Recovering alcoholic husband also has BPD. Not sure how to handle this.

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

This is my first post. Whenever I’ve started to type something I’ve felt too overwhelmed and just stopped. I’m hoping to actually finish it this time.

I’m 58, been married for 38 years, have 3 adult children who all live in different states. Husband is a recovering alcoholic, quite involved in AA, is always sponsoring somebody but has no sponsor of his own. He’s had them off and on in the past, but not for long. He has been told by past counselors, and I agree, that he is a ‘Dry Drunk’.

Years ago I started investigating the possibility that there was more going on than my husband being a recovering alcoholic. I researched to see if there was such a thing as a Jeckyl and Hyde personality and that’s when I learned about BPD. I’ve suspected since then that this is what my husband deals with, but dry drunk behavior is similar to BPD so I’ve just blamed the dysfunction in our marriage/family on his not dealing with his alcoholism in a healthy way.

We’ve gone to counseling as a couple many times through the years as well as individually (he is seeing someone now), but nothing changes. He lies like a toddler and when confronted with a lie excuses, justifies, or very ‘gently’ and carefully blames me. Same things that have happened for many years, only I’ve grown and matured and become informed and so no longer am I the co-dependant enabler that used to make it so easy for him.

My father had NPD, mother made sure everyone bowed down to him and worshiped him like a god, and I was the ‘golden child’, the perfect little people-pleasing doormat completely unaware of the dysfunction. That is, until my mother died and was no longer a buffer for my father. As I navigated the grieving process at that time, my father prepared to marry another woman. My need to grieve interfered with my father’s demand for attention to be on him, which is when I began to realize that there was a name for what he was: narcissist. That is when I ‘woke up’ to how I’d been conditioned. I started to understand how I’d been a magnet for people with NPD and BPD, and was drawn to those types as well. During this time my father conducted quite the smear campaign against me, he won over all family members, ‘friends’, and my then church family. I ended up going no contact with pretty much everyone. A few years ago I found out that my husband, who was pretending to support me through all the pain, was actually supporting my father and everyone who decided to believe my father’s lies about me. His main goal is for others to like him, no matter who he has to throw under the bus to achieve this goal. He has betrayed me many times, affairs, emotional affairs, etc. Discovering this betrayal was painful in a new way. I understood at a deeper level how naive I’d been to believe that who he tried so hard to make me believe he was did not match up at all with the truth of who he is. (He is a pro at gaslighting, as most alcoholics are.)

My husband has no real friends, no healthy relationships with anyone, including his children. It’s like he’s in denial about it though. He has never seemed to care other than to blame me when it suits him. He thinks if he does good things it covers over all of the heart issues he does not want to/cannot seem to face and deal with. He is content to receive praise, respect and adoration from people outside of the family (they are much easier for him to deceive). He passive aggressively, under the guise of being a caring husband, plants negative seeds in people’s hearts about me. This, I’m sure, is an attempt to damage my credibility should I ever decide to try to tell anyone the truth about him. He loves to play the victim; a recovering alcoholic who, he ‘humbly’ says, has done many things ‘in the past’ to hurt me, and I just can’t get over the past hurts, am unable to forgive, and so what can he do? I’m the one who is the problem, not him. Of course that is not true. I’ve forgiven and moved on, many, many times, because that’s how I’m wired. Confront, discuss, resolve. I won’t leave any hurt or conflict unresolved. But it makes it so much easier for him to convince others that he is a victim if he sticks with that story of the past, rather than accept the fact that things are so bad because of who he is right now. (So similar to someone with NPD)

Right up until just about a month ago I’ve convinced myself that all the dysfunction was a result of my husband refusing to get an AA sponsor who would hold him accountable, who would see through the masks and charade.  I suspect he is, as is typical for him, being dishonest with his current counselor (he chose a psychologist who has experience working with veterans) in order to be seen as a victim of PTSD (he is a retired cop). It seems as though this man is encouraging him to be even more self-focused, to bypass me and just do what he wants to make himself happy. Which is how he always has lived, but now it seems he has a psychologist giving him permission and even encouraging him to do so.

I am frustrated, and stuck. How do I live an authentic life alongside someone who is always wearing masks, choosing lies over truth, and always playing the victim.

I do have one trusted friend who is aware of my situation. We have been close friends for over 10 years, she knows everything. We meet weekly to share our lives over coffee, hold each other accountable, and support and encourage. But she is the only one. If I’m around others and with my husband I feel so stifled. I distance myself from him as much as possible, I’ve explained to him that I won’t be a part of his charade any longer, but we still attend the same church. He seems to have everyone snowed. I feel very alone.

I know my next step is to go, yet again, to counseling. I need to find someone who is very familiar with BPD and NPD though, and as of right now I just haven’t tried to find that person. I’ve considered talking with my pastor, feeling that someone at church needs to know my situation, but I can’t seem to bring myself to do that.

As I said, I just feel stuck.

I appreciate any wisdom or direction you can give.

[CoffeeHelps]

This is my first post. Whenever I’ve started to type something I’ve felt too overwhelmed and just stopped. I’m hoping to actually finish it this time.

I’m 58, been married for 38 years, have 3 adult children who all live in different states. Husband is a recovering alcoholic, quite involved in AA, is always sponsoring somebody but has no sponsor of his own. He’s had them off and on in the past, but not for long. He has been told by past counselors, and I agree, that he is a ‘Dry Drunk’.

Years ago I started investigating the possibility that there was more going on than my husband being a recovering alcoholic. I researched to see if there was such a thing as a Jeckyl and Hyde personality and that’s when I learned about BPD. I’ve suspected since then that this is what my husband deals with, but dry drunk behavior is similar to BPD so I’ve just blamed the dysfunction in our marriage/family on his not dealing with his alcoholism in a healthy way.

We’ve gone to counseling as a couple many times through the years as well as individually (he is seeing someone now), but nothing changes. He lies like a toddler and when confronted with a lie excuses, justifies, or very ‘gently’ and carefully blames me. Same things that have happened for many years, only I’ve grown and matured and become informed and so no longer am I the co-dependant enabler that used to make it so easy for him.

My father had NPD, mother made sure everyone bowed down to him and worshiped him like a god, and I was the ‘golden child’, the perfect little people-pleasing doormat completely unaware of the dysfunction. That is, until my mother died and was no longer a buffer for my father. As I navigated the grieving process at that time, my father prepared to marry another woman. My need to grieve interfered with my father’s demand for attention to be on him, which is when I began to realize that there was a name for what he was: narcissist. That is when I ‘woke up’ to how I’d been conditioned. I started to understand how I’d been a magnet for people with NPD and BPD, and was drawn to those types as well. During this time my father conducted quite the smear campaign against me, he won over all family members, ‘friends’, and my then church family. I ended up going no contact with pretty much everyone. A few years ago I found out that my husband, who was pretending to support me through all the pain, was actually supporting my father and everyone who decided to believe my father’s lies about me. His main goal is for others to like him, no matter who he has to throw under the bus to achieve this goal. He has betrayed me many times, affairs, emotional affairs, etc. Discovering this betrayal was painful in a new way. I understood at a deeper level how naive I’d been to believe that who he tried so hard to make me believe he was did not match up at all with the truth of who he is. (He is a pro at gaslighting, as most alcoholics are.)

My husband has no real friends, no healthy relationships with anyone, including his children. It’s like he’s in denial about it though. He has never seemed to care other than to blame me when it suits him. He thinks if he does good things it covers over all of the heart issues he does not want to/cannot seem to face and deal with. He is content to receive praise, respect and adoration from people outside of the family (they are much easier for him to deceive). He passive aggressively, under the guise of being a caring husband, plants negative seeds in people’s hearts about me. This, I’m sure, is an attempt to damage my credibility should I ever decide to try to tell anyone the truth about him. He loves to play the victim; a recovering alcoholic who, he ‘humbly’ says, has done many things ‘in the past’ to hurt me, and I just can’t get over the past hurts, am unable to forgive, and so what can he do? I’m the one who is the problem, not him. Of course that is not true. I’ve forgiven and moved on, many, many times, because that’s how I’m wired. Confront, discuss, resolve. I won’t leave any hurt or conflict unresolved. But it makes it so much easier for him to convince others that he is a victim if he sticks with that story of the past, rather than accept the fact that things are so bad because of who he is right now. (So similar to someone with NPD)

Right up until just about a month ago I’ve convinced myself that all the dysfunction was a result of my husband refusing to get an AA sponsor who would hold him accountable, who would see through the masks and charade.  I suspect he is, as is typical for him, being dishonest with his current counselor (he chose a psychologist who has experience working with veterans) in order to be seen as a victim of PTSD (he is a retired cop). It seems as though this man is encouraging him to be even more self-focused, to bypass me and just do what he wants to make himself happy. Which is how he always has lived, but now it seems he has a psychologist giving him permission and even encouraging him to do so.

I am frustrated, and stuck. How do I live an authentic life alongside someone who is always wearing masks, choosing lies over truth, and always playing the victim.

I do have one trusted friend who is aware of my situation. We have been close friends for over 10 years, she knows everything. We meet weekly to share our lives over coffee, hold each other accountable, and support and encourage. But she is the only one. If I’m around others and with my husband I feel so stifled. I distance myself from him as much as possible, I’ve explained to him that I won’t be a part of his charade any longer, but we still attend the same church. He seems to have everyone snowed. I feel very alone.

I know my next step is to go, yet again, to counseling. I need to find someone who is very familiar with BPD and NPD though, and as of right now I just haven’t tried to find that person. I’ve considered talking with my pastor, feeling that someone at church needs to know my situation, but I can’t seem to bring myself to do that.

As I said, I just feel stuck.

I appreciate any wisdom or direction you can give.

[formflier]

I'm so sorry that you find yourself in this position.

I do want to assure you that you've found a place with people that "get it".

Wise thing to look for a counselor familiar with BPDish things. 

I'm curious why you don't feel able to talk to you pastor.  Can you reflect on that for a bit and share your thoughts?

Best,

FF

[CoffeeHelps]

Thank you for the question FF. I appreciate the nudge to think through and articulate why I haven't talked to my pastor. I’m just struggling with what the right thing to do is right now. I’m still processing the fact that I really am dealing with a spouse with BPD. Any hope that I had that things might get better some day are gone. I’ve always been a strong person, it’s hard feeling so emotionally weak. I guess I should add that I have fibromyalgia, which makes dealing with life a bit more challenging. The thought of having to explain my situation to someone who knows nothing about it feels overwhelming. I also think I feel a bit like I'm being disloyal if I 'expose' my husband to someone he sees on a regular basis. ?

I feel a bit like a deer in the headlights, unsure of where to go or what to do.

[formflier]

  I’ve always been a strong person, it’s hard feeling so emotionally weak. I guess I should add that I have fibromyalgia, which makes dealing with life a bit more challenging. 

 

Physical issues can influence your mental state and also it usually works the other way as well.  Certainly does for me.  I'm a 100% P&T disabled veteran.  Generally have to deal with a lot of pain.  When the pain level goes up, I'm not able to "take on the world" with the same confidence I do when I feel "normal".

Listen:  I'm positive it will be a wise/healthy move for you to "talk things out" with an appropriate "stranger".  That may or may not be your pastor.  Even if it's not your pastor, I'm hopeful your pastor can play a role getting you in touch with the appropriate mental health professionals.

There is something about "talking things through" outloud that helps you organize/prioritize and deal with life's problems.

To you comment about "exposing" people.  I'm hoping you can switch your point of view to one of "getting help for yourself" and worrying less about "exposing people".

What kinds of things are you worried about "exposing"?

Best,

FF

[AskingWhy]

Dear CH, I understand how pwBPD are like chameleons.  They have so little self identity that they have to "become" someone based on who they interact with.

I am so sorry this has happened to you.  Welcome to the forum.

I have married to a uBPD H for 20 years, and I know well the pain of having a H with no identity.  High-functioning people with BPD also have a good deal of NPD in their behaviour.  My H was left by his uNPD W over 30 years ago, and he is enmeshed with his adult children to the point where he involves them in making decisions about our lives.

If you have not done so, you may wish to read, "Stop Walking on Eggshells: Taking Your Life Back When Someone You Care About Has Borderline Personality Disorder," by Mason and Kreger.  It will help you understand the mechanisms of the disorder.  

I do not plan to leave my H at this point, but it's comforting to know I can always leave if I, one day, wake up and find I don't want to play the game anymore.

Be well, and empower yourself.  Keep your friends and contacts.

 

[Red5]

...I know well the pain of having a H with no identity.  High-functioning people with BPD also have a good deal of NPD in their behaviour.

Another good read is;

"The Object of My Affection Is in My Reflection": Coping with Narcissists / Rokelle Lerner

Red5