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Author Topic: Can you turn the tables on a BP?  (Read 615 times)
alleyesonme
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« on: February 03, 2022, 08:08:20 PM »

I was having a conversation with a friend the other day and an interesting idea came up. He was talking about people with NPD, and said that there are ways to turn the tables on them and actually "manipulate" them. The example he gave was that a famous person with NPD may agree to do something for free as long as his face is on the cover of a magazine. You satisfy their intense need for exposure and adoration while also benefiting yourself.

Is it possible to do something similar with a high-functioning BP?

In general, I'm opposed to the idea of "manipulating" anyone. But when a BP is aggressively seeking to ruin your life, it may be necessary to think outside the box in order to make sure that justice is served. I'm curious to hear if any of you have any tips or success stories.
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ForeverDad
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You can't reason with the Voice of Unreason...


« Reply #1 on: February 04, 2022, 03:57:59 AM »

It may work once or a few times but eventually you'll have circled back to the original issues and odds are you will have accomplished little if anything overall.

Nice try, though!

Edit... I think this is an aspect of the Law of Diminishing Returns.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2022, 05:06:51 AM by ForeverDad » Logged

Notwendy
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« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2022, 05:41:04 AM »

It would be diminishing returns, on many levels.

BPD is a condition of disordered thinking. On one hand, some of the behaviors are intentional, but the source of them is an emotional disorder which can lead to distorted perceptions of their own behavior in relationship to yours.

When we discuss boundaries- boundaries reflect our own values. The way to get lost in a relationship is to focus on the other person rather than our own wants, needs, and values. Trying to manipulate the other person is still focusing on them, and also if it's not something you think is a good thing to do, then you are violating your own value system.

If one is in a romantic relationship- it's not loving or kind to be deliberately manipulating someone, and takes a lot of time and thinking to carry that out. If it's at that level, there's not much romance in that relationship.

If the pwBPD is doing things that are ruinous, then disengaging may be the better option. If these behaviors are illegal or dangerous - the legal system may be the way to go rather than planning how to do that yourself.


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BigOof
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« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2022, 10:47:19 AM »

I don't think it is necessary. Don't break the law and record everything. It is that simple.

"If you put a police car on anyone's tail for 500 miles, they are gonna get a ticket." - Warren Buffett
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maxsterling
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« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2022, 01:35:20 PM »

Probably not a good idea. It would be much better to simply disengage and protect yourself.  I know my W will endlessly pursue someone that she feels wronged her.  Example - a "friend" does something to upset her, and she will send endless lengthy text messages to that person laced full of insults and threats.  The "friend" usually responds by blocking her, rather than to respond or try to get the better of her. 

I don't have the option of simply "blocking" my W.  There have been times I tired to take a "fight fire with fire" strategy thinking BPDw will then understand that a double standard exists, and then back down on some behavior.  This doesn't work.  I have learned that a pwBPD thinks that they deserve a different set of "rules".  So my W can sat to me the exact same thing her dad said to her, but she is allowed to be upset by it, but not me.  They are incapable of putting themselves in others shoes. 

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formflier
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« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2022, 02:45:21 PM »


Yep..it's tempting to try.

However...who do you think is better and BPD...a non..or a pwBPD?

So...they will "beat you" at their own game.  So don't play.

Best,

FF
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BigOof
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« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2022, 07:20:56 PM »

alleyesonme, how is trial prep going? Thinking outside the box?
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I_Am_The_Fire
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« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2022, 01:45:56 PM »

From my experience, trying to turn the tables doesn't really help.  What are you trying to accomplish? Do you have any examples of what the BP is doing that you feel comfortable sharing? Maybe we can help in that regard.
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"My mission in life is not merely to survive, but to thrive; and to do so with some passion, some compassion, some humor, and some style" ~ Maya Angelou
alleyesonme
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« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2022, 12:11:51 AM »

Sorry for the delay in replying. Thank you all for weighing in.

To shed some more light on this, we have trial in less than a month for a custody dispute between my stbEX and I. We don't live together, and only see each other when we drop our D off with the other parent. One silver lining of this entire process is that I never have to live under the same roof as my ex again, and I try to focus on how grateful I am for that fact.

Over the course of our divorce process, I've experienced many of the same issues that other posters have - false accusations of sexual abuse of our D, false accusations of verbal abuse of my ex, calling me a liar and abusive for pointing out the domestic abuse that she committed and which we have documented proof of, intentionally restricting our D's time with me, coming up with weak and transparent excuses for why I can't spend more time with our D, and double standards galore.

What's best for our D is to spend more time with me than with a BP mom. The best analogy I can come up with here is as if there's a brick wall in front of me and I keep tapping on it with a hammer. With this wall and this hammer, I have a strong feeling that if I tap it in just the right place in just the right way, the whole wall will come crashing down.

I know there have been posters on here and articles I've read elsewhere talking about how months or even years after a bitter custody battle, sometimes a BP will just suddenly give up some or all parenting rights. It's as if they have nothing else to gain in the way of punishing the non-BP anymore, and they either can't or don't want to be a parent anymore.

As others on here have shared about their (ex)spouses, my ex's number one, two, three, four, five, six, etc priorities are doing what's best for her, and at no point does she truly care about what's good for our D unless by happenstance it ends up aligning with her own interests in that moment. So I guess what my question is is whether there's something I could potentially say or do to knock down this wall and give my ex what she truly wants and needs at a deeper level, which may lead to her dropping her act that she really cares about our D and give me what I really want and what's best for our D. In other words, get her to do now (while the custody battle is still going on) what some BP's do after the divorce is over. Just like someone with NPD may back off if you give them a hollow platform for widespread publicity, I was wondering if there may be a way to accomplish this same thing with a BP.
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alleyesonme
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« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2022, 12:12:54 AM »

alleyesonme, how is trial prep going? Thinking outside the box?

I think it's okay, but you never know. At some point, I just have to trust my L. I feel like I've done just about everything I can.
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ForeverDad
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You can't reason with the Voice of Unreason...


« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2022, 09:18:45 PM »

With my ex, it was foremost about her and the child.  As the Custody Evaluator wrote, "Mother cannot share 'her' child but Father can." (Yes the CE, a child psychologist, did use the quotes on 'her'.)

It's often been remarked here that many pwBPD view the children or a child as an extension of themselves.  This sort of relationship perspective I don't think you can sidestep very easily if at all.  Not impossible though.

Example scenario:  Often a pwBpd may be focused on obtaining an order or outcome that vindicates their position as Winning Parent.  Many have a heightened sense of Public Appearance, even if their parenting involvement level averages much lower.  We will strategize that you can offer various concessions, essentially not very consequential, but that lets the disordered parent feel like The Winner.

Can you start by seeking a long list of things you say you want, but then let her "win" some of the ones you know are not very important?  Can you look saddened like you lost when actually you got some of the things you desperately wanted?  That is... savvy negotiation.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2022, 12:13:09 AM by ForeverDad » Logged

alleyesonme
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« Reply #11 on: February 12, 2022, 10:55:31 PM »

With my ex, it was foremost about her and the child.  As the Custody Evaluator wrote, "Mother cannot share 'her' child but Father can." (Yes the CE, a child psychologist, did use the quotes on 'her'.)

It's often been remarked her that many pwBPD view the children or a child as an extension of themselves.  This sort of relationship perspective I don't think you can sidestep very easily if at all.  Not impossible though.

Example scenario:  Often a pwBpd may be focused on obtaining an order or outcome that vindicates their position as Winning Parent.  Many have a heightened sense of Public Appearance, even if their parenting involvement level averages much lower.  We will strategize that you can offer various concessions, essentially not very consequential, but that lets the disordered parent feel like The Winner.

Can you start by seeking a long list of things you say you want, but then let her "win" some of the ones you know are not very important?  Can you look saddened like you lost when actually you got some of the things you desperately wanted?  That is... savvy negotiation.

Great post, and this is exactly what I had in mind but just wasn't able to verbalize. Like you said, give her something that I frame as being important to me, but it really isn't. I've tried to think of something that would fit that, but haven't come up with anything yet. Anything you (or others) can think of? Once I hear some ideas, that may help be come up with some of my own as well.
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