Update: She signed a lease. She's moving out in 5 day. I'm heartbroken.

[Stillhopeful4]

Mod Note:  this thread is a continuation of https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=339034.0


Update:  She signed a lease.  She's moving out in 5 day.  I'm heartbroken.

[Red5]

Update:  She signed a lease.  She's moving out in 5 day.  I'm heartbroken.

I'm sorry SH4, I know how hard this is… I remember being asked to "leave" for the day while her 'Foo' moved her out of our home, lock-stock-& barrel…

At the time leading up, and the two weeks after the event that triggered it, we lived in limbo, while she looked for a new place… I remember thinking, as I was so worn down, and beat up… I posted here, and Enabler will remember… I wrote… " I am actually looking forward to bare walls and floors ".

I was actually shocked that she really moved out… even as she had done so before, exactly four months after we first to married… back in 2011,

I guess I gave her not much choice, I told her, after she belted my kid… that morning… "this is 'bs'… this cant go on like this, so either you leave, or me and S32 autistic will, you can have all this $hit, I'll pay the damn mortgage, but I cant have you hitting him"…

I have to own the fact that I kicked her out … it stinks, I had to make a choice, between her, and my Son… that's NOT fair : (

So she moved out, and I was branded as kicking her out… I guess I did, by the choice I gave her (us)… it sucks so bad, yeah.

… what else could I have done, maybe not said anything at all… and let it blow over, but the hitting is physical abuse, and that's a nogo deal breaker… damn it… even last night we had a texts exchange… shame blame, and FU stuff… "you kicked me out, and you use your autistic son as an excuse"… what in the world do I do with that… she has zero remorse still, even after nine   months : (

Please keep posting SH4, stay grounded as best you can, one day at a time… I know how this feels,

Kind regards, Red5

[Stillhopeful4]

Please keep posting SH4, stay grounded as best you can, one day at a time … I know how this feels,

Thanks Red,

I'm going to try, but I'm really struggling. 

I know, almost, exactly how you feel.  Her and my son got physical once and the day it almost happened again I said those words, you are making me choose between my kid and my wife...that's not fair.  (I know it's not the same as your wife hitting your adult autistic son but similar concept).  And you know what she told me... you choose your kids over me so I'm leaving...that's when this all started 2 months ago.  Like I said it isn't the first time she'll have left, it's actually time #10 and the second time she has gotten an apartment.  She seems very happy when she came back from furniture shopping yesterday, almost euphoric it was odd!

9 months for you and she's still going off about your trowing her out?  I get that two because in the past, before I knew about the BPD, after about 3 weeks of ST I would be like just get out if you can't even talk to me for a month...so I have had that just as recently as yesterday thrown in my face "how many times have you thrown me out?"  Ok saying we live in the same house we need to be civil and speak to one another and if you can't you can leave...isn't the same as GET OUT!  I just feel like I can't win, ever, so much pain, so much hurt, so much time lost.  It's all very sad and you are well aware.

Take Care.
SH4

[blackorchid]

Hi SH4

How are you feeling now. It’s so scarily similar reading your experience. My partner is doing the same thing now and I have also noticed that there seems to be a 9 month cycle of this. He is saying that he is moving out this week before I fly back home. And I just wanted to share my solidarity with you. Hope you’re coping ok today

[Stillhopeful4]

Hi SH4

How are you feeling now. It’s so scarily similar reading your experience. My partner is doing the same thing now and I have also noticed that there seems to be a 9 month cycle of this. He is saying that he is moving out this week before I fly back home. And I just wanted to share my solidarity with you. Hope you’re coping ok today

Hi Blackorchid,

I am hanging in there, barely.  It's very very hard.  The things she is saying that I've done and I haven't really hurt.  The fact that she suddenly won't speak to me again and I don't know why hurts.  My heart is broken and all I want is her to love me again.  I'm not sure how I will get through this.  How are you holding up?  When do you fly back?

Thanks,

SH4

[Enabler]

It's good to grieve, take you time and feel each bit. Each bit is important to learn. Take some notes.

Who knows, she may recycle... spend some time during this time deciding what is and isn't okay to allow back in, where you want your relationship zone to reside. Maybe this isn't just for your current partner, maybe it's for future relationships.

I'd imagine one of your primary feelings is frustration at the waste of it all.

Massive hugs your way

Enabler xx

[Stillhopeful4]

I'd imagine one of your primary feelings is frustration at the waste of it all.

Massive hugs your way

Enabler xx

Enabler,

Thank you.  It's very hard because I love her so much and all I keep hearing from her is that I don't and it's not real.  I DO.  She claims I am on;y saying this now because she's out the door and I don't want to be alone.  That's not the case.  I could care less about being alone at this point.  It hurts knowing that she doesn't want to be with me.  I didn't even do anything.  I've done so much for her and our marriage over the past 10 years, I just don't understand.

Do I want her back, yes.  Do I want it like it was, no.

She doesn't want me to text her, call her, give her cute cards, send her things or contact her.  She's just completely done.  Last night she accused me of having an affair.  I asked her where it came from and she said a dream and that she doesn't dream so it is a sign that I'm the one doing something.  I swore I have never even looked at another person in that way for 10 years.  She doesn't believe me.  Here's the thing, why would she ask me this...if she's gone gone and doesn't care about me and hasn't talked to me in three days, why would she ask me this?  Maybe it's her way of finalizing things and if that's what I am doing, in her mind, it would be easier for her to move on.

I just don't know.  I just wish she understood how much I love her and have never wanted anyone else but her.

Thanks again,

SH4

[Red5]

We all "suffer" through this borderline world,

SH4 you write… The things she is saying that I've done and I haven't really hurt.  The fact that she suddenly won't speak to me again and I don't know why hurts.  My heart is broken and all I want is her to love me again…

What do I see in your words,
*gaslighting
*intermittent positive reward
*silent treatment
*the "desire to return" to the ideation phase

Some spend only a few months in these relationships, some spend a few years, some spend decades… or even a whole lifetime… some are serial travelers, entering, and exiting the same relationship dynamics over and over…

Knowing the 'particulars'… knowing the dynamics, knowing the mechanics of these relationships, yet still even though we understand, we still hurt…

I think I have a good grasp now, I think I understand the "why", but it doesn't make it any easier.

So what else did we learn, what else has been taught to us by others here, and other sites, forums etc'…

When the 'chips are down'… when the forward compartments are flooding, and we are "going down by the bow"… we must go into survival mode, we must not drown in our sorrows… self care, and positive mindfulness is so crucial at this moment in time…

Like an infantry grunt in his foxhole, after the last bayonet attack, and artillery barrage… we check ourselves for wounds… we check our gear, we check to make sure we are still breathing… and we take off our helmet, and wipe the blood and sweat from our brow… and we go into "introspective mode"… where are we… what do we have left in us to survive, and sustain… will there be another '"attack"?

I am a metaphor person…

We are all walking this same path together… and we can help one another, to cope, share advise… and to understand more, through shared knowledge and experiences… but when it comes to the "merge"… we are on our own, but yet we aren't… we are alone, but we are still all together… spiritually, in the postive karmatic realm,

What one person has experienced, and has shared, may very well help another in a moment of extreme sorrow, or grief… this is so crucial…

SH4, many here have not figured it all out, but they did survive… "I'm not sure how I will get through this" … you are going to get through this… we all are, through shared good karma, and as blackorchid says, through solidarity.

Enabler is spot on, as he usually us… "It's good to grieve, take you time and feel each bit. Each bit is important to learn"… I've read and heard many times, as I mine and dig youtube, and the internet… "you have to feel it to heal it".

Hang in there SH4, keep posting,

Red5

[Stillhopeful4]

We all "suffer" through this borderline world,

Hang in there SH4, … keep posting,

Red5

Thanks Red,

Your advise is so helpful.  I really appreciate it.  I wish I could stop crying, I wish I could eat, I wish I would stop throwing up.  I feel like I'm counting the hours I have left with her, the number of sleeps.  I don't know why I'm looking forward to seeing her tonight, to falling asleep next to her...she won't even acknowledge that I'm in the room/house.  I know she's going to start packing soon, it's going to hurt more (not sure how that's even possible).  I feel like suck a fool.  Like I am a strong person, if this person doesn't want to be with me, why am I begging her to stay.  I know I need to accept it.  I have.  But I don't have to like it.  I'm usually such a happy go lucky person, and now I am just miserable.

SH4

[Red5]

She doesn't want me to text her, call her, give her cute cards, send her things or contact her.  She's just completely done.  Last night she accused me of having an affair.  I asked her where it came from and she said a dream and that she doesn't dream so it is a sign that I'm the one doing something.  I swore I have never even looked at another person in that way for 10 years.  She doesn't believe me.  Here's the thing, why would she ask me this...if she's gone gone and doesn't care about me and hasn't talked to me in three days, why would she ask me this?  Maybe it's her way of finalizing things and if that's what I am doing, in her mind, it would be easier for her to move on.

This is the shame and blame thing… I basically got the same the other night via text…

The borderline is full of self loathing, as per the "affair" accusation, my "T" told me a while back… "Red, borderlines will eventually destroy everything, and push everyone away from them, they will do this over and over and over"… he is right : (

Here's the thing, why would she ask me this...if she's gone gone and doesn't care about me and hasn't talked to me in three days, why would she ask me this...

My wife will do this too, like tossing a grenade to me, and then closing the door… but she will tell her D34(step)… "I still love Red, I miss Red BUT ____ ."

I don't understand it either, but yet I do… my wife has been like this her whole life, long before me… I have the "source data", and personal accounts from certain members of her Foo, and both her adult children… to validate this, to confirm this… I certainly am not going to "change her"… but as Enabler writes, I can certainly learn from her, just as I did from my first wife, whom I married when I was eighteen,

I heard the other day, "until the npd-bpd-hpd has introspection, and sees that they are part of the problem, and STOPS making excuses for their behaviors, then nothing ever changes"

… which in most cases, isn't likely to ever happen, that's where many of us are at right now, you, me… all of us here, we're stuck, split, colored black… pushed away, blamed and shamed… tough stuff, believe me…

Yeah… I got the same message from my own wife… she projected it all onto me… again… its all my fault, she told me "if you'd really wanted me back, you would have done ____ & ____ & ____." … so I am suppose to do all the changing, and she does nothing, but continues to blame me, and takes no responsibility (introspection) for herself… or her behaviors.

* que Foo flying monkeys, and enablers here…

Her D34(step) told me a few weeks ago, "Red, you're going to have to grovel, admit all fault, and beg her to come back, she has to always be right, she has to always be in control… always"

Keep posting SH4,

Red5

[Stillhopeful4]

I heard the other day, … "until the npd-bpd-hpd has introspection, and sees that they are part of the problem, and STOPS making excuses for their behaviors, … then nothing ever changes"

… which in most cases, isn't likely to ever happen, that's where many of us are at right now, you, me … all of us here, … we're stuck, split, colored black … pushed away, blamed and shamed … tough stuff, believe me …

Red5

Hi Red,

Question about this.  Because our "T" told us it takes two to make it and two to break it, that's what she is telling everyone, that we are both to blame.  I have outright asked her what her part is in this, she starts with the if you don't know by now...or don't you ever listen to me?  Yes I do, but lets break this down and break down what we are each responsible for:  then she will start on a tangent of what I did wrong and how I didn't allow her to parent my kids and they are the way they are because I didn't let her handle it... I try and pull her back, can we get back to what you feel you are 50% responsible for...the only thing she will admit is she have never shown me any type of affection, other than that she claims it's all me trying to control her.  It's so frustrating.  I try and talk to her and she won't talk to me, I text her and she won't even open my text (SMH).

Thanks for listening (going to lose it soon),
SH4

[Red5]

Question about this.  Because our "T" told us it takes two to make it and two to break it, that's what she is telling everyone, that we are both to blame.

Does your T know, or suspect… either dx or not, that your wife may be bpd-npd-hpd?

Marriage counselors (MC) will often do this, "it takes two", however with a disordered person, that doesn't work… because the communication is corrupted, by the disorder, to take responsibility for your half of the make or break, you have to admit fault, with a disordered person, that ain't going to happen.

I have outright asked her what her part is in this, she starts with the if you don't know by now...or don't you ever listen to me?

… mind reading, gaslighting, projection… when you ask her "what her part is in this"… this is shaming to her, again, trying to get a disordered person to admit any fault, nope : (

*shame   guilt
*guilt   drama
*drama   triggers control  
*triggers control   chaos
*chaos   punishment (ST)

There is little to no reasoning, no factual based communication, or problem solving, because ANY admission of guilt / fault triggers them… and boom !

... lets break this down and break down what we are each responsible for; then she will start on a tangent of what I did wrong and how I didn't allow her to parent my kids and they are the way they are because I didn't let her handle it...

My wife has said the exact same thing to me… word for word / verbatim… wow !

This happens when you try to exact the "breakdown", again, this equals admission of guilt… and it will trigger every time.

I try and pull her back, can we get back to what you feel you are 50% responsible for...the only thing she will admit is she have never shown me any type of affection, other than that she claims it's all me trying to control her.

See how she will turn it back around on you, a borderline has to be in control, has to win, you never will… and if you do try, you will be split, I read, "when a non tries to enforce a boundary with a npd-bpd, it is taken as "control"… and when a non tries to make a borderline be accountable, then its abuse"… this is very true in my experience with my ubpdw.

It's so frustrating.  I try and talk to her and she won't talk to me, I text her and she won't even open my text (SMH).

Because you represent accountability to her, and she cant handle that… a borderline will shut you out,   ST… every time,

Thanks for listening (going to lose it soon),

Self care… you are having emotions, I have learned, when I "get up a tree"… eg' Im having an emotion, anxiety, fear… I "name it"… "yeah, hello old friend, you SOB… I see you , I feel you , I smell you, now GTFO of my head… look!… a pelican"…

We live on the coast, "down east" NC… I've spent many hours down on the circle in Atlantic Beach, and at the boat ramp… fighting off demons (self soothing)… this is part of being mindful, "cognitive thinking ability", "dialectic thinking processes"… yes, its good, NO!… its excellent for us non's too  … talk to your T about this… try some mental exercises… name that emotion when it comes into your head… and then tell it to get lost !

Live in the here and now… not yesterday, not tomorrow… the 'right now'… another trick, name five sense's, what do I smell, what do I hear, what do I physically feel, what can I taste… what do I see? (Right Now)… this is a very effective tool to bring yourself back to baseline… to steady your gyro… to level your horizon…

Get outside, BREATH… feel the sun on your face, smell the trees, hear the birds, it does work, it takes practice… its like "bomb disposal"… cut the hot wire first, NOT the ground wire… (metaphors again)… I was a Marine… and bombs was my business… learn to take control of your fear, "false evidence appearing real"… and what does anger feed off of… the answer to that is fear, and reciprocally.

Plain and simple… I have read, that dialectic behavior therapy (DBT) is the best tool / remedy - type therapy for a person with borderline, we as the non in the RS can also greatly benefit from these types of  therapies… even self taught… look for Marsha Linehan on youtube, she is the foundational creator of DBT… she will say, that many of the tenants of DBT are based in "Buddhism"… neat stuff… you are one with your soul, your mind, don't let runaway emotions (mental eruptions) take over your mind… practice "mindfulness"… being in the here and now…

Hope all my "blathering" is helpful  

Keep posting SH4  

Red5

[Enabler]

I've spent hours and hours and hours laying myself bare in front of my W. I'm not sure I could have been any more accountable for my part. I don't think I've had anything other than small admissions of error from her. She has a fantasy of her behaviour, it doesn't align well with reality. She spends a lot of time and effort maintaining the distance between the 2... she supports her own delusions.

See the thing about delusions is that they can be protective. They can shield your ego from annihilation. If she were to accept that she had ANY role to play in the downfall of your relationship she could no longer support the supposition that she was 'White', and if she's not 'White', then the ONLY OPTION is for her to be 'Black'. Unable to support dichotomous thinking (things can be both good and bad... grey), she cannot see herself as grey in the same way that you and I can. The greater the emotional trigger the greater the 'splitting' since the greater the 'fight or flight' reaction.

I am very surprised that T's still push this 50/50 split in relationship demise. Maybe it's an attempt to reduce the emotional arousal and reduce the fight or flight mechanisms in a disordered person, maybe it's an attempt to get the person on-side, I dunno. I guess maybe if a T pushes for 50/50 accountability and one person appears to make themselves accountable and the other does not... well then they may well learn a lot from that. Couples counselling is a dangerous place for Nons. An inexperienced counsellor can easily be charmed by a pwBPD who may even act cool and easygoing and triangulate the T. Been there, done that, got the scars.

Enabler   

[Stillhopeful4]

Does your T know, or suspect … either dx or not, that your wife may be bpd-npd-hpd?

Hi Red,

I'm not sure he knows and if he does he won't admit it to me.  When I mentioned it to him about a month ago his reply was "so your hypothesis is that she's borderline?"  I said yes, he said nothing further.  I would think if he believed it that he would be pointing me in the direction to deal with that.  He only asks why I put up with the behaviors.

I find it so strange that we all have similar situations, especially with the conversations and that your wife said the same exact thing as mine.

Also, you talk about them needing to be in control.  That's strange because all of these years she has been telling me I am a control freak and I have reflected and I have been trying to control much of anything, and I look and in the end she is the one who controls most things.  Where we go out, she needs to make the plans, if I suggest something she says she's not interested in that "BUT YOU CAN GO".  So I stopped making plans, and now she says, this life is so boring we never so anything.  I can't.

She started packing last night, I cried so much.  I tried to tell her I love her and she told me not to talk to her and she didn't need to hear anymore of my lies.  She asked me not to make her dinner tonight and also asked me not to be there on Saturday when she leaves because she doesn't want to have to deal with my crying.

I'm heartbroken.

SH4

[Enabler]

Just had a brain fart of something I meant to note...

In pwBPD rumination is often seen as a bad thing. See slide 5 onwards:

https://www.borderlinepersonalitydisorder.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/EMOTIONAL-CASCADES.pdf

Why? Because rumination tends to lead to problem expansion and kitchen sinking rather than problem solving. I am a keen ruminator... why?... because I solve problems when I ruminate, I move pieces of the puzzle around till they make sense. I believe this is why I walk or sit when I want to think and loath running (W is a keen runner I think in part because she wants to STOP thinking). I don't know whether or not you are a keen ruminator or not, however, if you find if helpful to think, to rationalise and to make sense of your past, current and future position I thoroughly recommend you MAKE THE TIME to do this exercise. Wade through the back closet of your mind, make sense of things, make sense of where you're at. If you have a commute to work, shut your eyes and just think about situations and make sense of them critically. See yourself neutrally, you've behaved badly I'm sure, but you've behaved admirably as well. Take yourself to 30,000ft and see the situation as it was warts and all. When we're 'in' a relationship we're often too close and things are too messed up with projections of guilt to see things truthfully.

If you problem solve when you ruminate... make time for it... IT WILL BE PAINFUL... BUT BENEFICIAL.

Enabler

[Stillhopeful4]

I am very surprised that T's still push this 50/50 split in relationship demise. Maybe it's an attempt to reduce the emotional arousal and reduce the fight or flight mechanisms in a disordered person, maybe it's an attempt to get the person on-side, I dunno.
Enabler   

Hi Enabler,

Yes, I find it odd too.  The thing is if he were to call her out on things and she would feel blamed then she would up and leave, it's happened before and she didn't go back for 18 months.  I think her knows she's in a very bad place and putting more than 50/50 on her would make her angry at him and he probably knows I can handle the 50/50.  I know for sure I am not 50% responsible for this.  Did I feed into the gas lighting, yes, did justify myself and try and argue that I wasn't doing things "wrong", yes.  Did I send off a snappy text when she didn't come home or text me that she would be late (3 hours after she was due home), yes.  That's about all I was guilty of.

The anger I see in her eyes, it's so painful to see.  Other times, when I look in her eyes, I see emptiness.  It's so sad, and she has the most beautiful eyes.

Some of my friends say to me, SH4, what's wrong with you.  This isn't like you.  Just get really mad at her for doing all of this to you and move on.  The don't know about the BPD.  I won't talk to anyone about that, even if I did not many people know what it is and I would hate for anyone to say anything to her about it.  She would never talk to me again.

I just feel so stuck.  I can't stop loving her, I won't.  But at what point when she is leaving me and just mean most days do I stand up for myself?

It's going to be a very difficult weekend.

Thanks for listening to me vent.  I appreciate it.

SH4

[Enabler]

Did I send off a snappy text when she didn't come home or text me that she would be late (3 hours after she was due home), yes.

I don't want to be unhelpful but how certain are you of her fidelity (actual or feelings for others)? I only say this because of the high correlation between my W's accusations of infidelity and her own... I have had to COMPLETELY reassess my assumptions of her fidelity over the last 22yrs and leave quite a few unknowns in the air till I have more answers (which I'm unlikely to get).

Was she faithful in previous relationships?

Remember, you're not doing this to her, she's doing it to herself and disowning responsibility for her choices.

Enabler

[Stillhopeful4]

In pwBPD rumination is often seen as a bad thing. See slide 5 onwards:

https://www.borderlinepersonalitydisorder.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/EMOTIONAL-CASCADES.pdf

Enabler

I need to learn more about "rumination" and how to do it.  The slides don't really help with that.  Can you tell me more?

Thanks,
SH4

[Stillhopeful4]

Was she faithful in previous relationships?

Enabler

No she was not and has had several affairs during our marriage (usually why she leaves).  She swears this time is different and she has changed.  She says me not trusting her is why she's leaving.  She says she isn't doing anything wrong and when I ask for reassurances or where she is, she feels she should not have to answer to me as I am not her mother.  I shouldn't have to ask, I should just trust she's not doing things wrong.  She claims because I would like her to text me if she's going to be late (I'm not talking 30-40 minutes running late at work, I'm talking you know you are going out for dinner or drinks with friends and you won't be home for 3-4 hours).  I told her it's just out of courtesy.  She claims I just don't trust her and I want to keep tabs on where she is, what she's doing and who she's with.  Ughhhh.  Everything I do is twisted.  But yet she will claim I am the one twisting things.

This is so hard.

Thanks,
SH4

[Enabler]

rumination
/ruːmɪˈneɪʃ(ə)n/
 Learn to pronounce
noun
1.
a deep or considered thought about something.
"philosophical ruminations about life and humanity"
2.
the action of chewing the cud.
"cows slow down their rumination"


Basically, long and very very deep consideration of events. Running through, possibly replaying events in a different light. A few years back I made and replaced a box sash window. It scared the whits out of me so I gave it A LOT of thought. I thought about how I might construct the sash window frame, what wood I would use, what tools I would need, how the different bits of wood would slot together, how I would glue it together, how I would press the joints so they would stick. I thought about how I might remove the window, what I might find when I did. I thought about how I would get the window in place (not enough as I almost fell out the top floor window). I reckon I thought about it for 3 weeks before picking up a piece of wood. I then drew diagrams... I got my thoughts lined up such that I knew EXACTLY how everything was going to slot together. I'd spun that window frame around soo many dang times I knew it back to front.

Start with some significant events that felt confusing afterwards. See how they look with your new BPD enigma machine. Keep assumptions to a minimum. Often I think we tend to discount 'some' avenues as they're not probable based on our assumptions... our assumptions that we're the ones that are acting badly... or our assumptions that "she couldn't be doing that".

Enabler

[Enabler]

No she was not and has had several affairs during our marriage (usually why she leaves). 
...
She says she isn't doing anything wrong and when I ask for reassurances or where she is, she feels she should not have to answer to me as I am not her mother. I shouldn't have to ask, I should just trust she's not doing things wrong. 

Those 2 sentences are in DIRECT CONFLICT with each other.

When someone has proven that they are not trustworthy why on earth would anyone trust them? Trust is something that is earned through repetition of trustworthy behaviour time after time after time after (which is ironic because I'd imagine you have demonstrated trustworthy behaviour time after time after time yet she doesn't trust you). In some reverse logic way I agree with her second statement, you shouldn't act like a parent to her, you shouldn't need to ask (because she should have the respect to inform you), you shouldn't need reassurances... because she shouldn't have had affairs, because that's an abuse of trust, it's damaging to a partner you profess to love and cherish, it shows absolute contempt for marital vows and the promises of fidelity in a relationship.

You W supports a fantasy that she is trustworthy, yet the facts spell out the truth that she is not. That's delusional... the energy she put into defending and supporting that delusion is the energy she spends attempting to make you feel guilty for not trusting her... rather than spending that energy self reflecting and changing her behaviour TO EARN THE TRUST SHE HAS ACCEPTED SHE DESTROYED BY HAVING AN AFFAIR!

I have had many many many such incidences and felt a lot of guilt for not trusting my W. The last one when I caught her red handed in 2016... she blamed it on God! 

[Stillhopeful4]

rumination

Start with some significant events that felt confusing afterwards. See how they look with your new BPD enigma machine. Keep assumptions to a minimum. Often I think we tend to discount 'some' avenues as they're not probable based on our assumptions... our assumptions that we're the ones that are acting badly... or our assumptions that "she couldn't be doing that".

Enabler

Enabler,

I'm going to try this.  It's very hard to think back on things.  I've been blamed for all the chaos and it really hurts.

Thanks,
SH4

[Enabler]

All the more reason why you need to do this. Being to blame for everything seems a little improbable to me.

[Red5]

*It's very hard to think back on things... I've been blamed for all the chaos and it really hurts.

*All the more reason to do this (rumination)... being told UR to blame for everything seems improbable.  

To me rumination is in the same tool box as introspection… "to be introspective;… introspection means "to look inside," and describes the act of thinking about your own actions or inner thoughts. When you examine what you do, say, think or feel and how it affects your life and the lives of others, that's introspection."

In the same tool box, is the "gut instinct"… "trust your gut"… many thousands of years of human reaction programing in our DNA… its there for a reason… trust it always.

Also, cognitive, and dialectic thinking ability / processes… like Enablers box sash window, or Red5's crown molding, and floor trim… we study about how to do the job, look at drawings, and graphs, and "how to books"… nowadaze, its youtube videos… so we gather the materials, the hammer, and the jig saw, and the box miter… and we "go for it"… but alas, its not straight, a little crooked, uh' oh…

But HEY!… its just wood, and maybe a few brass fittings, framing, and some cut glass right… it can be "red-done", overhauled, removed and replaced… no worries, and have a cold one, life is good right…

In the mind of a borderline, no, its not… its the end of the friggen world… what did she say to me… YOU RED5 NEVER LISTEN TO ME, YOU DID IT ALL WRONG, NOW ITS RUINED!… and she snatches the claw hammer from my hand, and starts RIPPING it all down : (

*true story : (

Some folks (pw/bpd) cannot ruminate, or be introspective... at all, and it will all come out sideways, and all over the non… and its the end of the world… all over a few strips of wood, and a used up calk gun… yeesh… and she wonders how come I HATE doing anything involving home improvements with her.

Remember, the blame shame, and chaos, punishment via control is the biggest hammer in the borderlines tool box…

I was listening to a persona on the radio… and she said, "the non has to always be watchful of their own feelings, emotions around the narcissist/borderline, as the narcissist/borderline will suck all the air out of the room, always having to be "the one"… its always "all about them"… and if the non at all tries to obtain any validation, or expressive mutuality of their own feelings from the narcissist/borderline, it always ends with the non being relegated to non person status… as in the non's feelings, emotions mean nothing to the narcissist/borderline, as in not ever reciprocal, and this is not a sustainable relationship"…

I gasped a little when I heard that : (

… because its true, that was my life with my udxbpdw… even still is as we are separated… she will tell me, "no one ever checks on me, no one calls me to see if I'm doing ok"… so I would try to at least text her everyday… and she texts me back… "I am not playing games anymore, and I don't know what you hope to accomplish with your little texts messages about the weather… text messages don't make a relationship"…

This from the person whom belted my kid, no measure of accountability, just anger, blame and fault… and resentment… ugh

I need to do some deep ruminating too… that seems to take up a lot of my energy… but at some pint, er point; years ago now, I came to the epiphany, that its not ALL me… gaslighting be damned… no!

Keep Posting SH4!

Red5
 
 

[Stillhopeful4]

The last one when I caught her red handed in 2016... she blamed it on God! 

She blamed it on God?  That's the first I've heard that one!

She blamed her last affair on me, she said if she wasn't so unhappy in our marriage it would not have happened.  She claims she can't trust me with her heart because I'm just going to "rage" at her if she doesn't come home.  She says her two biggest values in life are RESPECT 1st and TRUST 2nd and she says that I don't have either for her.  The night she stayed out late and I snapped at her, she said couldn't you have just texted me and said "hey when will you be home", I said couldn't you have texted me 3 hours before and said hey I'm doing xyz?  She said she shouldn't have to.  That night before bed I said I'm sorry I shouldn't have snapped. (Because I shouldn't have and I know that was the adult thing to do) she's like you are right you shouldn't have.  I said to her don't you think you should simply say sorry I should have texted.  She flipped out.. NO I DO NOT REPORT to you!  She is in such a bad state, she feels one way one minute and another way the next.

SH4

[I Am Redeemed]

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