I'm at the end of my rope with DD25's rage and verbal abuse of GS4

[Only Human]

I suspect it will be a long time before either of them reaches out to the other. DD has exploded at GG before, when GS was about a year old. That time, the cut-off lasted just a couple of weeks before DD called to apologize. This time, we shall see.

GG is very opinionated and she voices her opinion freely, hurt-feelings be damned. I'm very familiar with her, "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" approach, have experienced it first hand when I was clinically depressed in my 20's.

I sent a text to GG a few hours after she left, sending love and support, but not an apology for staying out of it.

Me: Hi GG, I'm sending you some love. I know how I've felt after an event like today's; angry, frustrated, and sad. I hope you enjoy your movie later.

GG: Thanks for that but I have to be honest with you about DD. I don't think she is fit to be raising a child. It tore me up for him and it's so unhealthy for GS. After she called the police I heard her saying to him, "We don't like GG, she's a bad person."* She constantly seems to push away anybody who gets close. She desperately needs help. You need custody. The cops said "We're familiar with her, we've been here before."

Me: It tears me up too, when she's making unhealthy/destructive choices. Pushing people away is her go-to. I'm sad to hear that you heard her talking like that about you to GS. He knows the truth, I know the truth. I love you.

Me: She also knows the truth. She just can't see it in that moment. Black and white thinking has got to be up there in the list of most challenging behaviors with people with BPD.

GG: Love you back. I just wish she would get some help for herself. If not, GS will suffer for a long time.

Me: Yes, he's the innocent victim in this horrible situation.

*I heard all of what DD said, my bedroom and her bedroom share a wall. I never heard DD say this.

In the past, GG and I might have had a long discussion about "what to do about DD!" I'm not in that place anymore. I feel very protective of DD.

~ OH

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Only Human]

Oh yeah! I forgot to report the good news.

I woke up at 5:00 to work (busy time at work and I'm behind!) and heard GS in the bathroom at 5:20. Soon after, I heard DD telling GS it wasn't time to wake up, GS protested loudly, DD kept her voice low and calm. She put him in his room and told him he could wake up in 90 minutes, she would set an alarm, and until then he had to try to go back to sleep. She locked the door, GS was silent.

She sent a text letting me know what was going on. I texted back, "Ok, sleep well =)"

It's been a good day.

~ OH

[FaithHopeLove]

I am so happy you finally had a good day.

[Music Ace]

Baby steps in the right direction = wonderful celebrations !

Feel good about handling everything with grace OH.  Well done!

Ace

[Only Human]

Thanks FHLKC and Music Ace. I appreciate your support!

I'm back with more good stuff. DD is being consistent and firm with GS and GS is pushing every button. He's currently on an extended take-5 for kicking his bedroom door. I took the opportunity to go out into the kitchen for a drink (it's hard to tear myself away and go back to work when GS is wanting my attention but I must work!). DD is painting rocks, I had sent her a text, "I like how you followed through with consequences for GS."

We ooh'd and ahh'd over the rocks she was painting, I got a drink, then this happened:

Me: You're doing great being firm with GS, he's sure pushing it, isn't he?

DD: Yeah, painting rocks is keeping me calm. I also wanted to thank you for the other day. At first when you said you were staying neutral, I felt very abandoned. But when you stayed consistent with being neutral even after the police came, it made me feel good that you were being neutral.

Me: You're welcome. Thanks for sharing that with me.

DD: So yeah, I was talking about how it made me feel good and thought I should share that with you. Thank you again, it meant a lot to me.

Me: You're welcome again.

DD: Whew, that was tough.

Me: Sharing was tough?

DD: Yeah, I mean, it's not tough for me to share my feelings but it's tough to share them with you. So yeah, that's it, goodbye.

Me: (silly tone) Thanks, you're welcome, goodbye!

~ OH

[Only Human]

I didn't step back today, and I'm not sure I should have. I could use some feedback. I'm nervous about falling into our old habit of her not asking for what she needs and me stepping in to prevent a complete meltdown.

I've been working overtime every day this week and DD has not had any time to herself (away from GS) since Sunday afternoon. GS is 4 and rambunctious, as 4-year-olds are. He woke up at 5am, and didn't nap, has been running around the house all day, being loud and uncooperative. DD refrained from yelling, has been alternately patient then impatient with GS, talking calmly to him then lecturing him loudly.

GS was on a time-out, banging on his bedroom door, yelling.

I'm working from home, in my bedroom, and DD texted:

DD: I can't do it today, mom.

DD: I'm not ok.

Me: How can I help?

DD: I don't know but I'm gonna snap.

Me: I hear your frustration and that you can't do it. I'd like to help, what do you need? A walk? Me to take him with me to the store? I have some time banked, about 30 minutes.

DD: Store would be good to have him away for a min :/

DD: I can't walk I'm so mad tired and hungry.

Me: Ok, I'll get dressed and come out.

Time-out was over so GS came out while I was getting dressed. DD lectured him in the hallway, raising her voice, GS argued, DD continued to lecture and finally told him, "Go into the living room, I can't deal with you right now."

I came out and GS was on the couch, watching something on the tablet. He told me he was sad because mommy yelled at him. I said, "I'm sorry that happened, GS, that's no fun." GS started crying and walked to DD and I heard this:

GS: I'm so sad because you yelled at me.

DD: I still love you even though I yell sometimes.

GS: You do?

DD: Yes, I do.

GS: Can you please stop yelling at me?

DD: I'm working on it.

GS and I were gone for about 15 minutes and when we got back I asked DD, "How's it going?" She told me she's feeling better, she's had something to eat. exBF was here to take DD to a medical appointment and they all left shortly thereafter.

When they got home a few hours later, I came out for a break from work. DD told me about her appointment and GS was jumping around between us, making loud noises. DD sent him on time-out then broke down, crying.

She told me she needs more time away from GS; when they spend too much time together, it goes poorly. She gets stressed and impatient, GS gets stressed, and she yells at him, which causes GS to misbehave more. She knows she yells too much, said she feels like a bad mom, then she tells herself she's not a bad mom, she's just stressed, but then she tells herself she's only telling herself she's not a bad mom to make herself feel better, but she is a bad mom, says she knows that a slap across GS's face would make him be quiet but she can't do that, she's thisclose to giving him melatonin pills to make him sleep but she's not a pill-giving mom, she doesn't know what to do. 

I did my best to validate and listen with empathy. I said, "I'd like to help."

DD: You can't help. I'm with him all day alone, it's just my life. I'm so tired, he doesn't sleep and I need time to myself.

Me: If you'd like, I can take over the bedtime routine. Are you feeling up for a walk? I know how much you enjoy walking in this nasty weather.

DD: Yeah, that'd be good. Ok.

I'd like to have DD tell me what she needs rather than me making suggestions. This has been a problem for us in the past and was one of the first things we talked about in family therapy. DD shared that when I rescue her, it makes her feel like I don't think she's capable of doing things on her own. DD agreed to ask for what she needs and I agreed to wait for her to ask me. However, when I ask her what she needs, she says she doesn't know. If I say, "If you can think of something, let me know," her emotions escalate and she accuses me of not being helpful even though she's clearly asking for help.

I haven't really tried my hand at SET or DEARMAN after my last disastrous attempt at SET about a month ago, I've been focusing on validating and repairing our relationship, building a bridge. That's gone very well and DD seems to trust me, open up to me. I'm wondering which technique I should try - my goal is to talk with her about asking for what she needs specifically so that I don't fall into the habit of rescuing her from her emotions, then feeling resentful that I'm "doing everything."

Am I asking too much from DD? To little? Where is the balance?

I've still got a couple of hours of work to do and it's already 8:30 - I'm already feeling a little resentful because, while DD complains about being so tired, she stays up very late every night. I know she's depressed, I know she wants to feel better. I'm tired too 

~ OH

[once removed]

Am I asking too much from DD? To little? Where is the balance?

not asking too much in a punitive way, no.

people with BPD traits struggle to identify their needs. so in turn, they struggle to communicate them. having needs feels "needy", so they struggle with even having needs, and can feel self loathing over having them, which is often then projected on others.

it looks a lot like expecting other people to read their mind. its important to be realistic about the limits here, especially in times of stress.

i think SET or DEARMAN would both be good techniques here. maybe even try both on the board, get some feedback.

[Only Human]

Thanks for the reminder to be mindful of DD's limits, OR, and for sharing the insight into how BPD's view having needs.

I will take your advice and try my hand at SET and DEARMAN here on the board; coming here for feedback and support has been so great for me, I'm forever grateful for you all.

After GS was in bed night before last, DD thanked me for taking GS to the store and for taking over the bedtime routine so she could take a walk. I said, "You're welcome, I'm glad you're feeling better. Please know that you can ask for what you need." She said, "I know, I'm getting better at it."

Yesterday, she asked me to think about which days would be best for me to care for GS overnight if she is hired at the care home (she has an interview Tuesday); today, she asked if I could take her grocery shopping tomorrow. exBF is out of town, she didn't remember he would be, and she's out of food.

So I see that she's able to ask for what she needs - but, like you say - in times of stress, forget it.

Onward!

~ OH