Is everyone here suffering from trauma

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

I guess my situation is maybe unique. My life has been touched by the cluster Bs twice. In each case i am n/c. I am having trauma like symptoms. I had two pretty bad days this week and I'm not even in contact. I'm frankly sick of it.  I also feel like the people who care about me suffer in a way too or would if they knew how much I'm suffering. I'm sick of seeing people that don't deserve this (including me I guess) suffering.

I guess ignore that rant part but I'm just wondering those who are out of these relationships honestly are you suffering from trauma symptoms? I'm beginning to feel despite optimism that there is trauma after this.I don't need encouragment  I just want to know where other people are with trauma symptoms.

Also just an observation but I'm not sure everyone is aware they are suffering from trauma. because I suffer from it I recognize the symptoms. Things like ruminating thoughts, hypervigilence, uncharacteristic rage/anger... the context in which people describe these symptoms I think they are usually dealing with trauma too. Don't know if they would label it that way

[Stillstruggling]

I guess my situation is maybe unique. My life has been touched by the cluster Bs twice. In each case i am n/c. I am having trauma like symptoms. I had two pretty bad days this week and I'm not even in contact. I'm frankly sick of it.  I also feel like the people who care about me suffer in a way too or would if they knew how much I'm suffering. I'm sick of seeing people that don't deserve this (including me I guess) suffering.

I guess ignore that rant part but I'm just wondering those who are out of these relationships honestly are you suffering from trauma symptoms? I'm beginning to feel despite optimism that there is trauma after this.I don't need encouragment  I just want to know where other people are with trauma symptoms.

Also just an observation but I'm not sure everyone is aware they are suffering from trauma. because I suffer from it I recognize the symptoms. Things like ruminating thoughts, hypervigilence, uncharacteristic rage/anger... the context in which people describe these symptoms I think they are usually dealing with trauma too. Don't know if they would label it that way

[BetterLanes]

Hi Stillstruggling,

I'm still in a relationship but I wanted to post up some lists of symptoms here. As you said not everyone is aware they are suffering from trauma. Some readers might also not know that there is a (debated) state called Complex PTSD (C-PTSD) which is caused by trauma from repeated or ongoing events (eg child abuse, domestic abuse, captivity), rather than from a single key event (eg car crash, natural disaster, wartime event) which causes classic PTSD.  This website has a good explanation of both:
https://www.mind.org.uk/information-support/types-of-mental-health-problems/post-traumatic-stress-disorder-ptsd/symptoms-of-ptsd
https://www.mind.org.uk/information-support/types-of-mental-health-problems/post-traumatic-stress-disorder-ptsd/complex-ptsd
I thought that trauma was just something you got after a single severe event until I read about C-PTSD.

Hope that helps,
BetterLanes x

[BasementDweller]

Hi there, stillstruggling. 

I'm sorry to hear about what you have endured, and no, your situation is absolutely not unique. Many, or I'd say most of our members here have suffered and are still suffering trauma in the aftermath of these relationships. Those still in the relationships are as well, as BetterLanes mentioned.

I left my BPD ex in June and I still suffer from hypervigilance, anger, nightmares, panic attack symptoms, heart palpitations, anxiety, depression, and relentless insomnia (to name a few). I have never had a relationship with a cluster B person prior to him, and I never have even had a relationship with a "difficult" person before. He was the first, and despite having worked on the front lines in a level 1 trauma center in one of the highest crime and most violent cities in America for thirteen years, nothing, and I mean NOTHING that I witnessed there could have prepared me for the hell that this man put me through, or the horrors of watching him deteriorate into psychotic madness, and make me the target of his rage.

I am in a new relationship with a very kind, reasonable, emotionally stable, affectionate and loving man.  It is a constant struggle to not worry that he will turn on me and start to become abusive. (He is nothing like my ex and gives no indication whatsoever that he is capable of this.) I sometimes wake up sweating, trembling and gasping for air in his arms because I forget where I am and think for a second, while emerging from a nightmare, that my ex is back and has his hands around my neck.

You are absolutely not alone. These experiences are nothing short of horrific.

It does sound like your symptoms are trauma related. Are you getting any support? You mentioned not needing encouragement, but this stuff is serious. It can do long term harm in so many ways to suffer from unaddressed trauma. Do you go to therapy or have friends or family who can lend support?

Best wishes,
BD

[Stillstruggling]

Thank you for the replies.

You mention working in a trauma center and serving in a war. Both things that did not push either of you over into trauma despite the trauma risk. In between my cluster b's I also experienced something that technically could have caused PTSD but didn't. Basically an instance where I was the victim of an aggrevated robbery where I perceived that I was being dragged into a car and feared the worst. Because I had already dealt with trauma I was very aware and afraid of the effect it might have on my brain. But I still walk and drive that same stretch of road where I was attacked everyday and I am not triggered or reminded. But conversely there are landmarks from my relationship that I can't pass without being triggered into a very bad mental health day. I will take alternative routes to avoid them opting instead to take the road where I was physically attacked by three people.

So none of us sound like wimps. There is something about cluster B relationships that can push even a very strong mind beyond what they can handle and into trauma.

I've observed from reading about the stories of dsm qualified trauma victims that yes it was life threatening but that there was also often a psychological element that triggered their PTSD. It wasn't just the fact of the traumatic event but also the psychological elements around it. It's the denials, the betrayal of trust in authority, it's the lack of justice, lack of being believed, it's witnessing people not acting within a moral code. Not every traumatic event causes PTSD. In those who do go on to develop trauma there is often an additional psychological element.

I have a theory that people with cluster b disorders have a way of condensing those psychological elements in their relationships just by being them.

I am aware of the c-ptsd diagnosis and also the fact that it's not yet an official diagnosis. I still feel like my issue feels more like PTSD than c-ptsd. I think the dsm currently is not being inclusive enough in their causes of teauma. I think emotional abuse and psychological abuse need to be considered as a cause.

[Tosquinha]

YES.  I recently found out that there is such a thing as Post Traumatic Relationship Syndrome!  But yes, even my T recently talked about these kinds of relationships and them being traumatic.

[Cromwell]

 Not anymore but absolutely yes, and it was the first relationship where I could ever use that word appropiately and that is despite having had some experience with some challenging personalities - this was something that ramped my anxiety up on a minute to minute, daily basis and took over the span of a year to finally ebb away. The worst of it was the stalking element, despite going NC I felt that I would never get her out of my life, she would be an intrusion and although my life is back to normal and I dont get the ruminations, anger or hypervigilance - there still is an element of wondering if it really is over. I dont know about the psychology behind trauma but I feel like ive got towards the last stage of recovery, but it was a hellish process to get there and in the state of mind it feels like it will always be that way.

thats just my own experience what i went through, hopefully someone more knowledgeable on the theory of trauma can help out better. It is possible to recover though, and one thing that could have helped was anger management counseller of some sort, the ruminations went away when enough time went on and life went on without her around, they became pointless, the hypervigilance went away when I realised she had given up on stalking or thinking that there was any chance id ever feature in her life again, i managed this by intentionally ghosting her twice.

there is a lot of despair stuck in that place, but there is a way out of it, so keep your hopes up stillstruggling, I think its great that you recognise all of it as clearly as you do, I wasnt so aware of why or what I was feeling initially.

[In a bad way]

   So does everyone who is out have some kind of trauma     

Without a doubt.
2.5 Years later and I am still traumatised by it, triggers are everywhere. I don't watch certain TV shows and I don't eat certain foods, getting to sleep takes a few hours of lying there and I wake up soaked.
I've just been to the supermarket and it's like going on a mission behind enemy lines, I was soaking wet with sweat and I didn't get half of what I needed because I had already gone past it and no way am I turning round to go back, I have to do a fast in and out job. Then drove like a lunatic to get home and it will take me a couple of hours to calm down.
I don't go to the nearest supermarket because the last time I went in there was with her and it would mess my head up and possibly bump into her or one of her family.
When we were together I could walk round a shop and browse nice and calmly, I could sleep and didn't wake up depressed.
The list goes on.

[Stillstruggling]

If we are suffering from something that looks like PTSD I am wondering if is it something we can recover from.

Ptsd is actually a life long chronic condition that sometimes goes into remission but is for life. I know some people might not view it like that but this is what the research shows. It's fact really.

I'm not sure if what so many of us experince is PTSD or just a type of short lived trauma that resembles it. This matters because the difference would be that it's not life long or chronic.

[Harley Quinn]

Hi Stillstruggling,

I can say that I suffered severe trauma effects during my r/s and ongoing for over a year, however I found that counselling helped these to reduce. I also take medication to help with the panic attacks.  It's coming up on 2 years now and whilst not to the same degree I am still affected by symptoms. My BPD r/s was not my first rodeo either. I'd say that it's a lot more manageable now because I recognise it for what it is and in some cases strategies work to overcome the issues. Others less so. 

Your question above is an interesting one and I think that either way, support is essential to manage the impacts on our lives.  If we live with something long term, developing ways to cope and manage is important.  Can you tell us about your situation?  How are you affected and for how long?  What support do you have in place?

Love and light x

[Mustbeabetterway]

Hi still struggling (I feel like that could be my name, too). All of our situations are unique, yet have many commonalities.  Maybe that’s what makes us a “family”.  I’m sorry you’re struggling and having bad days.  However, I am glad you are reachimg out.  

.

I guess my situation is maybe unique. My life has been touched by the cluster Bs twice. In each case i am n/c. I am having trauma like symptoms. I had two pretty bad days this week and I'm not even in contact. I'm frankly sick of it.  I also feel like the people who care about me suffer in a way too or would if they knew how much I'm suffering. I'm sick of seeing people that don't deserve this (including me I guess) suffering.

I can understand how people you care about suffer, too.  One of the plethora of reasons I have stayed separated and am working on detaching is that my grown daughter was suffering and worrying every time we would separate and then shakily reconcile.  Other people and parts of my life suffered as well, so I get you.  

I guess ignore that rant part but I'm just wondering those who are out of these relationships honestly are you suffering from trauma symptoms? I'm beginning to feel despite optimism that there is trauma after this.I don't need encouragment  I just want to know where other people are with trauma symptoms.

Also just an observation but I'm not sure everyone is aware they are suffering from trauma. because I suffer from it I recognize the symptoms. Things like ruminating thoughts, hypervigilence, uncharacteristic rage/anger... the context in which people describe these symptoms I think they are usually dealing with trauma too. Don't know if they would label it that way

I definitely suffer from the symptoms you list.  I’m getting better through time and space, and connecting with friends.  .  I also exercised, do yoga, eat healthy and try to get enough sleep.  Sleep is the tricky one for me. I’m also still in therapy for anxiety.

I hope you are practicing taking care of yourself.  What are you doing to relieve your symptoms?

Also, we all need encouragement.  I’m glad that you shared with us and hope that we hear more from you.

Peace and blessings,

Mustbe

[Cromwell]

Is the nub of the question to do with a worry that this might be something you will carry on into the future - if so it is a worry that I shared at the time. I think trauma for what I went through is close enough to my understanding of the dictionary definition, but how it translates into a clinical condition is something i can say that I have in the main, escaped from, most significant is by going complete no contact, it was evident even within a small passage of time that there was improvements simply by not allowing the possibilty of more trauma generated on to old. NC was damage limitation, healing and recovery from what had happened took action steps.

There is stuff that can be done to at least mitigate what has happened, I can still feel post trauma memories but the difference is, they dont send me into an emotional tailspin like they once did, they are also frequently less occurring with the passage of time and distancing from the time being in a r/s. Life goes on and any of these memories have lost their sting, they resemble more of learning experience to chalk up as life lesson. Stuff like anxiety, depression, hypervigalance symptoms etc are things that can be isolated and dealt with rather than package it all up and let it masquerade as actual ptsd.

[Stillstruggling]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. Sorry I'm not responding back individually. I'm on my mobile and so it's harder to make good posts.

I guess these questions mostly have sprung from the difficult time I've been having lately.

I'll feel resolute about wanting to be finished with this... like I'm done. I'm okay. And then I'll wake up with trauma like symptoms in the middle of the night. I can even go to sleep feeling positive and wake up with my heart pounding.

I'll also wake up feeling like it's a trauma day. I know how my day is going to be by how I feel that morning. I can have a bad day and then wake up the next day feeling better.

Right now I feel fine. I feel positive and sure that I'm going to have a great week. It feels unimaginable that I should have to go through a couple days like what I went through last week but in all likelihood I probably will.

It honestly feels like a lot of suffering when I'm in this trauma type zone. I don't know if this is similiar to what others are experiencing.

I've done a lot of processing (researching BPD, reflecting) since I hit rock bottom with this relationship last winter. I feel like it's time to move on.

[Harley Quinn]

Sharing our stories can be very cathartic and help us to work through some of the emotions.  Perhaps you could tell us about what you've experienced?  Who do you speak to about what you're going through?

Love and light x

[Fie]

Hello 


This is how I felt after my relationship with NPD ended :

www.gettinbetter.com/fallout.html

You are definitely not alone.

Do you feel like going to a therapist to help you with this ?


Fie

[Stillstruggling]

Basically I've already been through npd with a family member in a conflict that ended in no contact. I experienced trauma like symptoms for a five year period after this happened. I recovered and then this person I had gotten close to in the interim had BPD. I did not know they had BPD or what BPD was. I honestly think my NPD family member wasn't even as bad in comparison. They at least didn't insist I stuck around just so they could be abusive. Maybe I should have caught the signs but I didn't until he starting exhibiting certain behaviours that came later. By the time he showed symptoms we had already established a close relationship

I can't tell if I've been retraumatized and had never fully rrecovered. I'm not sure if I would have went over to trauma had I not already been traumatized or if the fact that I had made me more susceptible to it happening again. Whatever it was I'm suffering is identical to what I experienced before

[Cromwell]

It does sound like there is an element of linking the two together - the past relationship with NPD and the most recent one. Im sorry for you having to endure both successively, but at the same time, you indicate that you did get over the trauma from the prior relationship indicating strength and experience.

I had the same issue of waking up and feeling I was in a state of an anxiety ridden panic attack, it happened whilst in the r/s as well as a few times after. There is a lot going on in our minds and it is not conducive to a restful sleep. Yet, part of my solution was to think wider than just trauma and the relationship itself - what other factors are going on that contribute? are there other stressors in life and this is something heaped on, or are you doing fine and this is the issue?

The tools you used to recover succesfully first time around, its a case of implementing them again, building up confidence that you will overcome this a second time round just as you did before.

knocked down... .but get up again. The ending of this r/s is the opportunity towards moving your life on to something more fulfilling and healthy.

[Stillstruggling]

Well last time I had the support of other family members who were close enough to understand the situation. I also lived in a different city which I didn't even see at the time what an advantage that is. I considered it a miracle that I recovered and it took five years.

So in many ways I feel like I escaped a disabling life long trauma situation. Maybe that perception isn't correct but that's how I view it. Now I'm worried it might be even more entrenched or complicated. I hope I escape from it again. It's true I did it once. But doing so almost felt like lightening striking and reading around it seems rare. However maybe I wasn't fully healed because i still was very careful to avoid the sight or knowledge of them.

[once removed]

Basically I've already been through npd with a family member in a conflict that ended in no contact.

what happened?

I experienced trauma like symptoms for a five year period after this happened.

what sort of symptoms?

I recovered and then this person I had gotten close to in the interim had BPD.

was this a romantic partner? how did things end between the two of you?

I can't tell if I've been retraumatized and had never fully rrecovered.

trauma can be persistent. often the way that it manifests has origins that can date as far back as our childhood. in order to recover from trauma, one has to reprocess it (talk about it, probe it, get perspective on it) in a rehabilitative/therapeutic way. its not easy, but as they say, the only way out is through.

[Mutt]

Hi Stillstrughling,

Now I'm worried it might be even more entrenched or complicated. I hope I escape from it again. It's true I did it once. But doing so almost felt like lightening striking and reading around it seems rare

I was worried about not being able recover from the break up I consider myself tough I am emotionally but this was pain that was in a different league. The pain was not just from the break up I could feel old pain resurfacing.

I had GAD, anxiety, depression, panic disorder before my exuBPDw after the r/s I had hyper vigilance, PTSD, trouble concentrating but that’s probably from ADHD symptoms caused by anxiety that’s what the ADHD doctor in my city said anyways.

Have you talked to an MD, GP, T or P?

[Stillstruggling]

 Hi. Yeah I have done edmr with a therapis. It was less than helpful.  I basically kept trying to explain the situation before I had any of this vocabulary. Any understanding I have I had to find myself and that was after I identified my family member as NPD. I also went to this one woman because she had a kind face and she ended up being into crystals and selling like crystal warrior protection. I feel like she almost should have been reported for trying to sell crystal suits to clients.  And I stopped going to her because I realized that was pretty bad but I actually got more out of her than the edmr woman simply because she listened and seemed kind.

I feel like when I went through this the first time all I wanted was someone to listen. At the time I was like maybe I should just pay a homeless person to listen because they need money and that's all I'm looking for.

I don't even really know how to find a qualified person. I also want to maybe try ADHD medication or be evaluated to see if I have ADHD because from all my research I know that can make you get stuck on things.

It honestly feels like PTSD. When I'm suffering it's incredibly intense. It's basically like I have non stop thoughts about this and they hurt me. I have been suffering again for two days after a week of having improvement. Its actually kind of triggering when people are like is it anxiety or is it depression. I know what depression and anxiety feel like. And no it's not. It's an intense pain caused by recollections of a very specific situation. It's so bad that it feels disabling when it happens. And I've always had really strong mental health my whole life prior to this.

I have ocd and I could potentially see that I might have ADHD. I wonder sometimes if that has anything to do with it or if it's just regular trauma. I am interested in hearing more about how ADHD can effect this if you have any additional information.

When I feel like I'm suffering from trauma as I am now I attempt to do mindfulness and try various things to change the channel and change my focus but it can be very difficult. But I naturally on my own started using the same stategies used for PTSD.

[Stillstruggling]

 Yeah that does sounds similiar to what I experience. Sorry to hear about your experiences but it feels good to know I'm not alone.

[Stillstruggling]

 

was this a romantic partner? how did things end between the two of you?

It was kind of like a romantic relationship in that I was the person he fixated on and pursued. It was a lot of romantic gestures and romantic declarations.

I'll use a metaphor it was like a genie in a bottle situation. Like how if you find a genie in a bottle they owe you for life. Only I found him and so I owed him for life.

[Skip]

Stillstruggling,

It would help us understand better if you could add some specifics and time frames to what happened to you. It's hard to look at these things in a general sense.

Everyone here has struggled with the relationships and relationship demise. As a general (very general) statement, most of these relationship bonds were "loaded". What our partner needed from the relationship was not healthy. Often what we needed was not healthy too. The partner may have be far more visibly "messed up" than we were, but there were likely deep underlying hopes and vulnerable attachments styles that made for a partnership that was extremely hurtful to us - in the relationship. Because of our own attachments struggles the pain often continues well past the end of the relationship and may repeat in other relationship failures.

OCD and ADHD could certainly play a significant role in this. Your feelings might be  chronic depression. They could be PTSD.  It could be a deep ego wound.

You are searching for it, which is good. Finding it will help you start to unravel the feeling you have. It may take a lot of reading/discussing here, but you will see it in others like you. Hang in there.

For me, it was insecure attachment style. I can trace it back to childhood. I was not dysfunctional at all, and I didn't have a series of bad relationships, but it was there and the BPD relationship (along with some other external stressors that landed at the time) really broke me down. I struggled with profound feelings of loss, ruminations, nightmares.  It took a few years and some hard work to fully bounce back. It took a few more to learn how to be more secure in my attachment and mindful of understanding my innate reactions to things.

Tell us a little more about you.

Skip

[Stillstruggling]

Sorry the exceprt function on mobile is difficult for me... So i started feeling better today. So I can explain both what the trauma days and what the normal days are like.

I guess I feel like I never get anywhere with explaining this to people because the effort it takes to explain what I'm experiencing is so lengthy.

I was just in intense pain for two days. Now today I feel normal again. I have intrusive thoughts about this person constantly and on a good day it's annoying but I don't get sucked into them. On good days I feel like myself again.

So on the bad days it's like I get sucked into the thoughts and I can't get out and the thoughts are beating me.

When I talk about thoughts what I'm talking about are the intrusive thoughts about the things i.am having trouble processing from this relationship. These things include things that were said to me and done to me.

I have a high threshhold.for being upset normally. There is nothing else that upsets me it is singularily this.

What I just went through for two days was extremely intense.
I've been depressed in the past and so I know what depression is. One time I took myself off benzos and as a withdrawal symptom was pretty secerely depressed for a year. So I know what even intense depression feels like and this is not that.

It feels like being attacked and beaten by my recollections. I just can't possibly describe how painful it is. I was crying this.morning just from the pain.

Before this happened to me I had never experienced.this type of feeling. I have explained it like in the past my pain level no matter what I went through still only feels like 1 person but with this I feel like 100 people suffering.

I am an otherwise healthy person. And when I am not suffering from this I am fine. Well despite ocd but even that I try to deal with it in stride.

In terms of the pwBPD I've done a lot of work around it already. I've dealt already with the loss of him but now I am just concerned about the trauma symptoms.   

[Skip]

Sorry the excerpt function on mobile is difficult for me...

You don't need to use  it. If you want to direct a comment to a specific member just use Skip.  

Let's keep it very simple. Was this a romantic relationship (opposite sex, same sex) or a friendship  (opposite sex, same sex)? Did you live together, live separate, was it long distance? How long ago? How long was the relationship? Was there infidelity/theft/physical abuse? Can you describe 1 traumatic event (20 words or less)?

This all has significant bearing on your feelings today.

So on the bad days it's like I get sucked into the thoughts and I can't get out and the thoughts are beating me. When I talk about thoughts what I'm talking about are the intrusive thoughts about the things i.am having trouble processing from this relationship. These things include things that were said to me and done to me.  

These are deep wounds that are probably beyond your ability to process right now. It's hard to say anything more without knowing some details.

Please don't feel pressured to share. Do whatever is comfortable for you, now.

[Stillstruggling]

It's a relationship that's long over. He is diagnosed with BPD but feels more like a sociopath snuck into my life. It's not really the issue because I've dealt with it. I am relieved to have him out of my life. I've educated myself on the disorder and I'm not even in the information gathering stage anymore. I'm just trying to work on my symptoms now.

[Skip]

I just want to know where other people are with trauma symptoms.

I personally suffered from PTSD for a 6-8 year period. In the middle of my relationship, I suffered a significant extended physical trauma (i.e., surgical malpractice). The two combined caused me a fair amount of ongoing distress - mostly nightmares. I participated in CBT for 6 months which was helpful for my awake hours, but not help the nightmares. Medication did not help the nightmares so the Rx portion of recovery was brief and not helpful. I made some significant changes in my life (started a mission, volunteered to helped others worse off than myself) and that reorientation, more than anything, helped me. I am 90% recovered today and living a healthy life. I have an occasional nightmare trauma, but I can bounce back in a few hours.

[Stillstruggling]

I made some significant changes in my life (started a mission, volunteered to helped others worse off than myself) and that reorientation, more than anything, helped me. I am 90% recovered today and living a healthy life. I have an occasional nightmare trauma, but I can bounce back in a few hours.

That's really great to hear. When I suffered from my thing with family it took me five years to recover and so that experience lines up pretty well with mine.

This is a tangent but I came across something called narcissist abuse syndrome and I wonder if there isn't a temporary type of trauma that comes from dealing with cluster B people. And if maybe the recovery time can be in the 1-6 year timeline.

I feel like psychology doesn't address enough why dealing with the things common to cluster B causes so much harm or even what part of the person it effects.

[Skip]

I wonder if there isn't a temporary type of trauma that comes from dealing with cluster B people... .

With the exception of children of mentally ill parents (children are defenseless), I don't think the recovery is solely about the partner... .it's a lot about us. Many of the non-professional Internet sources suggest that mentally ill people are vampires. It you read what the research psychologist say, its a very different picture.

I have since encountered people with mental illness and they haven't caused me to lose any sleep.

I am in a relationship with a very healthy person and against that backdrop, I can see my own issues. They aren't obvious to anyone else, but I see exactly what it is me that made the "BPD relationship" so hard on me.

I'm not underestimating how difficult and damaging a person with a mental illness can be in a close relationship. But look at the people coming back from war. Since WWII, psychologists have studied why some people exposed to the same trauma end up living on the street or shooting themselves, and others go on to me motivational speakers and win special Olympics. Family theory was born out of these initial investigations.

[Skip]

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