Part 2 My BPD partner is trying to separate me from my parents

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

mod note: this thread was split from a previous discussion. Part 1 is here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=337846.0


Thanks for your responses Jareth89 and Notwendy. Your replies are quite similar so I will reply to both at the same time.

The quick answer is that while at one time perhaps I felt a sense of attachment to her, the main reason that I stay with her now is because of fear regarding what will happen to the kids if/when we divorce. As you all no doubt know, a pwBPD can act without any real restraint once they've been abandoned. I can easily imagine distortion campaigns and/or an attempt to alienate me from my children. She could quite easily justify it to herself and others on quite spurious grounds - e.g. 'he lets them stay up too late at night, spoils them' etc. Sure I could take her to court but then I may end up running out of money before I've even had a satisfactory solution.

What makes it worse is that she is a foreign national and her home country has a terrible reputation for aiding/abetting their nationals in abducting children post divorce. She has in fact threatened to do just this. I've been to see lawyers to work out a solution but none of them are really perfect. The best they could come up with was that she would have to post a bond for their safe return if she went overseas with them. That might be enough of a deterrent but I'm not sure that I really want to live with that sort of risk.

Ultimately I know that one day I will have to bite the bullet and leave, but the longer I can tough it out the better. The older the children are when I go, the harder it will be for her to take them away from me.

[Oz2016]

mod note: this thread was split from a previous discussion. Part 1 is here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=337846.0


Thanks for your responses Jareth89 and Notwendy. Your replies are quite similar so I will reply to both at the same time.

The quick answer is that while at one time perhaps I felt a sense of attachment to her, the main reason that I stay with her now is because of fear regarding what will happen to the kids if/when we divorce. As you all no doubt know, a pwBPD can act without any real restraint once they've been abandoned. I can easily imagine distortion campaigns and/or an attempt to alienate me from my children. She could quite easily justify it to herself and others on quite spurious grounds - e.g. 'he lets them stay up too late at night, spoils them' etc. Sure I could take her to court but then I may end up running out of money before I've even had a satisfactory solution.

What makes it worse is that she is a foreign national and her home country has a terrible reputation for aiding/abetting their nationals in abducting children post divorce. She has in fact threatened to do just this. I've been to see lawyers to work out a solution but none of them are really perfect. The best they could come up with was that she would have to post a bond for their safe return if she went overseas with them. That might be enough of a deterrent but I'm not sure that I really want to live with that sort of risk.

Ultimately I know that one day I will have to bite the bullet and leave, but the longer I can tough it out the better. The older the children are when I go, the harder it will be for her to take them away from me.

[GaGrl]

When your husband stood up to his uBPD ex-wife, how did she react? What ultimately caused the divorce?

When I said he "stood strong" in response to attempts to separate him from his family, he simply did not respond to the attempts. He had a close relationship with both parents and his sister who lived local. He continued to visit with them, talk to them, and ignore the NPD/BPD attempts at manipulation.

What caused their eventual separation was her blatant and continued infidelities, and it was her who decided to leave to live with the current boyfriend.

DH was always clear that he stayed to provide stability through one parent who could provide a healthy role model. He isn't sure it was the best thing to do, but his military career was at a time that single parenting would have been challenging.

[Jareth89]

Oz2016 I think I have been a bit harsh. I'm very sorry about your situation. You need support. How many years do you reckon you would wait to sit it out while the children got older? I also don't think my brother would be prepared for divorce in the event that his wife doesn't take therapy. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if she tries for another child soon. It might be different if your wife's parents were more amenable, you might have had the possibility to talk to them about bpd and maybe help you in trying to get your wife to therapy. I honestly don't know how hard it is to get them into therapy but I know members here have already said don't mention anything to the person with bpd. I'm in pretty much the same boat with my brother's wife. It's a pity if you have to stay with her, because during the time you stay with her you are being deprived of finding a woman who appreciates you. I hope you can find a way out of this that doesn't cost you too much time and that doesn't end up with you not seeing your children. I have no idea how my brother is going to deal with his own situation yet. If there is really no prospect of improvement with his wife, then he really needs to set himself free so he can find happiness...but the emotional ties to his son will make it hard for him to divorce I feel. It's a terrible situation, I'm shocked by my introduction to the bpd world, it's a complete disaster.

[Notwendy]

It looks like a disaster if the goal is your own personal happiness. This is an important consideration, but when children are added to the picture, their welfare needs to be considered.

It's not good for kids to be in a conflicted marriage but neither is it good for them to be in a conflicted divorce. Deciding between the two is not a one size fits all decision. Each situation has unique circumstances- what is the best decision for one, may not be for the other.

Although I would not wish for anyone to be in this situation, I don't think it is zero sum. From the outside, it seems unfair that one parent carries the load of the jobs but there are rewards. My father's situation was difficult but we were mostly bonded to him. I have some good memories of times with my father. He was also able to carve some time to himself- travelling for work. It got more difficult for him to do this once he retired.

It wasn't easy having a BPD mom but we had some stability. I credit my father for being the reason for that- he had his issues with co-dependency but he was the more stable one. IMHO, sometimes deciding to stay for the benefit of the kids is a good reason, and while happiness is important, there are ways to be happy without seeking another relationship. It isn't necessarily time missing out on a better relationship. In fact, another relationship may not be a solution.

Attraction is the combination of two people. The non attracted and is attracted to that person with BPD. They need to understand why and how that happened. Even if the full behaviors were not apparent until later, something was off- and someone else may not have stayed that long. It is said that if someone ends a dysfunctional relationship without looking at themselves, their part, and then starts another relationship- they risk recreating the same patterns with someone else.

This is one motivation to do the work on ourselves in the marriage first. If we do that, and the relationship ends, then we still have better skills. Learning to deal with a pwBPD in a marriage isn't just about benefiting them. The person who learns better boundaries, how to not be as co-dependent, how to stand up for themselves will then keep these skills.

[zachira]

You are in a difficult position. You are married to a woman with BPD and you have children. You feel that staying in the marriage may be the best way to protect your children, and indeed it may be.
I grew up with a mother with BPD and a father who basically enabled her, though my dad did recognize mom needed help. When I was a teenager I had a fight with my mother, and my dad begged me to not upset mom anymore because he had done what he could to get her to go for mental health help and she had refused. I think that if my aunt had not helped me when I was a teenager I might have ended up committing suicide. Certainly having a mother with BPD has negatively impacted my life forever. Although my dad was not the best father, he certainly was a lot better parent than mom. I do know my dad did not get to see just how bad my mother was as she was at her worst when dad was not around.
It is unlikely you can do much to change your wife with BPD. Your challenge is to be the best father you can be under the most difficult of circumstances. Can you tell us how old your children are and how they are doing?

[Wilkinson]

Can you tell us how old your children are and how they are doing?

zachira, I don't want to commandeer this thread, after dealing with isolating my family and then reaching back out to them, I wanted to share my story for anyone else who's affected by this situation to see if it offers any help or insight to them.

My four kids are ages 9-15.  They spend most of their time around me angry with me because I'm still working out visitation with their mother during this separation.

[Oz2016]

Thanks for the replies. To answer your question - one of the kids is three, the other one is still due (that is another story entirely - she wanted one, I didn't. She threatened to leave me if we didn't have another one. I had decided I had to stay, so I bit the bullet. It was poor boundary control on my part I must say).

My 3 yo seems to be doing well, but he is behaving quite aggressively sometimes with other kids and with his mother. He sometimes hits her and says quite angry things to her. I do worry about him too. I especially worry that growing up in this environment is bad for him. His mother of course says it must be my lax parenting.

[Notwendy]

My own story is that, when we kids got older, we weren't completely compliant with BPD mom, and she found parenting stressful. My father's family welcomed us. We spent time with them when school was out as BPD mom found it stressful to have kids around all the time. This had a positive impact on us. We kids are still close to my father's family and so are our children.

Can you be frank with your family and share what is going on? ( in private of course). They probably already have figured out some of this. Tell them you are trying to work on your marriage at the moment, ask for their understanding. They may be willing to have the kids stay with them sometimes in the future- your wife may not let them now, but she may be more willing when they are older.

[PeteWitsend]

My own story is that, when we kids got older, we weren't completely compliant with BPD mom, and she found parenting stressful. My father's family welcomed us. We spent time with them when school was out as BPD mom found it stressful to have kids around all the time. This had a positive impact on us. We kids are still close to my father's family and so are our children.

Can you be frank with your family and share what is going on? ( in private of course). They probably already have figured out some of this. Tell them you are trying to work on your marriage at the moment, ask for their understanding. They may be willing to have the kids stay with them sometimes in the future- your wife may not let them now, but she may be more willing when they are older.

I agree with what Notwendy suggests above, but I'd like to emphasize the IN PRIVATE part, and also suggest you not tell any family members who can't keep things confidential, and may go back and tell your wife what you said, thinking they're going to be helpful or convince her to get help.

I'd also add: I told a couple family members who had been on the receiving end of angry text messages and emails from my XW that due to the suspected BPD, she rages out of control sometimes and not to take anything personal... just ignore angry texts and accusations and move on, and I understood what they were going through.

I heard back that this bit of advice was extremely reassuring to them, and they had actually lost sleep a few times worrying about what they might have done wrong, and whether I was also angry with them.

[zachira]

I would like to echo what others have said about the importance of getting family and other better role models involved in the care and lives of your children. Your children are very young and right now they are developing the brain-body wiring that will determine how they regulate their own emotions and the type of people they will attract as friends and partners. It is important who they are surrounded by and what kind of attention they get. You can make a big difference by getting them away from their mother with BPD as much as possible. My experience with my own mother with BPD was that she was way too overwhelmed to parent effectively and the less she was around her children the more stable she was, while my siblings and I benefitted from not being around her so much by learning more constructive ways of relating to ourselves and others. A little of the right kind of attention can mean a lot. I remember fondly adults that gave me just a little bit of their time and how much it meant to me. My aunts and uncles also went out of their way to spend special time with me. There are many books out there that help parents to interact with their children in ways that will support the children in develping the ability to love themselves while being emotionally present and caring  for others. I particularly like: "Attached At The Heart: 8 Proven Parenting Principles for Raising Connected and Compassionate Children", "The Whole-Brain Child: 12 Revolutionary Strategies To Nurture Your Child's Developing Mind", and "Trauma Proofing Your Kids: A Parent's Guide For Instilling Confidence, Joy and Resilience".
I admire how you are staying so that you can be with your children. My father really enjoyed his children, and it meant the world having him around while having to deal with a mother with BPD having constant mood swings.