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dtkm
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What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
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Don’t know what to do…
«
on:
April 29, 2023, 12:01:28 PM »
Don’t know what to do…
My uBPDh and I have been married for 5 years, together for 6 years. We have 5 kids together, he brought a daughter (11) into our relationship, I brought a son (11) and daughter (8) into our relationship and we have 2 children together (son 5 and daughter 2). My older 2 kids dad passed away before I met my husband, so they see him at their real dad. The last 6 years have been heaven and hell. We have had some great experiences, raising 5 amazing kids. We have also been through hell and back…abused…mentally, emotionally and physically hundreds more times than I can count (to the point I have had to run to neighbors houses 3 times, though I never called the cops)…behind closed doors and in front of the kids. Accused of having 100s of affairs, any time we are not in the same room. Feeling like I can’t leave the house without being accused of sleeping with the next person who walks past me, feeling like I can’t leave the kitchen without being accused of having an affair, feeling like if I wear a different shirt to work or put my hair in a ponytail or look anywhere but down at the ground that I will be accused of having an affair. I have been accused of having an affair with all of my oldest 2 kids coaches (men, women, young or old)…apparently it’s the reason they play their sports at such high levels. I have been accused of sleeping with more people than I can count on my hands of my coworkers that I am at the point that I literally sit in a room all day and don’t talk to anyone I work with. I have been accused of sleeping with patients of mine (I work with kids). I am also accused of lying daily, being vindictive, favoritism with my older kids. I was no allow to buy anything for my older 2 kids from joint money (where the money from their dad passing away gets put monthly). He has pulled my stepdaughter away from me telling me that I am evil, he needs to protect her from me. All the while he accuses all of my kids as hiding my millions of affairs, of protecting their mom. I have pulled everyone onto my side according to him. He has screamed at my 11 year old millions of times unjustified, accused him of cheating on games to beat my 5 year old, told him that he he play wrestled with my 5 year old again (which my 5 year old always starts) and my 5 year old complains of any pain that “he (my husband) will hurt him (my 11 year old)”. I have been told that I will “get it” if I don’t drop everything the second my youngest 2 kids ask for something…they are to always come before my older 2. I have been attacked while laying in bed with my older 2. My older 2 have been ignored and then ripped a new one when they didn’t say “hi” the second they walked in the door. Chores at our house did not apply to my stepdaughter only my older 2. I was even accused of having an affair when I had to get admitted to the hospital for extremely high blood pressure after having my daughter (I had preeclampsia). Apparently I left the hospital after he was with me when I got checked in (during Covid the kids were not allowed in the er) and went and slept with someone, returned to the hospital to get admitted again and admitted as an inpatient, and asked him to stay with me while I was an inpatient. I have been accused of letting my child catch RSV, because I let her go outside when it was maybe 40 degrees out started off without a jacket but me bringing one out to her maybe 5 minutes later. My husband has threatened divorce for years. He finally pulled the trigger and had me served back in October. I was heart broken. My lawyer suggested I get a protection order. I did and it was granted. Not wanting to get divorced, I dropped it asking for a reconciliation. We both agreed to go to therapy and couples therapy. He came home after I dropped the TPO and changed nothing. At that point he had rented a house, so over the next 2 or so months, he would “move out” and then back in. All for attention. He avoided couples therapy for the first couple of months and then agreed to go but all he did was call me a liar and a cheater mid sentence to anything I said. And the therapist sucked and didn’t stop him. He moved out for good about a month ago…coming over in the middle of the night to have sex, hanging out with the kids and I telling me that we can work through this (after months of saying it’s not going to work, he is tired of being used and walked on, etc). Then no contact for a week, then hanging out again. I then get an email from my lawyer that he is moving forward with the divorce. She advises me to go in joint with him as I don’t really have a choice. It will look better that way. I don’t want to but I follow her recommendations. My main focus is to keep the kids away from him as I believe it is not ok for them to be alone around him. I come to terms with things over the week, avoid him, keep him out of the house, away from me and the kids. The kids and I are as good as we can be in this situation for a week. Yesterday I am walking to pick my son up from school with my 2 year old and he pulls around the corner. He has t find to school pick up for over a month. Here he is…sucking me back in. Of course the kids ask if they can go to his house. If I say no they will scream and cry and my husband will video it telling his lawyer I am keeping the kids from him, so I agree we can go to his house but I will go with them. He gets all flirty with me, sucking me back in. I take him to do an errand, he buys the kids and I lunch…which is big considering that he won’t pay a single thing right now…nothing to any of the bills of the house that are in his name or for the kids…though he makes way more than I do and k work part time as I take care of 4 kids full time…yes I have had dental surgery while nursing an infant and entertaining a toddler…he can’t grocery shop with a kid. We then go back to his house I sit on the couch he lays right next to me…all over me. He starts to initiate having sex…I notice that he won’t even look at me so I stop it telling him that I will only do this if he wants to truly work on us. He stops…says he won’t talk about anything in front of the kids but we can talk later. The kids lose it when he leaves and I am left to pick up the pieces with no response from him to my text. At dinner time the kids ask to go to his house for dinner. We get there and my oldest refuses to get out of the car and go into the house. He is mad at my husband for all he has done to hurt us and only agrees to do in if he can sit and eat in a room where he doesn’t have to see anyone. I make that happen and start to worry about the marks I have seen on my sons leg. Is he hurting himself? After a bit, I ask my husband if he wanted to talk…since he had said so earlier. He agrees but the second we start talking he says this isn’t going to work and he wants to proceed forward with divorce. Upset, I say really so you just played me? Thanks…and I continue to ask him why he is doing this to our family. After getting told that I have cheated on him a million times and he is sick of being lied to and used I tell him that I can’t believe how he doesn’t care about the kids that obviously they don’t want this. I tell him he either needs to be all in or all out. He says that he doesn’t want to be all in. So I told him he is not welcome at the house that night or at our daughters soccer the rest of the weekend. He said fine. The kids are screaming since he isn’t going to our house and I am livid that he played me again so I don’t want to leave. He keeps saying take the kids home. I want my family but k don’t want you. The. He says let’s talk on Tuesday…you come up with a plan and I will tell you if I will do it…I will stay away from you and the kids until then. I leave. I’m beyond mad…livid right now. I want to scream at him to stop playing with the kids and I. He starts crap and makes me end up looking like the bad one…he video taped it and I’m sure will give it to his lawyer. I don’t know what to do anymore. I am completely miserable…I feel like I will go through these cycles forever. Sorry this post goes on forever…
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ForeverDad
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Relationship status: separated 2005 then divorced
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You can't reason with the Voice of Unreason...
Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #1 on:
April 29, 2023, 12:45:18 PM »
Your spouse constantly splits in and out of his blaming mode and is resistant to meaningful marital counseling or individual therapy. Frankly, you can't fix the marriage alone. So the alternative is divorce, and with firm, well thought out boundaries.
With the kids begging to go back and forth at whatever times, a parenting schedule is best, fortunately that is standard. You should of course seek the best schedule that would enable the "least bad" outcome. Once that is set up, then you are able to tell the kids, "Sorry, the schedule says you can't go over now." In other words, you can 'blame' it on the judge or court.
I and many others here are divorced. I never wanted it but that was the reality, my marriage was terminally dysfunctional.
I and my young son needed the distance apart that divorce provided.
My local court defaulted to giving my stbEx undeserved preferential authority in my "temp" order but during the long divorce process our Custody Evaluator saw the reality my court ignored and so I walked out of my divorce moved up to equal time and authority. Later I went back and sought full custody (as my CE's report predicted would happen).
Your boundaries of proper behavior are constantly tested. Read up on effective Boundaries here. Boundaries are not so much directly demanded of the other person - since the acting-out other resists boundaries - therefore they are for
your response
to poor behaviors. As in, greatly simplified, "If you do or don't do ___ then I will do or not do ___." See the two Boundaries threads here on our Tools & Skills workshop board:
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=329744.0
As much as possible, stick to your stated Boundaries and make very clear your stance on the boundary if you decide to allow an exception. The problem is that whenever you relax them and allow exceptions, then your spouse senses your seeming weakness and feels entitled and enabled to pressure you even more.
Do you have a temp order yet in the divorce case? If you get another protection order, make sure the terms of child exchange and other protections are spelled out so it is practical... and then stick to it.
An excellent handbook is
Splitting: Protecting Yourself While Divorcing Someone with Borderline or Narcissistic Personality Disorder
by William Eddy. Dealing with parenting issues - and how your spouse manipulates the kids - is addressed in
Divorce Poison
by Richard Warshak.
Does your ex (or his ex) have parenting time? If so, that may be a way for the older children to have time away from a problem ever-changing father or stepfather.
Technically, you have little or no rights concerning his older daughter. Similarly, he has little or no rights to your older children. Be cautious how those lines are drawn in any parenting plan. (While you may allow or even welcome his older daughter to come back and forth, it is clear your older children, and especially your older son, ought to have no or very limited contact with him. The temptation of his money or affluence should not buy their affections.) Your lawyer should be experienced enough to advise you on these myriads of decisions.
«
Last Edit: April 29, 2023, 01:04:51 PM by ForeverDad
»
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dtkm
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Relationship status: Married
Posts: 130
Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #2 on:
April 29, 2023, 01:18:48 PM »
Thank you for your response. I am shooting for full custody and nothing less. I don’t want him to have any time at all with these kids. I believe left alone, he is a danger to them. My oldest 2 kid’s dad passed away, so I have them all of the time. I don’t think he will ask for time with them, but who knows. I would love to be able to see my stepdaughter, but am ok if I am just able to text her for now. Her mom allows my husband to have whatever he wants, though says that she doesn’t understand what is wrong with him as he seems crazy a lot of the time. If I am not around, the crap gets thrown her (my stepdaughter’s) way.
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dtkm
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Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #3 on:
April 30, 2023, 11:26:53 PM »
My 11 year old son was “off” today. Thought he was tired since he slept at a friends house last night. Tonight, I told him he needed to put his phone away (he will not fall asleep when he watches his phone). I go to check to make sure he has put it away, walk around the corner, and there is blood everywhere…all over his hands and one of his legs. I had a feeling the scars on his leg were “something “ I just didn’t want to face it. But I had to tonight. I sat next to him and rubbed his back. He wouldn’t talk to me, just yes or no head movements to my questions. Is everything with your friends ok, yes; is this because of your home life, yes; are your siblings frustrating, no; is this because of me, no; is this because of dad, yes; because of how he treated/treats you, yes; because of how he treated/treats me, yes…both. 11 years old…no one, no one should ever feel this way…I have allowed this piece of **** to abuse me and
my kids. I feel like a horrible mother! I have tried for years to “hold this family together” for all of our sakes and in reality I have been slowly hurting my kids. My kids deserve so much more than this. I have been told “you will hold everything together until one day you will be DONE because of something he does to one of your kids”…I wish I could have seen this years ago. The pain my son is in is so evident…clearly he wanted me to know as he was sitting on the couch in plain sight. Tonight must mark a changing point…I have to be done focusing on my husband and focus on my kids. We need him out of our lives…he has hurt all of us enough…there can be no turning back. I hope karma really does exist. I am a mama bear…no one, no one gets in between me and any of my kids…and I let this ******. I am so mad! So mad! At this moment, I don’t ever want to see or talk to him again
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ForeverDad
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You can't reason with the Voice of Unreason...
Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #4 on:
May 01, 2023, 12:49:56 AM »
I'm so sorry to hear of this. We don't know all the circumstances, but I sense that somehow his distress should be documented, especially with a divorce in process. Are there any professionals, perhaps son's counselor or his pediatrician, that he could see on an emergency basis Monday?
This could also be an event that may merit filing for protection including the children. Ask your lawyer ASAP as well. And of course you know better this time, don't fool yourself that backing out of protection will help matters.
There's an old saying, "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."
Quote from: ForeverDad on June 03, 2007, 08:40:19 PM
This has been said many times so I don't know if there is an original quote to cite, but I remember from the original Star Trek series the starship Enterprise's engineer Scotty finally exclaimed to those on the Bridge, speaking of the Klingons trying to keep luring the Enterprise away from Captain Kirk and the landing party with a second false distress signal, "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me!"
This is yet another reminder of an old saying, "The walls have ears". The children are impacted by discord in the home, some more than others. The damage can be addressed, even if not fully remedied. Fortunately, time and love can heal many wounds and lessen the scars. Don't feel overly bad about the past, nothing can be done to change that. But redirect yourself to how best to remedy things for the future. Some of our mamas here are Mama Bears too!
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livednlearned
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Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #5 on:
May 02, 2023, 05:11:22 PM »
The same thing happened in my case. I thought I was protecting my son but I wasn't. I grew up with abuse so it was what I knew, but when I started to see the effects on my son it woke me up to the real damage taking place.
When my son was in his teens he said he wished I protected him sooner, a double-edged comment since it acknowledged what I did but also pointed out what I didn't do. It still haunts me to this day.
When I left, I told him my job was to keep him safe.
Sometimes, we can't do that in our families and we have to take drastic measures.
Is your son seeing a child psychologist? I can't say enough about how important it is that he has someone to talk to other than you. I went to the family specialist at my son's school to let them know there was tremendous stress at home and to please keep an eye out for behaviors that indicated that. They were wonderful, and gave him a special pass that allowed him to come to the family specialist's room any time he needed a break. He could talk or not, he could lay down. The teacher was given a heads up and together this small team of caring adults helped my son start to feel like there was a space for him to make sense of these intense emotions crushing him at home.
I also managed to get my son into counseling when he was 13. He self-diagnosed himself with depression in a health class and our pediatrician recommended a really wonderful child psychiatrist who in many ways helped both me and my son.
Leverage these boards and the collective wisdom. This was the best source of advice I received more than 10 years ago. It changed my life and helped me in ways that are hard to find anywhere else. These aren't garden variety divorces and there is a lot to learn and understand.
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Breathe.
dtkm
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Relationship status: Married
Posts: 130
Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #6 on:
May 04, 2023, 12:16:19 PM »
Quick question…my 2 little kids have the stomach flu. I had to take the day off from work to stay have with them. Never before has my uBPDh offered to take care of the kids when they are sick by himself. He has helped when we lived together but never offered to be the one to stay home so I could work. Now that we live separately, and he is fighting for 50/50 custody, he wants the kids to help take care of them. I do t want him anywhere near my kids. I already have a child who is cutting themselves because of his treatment of him. I don’t need any more from him. My lawyer is in trial today and this is not available to help me. Is this an appropriate response…”thanks for the offer, but I have always been with the kids when they were sick, so I don’t believe anything needs to change”. I want to go off on him telling him he has already damaged our family enough, but I know I shouldn’t do that!
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kells76
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Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #7 on:
May 04, 2023, 12:46:02 PM »
Can you remind me, do you have any kind of parenting time schedule yet (even just "status quo")? If so, stick with whoever's day it is. If it's your day, it's your day, and if it's Dad's day, it's Dad's day. For example, if it's Dad time at all today, an example response could be: "Thanks for offering. I'll drop them off at your place at 3pm and will pick them up at 7pm like usual. Best; dtkm"
If you don't have a set schedule, it's fine to politely and briefly decline, like the start of your idea: "Thanks for offering; I have it covered."
No explanation is necessary, and generally, offering any kind of explanation is opening a door to conflict and argument. DEFINITELY steer clear of "I've always been with them" -- for a pwPD, that's an invitation to an argument.
Keep it Brief, Informative, Friendly, and Firm, and avoid Justifying, Arguing, Defending, and Explaining -- remember Yes BIFF and No JADE, and that'll improve the vast majority of your parenting communications
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dtkm
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Relationship status: Married
Posts: 130
Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #8 on:
May 04, 2023, 12:57:27 PM »
Thank you! There is nothing in place. I tend to say way too much, which I feel like gets me in trouble.
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ForeverDad
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Relationship status: separated 2005 then divorced
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You can't reason with the Voice of Unreason...
Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #9 on:
May 04, 2023, 02:28:40 PM »
Logically we think JADE (especially E for Explain) makes sense for reasonably normal people but BIFF is best when we're dealing with pwBPD.
I recall my lawyer telling me his first task when hired is to sit on his clients so they don't talk (too much) - especially in testimony. Answer Yes or No then stop. Talking and explaining too easily gets them into trouble, though he's okay with charging more to fix whatever damage is done.
In addition, if there is even the least risk of you getting frustrated or losing your cool, imagine there's a judge looking over your shoulder observing you.
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kells76
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Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #10 on:
May 04, 2023, 03:10:39 PM »
Here are some links for the communication tools:
B.I.F.F. Technique for Communications
and
Don't "JADE" (justify, argue, defend, explain)
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dtkm
Offline
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Relationship status: Married
Posts: 130
Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #11 on:
May 07, 2023, 10:01:54 PM »
I want to scream. We went to my daughter’s soccer this afternoon. We get there and my uNPDh gets out of the car picks up my son and walks away…talking very secretly to him. I know he is telling him to say that he wants to go to his house, etc. He thing picks up my 2 year old and does the same. He then tells me he is taking the kids with him after soccer, I am not welcome at his house and I can call the police if I don’t like it. He was not. nice, clearly in a black mood…didn’t say hi to my other daughter, nothing, just his pure evil black mode. I started to talk to my stepdaughter and he step in between us and pushes her away from me. I do soccer with my daughter. My son has been sick all week. My stepdaughter gets sick very easily. Not a good idea to have them in the same room. He says that he needs to take my 5 year old to the bathroom. I say ok, but then my 2 year old wants nothing to do with soccer. He makes a scene the entire time, to the point that I don’t want to return to soccer ever again. We walk to the car, he grabs my 2 year old and starts to put her in his car, I tell my son he can choose where he goes, he responds no he is coni with me and not nicly tells him to go around and get in your seat numerous times. We drive off…he drives like a bat out of hell, I drive so I can see him in the distance. We get to his house, my son gets out of the car and I start to talk to him, he yells at my stepdaughter to hurry and get my son in the house so I couldn’t talk to him. I go to talk to my daughter, and get her out of her carseat, he pulls my hands off of her carseat and talks me to get out of here. He then grabs mu 2 year old and takes her inside. I get in the car, and call the police. They tell me there is nothing they can do without a court order, but they would suggest getting an emergency order, which doesn’t seem possible since we need to have a PRE involved. The police finally come over to do a well child check. Since they didn’t see any immediate danger, they told me that there was nothing they could do. I wanted to stay in front of his house, but they did advise me to not do so as he could call me in for stalking. I told him that it makes no sense as I am worried about my kids, he agreed but said even though they understand the circumstances, his hands would be tied. I left, not happy, but understood. Thankfully I was able to pick my kids up a couple of hours later. I let my stepdaughter’s mom know that while I didn’t want her to have to get involved, I would highly suggest she have a frank conversation with her daughter as to what she goes through over at his house. The emotional well-being of these kids is of no worry to him. I am so mad at him right now. My kids had to miss a school function I had planned with them because he took them with no care of them already having plans. He also refused to sign a check from the renters that I need to have him sign before I can deposit it and it covers the mortgage that is due on the 15th…he told me he won’t sign anything until I sign the title of his car over to him. Really, give me the 1/2 of the money you will get selling the car and I will sign it over to you…but he refuses to do so. At this second, I don’t ever want to look at him again. My kids returned entitled and not nice (do this now mom, saying I hate you to a sibling, etc, behaving badly) I don’t think I can do this for the next 16 years…I wish he would go away!
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ForeverDad
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Relationship status: separated 2005 then divorced
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You can't reason with the Voice of Unreason...
Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #12 on:
May 08, 2023, 08:29:45 AM »
Quote from: dtkm on May 07, 2023, 10:01:54 PM
I get in the car, and call the police. They tell me there is nothing they can do without a court order, but they would suggest getting an emergency order, which doesn’t seem possible since we need to have a PRE involved. The police finally come over to do a well child check. Since they didn’t see any immediate danger, they told me that there was nothing they could do. I wanted to stay in front of his house, but they did advise me to not do so as he could call me in for stalking. I told him that it makes no sense as I am worried about my kids, he agreed but said even though they understand the circumstances, his hands would be tied. I left, not happy, but understood.
Notice this was a weekend when most offices are closed. Almost predictable. This is one of many posts I made describing my experience:
Quote from: ForeverDad on July 23, 2021, 02:31:28 PM
It seems that you don't yet have legal protections as parent in place. That's what the divorce process establishes...
I called the police station in her area and asked them to accompany me to see my son. They refused, said I needed in hand a court order first. I asked what would happen if I went to see him without them. They said they'd come rushing if she called them. I decided to avoid predictable demanded arrest and waited three months for my divorce's temp order.
It is to the point that you need a temporary order, probably an
ex parte
emergency order though I don't know how many areas of your life can be protected. The first petition can get an order from the court while it does some basic investigation for initial reports and then a couple weeks later both parties appear in a hearing for the judge to determine what needs to be modified.
I don't know whether you can get an emergency order to state that your older children not go to his house. Probably since they were probably not adopted by him? Typically it determines what is appropriate to order regarding shared children. I also don't know whether the court will force him to pay bills but in a divorce case it probably would if his name is on the mortgage, contracts or bills. If so, then any refusal to cooperate with payments could impact him legally. The car and splitting its equity may be a different matter to address in a divorce.
Simply stated, court orders are requested to give some semblance of order to a disputed relationship and protect minor children.
Your spouse is using the lack of legal clarity (as you found out with the police response) in a relationship that does not have a court order in place. If you don't have a lawyer now, seek some consultations for legal advice promptly. If your lawyer is not up to the task of a high conflict divorce case then now is the time to interview a few, listen to your options and their possible strategies.
«
Last Edit: May 08, 2023, 08:37:38 AM by ForeverDad
»
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livednlearned
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Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #13 on:
May 08, 2023, 02:25:39 PM »
It's also possible he is trying to push you back, like a kid in a sandbox.
He figures, you pushed him so he'll give you a good shove back.
If he's anything like the PD patterns of men, he doesn't want the kids so much as he wants to keep you from having them.
That distinction matters because he will set things up like a win/lose and it's hard to step out of that dynamic when kids are involved. It is possible, but you'll have to do a lot of pre-work, especially learning to validate how the kids feel. "How did it make you feel when he said that?" for example.
As your kids get older, they'll notice who is really winning, and they will measure it by who is keeping them emotionally safe. When my ex had a psychotic break while taking care of our son, he made veiled threats that led me to think he was going to kill both of them. Similar to what you experienced, law enforcement could not do much other than a well check, and I worried they would arrive, find nothing too amiss, and things would go off the rails after that (with ex seeing it as the ultimate provocation). So I waited it out for 12 hours. My therapist answered my call on a Sunday afternoon (like FD mentioned, the weekends are a popular time for these things to go down) and assured me, based on her assessment of his pattern of behaviors, that he would likely return our son right on schedule.
He did.
It was like negotiating with a hostage taker. Having experts guide you is essential. And engaging him too much can backfire. He may decide this game is fun, he's winning, so he'll do it again.
When ex came to the door, I refused to open it, even with our son standing there in total distress. I just kept saying, Get in the car. Get in the car. Every time he shouted something or said something, I repeated Get in the car.
It was an insane moment, with ex shouting that I was trying to leave the country and he wanted the passports and I was a horrible mother no one liked me, I cheated on him, even Jesus wouldn't forgive me and he forgave everyone. I mean, wtf. I just kept calmly repeating, Get in the car. By our custody order, neither parent was to get out of the car during transitions (easier to do with an older child).
With that kind of authority in my voice, ex listened. He kind of hung his head like a mad little kid and stomped back to the car.
My point being that I had to put my safety ahead of my son's in that moment. I knew if I opened the door, ex would barge through and things would escalate and no one would be safe.
I grew a titanium backbone that weekend, probably in that moment. No one will ever make me feel that way again.
The upside, and it is a profound upside, is that my son saw me stand up to a bully. I found something deep inside that was calm, strong, assertive, taking no BS. The back-talking, chair kicking kid who was becoming angry and acting out at school disappeared after that. Having one safe, assertive parent made a
big
difference. It made all the difference.
When S11 finally came inside the door, I said, "I'm here, I'm here for you. I love you and what happened was scary. You can talk to me now, or, if you need a minute to be by yourself, that's ok too. I'll be here when you're ready to talk."
He hugged me hard for a minute then ran upstairs for three or four minutes. He came down and wanted to snuggle so we sat on the couch and I just held him and listened. A little bit came out but mainly he needed to bounce off the walls a bit. He kept coming to me for hugs and wanted things to get back to normal. I was instructed by my therapist and lawyer to get him back to normal life as quickly as possible, so he went to camp the next day and when I picked him up, we went to the supermarket where, in a kind of awkward kid way, he told me in the frozen food aisle that his dad had asked S11 if he could borrow his bat to beat me.
That's a very chilling thing to say to a kid.
I think S11 needed to get it off his chest, like he had a piece of intelligence that was too hot to keep. There was this nervous trembly energy I'll never forget, like he was shaking things off, almost like, "Here's something you should probably know so my safe parent remains safe."
It's still really hard to recap that day. I guess I'm sharing with you in case you're headed for similar experiences. Maybe something we went through will be a guiding light in what might be a dark night of the soul.
Looking back, I wish I did family counseling with S11, just the two of us. I had individual counseling and that was helpful, but I really needed a child psychologist to help me understand how to handle the repair part of S11's trauma. I created a safe environment and maintained consistency and coordinated stuff with teachers and whatnot. But sometimes I rushed too quickly to make things all better, if that makes sense?
I did not always give S11 lots of space to have his big, hard, horrible feelings so he could experience the catharsis of discharging them. Bottled up feelings can get very dark in adolescence. It's better to give them space to feel them as they occur, and to validate that it's ok to feel that way.
Regardless of what you decide to do, how do you feel about talking to a child psychologist about the best way to de-escalate these situations, and how best to talk to the kids after the fact?
If your state has parenting coordinators, some may be child psychologists. These types of experts tend to work with high-conflict families like ours and will remain focused on the needs of the kids. Some parenting coordinators are attorneys and they tend to see our conflicts in a way that isn't as insightful, especially in terms of what the kids are going through.
I can't recommend Don't Alienate the Kids by Bill Eddy enough. It's going to give you practical things you can start doing today, and will help you see the long game here, rather than these one-off battles where he wins every time.
My father used to say you can't win a pissing match with a skunk.
You have to figure out how to win the hearts and minds of your kids while your stbx is focused on winning a war of his own making.
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Last Edit: May 08, 2023, 02:53:40 PM by livednlearned
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dtkm
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Relationship status: Married
Posts: 130
Re: Don’t know what to do…
«
Reply #14 on:
May 09, 2023, 08:20:37 AM »
Thank you both for your responses! They are alway greatly appreciated! I definitely believe this was a “push back”. He was used to getting his way all of the time during our relationship. Since he moved out, I have not given in on the kids. I have held a very firm boundary there, and I know he doesn’t like it. It was his temper tantrum to me not giving in, to me not just rolling over anymore. The second I saw him on Sunday, I knew the mood he was in and I knew this wasn’t going to be good. While I do know that he loves his kids dearly, I do believe that he wants them more to hurt me than to actually have the kids. If this wasn’t the case, he would be at every activity, every school pick up, over the house all of the time, taking care of them, participating in holidays with them, truly being a part of their lives, organizing sports for them, organizing playdates with other dads and their kids (he got phone numbers to do this…probably 6 months ago) supporting them, showing true care…not sitting back, complaining that he doesn’t have the kids alone at his house, or alone at his house with my stepdaughter. “Alone at his house with my stepdaughter”…he has said that so many times to me…and it just sounds so sad to me…take the kids out to do something! But he can’t do anything by himself outside of the gym 3 times a day…he won’t even leave the house to go into work the 3 times a week he is supposed to…he always makes an excuse and his work buys it. Sorry for the rant! It is clear to me that he just wants me to hurt as much as he does. I still love him and I feel bad for him that he will most likely never get the true help he needs and will forever be in his cycle. While it hurts me, his cycle is not my problem any longer. I truly believe he needs to hit the lowest of lows to realize that he could have an amazing life, but it’s up to him to help himself. Just like it is up to me to help myself and my kids right now, regardless of where he will be in our lives in the future. Every day something pops into my brain, and I realize how messed up something was that I had made myself believe was totally normal…there is a lot to unravel. I know I have a battle ahead of me, I will fight until the end for what I believe is best for my children and myself…and hope that in the end love will win…whatever that means!
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