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Author Topic: He's suddenly messaging again - wants to hang out - then silence  (Read 894 times)
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« on: March 02, 2019, 10:43:18 AM »

Hi everyone!

I was quite active on this forum in the first half of 2018, when I was having a lot of trouble with my uBPDex. I was able to detach from him back in May last year. We've been in contact a few times since, drank coffee once, went to a concert once. It was difficult to try to see him as a friend instead of my boyfriend, but it was okay. We hadn't been in contact since the end of October. He had messaged me then that he didnt appreciate it that I was hanging out with his friends and that he would like to keep some friends because all the people I talk to all hated him now (of course not true, but there's no reasoning with him).

His birthday was last Sunday, so I congratulated him. I was quite nervous because I had no idea how he would respond. He was very friendly. He kept the conversation going and we kept on messaging throughout the week. It wasn't flirty or anything, but it felt like more than just catching up. Because in the past when we had these catching up conversations they'd be finished after a day or two and now the conversation just kept going. Eventually he asked me yesterday morning if I wanted to go get a coffee with him. I was of course very torn between saying yes and saying no, but in the end I didn't really see the harm of grabbing a coffee, so I said yes. He said that he didn't have his diary with him at work and would go straight to a friend afterwards, so he'd contact me today to tell me when he was available. He hasn't messaged me yet today though. Typical. The whole week he messaged me first thing in the morning when he woke up and now it's almost dinnertime and I still haven't heard from him. I wonder if this is the typical push/pull behaviour. Does he want to try to rekindle our relationship and lure me in again? Or does he really just want to be friends? Why doesn't he message me today? Is he doing that on purpose? Any ideas of what his behaviour means?

It's so difficult to notice that I'm still not over him at all. I've had one date with someone else since we broke up but that didn't work out. I'm quite lonely and would love to start dating again. The attention he gave me this past week has made me miss him even more again. I keep on forgetting all the bad things that have happened. I catch myself fantasising about us getting back together again and how he maybe has changed. It's very exhausting to have him back in my head like this. I really don't know what the smart thing to do is. I miss him.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2019, 11:19:16 AM by once removed, Reason: moved from Detaching to Conflicted » Logged

I know I’m probably better off on my own
Than lovin' a man who didn’t know
What he had when he had it
And I see the permanent damage you did to me
Never again, I just wish I could forget when it was magic
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« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2019, 12:30:02 PM »

I wonder if this is the typical push/pull behaviour. Does he want to try to rekindle our relationship and lure me in again? Or does he really just want to be friends? Why doesn't he message me today? Is he doing that on purpose? Any ideas of what his behaviour means?


It may be a push-pull thing. He may have felt vulnerable after inviting you out and so pulled back self-protectively. But I'd imagine the most likely explanation is that he feels exactly the same way as you do: he has probably really enjoyed your conversations, remembered the good times, and reached out to try get more of this in face-to-face contact (possibly to rekindle the relationship). And, then, like you, he probably thought about the other times, how it went wrong before and could go wrong again etc. I'd guess the two of you are going through similar thoughts and feelings at the moment.
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« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2019, 03:07:07 PM »

You're not sure if he's angling for rekindling the relationship or if he wants to keep you friend-zoned. But you miss him and hold out a slim hope for a better outcome than before. However, at the same time, you're confused about whether or not you actually want a relationship with him, but you would like to date someone again. In the meantime, he's taking up real estate in your head and not following through on his offer to meet up for coffee. What does that tell you?
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“The Four Agreements  1. Be impeccable with your word.  2. Don’t take anything personally.  3. Don’t make assumptions.  4. Always do your best. ”     ― Miguel Ruiz, The Four Agreements: A Practical Guide to Personal Freedom
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« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2019, 03:25:13 AM »

Thank you for your replies!

He ended up messaging me the day after. He said that he didn't have time during to have coffee during the day, so asked if I had time in the evenings on workdays as well. We agreed to meet up coming Wednesday evening (because all my evenings were full before that). I don't really know what to think of the fact that he wanded to meet up in the evening. I don't think it's true that he never had time during the day.

We didn't talk anymore after agreeing to meet up, so I haven't spoken to him now for a week. He's still in my head a lot though. Also because I found out last Tuesday that he was/is seriously dating/in a relationship with a girl he met on Tinder. I had already suspected this back in September because I saw on Strava that he was running in another town, which I found suspicious. He deleted Strava in October though, so I have no idea if he's still doing that. A friend of mine told me that he took this girl to his friend's birthday back in December, so they were still together then. People at the birthday didn't refer to her as his girlfriend though, but as his 'Tinder girl', so I don't know what that means. I can't imagine that they wouldn't have had a relationship yet by then if they were dating since at least September. I have no idea if they're still together now or not. When we were messaging eachother he never said anything about a girlfriend, he said that he spent his birthday with his parents and his friends and that he was planning on going on holiday by himself this summer. The evening of his birthday he kept on messaging me, so I can't imagine him being with someone at that time and if he had a girlfriend it would make sense that she was there on his birthday right? Oh well. I guess I'll ask him about it on Wednesday. Although he is a good liar so I'll never really know if he told me the truth.

Anyway, I'm really annoyed about the fact that I want so badly for him to want to date me again. I know it's not good for me and I know I shouldn't do it and I know my friends will never forgive me if I do it, but it sucks that I want it anyway. His grip on me is still so strong. Even after 4 months of no contact at all and hardly any contact the 5 months before that. I wish I could just meet someone else. But unfortunately I don't see that happening anytime soon.
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I know I’m probably better off on my own
Than lovin' a man who didn’t know
What he had when he had it
And I see the permanent damage you did to me
Never again, I just wish I could forget when it was magic
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« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2019, 10:35:38 AM »

You're feeling conflicted about wanting to date him again. Your friends don't approve and you don't think it's a good idea either, but you still want him as a boyfriend.

What keeps you from meeting someone else?
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“The Four Agreements  1. Be impeccable with your word.  2. Don’t take anything personally.  3. Don’t make assumptions.  4. Always do your best. ”     ― Miguel Ruiz, The Four Agreements: A Practical Guide to Personal Freedom
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« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2019, 01:52:36 AM »

You're feeling conflicted about wanting to date him again. Your friends don't approve and you don't think it's a good idea either, but you still want him as a boyfriend.

What keeps you from meeting someone else?

Well it doesn't really matter because he probably doesn't want to date anyway and already has a girlfriend. Otherwise he would've messaged me the past week I think.

Well, for a long time I wasn't over him enough to start dating. Now I guess I would be ready to date someone else (I've been on one date with someone else but he didn't want a second date), but I just have a hard time meeting people. I have to admit, I'm quite picky. Also I'm not very open when it comes to boys. I would never go home with someone after a night out or something. I have tried dating apps but they make me very insecure since they're all about looks. The fact that I'm not meeting anyone else is making me quite desperate and alone.
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I know I’m probably better off on my own
Than lovin' a man who didn’t know
What he had when he had it
And I see the permanent damage you did to me
Never again, I just wish I could forget when it was magic
Cat Familiar
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« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2019, 09:20:36 AM »

So the plan is that you'll see him Wednesday evening, but you're wondering if he has a girlfriend since he hasn't been in touch for a week or more.

Other than dating apps, have you tried to meet men the old fashioned ways? Joining groups, volunteering, attending events?
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“The Four Agreements  1. Be impeccable with your word.  2. Don’t take anything personally.  3. Don’t make assumptions.  4. Always do your best. ”     ― Miguel Ruiz, The Four Agreements: A Practical Guide to Personal Freedom
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« Reply #7 on: March 11, 2019, 09:25:36 AM »

So the plan is that you'll see him Wednesday evening, but you're wondering if he has a girlfriend since he hasn't been in touch for a week or more.

Other than dating apps, have you tried to meet men the old fashioned ways? Joining groups, volunteering, attending events?

Yes, and also because I found out last week that he was dating someone from at least September to December, so the chances that he's still dating her are quite big.

Yes, I am quite a social person and meet new people all the time! I volunteer at a local music venue and I'm a member of the students rowing association and students road cycling associationg of my city. At both associations I am quite active and in several committees. But unfortunately, none of the new men I met this past year have really sparked my interest. It seems like no one can top my ex.
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I know I’m probably better off on my own
Than lovin' a man who didn’t know
What he had when he had it
And I see the permanent damage you did to me
Never again, I just wish I could forget when it was magic
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« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2019, 09:32:54 AM »

But unfortunately, none of the new men I met this past year have really sparked my interest. It seems like no one can top my ex.

It seems that people with BPD can be very charismatic and that "nons" can pale in comparison. What if you were to try going on a date with someone who wasn't all that interesting at first. Sometimes it takes a while to get to know a person and for feelings to develop.

If I were dating nowadays, after my experiences with BPD men, I'd be wary about trusting those initial sparks from first attraction.
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“The Four Agreements  1. Be impeccable with your word.  2. Don’t take anything personally.  3. Don’t make assumptions.  4. Always do your best. ”     ― Miguel Ruiz, The Four Agreements: A Practical Guide to Personal Freedom
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« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2019, 10:07:52 AM »

It seems that people with BPD can be very charismatic and that "nons" can pale in comparison. What if you were to try going on a date with someone who wasn't all that interesting at first. Sometimes it takes a while to get to know a person and for feelings to develop.

If I were dating nowadays, after my experiences with BPD men, I'd be wary about trusting those initial sparks from first attraction.

Yes I have heard this before. I guess it's true. Even more so because my ex was my first boyfriend so I don't know what a "normal" relationship/person is like.

I guess that I don't like going on dates with people I have no attraction to, because I don't want to give them any false hope, especially if I know them and will keep seeing them (which is the case with the guys at the associations I'm a member of for example).

I'm scared for Wednesday. I have no idea what to expect. I guess it'll be difficult either way. If he shows interest in rekindling our relationship I'll have difficulty refusing him, and if he shows zero interest that would hurt me because I still have feelings for him.
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I know I’m probably better off on my own
Than lovin' a man who didn’t know
What he had when he had it
And I see the permanent damage you did to me
Never again, I just wish I could forget when it was magic
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« Reply #10 on: March 12, 2019, 06:27:39 AM »

I agree with Cat. My feelings about dating were similar to yours- very picky, didn't like to date when I didn't "feel" attraction, and long times between dating where it felt lonely. Still, I thought it was better than what I saw others doing "hooking up" casually- not as a judgement on that but that I knew I would not feel comfortable doing that myself.

So if I did find someone I felt "connected with"- I tended to hold on to that relationship too tightly and too long if it wasn't destined to continue.

I don't know how old you are, but I dated like this in college. I had no clue about dysfunction- and the influence of my own family background (BPDmom, enabler father) on my own feelings of attraction.

This wasn't necessarily a bad thing- the guys I did date were not bad people and I knew to avoid the big red flags of behavior that I observed with my mother, but they had their issues too. Looking back, I find it interesting that they came from divorced parents, or a parent with alcoholism. It's as if we had "matching" family issues in some way.

After I was married, I still interacted with men in the workplace on a non-romantic basis. I recall observing some that I did not find myself attracted to, but after working with them, learned that they were kind and caring people- which made them attractive. I was fully committed to my marriage, so this was only observation. I realized it takes time to really get to know someone well. I don't think there should be no chemistry at all between people, but you might want to consider that a person you don't find immediately attractive could become attractive to you in time. Some dates may be looking at you the same way- wanting to get to know you first. It's OK to be selective-  but maybe a different kind of selective- get to know them over time. I agree with not leading someone on, but maybe taking a little more time before deciding it isn't for you.
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« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2019, 06:59:09 AM »

I agree with Cat. My feelings about dating were similar to yours- very picky, didn't like to date when I didn't "feel" attraction, and long times between dating where it felt lonely. Still, I thought it was better than what I saw others doing "hooking up" casually- not as a judgement on that but that I knew I would not feel comfortable doing that myself.

Yes I recognize myself a lot in this.

Excerpt
So if I did find someone I felt "connected with"- I tended to hold on to that relationship too tightly and too long if it wasn't destined to continue.

I've only had one relationship but it's definitely true for that one.

Excerpt
I don't know how old you are, but I dated like this in college. I had no clue about dysfunction- and the influence of my own family background (BPDmom, enabler father) on my own feelings of attraction.

I'm 22, so also still at uni.

Excerpt
This wasn't necessarily a bad thing- the guys I did date were not bad people and I knew to avoid the big red flags of behavior that I observed with my mother, but they had their issues too. Looking back, I find it interesting that they came from divorced parents, or a parent with alcoholism. It's as if we had "matching" family issues in some way.

After I was married, I still interacted with men in the workplace on a non-romantic basis. I recall observing some that I did not find myself attracted to, but after working with them, learned that they were kind and caring people- which made them attractive. I was fully committed to my marriage, so this was only observation. I realized it takes time to really get to know someone well. I don't think there should be no chemistry at all between people, but you might want to consider that a person you don't find immediately attractive could become attractive to you in time. Some dates may be looking at you the same way- wanting to get to know you first. It's OK to be selective-  but maybe a different kind of selective- get to know them over time. I agree with not leading someone on, but maybe taking a little more time before deciding it isn't for you.

You're right. Just for some reason I find it really difficult to look past that first spark of attraction. Especially because it was so strong with my ex. I  saw him again yesterday (very difficult evening, I posted something about it in another board) and I felt that connection again straight away. I haven't had that ever again.
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I know I’m probably better off on my own
Than lovin' a man who didn’t know
What he had when he had it
And I see the permanent damage you did to me
Never again, I just wish I could forget when it was magic
Cat Familiar
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« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2019, 10:30:56 AM »

Yes, I know how magically attractive people with BPD can be. And that's what lures us into relationships, even when our head is asking what on earth we are doing.

Right now, you have more opportunities for dating than you will probably ever have. The reality is that people start pairing up when they're your age, then when you are in a workplace, there's even less opportunity to meet single partners, and as time goes on, the dating pool shrinks rapidly.

So please take the opportunity to date some nice guys you like, even if the sparks aren't there immediately. Believe it or not, sparks can develop.

I don't know if you've had much history building fires. You can build one that roars to life quickly with a lot of newspaper, but without substantial kindling and seasoned wood, it burns out quickly.

However a fire that's carefully started and slowly built with small kindling and split well-seasoned wood, if nurtured, will keep the house warm all night.




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“The Four Agreements  1. Be impeccable with your word.  2. Don’t take anything personally.  3. Don’t make assumptions.  4. Always do your best. ”     ― Miguel Ruiz, The Four Agreements: A Practical Guide to Personal Freedom
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« Reply #13 on: March 14, 2019, 11:32:26 AM »

Haha you scare me a bit Cat Familiar. It makes it sound very urgent, that I should start dating now otherwise I'll end up alone! That frightens me a lot, that idea.

But I can't force myself to like someone right? And it's not like people are lining up, asking me to go on a date with them. Not in the slightest actually.
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I know I’m probably better off on my own
Than lovin' a man who didn’t know
What he had when he had it
And I see the permanent damage you did to me
Never again, I just wish I could forget when it was magic
Cat Familiar
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« Reply #14 on: March 14, 2019, 11:36:51 AM »

I'm not suggesting that you will end up alone, but rather you have many more possibilities to choose from right now. What keeps you from asking someone out? It doesn't have to be a big formal date, how about after one of those events you volunteer for, just asking someone to join you for coffee?

Of course you don't need to force yourself to like someone. But you can show interest. And you might be surprised when you find there could actually be something to like there.
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“The Four Agreements  1. Be impeccable with your word.  2. Don’t take anything personally.  3. Don’t make assumptions.  4. Always do your best. ”     ― Miguel Ruiz, The Four Agreements: A Practical Guide to Personal Freedom
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« Reply #15 on: March 14, 2019, 11:39:19 AM »

I think "practice dates" are a great idea. That would give you a wonderful opportunity to test your conversational skills and to get to know men on a friendship first basis. Then when someone you're really interested in comes along, you will feel more confident.
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“The Four Agreements  1. Be impeccable with your word.  2. Don’t take anything personally.  3. Don’t make assumptions.  4. Always do your best. ”     ― Miguel Ruiz, The Four Agreements: A Practical Guide to Personal Freedom
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« Reply #16 on: March 14, 2019, 06:04:46 PM »

I think "practice dates" are a great idea. That would give you a wonderful opportunity to test your conversational skills and to get to know men on a friendship first basis. Then when someone you're really interested in comes along, you will feel more confident.

But aren't those practice dates leading someone on? Because I know beforehand that I'm not attracted to that person and it might be awkward to bump into them again after the failed date.

But maybe you're right. I'm just a very insecure person and rejection is not something I can handle well, so that's why I avoid dating too.
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I know I’m probably better off on my own
Than lovin' a man who didn’t know
What he had when he had it
And I see the permanent damage you did to me
Never again, I just wish I could forget when it was magic
Cat Familiar
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« Reply #17 on: March 14, 2019, 10:51:14 PM »

You can tell them upfront that you are only interested in getting to know them better and friendship, so you are clear that you’re not leading them on. Perhaps something might develop later, perhaps not. If you pay your share, you’re just out with a male friend. Then if there’s nothing there, you end the evening as friends.

If you’re clear about your boundaries, there’s no mistaking that you’re just interested in a friendship. And perhaps this guy has a friend that he could introduce you to.

Sure he might be disappointed, but having an opposite sex friend could work out well for him. Perhaps you could introduce him to one of your girlfriends if you think he’s a nice guy.
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“The Four Agreements  1. Be impeccable with your word.  2. Don’t take anything personally.  3. Don’t make assumptions.  4. Always do your best. ”     ― Miguel Ruiz, The Four Agreements: A Practical Guide to Personal Freedom
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