged him to spare the children. He walked out with a satisfied look on his face, saying that I need to get rid of the car. I don’t remember getting home, I remember almost collapsing in stomach pain on the floor and my mom picking me up. I have colonoscopy and endoscopy scheduled for Thursday as I have blood in my stool.

I was finally able to tell my mom most of the truth, sparing her from telling about cocaine and physical abuse. Still, it was enough for her to say: “enough, I can’t want you do this any longer, you need to get out, we are here to help, don’t you dare selling the house”.

So here is my plan, very specifically:
1. Find a counseling through university to deal with abuse
2. While a have access to his crypto wallets, take it in secret to a crypto lawyer for them to officiate the account number, and the amounts on it. I’m sure he will try to stash it, I need proof that it existed
3. Family lawyer
4. Codependent anonymous on Wednesday’s
5. Seek help from women who went through similar ordeal, support groups? Do they exist
6. Lc with him

My parents want me to finish with the bachelors, which is only realistic in April, I don’t think I should wait and should I find a job?

7. I plan to take him for spousal and child support, what do I need to prepare?
8. I need you guys here to know that I’m not going insane

Thank you whoever read this

Don't you think you should call a domestic abuse counseler hotline and line up a consult with someone?

[snowglobe]

Don't you think you should call a domestic abuse counseler hotline and line up a consult with someone?

Hello Skip, thank you for the reply. I remember when I got here things were also little shaky. Yet, being in one place, the continuity and the routine was more or less stable for uBPDh. I have booked my consult for the upcoming week. Speaking to the intake the have asked me about dv, any police reports and so on. Which I spoke about in hypothetical scenario. I suspect the lawyer will advise me to report. I also know that he will take it as ultimate deception and there won’t be any chance for reconciliation. I am not sure if there is any now. He went through with every single threat he has made to me recently. I’m not sure if you follow my story, but ever since we came out of silent retreat he isn’t smoking or using cocaine, he however split on me so much so that I completely lost track of reality. Given my current situation, do you think there is any hope of him coming down to baseline? If so, what would “healthy” steps on my part be? Thank you in advance

[GaGrl]

Hello Skip, thank you for the reply. I remember when I got here things were also little shaky. Yet, being in one place, the continuity and the routine was more or less stable for uBPDh. I have booked my consult for the upcoming week. Speaking to the intake the have asked me about dv, any police reports and so on. Which I spoke about in hypothetical scenario. I suspect the lawyer will advise me to report. I also know that he will take it as ultimate deception and there won’t be any chance for reconciliation. I am not sure if there is any now. He went through with every single threat he has made to me recently. I’m not sure if you follow my story, but ever since we came out of silent retreat he isn’t smoking or using cocaine, he however split on me so much so that I completely lost track of reality. Given my current situation, do you think there is any hope of him coming down to baseline? If so, what would “healthy” steps on my part be? Thank you in advance

I thought after you came out of the retreat he also had an incident in which he partied with his friends.  Would you not call that similar behavior?  What was he doing that night -- drinking? Anything else?

[snowglobe]

I thought after you came out of the retreat he also had an incident in which he partied with his friends.  Would you not call that similar behavior?  What was he doing that night -- drinking? Anything else?

heavily drinking, when he arrived home and his friends followed I stood on my driveway getting ready not to let people in, especially those I know to be criminals and drug users. He went inside, retrieved cocaine from his stashing place, which he always changes btw, and brought it out to his “friends”. They left immediately. After that he sent to sleep alone in the basement, but went to work early the following day and appeared to be sober. His cocaine use is older then my eldest d15, it’s about 17 years old. By now I know the signs, it’s usually making him remorseful

[babyducks]

The intake/consult?  Is it with a lawyer or a DV agency?

[snowglobe]

The intake/consult?  Is it with a lawyer or a DV agency?

Lawyer, I’m concerned that putting too many wheels into motion will somehow blow up on my face again. What is they will mandatory report him? Then someone else will make the decision for me to pull the plug... .

[livednlearned]

Do you have specific questions for the L? Maybe we can help you here think of a list of questions to ask.

It can feel emotional to talk to an L.

We might be gathering information, but sometimes it hits the part of our brain that thinks this is a decision (emotion brain). In the consult, if you have the list ready, it can help even emotions out so you can focus on what is being said (problem-solving brain).

[snowglobe]

Do you have specific questions for the L? Maybe we can help you here think of a list of questions to ask.

It can feel emotional to talk to an L.

We might be gathering information, but sometimes it hits the part of our brain that thinks this is a decision (emotion brain). In the consult, if you have the list ready, it can help even emotions out so you can focus on what is being said (problem-solving brain).

Please give me ideas and facts to share

[livednlearned]

Here's a great start, especially for figuring out if you have a lawyer who can guide you safely, without unnecessarily escalating the conflict:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=270440.msg12566140#msg12566140

What are some questions you have for the lawyer you are consulting with? We can work from that with you.

[Notwendy]

Dear Admins,
This is not my board, I don’t have any members here to support me, can you please move me to conflicted?


Please don't be afraid to post on more than one board. This is the right place to discuss legal questions and advice. I post on the boards that are pertinent to my own experiences- and these are where I can share what I have learned from them. However, I don't post here much as I do not have any experience with the legal system - so I can't share that. However, if I were to be seeking advice, information, and support on this topic- this would be the board I would post the questions on.

I am not an admin, but I surmise your post was moved here because this is the best place to discuss the questions you posted.

No matter what section your post is in- it does not take away your free will to choose what direction you wish to take. The categories are for the posters- they don't have actions on the partners. The partners are not posting here. Any actions are yours to choose.

You will find support here too and information so that you can make informed choices.

[ForeverDad]

This may not be the time now, but down the road and once separated, one condition you request is for mandatory surprise drug testing.  Given the history, that's not an unreasonable request.

Be aware that court may more easily agree with such an order if both parents start out taking drug or alcohol tests.  If you keep coming up clean and he doesn't, then the order can drop you and continue with him.

Does he drive 'under the influence' with the children in the vehicle?  If so, then that is something very concerning to the court and children's services.  It's one thing to drink or partake, quite another thing entirely to drive with them while impaired.

[snowglobe]

This may not be the time now, but down the road and once separated, one condition you request is for mandatory surprise drug testing.  Given the history, that's not an unreasonable request.

Be aware that court may more easily agree with such an order if both parents start out taking drug or alcohol tests.  If you keep coming up clean and he doesn't, then the order can drop you and continue with him.

Does he drive 'under the influence' with the children in the vehicle?  If so, then that is something very concerning to the court and children's services.  It's one thing to drink or partake, quite another thing entirely to drive with them while impaired.

Thank you for the suggestion, it’s fitting giving the circumstances. I don’t allow him to have any access to the children when he is under influence, nor does he try, really. Also, I think it’s excellent idea regarding both of us being tested, it will provide some accountability.

[ForeverDad]

I wasn't suggesting you ask for testing for both.  I suggested it only if the court was reluctant to start drug testing on your ex.

You're thinking in a "let's be fair" mode.  That often sabotages us somehow.  Honestly, most of us stayed in our relationship mess for far too long because we are reasonable and fair people, unwilling to give up too soon.  Collectively, our fairness and our niceness ended up being used against us.  For example, if you needlessly volunteered to be tested too, what if you had a test that returned ambiguous results?  Maybe you were at a wedding reception the day before, some celebration after work one day, and oops.  What I'm saying is don't invite potential problems however unlikely if you don't have to.

[livednlearned]

Do you want to learn more about the legal process for divorcing someone who is abusive?

[snowglobe]

Do you want to learn more about the legal process for divorcing someone who is abusive?

In hypothetical scenario, I’m still considering all of the possible outcomes

[flourdust]

In hypothetical scenario, I’m still considering all of the possible outcomes

Makes sense. The first time I met with an attorney, the consultation was about exploring my options. I had read a lot about divorce online, but the general information that's out there isn't nearly as useful (or accurate) as what you can learn in an hour from an experienced family law attorney in your geographic area.

The attorneys I met with asked me questions to help understand my family situation and financial situation -- having all that information you've been gathering about the finances will be really valuable there -- and then talked to me about how divorce might work and what sort of outcomes were likely for parenting time, division of assets, etc. It's also a good opportunity to ask about things your husband might have threatened... .such as cutting off your finances. I suspect that he can't legally get away with what he has claimed.