Divorce set in motion by spouse. Need your inputs on the situation.

[healthfreedom4s]

Background: I have been married for well over 15 years to my spouse that checks almost all boxes for BPD traits but has not sought help. She had childhood abuse/trauma. Our relationship has always been in state of tension. Splitting, emotional dysregulation, uncontrolled anger, deep distrust are all involved. We have two young kids that are in elementary school.
Late last year, my wife couldn’t handle my older one’s special educational needs during COVID and it led to a crisis. I came out of home (she forced me out that day). I didn’t want to go back after living in hotel for a week like I did twice before years back. This time, I rented an apt and started living separately. She calmed down in couple of days, we patched up, she accepted the two-home setup as a temporary solution to the situation. Kids started being at home with her during most of weekdays and they spent remaining 2 or 3 days with me (I started with 2, then increased it to 3 days). I would visit home during the evenings every day to spend time with kids and eat dinner with them. I am the primary bread winner, while she works part time from home. I managed finances and home affairs like I did before with no changes. We were not intimate for few months, then we got back at it.
She doesn’t like any of my family and has had very little or no contact with them in the past 12 years. Also, they either live overseas or in neighboring country. She has incidents from 15 years ago to back up how bad they have been with her. As she doesn’t like them, I had reduced my kids contact with my family to nothing over the past two years.
Now to the current situation: My only sibling was going to visit my city for business reasons. She didn’t want us (including me) to have any contact with him after he married someone from outside of our culture /race /country. I texted her saying that my sibling might visit and I will meet him for lunch if he visits and I just wanted to keep her informed (I wrestled with it for three weeks before I sent that text). She called me immediately and blew up badly. In couple of hours, she texted me that I chose my family over our family and said that we should file for divorce after the weekend. I tried to talk to her over the weekend, but she won’t budge. On Monday morning, she was outside my apt in the parking, wanting to go file for divorce together. I decided to engage with her than let her do her own thing (file for a contested divorce). I asked her that we do meditation first before filing. But she wanted ACTION that day. She initially wanted full custody with only visitation for me. I spoke to her for an hour and then she agreed to equal custody but wanted ME to file. In where I live, it doesn’t matter who files and who acknowledges for mutual divorce. So I filed the initial paperwork that day. It is only initial filing. We need to work out the final decree and file it for divorce to be awarded.
It was stunning that it started with my text about a lunch plan and three days later, we had filed initial papers for divorce (we came very close to filing six years back though).
I wanted the two-home setup to continue for next eight to ten years until our kids finish high school. Reading about BPD, it is possible that she saw my leaving home as abandonment (While I still took care of everything like I did before, I just didn’t spend time managing her emotions full time like I did before).
Since the filing, she has agreed to meditation. We are likely to get appt for mediation in next two months. I had told her early this year that she would keep the house. So, some broad aspects of the divorce are known to her while the splitting of finances and spousal support need to be worked out in meditation.
Here is how I am processing it, and this is where I need your inputs:
I am not making any effort to reconcile (as the only offer that she would accept is my severance of ties with my sibling and I won’t do it. I have given up so much and enabled her all these years). I am okay with moving forward with divorce in general.
With divorce, I would start dealing with bpd-ex than bpd-spouse. I know the bpd-spouse and I have SOME influence. I don’t know how the bpd-ex will be. It makes me nervous. And since I didn’t initiate the divorce myself, I am still entertaining thoughts if the marriage could still be saved. I have not spoken to her about it in any form.
It appears that I need to go thru a phase of adjustment/acceptance to accept the divorce. I want to hear if anyone had similar experience. Please share your thoughts. Thank you!

[ForeverDad]

Many here, myself included, experienced a spouse's blanket rejection, even hatred, of our relatives.  It is a behavior pattern that is almost predictable.

Remember that in a divorce you must avoid conceding to any demands that your relatives be blocked from your life or your children's lives.  Your stbEx would never be able to justify inserting that into a divorce decree before a judge.  Of course, exceptions would be child abusers or DV abusers.

My advice concerns the initial temp order.  Too often the impression is that it's no big deal, after all, any poor terms are only temporary.  Wrong!  That may be so in normal divorces, but our divorces can often take a year, even two years (as mine was) or even longer.  Sadly, my temp orders were never adjusted, neither the magistrate nor the lawyers were inclined to fix the problems as they arose, after all, it was "only temporary".

So my message is that if you do start with a temp order, do your best to get the "least bad" temp order possible.  As some have noted, it is very easy for a bad temp order to morph into a bad final decree.

If you do have to appear before a judge, such as in a contested divorce, be sure to make a clear case for you getting as much custody and parenting from the start.  Formulate a list of your most important issues and concerns... in priority order.  I recall at one hearing I had typed out my issues for my lawyer, grouped by category.  It was a disaster because the time was so limited some of my urgent topics never were addressed.

In many states (in USA) temp orders are issued before mediation is ordered.  I'm not familiar with how things are done in your state.  This is where having an excellent and proactive lawyer is so very important.  Strategies and brainstorming are essential.  This and so much more is covered in William Eddy's Splitting: Protecting Yourself While Divorcing Someone with Borderline or Narcissistic Personality Disorder (revised in 2021).  This is an essential guide to help you and others avoid some common mistakes and pitfalls in our intractable divorces.

With all these details, don't forget that both you and the children need a decent outcome.  As an example, you can do thought experiments sort of as Einstein did.  Imagine yourself 5 or 10 years from now.  Are there any concessions made now that you might regret in the future?

[Turkish]

She initially wanted full custody with only visitation for me. I spoke to her for an hour and then she agreed to equal custody but wanted ME to file.

It doesn't matter what she "agrees to." You desire joint custody, yes?

[ForeverDad]

She initially wanted full custody with only visitation for me. I spoke to her for an hour and then she agreed to equal custody but wanted ME to file.

Funny thing about "equal" custody... Sounds great but if there is a disagreement — as there almost certainly will be, perhaps multiple times — then you can't get anything done about it until a mediator, parenting coordinator or family court itself decides the matter.  And the resolution can be delayed until many months later.

Another looming issue... who will be considered the primary or residential parent?  Courts usually default to a preference for the mother who is also usually the one defaulted to majority parenting time.  Doesn't sound all that bad, until she moves away as far as she can (to be near her parents?) and then your parenting is made more difficult unless you move closer to her new residence.  If you can manage a move and find work there too.  Then she moves again... then what?  This is just one of the many "gotchas" you will encounter.

I pondered that last issue and so I was able to hold out to become "residential parent for school purposes".  I never moved yet she moved several times over the years.  Our child stayed close to me and my local schools.

[Turkish]

That's a great point. I'm the implicit residential parent for school, but it isn't in our stip. That only states that neither parent can move out of the county without the other's permission, and it's a big county.

Their mom talked about moving them to a better district several times in the beginning. I lightly triangulated with the school to let them know. It took over a year, but mommy calmed down after some initial drama that resulted in us being called into the principals office after my ex threatened another parent. Our kids are now old enough to give their opinions that they want to be with their friends.

A more conflictual parent can be a problem.

[ForeverDad]

Oh, Turkish reminded me.  Here's what happened as school switched from my ex's control to mine.

Typically a school cannot pick and choose the students.  They're stuck with the kids in their districts, so the deciding factor is often where the parents (or residential parent) live.  So they won't complain about something they can't change by much.

I have written about this many times over the years.  My divorce decree was issued near the end of my son's first year in school - kindergarten.  Previously mother had temp custody and temp majority time, so he attended the school in her area.  School even stated that they had nothing to report, prior incidents were resolved, when the divorce trial was looming.  Then I became the residential parent.  At first school let me file for him to stay until the end of the school year.  But she continued creating incidents, both for the school and my daycare for after school.  With only 5 weeks left before summer break, I was notified over the phone that the board had decided I had one day to register our son in my school district.  One day.  They denied my prior application for open enrollment... because now they could, in effect, kick out the problem parent.

[healthfreedom4s]

Remember that in a divorce you must avoid conceding to any demands that your relatives be blocked from your life or your children's lives. 

Forever Dad, This is a very important input for me. Thank you so much for reminding me of this possibility. This is not a negotiable item for me.

My advice concerns the initial temp order.  Too often the impression is that it's no big deal, after all, any poor terms are only temporary.  Wrong! 

We live in a large southern state. We filed using the form for Uncontested Divorce. We didn't fill out the custody arrangement section (as we were still discussing the schedule). When we asked the Clerk with whom we filed it with, she said they don't care about those (it appeared that it is the Final decree that we file is what is awarded). There may not be a temp order in this situation. However, I will look into this further.
The issue that you raise is important. I am still hopeful that I could work this out amicably with my spouse. But with BPD, nothing is certain. I realize that Hope can't be my only strategy.

With all these details, don't forget that both you and the children need a decent outcome.  As an example, you can do thought experiments sort of as Einstein did.  Imagine yourself 5 or 10 years from now.  Are there any concessions made now that you might regret in the future?

I realize that I am very short-term focused at this time and I am placing high value on having low or no conflict during this process and I have tendency to concede more with the belief that it would make myBPD be nice. I will work on this thought experiment, it requires shift from where my mind is.

Forever Dad, Thanks much for your inputs.

[healthfreedom4s]

It doesn't matter what she "agrees to." You desire joint custody, yes?

Turkish, Yes, I want equal custody. I was describing where she started off the conversation (she asking 'full custody for her with visitation for me') and where we ended in an hour (she agreeing to my ask of 'equal custody').

[healthfreedom4s]

Another looming issue... who will be considered the primary or residential parent?  Courts usually default to a preference for the mother who is also usually the one defaulted to majority parenting time.  Doesn't sound all that bad, until she moves away as far as she can (to be near her parents?) and then your parenting is made more difficult unless you move closer to her new residence. 

In the initial filing, we selected 'Joint Conservatorship' and both parents will not move out of the county. I think I need to think this thru and work on this further.
Thanks much for raising these issues.

[Turkish]

We have to stay in the same county, but it's a big county with some of the worst freeway commutes in the USA. Where mommy finally ended up in a stable living situation was south of me with our work north. Dropping the kids off at school for her is a 25 minute diversion round trip from the main freeway. For me it would have been 20 minutes south to her district one way.

Even almost 3 years out, she was proposing to move the kids into her district based upon better culture and test scores. That's when I gently triangulated with the school to let them know what she was thinking.

It took over a year until her anxiety was satisfied and she was happy with the school district. She and I got involved in the school to build relationships with staff and other parents age that made a difference. The kids are off an age now with a friend cohort that they'll protest greatly if moved.

If you can get primary residence for school, though, that's better.

[healthfreedom4s]

If you can get primary residence for school, though, that's better.

Turkish, Thank you for sharing your experience on schooling. While moving is not on the cards, I can see how it can quickly change things in future if it happens. Appreciate your input on getting primary residence for school.

[healthfreedom4s]

It appears that my wife is going back and evaluating the situation where she took the step towards the divorce. She had a major dental surgery this week and I was at home with home for two days to ensure she is doing okay (this was planned before). During this time, my wife kept repeating that I prioritize my family over the kids. This is apparently re-hashing the situation now as she had been talking calmly only about divorce/moving forward for couple of weeks.
But there is not a way I can help de-escalate this situation as my severing of my ties with my sibling is the only option that she could think of before. And it is not negotiable for me.
As I was not expecting this sudden divorce pursuit (and I was planning to continue the two-home setup while staying married for foreseeable future), I am thinking (wishfully) if there is a way I could de-escalate the situation and put her on a path of recovery.
On my T's advice, I was drafting a letter for several months now on how trauma affects people, how it has a long lasting effect decades later (without their awareness) and how therapy could help process the past trauma. I was explaining that the approach could be two pronged - 1) process trauma and making meaning out of the experience 2) handle immediate mental health issues like anxiety (which she acknowledges as an issue). My T reviewed the letter and said I had drafted it well without any blaming and in a very positive encouraging way. Before I could time and give it to her, she threw the divorce bomb.
I am thinking (wishfully) if I could give this letter to her and somehow it would make her seek help. She may not come to any substantial realization that her condition causes the marriage issues (and the divorce may still proceed). But I have a hope that she might at least seek help (I had not spoken to her about how her childhood sexual abuse could have an impact on her, how she is a victim, how much she has weathered it to achieve so much in life and how processing it properly will help her. Until now, I had made only general suggestion that she seek help, which had very marginal effect of attending a session and stopping for years). It may work. Or it may make things worse. But I am at a point why not use the only tool left in my arsenal (which I was working on).
I wish I made linear decisions in this part of life and I go from step1 to 2, to 3... to 10. But I struggle. I go back and forth. I am grinding in my mind.
Please share your thoughts. Thank you!

[ForeverDad]

But there is not a way I can help de-escalate this situation as my severing of my ties with my sibling is the only option that she could think of before.  And it is not negotiable for me.

And even if you caved on that matter, it wouldn't be long before she found a myriad of other demands.  As many have noted here, "It. Never. Ends."

On my T's advice, I was drafting a letter for several months now on how trauma affects people, how it has a long lasting effect decades later (without their awareness) and how therapy could help process the past trauma. I was explaining that the approach could be two pronged - 1) process trauma and making meaning out of the experience 2) handle immediate mental health issues like anxiety (which she acknowledges as an issue). My T reviewed the letter and said I had drafted it well without any blaming and in a very positive encouraging way.

A logical approach typically does not work with such deeply emotional mental health issues.  I can't say it wouldn't work, but probably you'd be blamed anyway sooner or later.

Pondering this, now that divorce has entered the conversation, it will come up again if avoided now.  You were already planning separation, the concept of two homes, sending the kids back and forth.  Around here, separation is typically just a prelude or introduction to divorce.  She's raised the topic, why not proceed?

A worry I have in such "try one more time" scenarios is that it may give her time to exit on her terms, not yours.

[healthfreedom4s]

Pondering this, now that divorce has entered the conversation, it will come up again if avoided now.  You were already planning separation, the concept of two homes, sending the kids back and forth.  Around here, separation is typically just a prelude or introduction to divorce.  She's raised the topic, why not proceed?

Forever Dad,
I think I went into this two home setup last year with a totally different mindset/expectations (and to some extent, not thinking all the way thru). We had episodes/crises during the year last year and I was forced out during an episode towards the end of year. I rented an apt and established a second home after living in hotel for a week. My mindset was - that the second home would provide separate space for both of us (I am WFH for over two years due to COVID) and it would help in stabilizing the relationship. My expectation was that - we would continue to live as couple in two home setup until she seeks help and things improve. TBH, I didn't think beyond the lease term of 1 year. This mindset of not pursuing divorce comes from my conditioning in a conservative culture.
What I failed to consider is - how she would see this setup. Initially, she saw the two home setup as a temporary solution to our situation and things were good. But I think she saw that as an abandonment at some level. With my sibling visiting my city triggering her badly, we are here now.
Though I am inclined to avoid divorce at this time, we are heading towards it. This has not been easy with my conditioning/mindset.

[healthfreedom4s]

After kids were off to school, wife texted me this morning saying she wanted to discuss few things. I called her.
She said she wanted to ensure that we have a ground for divorce and final decision on pursuing divorce. She asked who I am choosing - between her and my sibling. I said I don't see it that way and it need not be framed that way. I told her that this is like choosing between gun and a knife for me - choosing her (severing ties with my sibling) or choosing my sibling (which means getting divorced). I didn't answer the question. She said she knows the answer (which she construes as - I choose my sibling). And she would tell the same to kids.
I told her that I never held her hostage for any of her relationship with her family. To which, she said that she has always acted on her family relationships based on my inputs and citied incidents where I had given some inputs when asked. I always wanted her to have good relationship with her family (and encouraged her as well). But her relationship with them has always been strained / on-off. She now cites me as the reason for some of the temporary cut-offs that she did (she eventually patches up after sometime).
It was difficult to explain when she remembers incidents/causations aligning with her narrative.
We ended the call after discussing other things. We have already planned to work with mediator in January.
My hope in giving her the letter that I drafted (explaining about how seeking help for her childhood abuse will help her thrive - as we never discussed about trauma being reason for her challenges) and getting her off the divorce cliff - is diminished.
It occurred to me that I can save this marriage only if she too wants it at some level.

[thankful person]

It occurred to me that I can save this marriage only if she too wants it at some level.

This is exactly what I’m feeling right now. My wife was also a victim of sexual abuse. As you know, I have worked so hard to lessen her control over me, help her remain calm, uphold boundaries. And I almost feel like maybe I have changed too much and she preferred the old me that was sobbing all the time and begging her not to leave me. She’s even said she doesn’t like to see me laughing and smiling because it seems like I don’t care. I think it’s wonderful that I can laugh and smile through these awful times and I owe it all to my children.

[zondolit]

She’s even said she doesn’t like to see me laughing and smiling because it seems like I don’t care. I think it’s wonderful that I can laugh and smile through these awful times and I owe it all to my children.

thankful person,

Of course it is wonderful--and just want the children need--for you to laugh and smile with them. Only a disordered mind would see it differently--and try to convince you to see it differently.