Shouting at me again now

[Perdita]

He was out of town for 2 days. Got back today. We weren't even "home" yet when he started shouting at me.

All of it started because on Monday he sold one of his cars while I was out. His car, his money, but I was shocked that he did it especially since we previously agreed that I would take it over eventually.
  
While we were driving "home" today he asked me what I thought about him selling the car.  You see, even though I was shocked I kept my feelings to myself. Now he wanted to know my thoughts on it. I told him that I was shocked, that I got to know him back when it was his only car and he always talked about how much he loves it. I said nothing about me taking it over and being disappointed that he went back on his word.

When I said I was shocked and that he might end up regretting letting the car go, he lost it completely.  Banged the steering wheel, shouted at me that I have ruined his homecoming with my "negative attitude ". I remained silent. What can I say knowing that as a BPD person he was probably looking to argue about something the moment he saw me?  

On Friday he casually informed me that he went to look at business premises for sale that has a residential house attached to it and that he decided it needed too much work.  I was stunned! Turns out if he had liked it we would have moved to the very noisy part of town he moved away from a mere 6 months ago so we can live here together. His idea completely.  I feel a terrible lack of security knowing that he can sell this house as easily as he did the car and expect me to move across town without even discussing it with me. Yet I have remained silent out of fear of sparking an outburst.

I've taken what I have learned on this board about not engaging, but it's still that thing where you are damned either way. I keep backing off, but he restarts it. I say nothing or very little yet he just goes on about what a crappy person I am. How it sucks being under the same roof with me etc.

He just came to the bedroom to ask what he can go get us to eat. I told him whatever he wants is fine. I am too nervous to even suggest anything that might set him off. Next thing he started talking about our previous agreement and saying he wanted me to have the car but he needed the money right away. Only recently he was going on about how great it is that he has zero debt.  Now he claims there are some "minor debts".

He just went out but I know it will start as soon as he returns.  I am getting so fed up with his crap and mood swings. I find myself hoping he just dies so that I never have to deal with him again. It feels like the only way I will ever get away from him.  He just got back and I can hear him cussing.

[AskingWhy]

I say nothing or very little yet he just goes on about what a crappy person I am. How it sucks being under the same roof with me etc.

I am too nervous to even suggest anything that might set him off.

I am getting so fed up with his crap and mood swings. I find myself hoping he just dies so that I never have to deal with him again. It feels like the only way I will ever get away from him.  He just got back and I can hear him cussing.

Perdita, this is why they call it "walking on eggshells."

My uBPD H is the same way.  He will go out of town to visit his adult children and grandchildren; H is enmeshed with his children and idealises them, splitting them white and me black. For a few hours, H will be romantic and make amourous overtures.  Several hours later, he's laying on the hate, how he hates me, and wants a divorce.  He even has confided this desire for a divorce to his adult children; of course, they validated what ever he was telling them.  He takes their advice over mine on almost everything:   what to think about a movie or a restaurant, colours for the new dining room paint or house exterior, what household appliance to buy, where to take our next vacation, etc.  He is so codependent with them that he has no mind of his own.  

H's favourite "pet" named for me, for years, was "c*nt."  He addressed me that way because, to him," I was one, and I deserved the rages, broken furniture and holes punched in walls.

One gets tired of the abuse over and over.  Know you are among those who understand and can relate.

[Perdita]

AskingWhy,

I know the frustration of a partner that constantly dismisses your input on things involving your life together and instead listens to other people. Been dealing with this since the start myself.  Mostly involving the family of his crush.  A totally messed up family yet their word is Gospel.  Been handling that the past two years about by avoiding saying anything about them to him.  This method has been reasonably successful.

Verbal abuse (vile name calling) towards me started about 3 weeks ago.  Just out of nowhere he blew up.  Even spat at me. That's a story for another post.  I am still trying to take that incident in.

He also loves me one minute and hates me the next. I am so scared by now of doing or saying anything to set him off. I can see a beautiful flower and comment on it only to be yelled at to shut the f up.  This then leaves me regretting getting excited about it and sharing it with him only to have him crush that feeling of joy I had.

Thanks for the support.  

[AskingWhy]

Perdita, make no mistake:  name calling is a form of emotional abuse and therefore a  form of domestic violence.  It is psychological violence.

In fact, spitting is a form of physical abuse.

Please see this site and consider a T if you are not already seeing one.  

In my experience, BPDs with NPD characteristics really don't like seeing their partners happy.  It reminds them of just how unhappy they themselves are.  It's pathetic.

It's ironic that I had been trying to grow herbs and flowers in our garden one year.  In seeing some flowers bloom in the yard, I came into the house and exclaimed how beautiful they were.  Without any emotion, and clearly trying to crush my delight and enthusiasm, my uBPD H simply said (implying how stupid or childish I was), "Flowers bloom in the spring time."

https://www.doorwaysva.org/our-work/education-advocacy/the-facts-about-domestic-violence/types-of-domestic-violence/

[WitzEndWife]

Perdita, it definitely sounds like you need to do a bit of self care so that you can re-examine your boundaries. What are some things you can do to recharge yourself? Is there anything you enjoy doing that you can do without him to start to feel better? Sometimes for me it's just taking a bath, taking a walk, or writing in my journal.

Do you have your own car or does he own the only car and the house? If it's the latter, do you live in a walkable neighborhood with easy access to public transportation, or are you 100 percent reliant on him to get around?

One thing I think BPD men tend to do is control physical space - like housing or cars. My husband likes to drive the car when we're going somewhere. He also has tried in the past to make it so that I was reliant on him for a ride to and from work in my own vehicle (citing he needed my car for something, but keeping it for a day or so longer than necessary), or offered to drive me to and from social events with friends (trying to be "helpful" so I could have drinks and not worry about driving). He is extremely rigid about our home and the decisions we make about it, and is always looking to move elsewhere. I don't think he's ever been fulfilled staying in one place. And that makes sense, if you don't have a sense of identity, you aren't able to have a sense of place either.

The way forward in these situations is totally counterintuitive, as the more you shrink back and let them take control, the more they will take, and they will never be satisfied. It is only by holding boundaries (which, yes, often comes with tantrums, rage, and posturing), that we can get through this. I try to remind myself that my husband needs me a lot more than I need him, so if he threatens to leave, he's hurting himself more than he's hurting me. If you're concerned for your safety, leave, or call police (or both). You don't have to stick around for name calling either. You deserve to be treated with respect. The best thing to do when they start in calling names, is to say, "I don't appreciate being called names, so I'm going to table this conversation until you're ready to have a calm, respectful talk." If he continues, you leave - not in a huff, but calmly and deliberately. If he asks where you're going, you can say, "Out for a bit. I'll be back." You'll be shocked at how quickly they calm down after being left alone. My H will send a couple of rage texts, which I don't answer, and then will call me and try to get me to come home. Abandonment is their greatest fear.

But, first and foremost, you need the strength to stay calm and stand your ground, so definitely do some self care - whatever you can - to build yourself back up.

[Perdita]

WitzEndWife,

Thank you for your thoughtful reply.  No, I don't have my own transport.  95% of the time I have to rely on him. He gets so angry about this even when we are already driving anyway and I ask him to stop at the grocery shop so I can get items to prepare meals for us. He flat out refuses to let me buy everything for the week, never mind the month ahead. Then he gets angry about having to go back to the shops frequently as a result and shouts at me.  I agree that it's a control thing on their part.

I also get the threats to leave and the "if you don't like it then leave".  I don't think I have ever been able to talk a problem through with him like adults. 

[Perdita]

To answer the first part of your post, I have quite a few hobbies but I struggle real hard to get to them.  He constantly interrupts and wants me to do this or that.   He pretty much just smokes weed all night long.  I am so tired of him sitting at his desk rolling spliffs. After I have cooked etc I have virtually no time to myself in the evenings while he spends all night smoking cigarettes and weed.

[WitzEndWife]

It sounds like right now he has a lot of control over you, both mentally and physically. Do you notice how, if you read over your responses, you're focusing primarily on him? Like, what he does, what he says, how he reacts, etc., and not much on yourself? That's really the crux of a codependent BPD relationship.

I've had to come to terms with a lot of things recently myself in my relationship. For example, I "give away" most of my power to people with whom I want a relationship. Whether it's a friendship or a romantic partnership, I defer to them and let them take control. I'm stuffing down my power to give them power. Why do I do this? I fear rejection. I think they're not going to like me or value me if I reveal my real self - all of my wants and needs, likes and dislikes. So, what ends up happening is that I compartmentalize my real thoughts and feelings and focus on theirs. I worry about their mood and ignore mine. I think about what they want to do versus what I want to do. As a result, they end up having a lot of control over my life. You know what that does? It causes a lot of resentment and depression, which leads me to want to get out, but because I've created this learned pattern of prioritizing my partner's needs over my own, I have to unlearn that.
And it is NOT easy.

BPDs + codependency-prone non partners end up being a really bad combo. The BPD uses every drop of the non's energy and attention, which actually isn't healthy for them either. By doing so, the BPD is being enabled and can't get better. In many of these cases, the only way for both parties to get better is to be apart from each other, or for the non to be able to learn to live independently and regain their sense of self while living with their BPD partner (something that is very challenging).

But let's go back and start with some truths here. You are here because you are unhappy with this situation, right? You want changes to happen, I assume. The issue is that, if we want to have change happen, we have to change our behavior as well. Therapists are very helpful for this, but if that's not possible, start as small as you can.

I don't think I need to tell you that a grown man commanding every moment of your attention is not healthy. What might happen if you chose an activity you enjoyed doing and you said, "Hey, I'm going to be doing X for the next 30 minutes and I'd like some quiet time by myself so I can concentrate."? What would you choose to do if he got upset at that request? Part of the hard work is practicing boundaries, no matter how small, and deciding what you will do if he breaks those boundaries. You have to create consequences, even though you have very little control of your physical situation. Is there another place you can go if things get bad? A friend or relative's home?

[Cat Familiar]

Awesome post,  WEW    

[Perdita]

Thanks for the thoughts,  CatFamiliar.  I have tried the thing about having an evening to mtself albeit at home. He is ok sometimes a lot of things but then later at some point expresses deep anger about it. That really leaves me feeling once again that the rug has been pulled out from under me because I don't see this or that specific rage coming.

I stopped being a people pleaser quite some years ago and am strong in telking people to back off when they cross the line. It's very hard with him though because he reacts like a child having a severe tantrum. He threatens to leave or tells me to leave him and often he threatens suicide. 

What I hate about living with him is that I now truly feel like I am a mom living with a 5yr old in a man's body. That gives me next to no time to do the things that make me feel content 

[WitzEndWife]

It's very hard with him though because he reacts like a child having a severe tantrum. He threatens to leave or tells me to leave him and often he threatens suicide. 

What I hate about living with him is that I now truly feel like I am a mom living with a 5yr old in a man's body. That gives me next to no time to do the things that make me feel content 

You feel like the mom because he treats you like the mom. He expects you to take care of his needs like a mom. You are unhappy, of course, because that's clearly not what you signed up for. You signed up for a relationship with an adult, I imagine. So, let me ask this: if suddenly you could have everything you signed up for, an adult relationship, what would you not be doing that he currently expects of you to do today? And what would he be doing more of?

[formflier]

Some awesome perspective's in this post. 

When he "announces" that you have an attitude that you do not have...I'm wondering why you decide not to offer an accurate point of view?

What do you think?

Best,

FF

[Perdita]

So, let me ask this: if suddenly you could have everything you signed up for, an adult relationship, what would you not be doing that he currently expects of you to do today? And what would he be doing more of?

I would not be dropping everything constantly to help him and I wouldn't always put his needs first which means more time to be me, really.

[Perdita]

When he "announces" that you have an attitude that you do not have...I'm wondering why you decide not to offer an accurate point of view?

What do you think?

I do, but often I just can't because I know it's going to go endlessly in circles . 

More and more I even find myself wonder if he is a bit mentally handicapped.  I don't understand his inability to understand things that everyone else can grasp right away.  I also can't fathom why he keeps messing up the same things.  For instance, today AGAIN he left his car keys in the ignition over night, window rolled down on the drivers side, alarm off, garage door open.  Currently there's been a wave of car thefts and things been stolen out of cars in the area.  He knows this.  Last week he went away overnight and didn't lock his car and again leaving it where anyone has access.  I was not sleeping there that night and had to go out of my way to go and search for his keys and then lock up the car.  Other things he keeps repeating that drives me batsh!t is not locking the house up at night.  Or he will lock up with my keys and then in the morning I find his house keys lying in the pathway right by the front door.  This has happened with the car keys as well.  He was robbed last year because of this nonsense, but he doesn't learn and gets so angry when I ask him if the car is locked etc.  He says I am being difficult when I remind him of why he needs to do these common sense things.  I feel I am damned if I speak up and exaully damned if I don't.  I actually don't even care if his car gets stolen, but I sure care about having to listen to him yell about it for hours and throw and kick things around.

[formflier]

I do, but often I just can't because I know it's going to go endlessly in circles . 
 

How is that possible? 

If you speak up clearly...once.  How can the conversation keep going in circles?

Best,

FF

[Perdita]

FF, that's how it goes.  I speak clearly but he just keeps twisting and denying. For instance I will catch him out again using my nice kitchen towels to clean his car with and ask why he did it when there are brand new cloths under the sink specifically for the car and why use the kitchen ones yet again when he knows it upsets me.  He will then say he didn't use it and be very offended and rude about it.  I'll show him, hey there it is in the now dirty water filled bucket next to the car and there's another one now lying on the grass.  He will keep denying, telling me I am nagging and last time he even claimed that he was washing one of the towels for me - really, by placing it in dirty water with car wash?  That time he accused me of being ungrateful that he was washing it!  The worst part is he will afterwards put it back in the kitchen, dirty and stained, and carry on as though I am nuts when I ask him if he did it again.  Then he denies, calls me a nag, tells me I am imagining things.  This is just one example.  There are so many little things like that on a daily bases.  If I had to tell anyone about it - his friends or mutual friends - then I know they will think I am the crazy nag.

[formflier]

FF, that's how it goes.  I speak clearly but he just keeps twisting and denying. 

Big point..speak clearly ONCE.  Exit.

He can twist and deny all day. 

The towels are a "hook"  and "dysfunctional tool".  Please understand he isn't going to respect your wishes/desires/towels.  He's just not.

I would get a lock and put in on the drawer where they are kept, or otherwise secure the towels.  (or drop the issue and realize he will use whatever he wants)  I'm not seeing middle ground here.

The lock is likely more of a classic boundary FF move, vice good general advice from bpdfamily.  In my relationship I've drawn hard boundaries and went on with life without a care in the world..waiting for my wife to back down.  She eventually did.

The "best" advice is likely to "let go" of the towel issue.  He will likely stop when he realizes it doesn't matter any more.  He likely does it because it matters to you.

Can you see that?

Best,

FF

[Perdita]

FF, there are just so many things that he keeps doing that's not ok or hygenic.  I don't know how much I can let go of.

He just (less than hour ago) opened his chat app in front of me to show me someone's profile pic. He messed up because when he went back to his chat front page, I saw his ex gf right at the top. That means he spoke to her the most recent of all his contacts. Probably shortly  before he screwed up because I know he send a client a message about 90 minutes ago.  He just left tonight to go to the coffee shop again. I am doubting that he is going there to meet his friend and the guy's gf as he claims. I said nothing about seeing her on his chat, but he knows I saw because he started sucking up to me afterwards. I also only found out now that he is taking tomorrow off from work. Overheard him telling a colleague on the phone.   He very rarely takes a day off. 

This is the ex gf who has had affairs with 2 married men that I know of, cheated on my man when they were together and had another man lined up before she walked out on her husband nearly 2 years ago.  Not exactly a person of good morals. Then there is my SO and his messed up way of rationalizing everything.

[formflier]

FF, there are just so many things that he keeps doing that's not ok or hygenic.  I don't know how much I can let go of.

Then...if you can't let go of it.  Lock them up.  Seriously...don't discuss it any further.  If he is destructive to try and get to them...let those consequences flow to him from authorities or whoever.

The boundary is that you will live, breathe, eat etc etc in a hygienic environment.  You set about controlling your environment. 
. 
How do you think he would respond?

Before starting down this path, give a lot of thought to "letting go" for a period of time.  (weeks) 

Not really any middle ground on stuff like this. 

(Note:  I do lots of mechanical work in garage.  We only use brand new microfiber towels in kitchen.  When they become worn they become "garage towels" .  Kids can get confused on this..so I spend a lot of time explaining.  I'm thankful my wife enjoys things being tidy and clean.  Kitchen stuff in kitchen..garage stuff in garage!)

     

Best,

FF