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Author Topic: I want to breakup  (Read 711 times)
CoherentMoose
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« Reply #30 on: January 08, 2021, 02:33:09 PM »

Excerpt
Como: because until I move next month, I don't want to provoke her to show up. When I tried to really start distancing myself she flipped out so I'm sort of biding my time till i can get to a new safe place, block her number etc.

Ahh, that makes sense.  Ops normal while preparing for the safe exit.  And I completely understand your strategy to isolate and minimize physical interaction while preparing.  Good plan.

Excerpt
Another possibility is to write her a brief letter. I did the same, working with a therapist. Some people write one and share it here to get feedback about phrasing (to close any loopholes that we sometimes create out of fear, obligation, or guilt.)

My Fiancé did something similar when she separated from her xBPDH.  Ops normal until she had everything in place to leave, and then departed on "d-day" and left a BIFF note (generated with help from this forum) for him to read when he got home.  She texted him stating he needed to go home and read a letter she left and turned off her phone for the weekend.  In her case, because there are children involved, she could not go full no-contact but it allowed her peace for few days to gather strength.  As part of the letter, she stated all communications would be through email only to keep her away from any personal interactions with him.   

In your case, however, you are preparing to go full no-contact when you vacate your current accommodations.  On your way to your new life, you could text and tell her you need some time alone and she will be getting a letter shortly explaining what is going on and then drop a BIFF letter of things you want to say in the mail.   And then turn the phone off.   

Your planned option is sound too, but be aware of the emotional manipulation you are exposing yourself too.  Be well.  CoMo
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« Reply #31 on: January 08, 2021, 06:29:39 PM »

Thanks, CoMo.
Even though I'd love to either send a text or write a letter and be done once I'm in my new space, part of me fears that could backfire. If she feels like I'm taking a coward's way out, (oh no, you're not getting out of it this easily etc.), or that I didn't give her a chance to have her say, my concern is it might provoke her to want to seek me out to get her say.
She's said that kind of thing before, sometimes when I thought the conversation was going well and I was almost home free, and then she'd switch to "I'm not some pebble in your shoe that you can just discard. Maybe what you need is to get a callous so you learn how to deal with stuff instead of always running away", or, "go ahead, run away then. You'll feel so relieved tomorrow when you wake up and have your new day, but you'll never know if I woke up and had a day". That sounded ominous so I stayed on the phone with her for hours trying to make sure it wasn't a threat and she refused to clarify saying "I'm not gonna make you feel better about leaving me. if you leave you'll just never know".
The thing is, I hope these are just theatrics, because she's 50, has been through 2 divorces already, and obviously survived those. She lived with them for years and everything, is this relationship is only 7 months, we never lived together, and I haven't even ever once spent the night over.
I'm hoping her life really doesn't fall apart, but I'm definitely not sacrificing mine for hers either, and she won't be well with or without me.
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« Reply #32 on: January 09, 2021, 06:29:52 PM »

Most of the time I've just been trying not to rock the boat till I can exit, but today she posted something online and I asked her about it, which of course, was a mistake.

I told her we didn't have to have a problem and this doesn't have to become a big deal. It's just a question, and she replied:

And not to make a big deal but why are you always checking on me or testing me like you want me to fail. I told you any little bit of progress I think we make you don't see. Why can't you just ALLOW yourself to be happy with me

She said she had to finish her shift but now she's "all stressed". I replied:
Have a nice rest of the shift. As I said this isn't going to be a problem. It doesn't have to be a stress. It was just a question. For us to be comfortable with each other we can't never ask each other anything out of fear that it will cause a big reaction when it just doesn't need to be. I'm going for a walk now. As far as I'm concerned we don't have an issue about this so please you let it go too and don't stress yourself about me just asking you a question.

I'm just trying to keep her calm till I can move to my new place. Obviously I messed up by even asking her about anything.
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CoherentMoose
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« Reply #33 on: January 11, 2021, 04:06:02 PM »

Excerpt
You'll feel so relieved tomorrow when you wake up and have your new day, but you'll never know if I woke up and had a day". That sounded ominous so I stayed on the phone with her for hours trying to make sure it wasn't a threat and she refused to clarify saying "I'm not gonna make you feel better about leaving me. if you leave you'll just never know".

Do you consider this an emotional manipulation attempt?  Seems like Fear, Obligation, and Guilt (FOG) manipulations BPDs are amazingly adept at.  There are a number of articles in here discussing FOG and how to handle it.  It know it's very difficult to handle.  She is an adult, and at some point, she needs to own her emotions and issues....and you have the right to live your life as best as you see fit. 

You have a sound plan, but again, be aware where her strengths reside versus your weaknesses.  Minimize opportunities where she can take advantage of her strengths versus your vulnerabilities.  I call it "Play on your field, not hers". This is why my GF enforced written only communications.  Personal and voice communications were her xBPDH strengths against her conflict avoidance personality.  She could handle conflicts in the written form, but not on phone calls or personal interactions.  Be well.  CoMo
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« Reply #34 on: January 12, 2021, 04:32:02 PM »

Thanks for your reply, Como.

Yes, I do consider it a manipulation, but I don't think she's capable of being aware of what she's doing.

It's so ingrained in her, it's like autopilot. No matter how many times I've told her how I feel about the way she acts, she claims to understand sometimes saying "I'm clingy because" but then the next day she'll do something like make a fuss if she hasn't heard from me by a certain time, or begin a visit by greeting me with grievances about things like being 9 minutes late.

I'm just biding my time till I move.

Any tips about the actual break up strategy? How is it best to word things? Is it best to be all therapy-talk and use only we statements instead of blaming, or is that more likely to seem less conclusive than a simple "look, I can't take this anymore. I can't live like this, where everything is push, control,blame, guilt, grievances and I have to be in constant fear of not doing what you want to avoid you giving me grief. It's 11am and I didn't text yet? Better get on that or she'll have anxiety. Don't feel like hanging out? I'd better still go over there or she'll have a panic attack. Got there but don't feel in a great mood? I'd better stay smiling or she'll ask me what's going on and then have a panic attack. I'm tired of being controlled and bullied by this constant threat of if I don't act how you want, you're going to have a panic attack or at least anxiety and give me grief. I can't live like this anymore with the constant pushy clinginess. It's making me miserable and physically ill and you can't just hold someone in a relationship they don't want to continue with by doing this. I'm out and I don't want to hear from you ever again" and then just change my number and block her after having already moved.
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« Reply #35 on: January 12, 2021, 05:29:31 PM »

You mentioned elsewhere that you wanted someone else on the call to help mediate.

How does that process work? Have you had any conversations about what that person's role is and how he/she will facilitate the call?

I would also have a therapy appointment lined up so you can get some good insight while you're processing what happened. Can't say enough about how helpful that is for these kinds of break ups.
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« Reply #36 on: January 12, 2021, 05:44:41 PM »

Excerpt
Any tips about the actual break up strategy?

I suggest Ghosting.  In other words, a "surprise" exit where you send a text stating you have decided you need time alone and there is a letter in the mail.  Then throw that phone away.  Send the letter on the way to your your new safe place.  Better yet, send the text, throw the phone away, and go on a nice vacation for few days.  Do something nice for yourself as you start your new life. 

And here is why: 
Excerpt
It's making me miserable and physically ill

Life is short.  You are not happy.  To the point you are making yourself ill dealing with this person. 

You are executing a plan to make a path towards happy.  The final detail is how to inform her of your decision.  I'm a "rip the band aid off" kind of person.  Stay off of her playing field of emotional manipulation and move on.  CoMo
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« Reply #37 on: January 12, 2021, 06:37:40 PM »

I understand this completely. I was constantly afraid of what my expwBPD was going to say to people I cared about when he was upset with me. He knew personal things about me and he also made up “facts” about me that he believed were true (which were not). I felt like I was always afraid of who he might say a lie too, especially my parents.

The only way I could do damage control was making him want the break up. Having it be his idea. So the last time he broke up with me due to me not responding to his texts fast enough, I let him and I went no contact. There was no smear campaign that occurred. I was hugely relieved.

Just an idea that worked for me. If there’s a way to make her feel she has some control over this break up, that it’s her idea. It could help. Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #38 on: January 12, 2021, 06:49:28 PM »

Thanks CoMo and Broken,

I'm leaning towards doing it by text, but fear that it may backfire if she feels like "oh no you're not getting away that easily. I didn't have my say".

What do you think?
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« Reply #39 on: January 12, 2021, 07:16:24 PM »

HopelessBroken,

By the way, she has never tried to break up with me, and nothing I've tried has resulted in her even being willing to consider it. She says it's "off the table" otherwise she has a panic attack.

It would be my dream come true for her to break it off with me but nothing's worked. When I tried just staying away she went to the ER for severe anxiety. If I take a while to reply she just gets pushy "I haven't heard from you were you busy what were you doing?"
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CoherentMoose
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« Reply #40 on: January 13, 2021, 05:27:33 PM »

Excerpt
I'm leaning towards doing it by text, but fear that it may backfire if she feels like "oh no you're not getting away that easily. I didn't have my say".

What do you think?

I think her "playing field" is to engage with you verbally or personally and turn up the emotional manipulation.  To stay off of her "playing field" and keep her away from your vulnerabilities, a text will work just fine.  It means a new phone number though.  Are you on social media?  If so, you'll likely have to shut those down for a while. 

You can follow up with a letter or email with a pre-crafted BIFF announcement clarifying the relationship is over if you think it's necessary, but do not apologize or JADE.  State the fact that the relationship has ended and leave it at that.  Don't look back.
 Press on with your new life.  CoMo
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« Reply #41 on: January 13, 2021, 07:17:00 PM »

Thanks CoMo. Yes, I've shut down social media and already asked my family to block her in preparation. I can't just go no contact yet though, as not to provoke her showing up. I'm waiting to move first.
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Gemsforeyes
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« Reply #42 on: January 13, 2021, 07:35:32 PM »

Hey Andrew-

When I decided it was time to leave the relationship with my NPD/ BPD BF of 6.5 years, I knew he had to be the one to do it... and I knew there eventually would come a time he would.  He had left many times before, always in a horrid RAGE, but I had always allowed him back in.  I had discovered some things and I wanted OUT badly, but I  was afraid of his RAGE, his anger.  And although he had never raised a hand AT me, he had kicked a hole in a door.  And I was thrown across a room by my exH years before.  I needed the exBF to believe this was HIS decision.  It’s almost been a year now, and yes... he’s tried to return several times.  But NO.

What I DID do in the few months leading up to it, was to go more “grey rock”... I stopped asking questions / being interested about his day-to-day; I became less engaged, and I stopped prettying myself up before his visits... meaning I REALLY ceased on the intimacy.  I was “tired” a LOT.  I needed him to FORGET about me in that way, needed him to lose interest.

I may be incorrect, but if you think that seeing her on demand, sharing intimacy, being inquisitive about her life and then Ghosting are your best bet for a “clean exit”... well, I’m just not so sure.  Not so sure that’s the way to go about it, and not so sure that will work.  She MAY seek you out.  She MAY find you.  You do NOT want this woman to have reason to say you “used” her and then disappeared without a word.  Sleep with her, or arm around her watching a movie on Sunday and sent a text on Tuesday?  Do you?

And continuing with intimacy (IF you’re doing that) with a disordered person, when you know your  immediate intent is to leave, is not right.  For you or for her. 

You can leave whenever you wish.  Neither of you need to manipulate the other.  She may or may not have the awareness of what she’s doing... but you do. 

When she “threatens” panic attacks if you do or don’t do such and such, you can respond that you’re sorry she’s having heightened emotions, and perhaps she needs to ring a friend or family member.  And if it’s a bonafide panic attack (and not anxiety), you’ll send the paramedics to her home.  But you are NOT a medic and are not equipped to handle medical emergencies.

My friend, I don’t mean to be harsh, but again... you are allowed to exit a relationship whenever you wish.  You can try, one more time... And yes, try to do it with the LEAST  amount of “blame”, even if she pushes for reasons....  your “reasons” are “I cannot control or manipulate my feelings, and neither can anyone else”.

A possible statement could be... “I am not in a position to be in a relationship any longer.”  I cannot control or manipulate my feelings and neither can anyone else.  I truly wish you the best.”

All *I* statements... because if you don’t make it all about you, she will.  Ad nauseum.  And you do NOT owe her hours upon hours on the phone.

I am not happy with myself.  I am exhausted.  I have things I need to work on.  I am not feeling like myself and haven’t for several months.  I need time to myself.  I feel out of sorts.  I cannot make myself any clearer.  I’m sorry but I Do Not have a better explanation.  I wish you the best.

Your thoughts?

Warmly,
Gemsforeyes
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andrew77

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« Reply #43 on: January 13, 2021, 08:05:45 PM »

gemsforeyes,
Thanks for that. Yes i SHOULD be able to leave any time, but should and is aren't always the same. She currently knows where I live and I don't want her showing up. My plan is wait to move. It shouldn't have to be this way, but it just is.

Also, she's never going to be the one to end it. I really wish she would, but nothing's worked, and I've tried so many things. Going grey rock as you put it only made things worse. Taking time not going over sent her to the ER. Just coming in and sitting down and keeping distant or looking sullen just caused a row.

I'm not very concerned anymore about ideals, I only want an escape.
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andrew77

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« Reply #44 on: January 13, 2021, 09:12:50 PM »

gemsforeyes,

What if I go on a trip to visit family to get some distance, and then during the period send a text containing the things the you suggested?
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Gemsforeyes
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« Reply #45 on: January 14, 2021, 12:30:04 AM »

Hey Andrew- (please forgive the length of this response)

Sure, you can go on a trip, text her from there, but she’s still going to be who she is when you return.  Her behavior won’t change.  The important benefit to you, and this IS an important benefit, is that you’ll have the support of family RIGHT THERE with you.  I believe you need and deserve that.

What you CAN do, is allow some, a bit, of communication after the text ending the relationship.  While you’re WITH your family, so that you have that support.  So that the communication does NOT drag on for hours, or DAYS... “I need to go, my family is sitting for lunch, please respect that.”  And you hang up the phone.  And NO, you will NOT be getting together for a “goodbye” meeting in-person.  There is NOTHING more to say.  Nothing more to hear.

As far as her ER visit(s) for panic attacks.  Sadly, I’m personally acquainted with anxiety.  I had two anxiety attacks that required ambulance rides to hospitals...  the first was three weeks after my exH hurled me across the room; and the second happened about 6 weeks after I arrived from my cross-country move.  (I had fled my home.)  When they happened (9 months apart) they came out of nowhere.  I was NOT the person who called 911.  I did NOT know what was happening; and each time I was kept in the ER for nearly 5 hours while they repeatedly ran tests.

It is NOT something I readily discuss with anyone.  I’ve worked HARD to get my GAD (generalized anxiety disorder) well under control, and finally it is.  It is situational.  I KNOW what I need to do for myself.  This is NO ONE else’s problem. 

HER panic issues are NOT your issues, and NEVER were.  It is WRONG for her to place that burden squarely on you.  You CANNOT take on her anxiety disorder OR the burden of trying to manage that disorder.  Again, You can compassionately State that you’re sorry she’s having heightened emotions, but you cannot help with this... you are NOT equipped.  But turn it to YOUR “inability”... “I am unable to help with this...”. You see?  And the fact is, YOU are unable... you are NOT a therapist or psychiatrist.  AND... because this is NOT the relationship you WANT.

So stay with me for a sec, okay my friend?

I understand that some of this may feel wrong at first glance, but it seems to me the safest exit techniques for you MAY be to begin your exit BEFORE you move.  I know I had to be “manipulative” when my relationship needed to end... we’ve got to do things for our safety and wellbeing.

*Use the  *I* statements.
 
*If you have a few calls with her while you’re with family, you’ve got that support, either to calm you or to shorten those calls.

*If you give her some  “air time”, not a LOT, she may let it go... if she doesn’t, then you have to play harder ball.
   
*If she comes by your existing apartment, you already KNOW your neighbors.  You can give these known people a heads-up, AND you know you’ll be leaving.  You DON’T need to answer the door.  And your recourse if she refuses you leave is to call the authorities.  You first TRY to remind her that she is humiliating herself, and you do NOT think she wants to do that.

*In my way of thinking (take that for what it’s worth), it would be better for her to plant her face at THIS door than your NEW door!

And about the moving, Andy.  Right now, in this case, you have that moving flexibility.  This is a rental apartment and you said earlier that you were already considering moving.  But... what if you were NOT wanting to move?  What if you LOVED where you live?  Or... what if you OWNED this home?  These are things to consider.

I own this home.  NOT a gated community.  And in the exBF’s latest text to me on 12/14/2020, he wrote something that made me KNOW he had crept by my home.  I don’t know how often he does that, but now I KNOW he does it.  That text has convinced me to begin my search for a smaller home in a gated community.  I cannot afford what I have now if I want that community protection, and he will ALWAYS be able to find me.  At least in this god forsaken state he will...

Enough said... so so sorry you’re going through this, Andrew.  It’s a horrible situation to be placed in.

Your thoughts?

Warmly,
Gems
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« Reply #46 on: January 14, 2021, 12:33:01 PM »

I agree with Gems that you are making things worse for yourself by continuing to “lead her on” and think that somehow she will be successful in changing your mind.

Think about it from her perspective. If you continue to behave as her boyfriend, then when you suddenly pull the rug out from under her, she will be even more blindsided.

Whereas if you start pulling away now, telling her she’s responsible for her own emotions, yes, she may not like it, but you are under no obligation to try to “fix” that for her.

I’m just worried you’ll incite a nuclear reaction by acting “normally” then suddenly ghosting her.
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« Reply #47 on: January 14, 2021, 04:08:50 PM »

When I tried pulling back a bit, that's the first time she issued a threat (of coming over and causing a row). My whole thing is she knows where I live right now and I don't want her coming over, and she does not accept any type of pulling back.
When I thought along those same lines of not leading her on, I tried just talking to her about what's on my mind so it WOULDN'T blindside her, but any mention of it triggered her flipping out and talking about going to the hospital.
I'm strongly considering the out of town visit to family as a good way to get away for a while, and then slowly, gradually start communicating from a distance about my misgivings before actually ending it.
I see no other way. If I just go with "shouldn't have to" and "should be able to", that really doesn't change the fact that if I ended it today, there's a danger of her coming straight over here and making me feel unsafe.
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« Reply #48 on: January 14, 2021, 04:11:08 PM »

Also, even from her perspective, she knew many times that i wanted out, and insisted on this "trying" period. She said I need to "try" and allow myself to change my feelings, so I'm hoping she won't consider that leading her on when all along I've made it clear I don't want this and she was the one insisting on staying and "trying even if you have to fake it for a while. Feelings can change just allow yourself".
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« Reply #49 on: January 14, 2021, 04:15:01 PM »

Also, how many breakups actually take that exact form? Not even premeditated, but how many times are people going through the motions of daily life and then suddenly something clicks, and one of them realizes one day they don't want to continue, says "can we talk?" and says something like "I just realized I've been unhappy for a while and don't want to continue".
Do all breakups need to be a whole process where the other person is expecting it for a while first?
i've actually been on the receiving end of a breakup like that. My ex-wife seemed normal when we woke up. Her brother was visiting and said "you guys seem happy. I'll be back in the spring". And later that day, she came home, wanted to talk, and ended it. Her only explanation was "I loved the life we built together, but I just don't see a future". I had to accept that was how she felt, and that was that.
Let's say she did know in advance. What could she have done differently? Just started acting cold to give me a heads up?
Look, if I could break up today and feel safe doing so, I would. I would have 6 months ago. But the logistical facts remain, regardless of should and shouldn't. I can't break up today. I can break up after I move. If I distance in the meantime, I will be in danger of her causing a disruption to my daily life and work.
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« Reply #50 on: January 15, 2021, 02:02:55 PM »

Excerpt
Look, if I could break up today and feel safe doing so, I would. I would have 6 months ago. But the logistical facts remain, regardless of should and shouldn't. I can't break up today. I can break up after I move. If I distance in the meantime, I will be in danger of her causing a disruption to my daily life and work.

You know your situation best.  You know both your and her personalities better than anyone in here.  I know my fiancé still has a noticeable physical reaction whenever her "kid" phone text alarm goes off.  Her face flattens, shoulders slump, and her head looks down.  I can see it.  This is over a year and a half after her "surprise D-Day" exit, divorce, and her xBPDh remarrying and having a child.  I know that today she cannot handle any personal or lengthy phone conversations (she's had one, and it took a day to settle down) with him even though she is stronger.  Too much trauma still embedded.  Someday she'll be able to handle it.  Not today. 

There are a number of options presented to you in here.  They are all valid.  Some are considered more harsh than others.  It comes down to what is your gut feel of how you can handle any phone conversation with her if you announce your intent to distance, or terminate the relationship.  Trust your gut and execute.  You have a life to live.  Best of luck.  CoMo
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« Reply #51 on: January 15, 2021, 02:55:37 PM »

andrew77, I think part of the encouragement to leave now is not to endanger your safety or push you into something you aren't ready to do.

It's more about not sleeping with her if you know that you're leaving.

If you find it too challenging to end it now (no judgment, these are hard exits to make), then like you suggest, your plan to stay with family and wind things down slowly is probably the best.
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Breathe.
Can You Help Us Stay on the Air in 2021?

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Our 2020 Financial Sponsors
We are all appreciative of the members who provide the funding to keep BPDFamily on the air.
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