Feeling Lost and need advice

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

 
Hello everyone. I am new this site and have found it really helpful reading through all the different threads.

A little about our relationship. We are married for about a year and 4 months. We have been together for about 2.5 years. Our daughter happened rather quickly and she is currently 20 months. In the beginning we had a great relationship. We did not have much arguments and really enjoyed being together. After our daughter was born about 3-4 months in we moved with my parents for about 7 months to allow us to house shop. This past August we purchased our first home. We had one of my friends move in as a roommate since he was in between apartments.

About 2 months ago she had a mental breakdown on me and said she did not feel comfortable with him living there. She also ended up going into an inpatient treatment center. This for me was the first time I realized what she was dealing with was more complicated than my initial thought. This is also when they diagnosed her BPD and not just depression. After this situation I tried my best to meet her expectations even asking my friend to move out.

Since then I have felt like I am walking on eggshells and I have to be perfect. I try to help around the house as much as I can but sometimes after work I don't feel like doing anything. She feels I do not help with our daughter enough. Fast forward and currently she is back in the behavioral health unit and has brought up separating again. I told her we need to work through it and make adjustments. Relationships are work and I want to work on us. She is firm about feeling unhappy with me apparently for 6 months now.

She does not have a great relationship with her family and recently they have been trying to get closer. Her dad also suffers from Bipolar and had an attempt while she is in the hospital. I was frustrated with her mom because she keeps pushing her dad back into her life and mentioned that and now they are mad at me.

We had a hard discussion over phone last night where she said she is truly done and needs a divorce. She cannot handle the responsibility of dealing with her mental health and having to worry about my emotions. She does not see me making more changes and cannot go on.

Now here is where I am lost. I do not want to simply give up on her. She is not pushing to take our daughter away from me or anything like that. On the contrary said she will work to find a place near so I can maintain my relationship with out daughter. I feel like she is reacting to her being under a stressful situation and pushing me away because I have been that person that has been there for her for everything these past 2.5 years. Do I give her space or do I distant myself a bit but still let her know I am by her side per se.

One note she has health insurance through me so I do not want to divorce right away so she can go through a DBT session.

[gaherna3]

 
Hello everyone. I am new this site and have found it really helpful reading through all the different threads.

A little about our relationship. We are married for about a year and 4 months. We have been together for about 2.5 years. Our daughter happened rather quickly and she is currently 20 months. In the beginning we had a great relationship. We did not have much arguments and really enjoyed being together. After our daughter was born about 3-4 months in we moved with my parents for about 7 months to allow us to house shop. This past August we purchased our first home. We had one of my friends move in as a roommate since he was in between apartments.

About 2 months ago she had a mental breakdown on me and said she did not feel comfortable with him living there. She also ended up going into an inpatient treatment center. This for me was the first time I realized what she was dealing with was more complicated than my initial thought. This is also when they diagnosed her BPD and not just depression. After this situation I tried my best to meet her expectations even asking my friend to move out.

Since then I have felt like I am walking on eggshells and I have to be perfect. I try to help around the house as much as I can but sometimes after work I don't feel like doing anything. She feels I do not help with our daughter enough. Fast forward and currently she is back in the behavioral health unit and has brought up separating again. I told her we need to work through it and make adjustments. Relationships are work and I want to work on us. She is firm about feeling unhappy with me apparently for 6 months now.

She does not have a great relationship with her family and recently they have been trying to get closer. Her dad also suffers from Bipolar and had an attempt while she is in the hospital. I was frustrated with her mom because she keeps pushing her dad back into her life and mentioned that and now they are mad at me.

We had a hard discussion over phone last night where she said she is truly done and needs a divorce. She cannot handle the responsibility of dealing with her mental health and having to worry about my emotions. She does not see me making more changes and cannot go on.

Now here is where I am lost. I do not want to simply give up on her. She is not pushing to take our daughter away from me or anything like that. On the contrary said she will work to find a place near so I can maintain my relationship with out daughter. I feel like she is reacting to her being under a stressful situation and pushing me away because I have been that person that has been there for her for everything these past 2.5 years. Do I give her space or do I distant myself a bit but still let her know I am by her side per se.

One note she has health insurance through me so I do not want to divorce right away so she can go through a DBT session.

[Cat Familiar]

Welcome. These relationships, as you know now, are difficult. That you are the emotionally stable one puts additional responsibilities upon your shoulders, but you can only do what you are able, and it seems that often with BPD partners, they expect the impossible.

Additional stressors, such as parenthood, house shopping, financial issues often bring out the undesirable BPD behaviors. What so many of us want/expect is to return to the honeymoon phase of our relationships. Unfortunately that ship has sailed.

Take a look at the Tools at the top of the page. You don’t need to make any decisions now or even come to any conclusions about her plans. Often people with BPD threaten divorce just because they are so uncomfortable emotionally and have foisted all their discontent upon their partners.

Best thing you can do is to take care of yourself and learn how to respond to her in ways where you are grounded and feeling centered. She is going to be emotionally erratic, but you don’t need to follow her there.

[ForeverDad]

Do you have documentation of her diagnosis and in-patient treatment?  If so, make copies for your own documentation and preserve them somewhere she doesn't have access to, just in case she later tries to deny (a common behavior).  Beware, at some point you may be pressured or convinced briefly to delete or destroy them but resist that impulse.  Better yet, don't bring up the matter.  In other words, don't invite conflict.

While having BPD in itself is not proof she would be a poor parent, but legal awareness of that diagnosis would give weight to investigating the parenting aspect if you ever end up in domestic court.

The way you worded the post is as though she would 'allow' you to be a father.  There's real risk that later, down the road a bit, she may want you to be less a father and shift you to the side.

When dealing with BPD behaviors, understand that they're often more self-centered and if her perceptions about you change then her apparent agreeableness now might vanish.

However, on the bright side, her awareness of BPD and willingness to start DBT are positives.  The key is whether she will listen to the therapy and diligently apply it in her life and perceptions.  Warning signs are if she attends for a while without meaningful improvements and then declares herself fixed.  Successful therapy is not measured in a few sessions or quitting after a few months.

[livednlearned]

We had a hard discussion over phone last night where she said she is truly done and needs a divorce. She cannot handle the responsibility of dealing with her mental health and having to worry about my emotions. She does not see me making more changes and cannot go on.

gaherna3, welcome and hello. You've hit a lot of milestones in a short period of time, and done a really admirable job holding things together. That had to be hard to ask your friend to move out while supporting your wife, and she seems to be managing the pressure cooker of her condition by reaching for the rip cord.

I do not want to simply give up on her. She is not pushing to take our daughter away from me or anything like that. On the contrary said she will work to find a place near so I can maintain my relationship with out daughter. I feel like she is reacting to her being under a stressful situation and pushing me away because I have been that person that has been there for her for everything these past 2.5 years. Do I give her space or do I distant myself a bit but still let her know I am by her side per se.

Do you feel comfortable sharing what you think she means when she says you aren't making changes? What are some of the issues coming between you, or coming up for you?

Let us know the best way to support you. It might help to learn what the different boards offer:

Should I use "Bettering" or the "Conflicted Board": The " Bettering a Relationship or Reversing a Breakup" board is for members looking to solve specific relationship problems, to be coached on the use of relationship tools, and to examine their role in relationship conflict.

The "Conflicted or Just Tolerating a Relationship" board is for those seeking some emotional support and coping skills, but are not motivated for problem solving or learning relations tools at this time - or who are conflicted about staying in the relationship.

It seems like you might be open to examining your role in relationship conflict.

She is talking about divorce, and like Cat Familiar says, it might be that's her go-to rip-cord while she discharges extreme stress and pain.

It's also possible there are some things you can do to help make things less worse (this is true in all relationships).

I found the Bettering board gave me excellent tools to improve my parenting. The skills are good for all relationships, not just BPD. When your child has a BPD parent, these skills can be life-changing for them because BPD behaviors are rough for children who are often not adequately validated, making them susceptible to BPD themselves.
 

[gaherna3]

Thank you all for all your responses. A little update on our situation. She came out and decided she was being irrational. She was immediately put into a DBT intensive outpatient program where a lot has been being uncovered. It has been very tough with her trying to cope with her learning about herself.

Not only that but it has been extremely hard on me trying to stay strong for her and also manage all the family finances. I broke down over the weekend and mentioned I was exhausted and did not know how much longer I could go on. She did not receive this well and again insisted that maybe we are not compatible and need to go our separate ways. She is currently now in an in patient center again.

I think the difference now is I have her therapist from DBT in out corner and wants her to get back into her sessions as soon as she is out. I think her bringing up separation again is a defense mechanism like mentioned here. Obviously with more stressors now she is definitely trying to end it before she gets more hurt. I assured her I am still in this with her and that I just needed to vent a bit. Now is another long week or 2 of going through this rollercoaster until she comes back to a logical place.

[Czr_Crrll]

Hi, gaherna3! I sympathize with your situation. I also went through a rough period of being devalued/demonized that only ended a couple months ago. I noticed that my GF wBPD would use me as a scapegoat for a lot of personal issues that really had very little to do with me. She would say that the cause of all her misery and dissatisfaction was me and our relationship and she would constantly try and find excuses to end it. Realizing that this behavior is pathological and that pwBPD will usually try and place the weight of all their problems on the people closest to them helps me keep calm when these kinds of things happen. It's not that you are not doing enough. Even if you try your hardest, it will never be enough. That isn't to say you can't do anything, though!

It seems like your wife is open to receiving help and support and that's a great thing! By being kind and supportive in her process you can slowly reverse your role as villain of her story. Just be as helpful as you can in fostering her personal growth and keep in mind that her solving her personal issues is indirectly also healing your relationship. Communicate with her as to how you can be supportive in a way that won't be triggering to her. Sometimes you'll find that the things that are triggering are simple and easily avoidable.

In the meantime, you can work on your personal growth and wellbeing. Try to do things that bring you joy. Practice self care as much as you can and set healthy boundaries with your partner so that you have the space to not feel overwhelmed, especially when BPD symptoms spike.

Communication is definitely key. The better your communication the better things will go. And that's for all relationships not just ones involving BPD!

I wish you the best in your situation. Thank you so much for sharing!

[gaherna3]

Updating everyone as this is sort of a Journal for me.

She left again yesterday for the fourth time in a year. I feel in my heart I tried being as patient and understanding as possible. I don't see us moving forward together anymore unless she really makes some changes. I do think a separation from me and her doing her therapy will be beneficial. I almost made everything too easy for her. I took care of as much as I could relating to our relationship and daughter. I think her separating and feeling my absence of help that I provide will be a rough wake up call. But I hope that this in combination with therapy that she is doing will help her stop splitting from me. I am not holding on to this hope but I do feel that if I saw changes in the future I would consider it.

Ultimately, if this does end and we are to co-parent and part ways, I myself feel content that I gave this 110%. I was willing to go above and beyond to be there for her. As much as it pains me to think of a future where I will only see my daughter half the time I know those moments with her will be cherished. Fortunately, she is only 2 and won't have much of a recollection of a family. I know it is a hard and long process from here. I have a lot of healing to do from this.

[Czr_Crrll]

Hi gaherna3,

I'm sorry to hear that this is happening again. I do recognize that feeling of having given it your all, and I think it's good that you see it that way. I think right now is definitely a time for you to focus on things that make you happy and that help bring you joy and growth.

I think it is likely that you will hear back from her once she feels your absence, but whatever you two decide to do, make sure to set healthy and firm boundaries with your partner and act on those boundaries if they are crossed.

I hope things look up soon!

[Pook075]

Hi Gaherna and welcome.  My story was very similar, although it was a 24 year marriage.  I'm really sorry you're going through this and it's great you have enough self-awareness to see the situation for what it is- your wife is sick and she can't be responsible for more than herself right now.  It's sad and heartbreaking, for sure, but the problem lies with her and she's the only one that can overcome this.

Here's some practical advice that I learned along the way from my own mistakes:

1)  Don't walk on eggshells, but also don't try to be her white knight.  She needs time and space to heal and come to terms with her own struggles.  If you push to restore things, that will only drive her away.  If you try to do everything for her, it eliminates any desire to change.  If she wants to walk away, then let her walk away no matter how much it currently hurts. 

Now, that doesn't mean to give up completely...it just means to take a pause and let her stabilize mentally.  In short, she needs to find herself.

2)  Take this time to work on yourself and do everything you can to not obsess over how you can fix the relationship (or what you did wrong).  The simple answer is that you can't because this isn't on you, it's not your fault.  However, you've also been traumatized and there's some healing to do on your end as well.  Find healthy choices to fill your time and do not hesitate to consider therapy for yourself.  It really helps, even if it's only to just reinforce what you're already doing. 

3)  When talking to your wife, remember that the most important thing isn't getting back together, it's her healing mentally and reaching a point where she can be in a productive marriage.  You've already shown a great deal of compassion and understanding, so continue to lead with that.  Don't focus on her words (complaints) as much as how her emotions drive the conversations.  Learn to be a better listener as well and give her mental support whenever possible.

4)  Likewise, talk to friends and family for mental support, but DO NOT rely on their advice.  They don't understand and will be quick to judge your wife, which does nothing but stoke the flame.  The person to decide whether to keep fighting or give up is you and only you.  If you need direct advice, see a counselor who will understand exactly what you and your wife are going through.

5)  I've already said this, but I have to drive home that this is not your fault!  It would have happened regardless of who she was married to, because this all stems from mental illness and dysregulated thinking.  Your job right now is to be a husband, to love and support her while she's spiraling, but it's not to take abuse or accept unnecessary blame.  In a healthy marriage, two people work together to solve their problems.  That's not an option right now because she's unable to carry her weight, so you have to accept that.

I hope that helps!

[ForeverDad]

A good predictor of the future is the past.  If it has happened before, it is likely to happen again.

Improved and smarter boundaries do help but they are not a complete "fix".  Meaningful therapy and diligent application in the other's life and thinking are also crucial.

A comment I often make when there is risk of heightened conflict:
If it has been threatened or even contemplated, then it will happen, given enough time.

[gaherna3]

Thank you all for your comments and your advice. She is fully gone from the house now and we are strictly co-parenting. It is breaking my heart and I am trying to stay in good spirits. As many of us in a relationship with pwBPD I am hopeful that therapy helps and she wants to start working on us. For now I am taking it a day at a time and trying to give her as much space as needed. It is a scary path to lead because I do not know where this is heading but I am staying as strong as I can.

[gaherna3]

Update:

It is amazing to me how much of a bond I had with her. I feel so empty without her. We have been doing good co parenting but now that the stress is hitting her she is starting to ask for more child support. It is killing me because I still pay for all of her stuff on top of buying our daughter here necessary things. I also fully pay for daycare because she is in DBT every day. It is an IOP. She says however that she just wants the money to purchase our daughter her things instead of me doing it and giving it to her. That is not what we agreed on initially but now it is changing. I am afraid of where this is heading as she start to feel the separation more. I don't want to be unfair to her but I do believe I am doing more than enough. This does not take into account all the hospital bills she left for me to pay.

I am so frustrated today. I just want her back. I want that person I met back. She has done such a 180 on me and it was so sudden. I am feeling very defeated in life.

[Czr_Crrll]

Hi, gaherna3,

I'm very sorry that you're going through what sounds like a really rough time. I've been in a situation like yours in which I was still taking care of my pwBPD financially while we were in a period of separation. It can be very, very frustrating and it can make one feel like they are just being used.

I can't stress enough the importance of boundaries during a time like this. If you give in to demands, you prevent her from seeking out change. If she's doing something that wasn't in your agreement, you can refer back to the agreement and be firm. She'll likely be upset, but not doing it communicates that it's okay to do that to you, and that she doesn't need to change because you will solve whatever problem she has. I believe that pwBPD benefit from seeing that there are real consequences to their actions. It's hard as hell to have to be the bad guy in those situations, especially because in cases like ours, it means being cruel to a person we really love.

However, your wife has to be left to made the decision if she wants to continue with you and commit to work on herself and the relationship or move on and lose all benefits as well. It'll always be more comfortable for her to be in this middle ground of keeping you around, but never commiting to you. I myself was stuck in this limbo for nearly 2 years before I finally gave my GFwBPD the ultimatum. She also might tell you it's impossible for her to decide, in which case you can set a deadline and if you don't get an answer then it's an automatic no. This kind of measure might seem cold, but it's meant to communicate a very important message.

Whatever situation she is in, she is in it because it was her decision to be there, not because of you. She has to learn to accept whatever comes with the choices she makes.

I know it gets more complicated with your child, but you can't keep bailing her out and making it easy for her to overstep your agreements and boundaries.

I sympathize with you. It feels awful. In these cases I encourage you to be just a little bit selfish. Prioritize your own happiness. Do what you think is best. Whatever you do, though. Don't stay in a situation where you can be taken advantage of out of fear of change. Even if your partner doesn't mean to, she might still do it unconsciously.

I am currently in a situation in which I was able to reconsolidate my relationship by being a bit more assertive and firm with my actions. And even now, with us back together, with my partner receiving help, with us going to couples therapy and having just had a month of what feels like the best our relationship has been since our honeymoon stage, she still gets thoughts of running away.

It's all part of it. It comes and goes in waves and if we're choosing to stay, we have to learn to be happy regardless of whether our partner gives us everything we want or disappears from our life tomorrow, which is always a possibility.

And that's what I wish for you. I hope you find your happiness even in these dark times! I will continue to wish you the best of luck!

[gaherna3]

Czr_Crrll,

Thank you for your words. It is extremely hard to set boundaries with her. I know she is going to struggle as she does not have a job or anything. I know logically I need to let her do that, but it is so hard. I appreciate your words. I am hanging in there as much as I can.

[livednlearned]

It may be that you feel better when you pick up her slack and let boundaries slide, but can be incredibly counterproductive for her recovery.

Maybe think of it as expectations for her versus setting boundaries. This can help regulate her -- it can help her see herself as a competent person, through the eyes of someone who knows her.

She won't like it, and might be furious, but when the fury subsides the lasting message is that someone sees her as competent. Maybe it's true, and she really can do these things ...

Sometimes when we have a hard time holding boundaries, it sends a message that we have a low opinion of this person's ability, which is very persuasive, and not in a good way, to someone who has a profoundly low opinion of themselves.

My stepdaughter regresses when people help her solve her problems. It's so much easier to solve her problems for her, but it seems to convince her that she can't do anything on her own, the exact message we say we don't want to send.

[gaherna3]

livednlearned,

Thank you for your reply. I can definitely see how her regulating her own self could help her. I am learning how to let her figure her own self out. It is just a scary thing to do because she distances herself and almost feels abandoned which is not what I want her to feel. I am hoping her DBT sessions will slowly teach her that is is fine for me to step back and at the same time still be supportive without me figuring it out for her.

She has been a bit more communicative with me lately and told me she wants to learn how to be a better partner. She does mention wanting to eventually get back together but she needs time to learn about herself and learn to deal with the negative thoughts that cause her to push me away.

[kells76]

Hi gaherna3, thanks for the update.

This is interesting:

She has been a bit more communicative with me lately and told me she wants to learn how to be a better partner. She does mention wanting to eventually get back together but she needs time to learn about herself and learn to deal with the negative thoughts that cause her to push me away.

Did she explicitly say the part in bold?

[gaherna3]

kells76,

She did. When she is more stable on some days she does admit that she needs to do the work to get herself more stable. She is also able to communicate with me better about how I can help support her. Having been split over the holidays was tough and on New Year's day she told me she does not see us being separate but that it will also take her some time learn how to better handle situations.

[gaherna3]

Update.

I had surgery about 2 weeks ago and she came back to the house to help me post surgery. It was really nice having her over. We did talk last night and she mentions she just doesn't know how to let go of some of my downfalls and accept my apologies.

For context, we moved to my parents in 2021 while our daughter was an infant for about 6 months. I chose to do this so we could save a little faster for a house. Afterwards we managed to purchase a house. During this period the stress and pressure I put on myself, in combination at being back at my parents house really got to me. I shutdown emotionally and neglected her emotional needs. I resorted to simply being a "provider".

After therapy and such I admitted to her I shut down and asked to apologize and move forward. This two weeks while she was with me I tried to really show her that I am trying to move forward and be more emotionally available to her. However, this is where she mentions that she does not know how she can trust me to not shut down emotionally again and neglect her emotional needs. She says she sees the changes and wishes this was how it was the whole time. I apologize to her and tell her I cannot change the past but I can actively make changes now which I am doing.

It is hard because she finds it hard to accept my apology and trust that I will not shutdown again. Have any of you experienced this where your pwBPD finds forgiveness hard?

[Pook075]

It is hard because she finds it hard to accept my apology and trust that I will not shutdown again. Have any of you experienced this where your pwBPD finds forgiveness hard?

Of course, a BPD's biggest fear is abandonment...so she abandoned you before you could abandon her.  To take you back, she has to overcome those old fears PLUS convince herself that you won't abandon her again (which you never did in the first place).

I just re-read this thread and here's what I hear from you- it's all your fault and she must forgive you.

What I read from that, you're still walking on eggshells and willing to take the blame for everything.  And what that tells her is that she was right to leave you, it was all your fault, this has nothing to do with her behavior, etc.  Can you see the glaring problem here?

Relationships take two people.  Two.  I've had similar conversations with my wife and very similar scenarios- why couldn't I be more loving?  The honest answer, if we break down all the barriers and get to the heart of it, is that I didn't feel loved.  Often I felt the opposite of that. 

Relationships take two people working together to make things work, there's no substitute.  It's good that you're leading with compassion and making real changes, but it's also completely unfair that you're taking all the burden and none of the benefit.

It takes two, don't forget that.  You won't shut down if you're actively being loved.

[kells76]

Hey gaherna3, hope surgery recovery keeps going well. It sounds like you and your W were able to have some low-key and positive times, and that can build a better foundation for your relationship.

One thing I've read here, that seems like a helpful framework for understanding your situation, is that some pwBPD may extrapolate their feelings forward and backward in time. That is to say, if a pwBPD in this present moment feels doubt about being loved, then "you never loved me" and "I don't think we'll ever be able to love each other". Or, if a pwBPD in this present moment feels good about the relationship, then "we've always been twin flames" and "our love will never die".

Maybe that's an aspect of lacking a self, or having a weak, unstable sense of self -- it would be difficult to identify where feelings come from and the fact that my feelings come from inside of me, and difficult to have a perspective of one self growing over time. That can be why trying to resolve/relitigate the past with a pwBPD typically isn't productive -- their disorder impairs their ability to have the insight that "well, even though I did feel that way then, and it hurt then, I can feel differently now, and we can make different choices in the future".

What's hopefully good news is that to me, at least, I see a lot of opportunities in your post for you to try different approaches to communication and connection with her, that can bypass the "she needs to accept my apology" rabbit trail.

Let's take a look:

After therapy and such I admitted to her I shut down and asked to apologize and move forward.

OK, that makes sense to state that at least once. Even though pwBPD often have distorted perceptions of what happened, that doesn't mean that they're never right about us messing up! If it's true, you can own it.

How did she respond at that time?

This two weeks while she was with me I tried to really show her that I am trying to move forward and be more emotionally available to her.

What did you say or do (or not say or not do) to try to show those changes?

However, this is where she mentions that she does not know how she can trust me to not shut down emotionally again and neglect her emotional needs. She says she sees the changes and wishes this was how it was the whole time. I apologize to her and tell her I cannot change the past but I can actively make changes now which I am doing.

Can you post a "transcript" of how this conversation went down? Something like:

You: I'm so sorry for the times when I wasn't there for you. I apologize and I want to change.

Her: I don't know how I can trust you to not shut down emotionally again and neglect my emotional needs. I see the changes and wish this was how it was the whole time.

You: I'm really sorry. I can't change the past but I can actively make changes now which I am doing.

...

If it went something like that, then to me, the parts that stand out as opportunities are when she says "I don't know how I can trust you..." and when she says "I wish this was how it was the whole time."

I'm guessing you've already taken a look at the validation workshops?

What I see in her statements are huge invitations for the two of you to connect positively through emotional validation.

It wouldn't mean agreeing that you aren't trustworthy, arguing that "it wasn't like this the whole time", trying to make her feel better, trying to be positive or make her happy, or placating/capitulating.

It would look like finding the feelings and emotions behind her words, putting yourself in her shoes, feeling how it would feel to feel that way, and finding common ground that normalizes her emotions:

"Oh babe, it would hurt to feel like you couldn't trust me", or "I would want things to be like this the whole time, too" or "It would feel so painful to feel like your emotional needs were neglected".

None of that requires her to move forward, work through the past, accept your apology, etc, for the two of you to connect positively. Finding positive connection through "normal" channels like discussion and closure may not happen with your W, but finding positive connection through emotional validation is a possibility.

And finally:

Have any of you experienced this where your pwBPD finds forgiveness hard?

Yes, my H's kids' mom has held many grudges against him for over a decade, the oddest one being that "he prevented her from going camping like she always wanted to" >15 years ago. Long story but now that she's free of him, she... doesn't go camping. Anyway.

[boundriesrus]

I am sorry that you are having to go through all this. I am in a similar boat as well, and have been thinking about divorce for months, ever since the first time she randomly brought it up on a date night, out of nowhere and then went silent for a day. Then I bring it up a month or so later that this isn't working for me and now she is in "Stepford Wife" mode as I refer to it.

Honestly, after spending a long time in therapy discussing this (and figuring she also sexually assaulted me a few times when we were trying to get pregnant years ago, and I thought by ignoring it, was the best fix...it was not and it turned into sexual trauma...now getting treatment for). My best advice...focus on your daughter 110%. Shield her from as much of this as possible, get primary custody if possible/required. But your best bet is to get into therapy yourself and work this out. It was not an easy decision for me, but honestly since I made it, I have been feeling better and better every day. I am still married to her as we are in couples counseling, and I already told the therapist in a private session everything that is going on, she agrees with the assessment, but says she needs to figure out a new game plan, as I told her divorce was imminent. I am staying right now for my daughter who just turned 6 in order to ensure her mother gets the help needed and its as smooth of a transition was possible. Mind you I am also battling my ex partners in court for stealing over $1,000,000 from the company we owned together, I quit, started another company, but have no cash as my wife decided to ignore my requests of her going back to work to help with bills, or to stop spending money on PLEASE READ we don't need. Suffice to say both of those requests were met with a resounding no, followed by screaming and crying, and how its my fault. Mind you, both ex partners have cluster b personality disorders as well (NPD/ASPD and his wife BPD).

In short...get into therapy for yourself, focus on loving your daughter with all your heart and no that the person who is your wife, is very mentally ill, and to a certain degree lied to you about who she truly was. It's part of the disorder. Get a good attorney who knows how to navigate this PLEASE READ too. It's gonna get much worse before it gets better. I got 2 other friends going thru the exact same thing with their wives no magically being diagnosed BPD. Just know...it's not you. It's always been her, and learn to catch the red flags ahead of next time, so you don't repeat the same pattern.

[ForeverDad]

When I was ill my then-spouse and now-ex would be nicer, in contrast to other members here who report the opposite.  So that means the behaviors and responses can vary.

And my ex demanded apologies over and over even for the same incidents, yet eventually she herself would not apologize.  That was a dysfunctional dynamic.

However, brief periods of seeming sanity alone did not fix the relationship, it kept getting worse until I divorced.

What could help is meaningful therapy over an extended time, probably years, with your spouse diligently applying the therapy in her perceptions, behaviors and life.  The key question is whether she would actually do it and stick with it long term.

[livednlearned]

I shutdown emotionally and neglected her emotional needs.

How did she respond to this at the time?

[gaherna3]

I am sorry everyone for not answering your questions. It has been an eventful week. This past weekend we had a discussion and she brought up the divorce again. I mentioned that I am trying to work this out and wanting to make changes that will help us stay together. She said she just does not love me anymore. She only sees me as a friend. She also mentioned that I need to listen to what she is asking for which is a divorce.

After this rollercoaster of a past year, I feel like there is nothing I could do anymore. I simply agreed. I am lost, heartbroken, and destroyed. I know things will eventually get better but I just wanted this to work. I tried everything in my power but I think the time has come.

[ForeverDad]

Toward the end of my marriage of over a decade things were heading decidedly negative, co-worker, my family, our mutual friends, and finally me.  The last couple of years (after we had our child) she avoided intimacy and pulled away.  When I became the Bad Guy, the marriage imploded.  Police, allegations, courts, divorce.

Though we've been divorced now for some 15 years, never once have I heard her express a desire to resume a relationship besides the existing parenting.

Sometimes the spark is just gone for one person.  The other has to accept that.  To your credit, you did try.

[Pook075]

I am sorry everyone for not answering your questions. It has been an eventful week. This past weekend we had a discussion and she brought up the divorce again. I mentioned that I am trying to work this out and wanting to make changes that will help us stay together. She said she just does not love me anymore. She only sees me as a friend. She also mentioned that I need to listen to what she is asking for which is a divorce.

After this rollercoaster of a past year, I feel like there is nothing I could do anymore. I simply agreed. I am lost, heartbroken, and destroyed. I know things will eventually get better but I just wanted this to work. I tried everything in my power but I think the time has come.

This may sound dumb, but have you asked her why she wants a divorce?

There's two problems in every marriage- the stuff you fight about, and the stuff left unsaid.  In a normal marriage, that unsaid stuff often gets forgotten or forgiven.  But for a person with BPD, it can linger and make things much more complicated.

Again, if you want to try to save this, to put in a last ditech effort, ask her why and be prepared to truly listen.

You won't like what you hear, it will be full of blame and unfair accusations.  But just listen and try to understand her viewpoint, where her fear and pain is coming from.

The relationship is falling apart not because of what's been said, but what she's holding back and can't deal with.  That's what has to be fixed...but you can't fix something you don't know about or understand.  Listening with empathy is the only possible way to make that happen.

I'm so very sorry you're going through this, but you're at the point of making a real decision.  Are you in or out?  Whichever way you lean, it has to be 100%.

We're here to support you no matter what you decide.

[gaherna3]

Pook

As Forever Dad mentioned she says the spark is gone. We have talked about various things that she says it is but every time after I try making corrections and fixes it comes back to her not loving me as a romantic partner anymore.

I have tried more dates and trying to be more present with her but ultimately if she does not love me anymore, I am not sure there is anything to save.

[Pook075]

Pook

As Forever Dad mentioned she says the spark is gone. We have talked about various things that she says it is but every time after I try making corrections and fixes it comes back to her not loving me as a romantic partner anymore.

I have tried more dates and trying to be more present with her but ultimately if she does not love me anymore, I am not sure there is anything to save.

Saying "the spark has gone" is a generic, surface-level answer.  You're unhappy, she's unhappy...of course the spark is gone.  The question is whether you're willing to dig deeper.

I know that probably sounds like a riddle, but it's really not.  If you're hungry, then you eat...and you're not hungry anymore.  So what do you do when the spark is no longer there?  Because millions of couples have reached that point and simply said, "Oh well, there's nothing else to do but divorce I guess."

This is your choice, to fight or give up.  None of us here can tell you what to do.  But there is another option than simply giving in and giving up.  I just want you to see that and go into this with eyes wide open.

[gaherna3]

Saying "the spark has gone" is a generic, surface-level answer.  You're unhappy, she's unhappy...of course the spark is gone.  The question is whether you're willing to dig deeper.

I know that probably sounds like a riddle, but it's really not.  If you're hungry, then you eat...and you're not hungry anymore.  So what do you do when the spark is no longer there?  Because millions of couples have reached that point and simply said, "Oh well, there's nothing else to do but divorce I guess."

This is your choice, to fight or give up.  None of us here can tell you what to do.  But there is another option than simply giving in and giving up.  I just want you to see that and go into this with eyes wide open.

I completely agree with this. I have asked her what I can do. We had an incident where she felt I put one of my friends before her. I owned up to it and apologized. However, she does not seem to be able to move on from it. I have done what I can from dating her more, speaking more words of gratitude for her, and even talking to my friend about the situation. Nothing seems to be working. I have tried for this last year. Including going to couples therapy and her DBT family group sessions. But it takes two to make this work and if she is checked out I am not sure how to keep going.