Part 2: Did You Ever Catch Them Lying About Something That Really Caught You By Surprise

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

This is a continuation of a previous thread: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=339399.0

You said you noticed red flags early on but lying really wasn’t one of them. What did you see?

When did things start to get bad? Was there a certain point you can remember or was it a slow drift?

Did she exhibit the classic bpd behaviors in the beginning? Love bombing, pushing the relationship forward quickly ect?

For me, it took awhile to notice the lying...like a few years into the relationship. I did however notice that she tended to exaggerate things and give really inaccurate information. It was over really benign situations though, so it wasn't really an issue.

Yes, I did notice the "love-bombing" and "pushing the relationship forward quickly" very early on.  The other bad behavior that showed itself very early on is that she seemed to have issues with every single one of my close friends and family. They all seemed to have a bad taste in their mouth toward her and she very quickly sensed it and started talking badly about them. She was very cunning and manipulative about how she went about it though, so it was hard for me to see it at the time. I knew she was driving wedges into my other relationships, but I felt that she was just being supportive of me and cared about my well-being. I ended up doing quite a bit of damage control later on and have repaired all the relationships she tried to ruin. As you can imagine, all of my close friends and family don't particularly care for her and make no real effort to try to have any type of relationship with her anymore.

Another big issue I experienced really early on was intense jealousy and insecurity on her part. She seemed to be jealous of any sort of social interactions I had with anybody other than her or her close family members and that continues to be the case today. Ironically, as far as her family members go, she also tries to constantly make me look bad in front of them and doesn't like it when they seem to like and get along with me. She and I have had many fights over the years where she likes to inform me about how none of her friends or family actually like me. They're apparently just being polite around me. I know this isn't true. Other than her mom (who I'm still cordial with), I get along great with most of her family.

Another thing is the way she'd explode and completely lose control over really mundane things. I started tip-toeing and walking on eggshells very early on around her.

These are just some of the things. As most people here can probably relate, there are so many more things! On a side note, she was extra bad over the weekend and was starting lots of fights and conflict. She's currently angry because I plan to attend a parent-teacher conference today at our son's school. She didn't realize I was planning to go and she invited her mom (who remember lives over 2 hours away) to be part of it. She also told me that I'm "going to look really dumb" for showing up because nobody is expecting me to. I know that's not true. The reality is she probably has some sort of agenda she's planned to take control of the meeting (she always does) and that's why she's got her mom there for back up...and now suddenly I'm going to be there. I know it's eating her up. Of course, if I didn't go, she'd then go telling people how involved I am in our son's life.  

[mstnghu]

This is a continuation of a previous thread: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=339399.0

You said you noticed red flags early on but lying really wasn’t one of them. What did you see?

When did things start to get bad? Was there a certain point you can remember or was it a slow drift?

Did she exhibit the classic bpd behaviors in the beginning? Love bombing, pushing the relationship forward quickly ect?

For me, it took awhile to notice the lying...like a few years into the relationship. I did however notice that she tended to exaggerate things and give really inaccurate information. It was over really benign situations though, so it wasn't really an issue.

Yes, I did notice the "love-bombing" and "pushing the relationship forward quickly" very early on.  The other bad behavior that showed itself very early on is that she seemed to have issues with every single one of my close friends and family. They all seemed to have a bad taste in their mouth toward her and she very quickly sensed it and started talking badly about them. She was very cunning and manipulative about how she went about it though, so it was hard for me to see it at the time. I knew she was driving wedges into my other relationships, but I felt that she was just being supportive of me and cared about my well-being. I ended up doing quite a bit of damage control later on and have repaired all the relationships she tried to ruin. As you can imagine, all of my close friends and family don't particularly care for her and make no real effort to try to have any type of relationship with her anymore.

Another big issue I experienced really early on was intense jealousy and insecurity on her part. She seemed to be jealous of any sort of social interactions I had with anybody other than her or her close family members and that continues to be the case today. Ironically, as far as her family members go, she also tries to constantly make me look bad in front of them and doesn't like it when they seem to like and get along with me. She and I have had many fights over the years where she likes to inform me about how none of her friends or family actually like me. They're apparently just being polite around me. I know this isn't true. Other than her mom (who I'm still cordial with), I get along great with most of her family.

Another thing is the way she'd explode and completely lose control over really mundane things. I started tip-toeing and walking on eggshells very early on around her.

These are just some of the things. As most people here can probably relate, there are so many more things! On a side note, she was extra bad over the weekend and was starting lots of fights and conflict. She's currently angry because I plan to attend a parent-teacher conference today at our son's school. She didn't realize I was planning to go and she invited her mom (who remember lives over 2 hours away) to be part of it. She also told me that I'm "going to look really dumb" for showing up because nobody is expecting me to. I know that's not true. The reality is she probably has some sort of agenda she's planned to take control of the meeting (she always does) and that's why she's got her mom there for back up...and now suddenly I'm going to be there. I know it's eating her up. Of course, if I didn't go, she'd then go telling people how involved I am in our son's life.  

[ct21218]

A therapist once told my exhusband 'You lie when the truth would suit you better.'  That pretty much summed him up.  My most recent ex was very honest.

[mstnghu]

It's been about 11 years but I clearly remember the first time I ever saw my wife dysregulate over absolutely nothing. I was completely ill-equipped to deal with it and handled the situation entirely wrong. I'd just never seen somebody act the way she did and it completely confused and infuriated me. I'm STILL working on responding appropriately to her to this day.

Anyways, it was the first time we'd ever gone to the gym together. She wanted to do an aerobics class and I was going to lift weights while she did that. I finished my workout and saw through the windows to the aerobics class that it was still in session. I decided to go over to the ab equipment and do a short ab workout to kill time. Keep in mind that I was still in clear view of her if she decided to turn around and look out into the weight room (this particular 24 Hour Fitness is a small gym and everything is pretty much in one big room...it's impossible to lose sight of somebody).

While I was continuing my workout, I bumped into a couple of friends of mine from work...not even girls. They were guy friends of mine who were brothers. I literally talked to them for about 5 minutes when all of a sudden my wife (then girlfriend) came up behind them beet red and looking like she was about to blow a gasket. My friends both simultaneous looked at each other realizing that was their cue to leave. The look in their eyes was very obvious. It was a serious WTF? look toward her behavior. I quickly introduced her to them and they said goodbye to me and took off.

 She didn't say a word to me until we got to the parking lot. When we did, she verbally unloaded on me about how she'd been looking all over for me and had been done with her class for a long time and I was so selfish and inconsiderate of her, blah blah blah.  I was completely blind-sided by this. I've never personally experienced dealing with behavior like this from anybody in my entire life. It was completely bizarre! Unfortunately, I still chose to continue the relationship and these sorts of flip-outs have happened many times since.

[pausercell]

One trait that I have seen as common among people with BPD, like my ex wife and NPD like my dad is that when they’re about to be caught in a lie they use the “word salad” technique wherein they will rapidly shift from one topic to the next in a way to prevent from technically lying:  For them it’s their “version” of telling the truth.  Of course for everyone else who doesn’t struggle with a PD we would consider it obfuscation, misdirection and basically lying by omission.  In answer to your question, do they know they’re lying.  Yes, they know, but that isn’t their aim, their goal is to not let you know that they’re lying.  And in their attempts to shift things they can always fall on plausible deniability, stating that they were answering a question you asked or not fully lying because they said everything else except what you wanted to know, which was the truth.  It’s a way of protecting themselves because they feel that if they were to tell you the truth you would leave them.  Remember at their core is this intense fear of abandonment and when they are caught up in it they don’t know what to do or say so they will do or say anything if they don’t paint you black first.  That’s also why people with BPD often lie about little things as well because in their mind they can’t judge what condition will be necessary for you to leave.  In their mind EVERYTHING that they do or say carries a great deal of consequences.