L Not Getting Paid

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Not sure what to make of this.

I was granted interim in April. Although it's my STBX who is to pay interim FIL is actually the person okaying the interim. Before I got interim, I had been without money, except for a very modest SSN check, for six months.

I have been okay since. Not great, but okay. The money has come in as a direct deposit in all that time. Last month it was changed, so it is now a wire, which costs me money. Not a lot. Still it's a change, and it had worried me. I thought my FIL was getting ready to tell CPA not to send interim. (I know. I may be borrowing trouble, as my mother used to tell me.)

The problem is I don't trust FIL at all. So I mentioned it to my L, who said not to worry, it's just as easy to stop a direct deposit as it is to stop a wire.

So I relaxed. Until yesterday. FIL has not paid my L (and hadn't paid his L or STBX's L) for at least the past 2 months. L wrote to FIL's L expressed irritation and gave a date by which s/he needed to be paid or she would need to get a court order. FIL's L got back in touch, told my L to please file the court order, as FIL is not cooperating with his lawyers. Second time I've heard how difficult he's been.

I would characterize my FIL as ruthless, something I am not, which is part of why I distrust so much.

By not paying my L, discovery and settlement stop. The settlement facilitator we had agreed on is backed up 4 months.

Here's my biggest worry: I am scared my FIL is somehow trying to get me without legal representation and then cut me off again.

I don't know if that's a legitimate worry. If there's a court order regarding my interim, my STBX could go to jail. However, my STBX may have moved out of state, and if that's the case, it's unlikely he'd go to jail, at least right away.

I am now nothing but a business transaction to my FIL, and although some might not agree, I don't think he fights fair. He is the type to spend $1 million to get $500,000 if he thinks he's been wronged. (I actually witnessed this with a former employee of his.) And I know he blames me for the divorce although it was my STBX filed.

Okay, so that's my worry. In a way, it's good to run through worst case scenarios. Last two times he cut me off I wasn't prepared. This time I am. It will be very very rough, especially right before the holidays, but this is exactly when he cut  me off last time.

Okay. Off to figure out more of what to do.

TMD

[toomanydogs]

Not sure what to make of this.

I was granted interim in April. Although it's my STBX who is to pay interim FIL is actually the person okaying the interim. Before I got interim, I had been without money, except for a very modest SSN check, for six months.

I have been okay since. Not great, but okay. The money has come in as a direct deposit in all that time. Last month it was changed, so it is now a wire, which costs me money. Not a lot. Still it's a change, and it had worried me. I thought my FIL was getting ready to tell CPA not to send interim. (I know. I may be borrowing trouble, as my mother used to tell me.)

The problem is I don't trust FIL at all. So I mentioned it to my L, who said not to worry, it's just as easy to stop a direct deposit as it is to stop a wire.

So I relaxed. Until yesterday. FIL has not paid my L (and hadn't paid his L or STBX's L) for at least the past 2 months. L wrote to FIL's L expressed irritation and gave a date by which s/he needed to be paid or she would need to get a court order. FIL's L got back in touch, told my L to please file the court order, as FIL is not cooperating with his lawyers. Second time I've heard how difficult he's been.

I would characterize my FIL as ruthless, something I am not, which is part of why I distrust so much.

By not paying my L, discovery and settlement stop. The settlement facilitator we had agreed on is backed up 4 months.

Here's my biggest worry: I am scared my FIL is somehow trying to get me without legal representation and then cut me off again.

I don't know if that's a legitimate worry. If there's a court order regarding my interim, my STBX could go to jail. However, my STBX may have moved out of state, and if that's the case, it's unlikely he'd go to jail, at least right away.

I am now nothing but a business transaction to my FIL, and although some might not agree, I don't think he fights fair. He is the type to spend $1 million to get $500,000 if he thinks he's been wronged. (I actually witnessed this with a former employee of his.) And I know he blames me for the divorce although it was my STBX filed.

Okay, so that's my worry. In a way, it's good to run through worst case scenarios. Last two times he cut me off I wasn't prepared. This time I am. It will be very very rough, especially right before the holidays, but this is exactly when he cut  me off last time.

Okay. Off to figure out more of what to do.

TMD

[david]

So you know when he cuts you off and you are learning his way of doing things.
My ex had me all twisted around in the beginning. Once I settled down and distanced myself emotionally it all became a game with the rules (legal) and I just needed to know how to use them. Fairness is not part of the "justice" system. Justice is served when the courts make a ruling and follow the rules that are established. The better you understand the rules the better you get at playing the game.

[formflier]

Did your L tell you things would stop until she got paid?  I would doubt she would do that.  She has a court order route and a L on the other side helping her with appropriate information.

If anything... .I might advise you to push harder for discovery... .

Overthinking alert... .focus on YOU being the troll... .not FIL. 

FF

[toomanydogs]

Did your L tell you things would stop until she got paid?  I would doubt she would do that.  She has a court order route and a L on the other side helping her with appropriate information.

If anything... .I might advise you to push harder for discovery... .

Overthinking alert... .focus on YOU being the troll... .not FIL. 

FF

ahh, FF. When I'm twisting in the wind, agonizing in my head, I see that image of my being a troll beneath the bridge, and it makes me laugh.

I responded to you elsewhere, and, yeah, everything has stopped until my L gets paid. And FIL's lawyers contacted mine admitting that FIL has stopped cooperating.

And with that, I'm off to take care of animals.   
TMD

[formflier]

 
Can you ask your L if she can get past this... .to keep the process moving?

If not... .Is there a way you can pay a small amount to get her to launch some arrows back the other way. 

The thing is... I can't imagine she doesn't' eventually get paid and it seems like her stopping plays into FILs hand... desires.

FF

[toomanydogs]

Can you ask your L if she can get past this... .to keep the process moving?

If not... .Is there a way you can pay a small amount to get her to launch some arrows back the other way. 

The thing is... I can't imagine she doesn't' eventually get paid and it seems like her stopping plays into FILs hand... desires.

FF

I'm thinking, but I could be wrong, that by filing a motion to get her fees paid, and a motion for a default judgment (I don't think my FIL anticipated that, but I could be wrong) that she is moving it forward.

Also that default judgment was accompanied by a request for a final decree for a legal separation, which is what I'd wanted initially. Now I don't care.

But I'm guessing that L filed that way to force FIL's hand. I'm thinking my STBX is not going to want a legal separation. It benefits me in that I still get medical insurance.

I'm waiting for the next 5 to 6 weeks to see what his response is.

FIL has let the pool break. Upside? I now have a skating rink, albeit a small one. 

Not maintaining the property, which he refers to as an asset, is also puzzling to me, but then I tend to think of myself as relatively logical, and if I were required to maintain an asset, I would. It hurts my heart that FIL is letting the property fall into disrepair. That could also be calculated.

I will be grateful to be beyond this.
TMD

[formflier]

Perhaps you are right.

I would encourage you to email your L and ask if there are any other legal things she would be doing at the moment... if she was getting paid.

Has discovery been asked for (or demanded)... .whatever the word is or has that been delayed due to non-payment.

FF

[david]

When my ex was in a highly agitated emotional state she would use the scorched earth policy, if I can't have it no one can. Later, when she realized what she had done, she would project the blame on someone else in order to feel better about herself. It still doesn't make sense to me but I'm glad of that.

[toomanydogs]

Perhaps you are right.

I would encourage you to email your L and ask if there are any other legal things she would be doing at the moment... if she was getting paid.

Has discovery been asked for (or demanded)... .whatever the word is or has that been delayed due to non-payment.

FF

Yeah, discovery was due the second week in December, and now it's been delayed indefinitely.

And FIL had objected to the scope of discovery, wanted his lawyers to narrow the scope.

TMD

[formflier]

Yeah, discovery was due the second week in December, and now it's been delayed indefinitely.

And FIL had objected to the scope of discovery, wanted his lawyers to narrow the scope.

TMD

OK... and is there something your lawyer could or should be doing about it at the moment... .but isn't.

That's what I'm driving at.  You don't get to control their crazy... .but if their crazy is delaying your lawyer from taking action... .well... you need to talk that out with your lawyer... because that is letting crazy win.

FF

[toomanydogs]

Okay, FF, let me think about what she could do, and I'll ask her. I agree, the crazy is definitely in control right now. Not necessarily winning, but definitely in control.
TMD

[ForeverDad]

Also that default judgment was accompanied by a request for a final decree for a legal separation, which is what I'd wanted initially. Now I don't care.

But I'm guessing that L filed that way to force FIL's hand. I'm thinking my STBX is not going to want a legal separation. It benefits me in that I still get medical insurance.

Early on, you didn't want the marriage to fail and hoped separation would give time for some kind of resolution.  But then it became apparent that the prolonged emotional and legal obstructions instead indicated a clean break would be best.

Beware of shifting back and forth from one goal to another.  Too much emotional turbulence and backwash IMO.

Me? I don't think health insurance support is a reason to stay in a dysfunctional and distressing marriage.

[formflier]

Hey... .sometimes the question needs to be precise.

"Is there anything you could be doing to advance my case, that you are not doing because you are waiting on payment."

If the answer is yes... .then ask follow up questions.

FF

[toomanydogs]

Okay. Sounds good. I'll get in touch with L on Monday.
TMD

[toomanydogs]

Beware of shifting back and forth from one goal to another.  Too much emotional turbulence and backwash IMO.

Me? I don't think health insurance support is a reason to stay in a dysfunctional and distressing marriage.

I agree, ForeverDad, health insurance is most definitely not a reason to stay in a marriage.
However, I believe my L has written it that way to get FIL and STBX to move on this.
A legal separation in my state is almost identical to a divorce, except that I wouldn't be able to remarry, but spousal support, the division of property--all of it--is exactly the same. And at this point I'd be willing to call their bluff: Okay, don't give me a counter offer, let it be a default judgment, including a legal separation as opposed to a divorce.
It really doesn't matter, and I'm pretty certain it matters both to my FIL and STBX. I see it as a move on my L's part to force their hand. We'll see how it plays out, but probably not for another 4 or 5 months.
TMD

[formflier]

I  I see it as a move on my L's part to force their hand. 

Yes... yes... .triple yes.

This is exactly the kind of stuff your L should be doing to show them "you are a Troll".

For the discovery thing... .perhaps there is a way to force it... .and then hold them in contempt for not providing things.

Note:  If the default judgment is "more than enough" for you, then perhaps the above stuff isn't warranted.

Asked another way... .do you believe the default judgment is more than you would get if discovery "went the way you hope" and this issue went to trial.

Random advice:  Do you have "proof" that you asked for help/warned them about the pool being damaged?  Very important to preserve that if you have it... .so that you can establish a pattern of them trying to damage/devalue the marital property... .to damage you.

Hope you had a good Thanksgiving!

FF

[toomanydogs]

Yes... yes... .triple yes.

This is exactly the kind of stuff your L should be doing to show them "you are a Troll".

Yeah, i think my L is as good people have told me.

For the discovery thing... .perhaps there is a way to force it... .and then hold them in contempt for not providing things.

Would love to do this.

Note:  If the default judgment is "more than enough" for you, then perhaps the above stuff isn't warranted.

Asked another way... .do you believe the default judgment is more than you would get if discovery "went the way you hope" and this issue went to trial.

Default judgment would be more than enough, and I think it would be worth it, even if I could get more at a trial, just to be done with this. I purposely went higher than I'd expected to get, primarily because of the type of negotiator FIL is. If I'd asked for what I expected and what would be enough, FIL would have gone lower, and I wouldn't have had room to negotiate.

Random advice:  Do you have "proof" that you asked for help/warned them about the pool being damaged?  Very important to preserve that if you have it... .so that you can establish a pattern of them trying to damage/devalue the marital property... .to damage you.

Yes, I have proof going back to May about the pool, letting them know that I didn't know enough about pools to know if the water level dropping would hurt it.
I have emails/texts regarding the pool needing to be closed before winter.
I have an email to L regarding my not wanting to be blamed if the pool broke. L told me no one would blame me as FIL hired property manager.
I have emails about the roof leaking.
Like I said, FIL's behavior is puzzling. The pool cost more than my first house, letting it break is bound to be costly.
[/quote]

Hope you had a good Thanksgiving!

FF

I had a terrific Thanksgiving. Great to have my kids and grandkids here. Had a little too much wine, something I rarely do.

 
TMD