Well, I Got an Offer...

[toomanydogs]

i haven't been on these boards in a while. nothing new to post. until now.

it's too complicated to explain all the ins and outs of the past few months, but my L has a court date coming up pretty soon, so she can get paid.

this morning, she sent me the other side's "offer."

they still want to annul the marriage because i coerced this mentally ill man into marrying me.

they want to hire a forensic accountant to determine how much i stole from my STBX over the course of the marriage.

they want to charge me criminally for stealing from my STBX over the course of the marriage.

in order to save me the embarrassment and cost of discovery and possible criminal charges they will pay me the prenup. and they want me out of the house in 60 days with a walk-through prior. guess they think i'm like my STBX and that i'll destroy the house.

i told my lawyer that i was really tired of being portrayed as this controlling thief of a woman. told my L that if they think i did something criminal, charge me. if they think they can annul the marriage, go for it.

the forensic accountant can only benefit me. and i seriously would love to see them try to charge me for stealing from our joint bank account.

(Insert expletives here)

TMD

[Turkish]

What are you going to do?

[toomanydogs]

Hi Turkish,
  I already did it. I got back to my lawyer and said:

  1) My FIL pulled the same "criminal" stuff when I'd attempted to divorce STBX  several years ago. Let L know that I had told him then to file charges, and I repeat that response. I have nothing to hide. I didn't steal. And in this state a joint bank account belongs to both parties equally. Not possible to steal from one. In order for me to have done anything criminal, I'd have had to steal from my STBX's private bank accounts. I also said that I could have stolen from STBX when we first met because within 2 weeks of knowing him, he'd given me access to his bank accounts and his SSN and his mother's maiden name and all his previous addresses.
  2) That I had asked my FIL to allocate money differently so my STBX had a portion put in his private account and I had a portion in my private account, so STBX wouldn't construe my paying bills as stealing.
  3) That STBX had accused both me and FIL of stealing on Facebook. (Have the post)
  4) That I have emails going back to the very beginning of my relationship with STBX and they would argue strongly against my being a controlling woman who had coerced a mentally ill man into marrying her so she could get his money.
  
  My L got back to them, laid all that out, and told them that the two offers they'd sent so far had been a waste of everyone's time and when they are ready to offer above the prenup then send something.

  In my state, a prenup cannot adversely affect a spouse's right to alimony because the state doesn't want its population on welfare. Given my age, the discrepancy in resources between my STBX and me, and the length of the marriage, I will, in all likelihood, qualify for lifetime alimony. I say "in all likelihood" because I don't know the judge, can't tell the future. However, my L was on the committee that wrote the state standards for alimony.

  What L said in the letter was that the latest offer was really "take the prenup or else." If there needs to a forensic accounting, which can only benefit me, I will ask that the court appoint someone so I can be assured that that s/he is not biased.  

 Finally, I handled the money how I was advised to do by STBX's psychiatrist at the time. I emailed the P and the former T asking if they'd be willing to testify, if this were to be litigated. However, I'm pretty sure the P will not get back to me--not a fan of mine. Additionally, one of my STBX's caregivers was at the meeting where I'd been advised to handle the money as I did. She could testify. Because she's more of a friend these days, I hate to get her involved, but she said she would.

  We shall see where this goes. At this point, my FIL is going pro se  He doesn't like lawyers or real estate agents. And I'm not really sure how that'll look should we go to court.


TMD

[david]

FIL going pro se. Sounds like he wants to help you.
Back in 2007 my stbx literally took everything she could out of our house. When I say everything I do mean just that. I had to replace 47 electrical covers throughout the house since she removed them all. She took the three spring loaded toilet paper holders from each bathroom. I mean everything. A few months later I came home and got the mail. I had a rejection letter from our homeowners. I discovered that ex put in a homeowners claim stating that I stole everything from our house and she wanted money. Since both of us were on the policy they rejected it stating that you can not rob yourself and then make a claim. I had to read it three times until it sunk in. I laughed so hard after that. Years later when we finally got divorced we had to go through equitable distribution. She again made the same claim and put a valuation of 1.2 million. I would estimate it was less than $20,000. She hand wrote four pages of things she claimed I stole. When she first left she rented a house and put all kinds of pictures on facebook. We were still friends so I made copies of all the photos in her new place. Around 80 % of the things she claimed I stole were in the pictures she posted. When her attorney seen a few of the pictures she took her client out of the room and we settled around 20 minutes later. I actually agreed with her valuation and simply asked for my half in cash. Hope that made you laugh. It works for me every time I think of it.

[toomanydogs]

Hi David,
   This did make me laugh. I'm actually a little concerned that my FIL will accuse of me of attempting to take everything out of the house.
   My STBX and I didn't remodel our house, but we did a lot of improvements--replaced flooring, painted, those sorts of things. And, as I really love old things, I bought an old barn door, and a friend turned it into an interior door for me. A gift.
He also replaced the a/c grid with a custom made wood grid made from the barn door. another gift.
  And he made several other interior doors--all gifts. Although I cannot put a price tag on them, I will fight very hard for them.
  I also bought, with Christmas money given to me by my FIL, 2 beautiful copper sinks. I will also fight for those. However, as they were not gifts, and they are technically replaceable, I'll not fight very hard.
  And then the outdoor plants. Ahh.
  When we moved in all we had in the yard were trees and weeds. Under my direction (but with my STBX's money that came from his trust), the yard is now gorgeously landscaped. Annoys me. I won't dig up all that plants as I'd like, however... .
  I am an animal lover, hence my moniker TooManyDogs. And I had 6 animals die here, 4 of whom I commemorated by planting bushes in the yard. I will also fight very very hard for those.
  I have read advice from divorce lawyers not to get caught up in fighting for things that have little monetary value; however, I don't know how not to fight for gifts that were given to me only, not to my STBX and me, and I don't know how not to fight for the bushes I planted to commemorate the deaths of animals I loved.
  Funny--in a horrible sort of way: the "offer" I received specified that I was to take the animals with me. I think that about says it all regarding my FIL. How anyone could leave behind animals--and I have horses and goats and dogs and cats and a donkey--that depend on them is something I just can't wrap my head around. But if he put it in the offer, I guess it's something he could wrap his head around.
  I don't often think of people as evil, but my FIL comes pretty close.
  Thanks for the laugh,
TMD  

[david]

My ex took everything. At first I was upset because some held memories. I later realized she didn't get the memories just the things. I found out later that many of the things went into a storage unit. The storage unit leaked during a rain storm and ruined a lot of the things. She did not have any insurance for them so it was a loss.
I began to realize the things were important to my ex. I believe it is called object constancy. She needs them to remember. She fought for things the entire time during the divorce process. She tried fighting after that too but I had already learned to deflect her fighting tactics. I think it was her last emotional connection. I focused on our boys and only communicated through email. My emotions were gone from any communication. She occasionally flares up but I never reply to such emails.
I believe you could remove the doors or any other gift with little consequence in court. Of course, an exterior door would have to be replaced. I had several checks written to me that totaled between 5 and 10 thousand dollars on my dresser right before ex ran away. She deposited them in a joint account by endorsing them by forging my signature. She took all the money out of the accounts when they cleared. The signature was not close in any way to the way I write. The court was not interested in doing anything about it and it would have cost me close  to the amount of the checks to go to court with an attorney.

[Turkish]

I had asked my Israeli former boss, later friend,  if I could buy a DSLR though her Costco account.  For whatever reason,  I had left my checkbook by their computer.  I didn't write checks other than for rent. 

Weeks later I noticed a $250 charge/check to my account.  My boss had gone on vacation with her family so I couldn't contact her.  I saw the check image and recognized the Hebrew script which looked nothing like my signature.  Hebrew script doesn't look like Hebrew printing but unlike English cursive,  the letters don't connect. I had taught myself both forms of Hebrew years before and recognized her name instantly. 

I knew how absent minded and harried she could get and thought it an honest mistake. She paid me back of course.  The funny thing was that my BPD girlfriend,  later my ex, thought that she had done it on purpose to steal from me. 

The point is to secure your checks. The bank isn't going to compare signatures apparently.

When my ex was living with me and I was trying to get her out,  I took the hard copies of my mortgage papers and, anything with my social security number,  and gave them to a friend for safekeeping.