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Author Topic: 6.13 | How Can We Forgive Ourselves?  (Read 23495 times)
Nutts45
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« Reply #60 on: April 20, 2010, 12:30:02 PM »

You do realize you are working through it... .you have identified your feelings.  

Feeling wrong is a different emotion than anger.  Anger is a secondary emotion in response to the first emotion... .What are your feelings if you do something wrong... the same with acting unfairly.

Start with these... .if you are ashamed if you treat someone unfairly... and than feel anger directed at yourself... are you angry because you feel shame.  Most people do not like feel ashamed of something the do... so we replace the emotion with another.  What is the worst thing that can happen if we allow ourselves to feel shame... it just doesn't feel good.  Ok so it does feel good... you know it is ok not to feel good.

Shame just sits there... .Anger is tricky because it releases something... .it provides a high... good/bad.
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LionDreamer
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« Reply #61 on: April 20, 2010, 08:52:44 PM »

Thank you oceanheart, dsnutt45 and BMama for your meaningful contributions:

It's ironic we can have so much compassion for others and so little for ourselves. If someone treated a friend of mine like I treat myself, I'd call that person abusive... .

Being able to observe my feelings with a little bit of detachment has helped me recently. I have to watch and not dissociate, because that's taking it too far, but a little bit of distance is healthy, because then that wave of shame doesn't drown me, and I can tread water. Soon, I'll be able to swim, then jump on a board and surf the wave! Smiling (click to insert in post) dunno what I mean really, except gaining mastery over the emotions that used to be like a tsunami... .

I love your imagery oceanheart.  We engage in "person abuse" with ourselves, that is a classic!  Smiling (click to insert in post)   And thank you for sharing your concept of surfacing the waves of our emotions with some detachment (but not too much) and building up to bigger and bigger waves.  Self-forgiveness is a process and your metaphor does a great job of expressing that.

I'm afraid of expressing my anger because 1) it's physically painful 2) I'm afraid it will escalate or I'll lose control 3) I might be wrong 4) I might be acting unfairly 5) I'm afraid I will like it too much (the feeling of being powerful and in control). Any suggestions besides bringing it up with my T today?

I think you've hit on a very common issue, not just for children of pwBPD but for most people.  Anger is indeed frightening.  It is a strong emotion and it has often been used against us to belittle and control us.  But the problem is that anger is a natural human emotion and can be very appropriate at times.   In fact, if we squelch our very appropriate anger, we end up squelching our other emotions too - even the good ones like love and appreciation. 

Old habits die hard.

  I guess it's that old, "Putting other's needs before your own" mentality that we grew up with. 

It sounds like you have been doing some really deep work BMama.   You are right old habits do die hard, that's why we need to celebrate your little victories.   Good point also about this being the mentality that we grew up with.  So these aren't just old habits, they are also childhood habits.  Double hard to break.

Yesterday, I dropped my son off at preschool.  I didn't have his permission slip for a trip tomorrow filled out or the money.  His teacher said, ":)id you get a form?"  I automatically started assuming I did and I just forgot it or didn't see it in his papers on Friday.  She said, "I have one here with his name on it, but it was still laying here so I crossed his name out assuming maybe there were two and he got his... .I'm sorry."  I didn't give her a second... .I just automatically went to me messing it up.  I even was like over apologetic and making sure that she knew I wasn't mad at her or anything.  Man that is so annoying.

Wow!  You should write up this story and post it in an obvious spot - the refrigerator, the bathroom mirror - along with the words - "See it's not always my fault! - Remember, remember, remember"

I have gone back to a mindfullness tool.  Becuase so many of us have have buried our emotions and the focus of BPD being... they have hidden their emotions from such an early ages.

emotions = feeling.

The jest of it is not to run away from you feelings.  Identify what you are feeling and the emotion behind it and allow yourself to feel... not replace it just feel.  We grow up being told you should feel this or that, but to move on you have need to experience what you are feeling to move past it.

If you sit with your emotions and feelings you will find that they hold less power over you.  The training is that emotions are fleeting... .if you sit with them you will notice that you will not run away from your feelings and emotions because you realize that they will leave on their own.  If you sit with fear... .especially if you didn't allow yourself to feel it when you were a child... you will be able to recognize it when it is useful to identify true threats.

Do you need forgiveness.  If you done something you regret... .feel it... .how does it feel... identify why you truly feel regret... what could you do different... by allowing yourself to feel regret... you are no longer running away from it... .you can change it... .you understand you did something unhealthy and have learned from it... .it now becomes wise remorse.

When you start a something simple ask why you are doing it...   needs to? makes me feel better?  something I want to do? fear of what someone might think? Identify the feeling and emotion behind what drives you... .You might be surprised  at something that you really want to do and and the positive emotions and feelings are suddenly place with a negative one will follow and that is the reason we don't follow through with our dreams.

Really beautiful and strong words about mindfulness dsnutt45.  Great lessons!  Thanks.

When I had extreme anger... I was real scared of the way I felt... And I got stuck awhile on this, because I too grew up... Dad can show anger we couldn't.  And actually I found out with me it was not the anger I was scared of... .it was fear... fear of losing control.

More excellent words about this. 

LD
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Nutts45
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« Reply #62 on: April 21, 2010, 12:37:42 AM »

Excerpt
Really beautiful and strong words about mindfulness dsnutt45.  Great lessons!  Thanks.

Ever hear of the story about a hole that you keep falling in... .until eventually you learn to walk around it.

I fell in... Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)  ... so I am currently stepping on top of my mindfulness books so I can climb out of the hole...

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BMama
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« Reply #63 on: April 21, 2010, 08:40:02 AM »

Oh, that's an excellent metaphor.  I need a picture of a hole to put on my fridge, LD.

Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)
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LionDreamer
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« Reply #64 on: April 21, 2010, 08:48:48 AM »

You guys crack me up.   I now have a picture in my mind of dsnutt45 using her mindfulness books to make a ladder she is tottering on to climb out of the hole.   Just goes to show you there is always more that one way to use our tools - you can read the books or you can use them as a step-stool.   

BMama, don't forget to put a ladder in your hole too.  Being cool (click to insert in post)

LD   
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BMama
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« Reply #65 on: April 21, 2010, 08:53:15 AM »

Oh, yeah, that'd be me... .find a picture of a hole with no way to get out!

Smiling (click to insert in post) Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)
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Nutts45
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« Reply #66 on: April 21, 2010, 11:04:05 AM »

 Smiling (click to insert in post) Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)

Now I have an image... .and I have enough eastern philosophy books to actually do it.  

Can see it now... honey why is there a picture of a hole on the fridge. Being cool (click to insert in post)
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ArtistGuy70
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« Reply #67 on: October 14, 2010, 08:27:09 AM »

This is tough.

I would think for years things like

"If I was smarter, my father would have not been so violent."

"If I was more talented, my parents would have loved me more, my father would have been a better parent."

"If I could go back in time, knowing what I know now, I could be a better son, make my father a better person, prevent him from dying in bitterness and anger, make my mother more loving and attentive."

"If I had super powers, I would be more heroic. People would love me more. I would finally be special."

Now, after my breakup, I found myself thinking things like... .

"If I was a better boyfriend, she would not have cheated on me."

"If I was thinner and in better shape, she would have loved me more and not lied so much."

"If I made more money and was rich, she would not have gone off with her rich, married boss after our break up and possibly during the r/s."

"If I was more talented, shot more pictures that she wanted, she would not have left."

"If I was a better person, she could have never have left me."

What I have to realize is... .

"I am a good looking, great guy. I am talented and smart. I am a great father. I was a great bf to her. Attentive person. Great, open minded, adventurous lover. I was a great son. I got good grades. I make enough money and that should not be important to someone. If it is, they are not worth my time. My parents should have loved me unconditionally like I do with my daughter. My father had his own issues and had no reason to act the way he did in life. My mother as well. My exgf has BPD and makes self destructive choices in life. She is a disturbed person and even admits that much. She has problems. They are not my fault. She has low self esteem and worth. She lacks identity. She is untrustworthy. She has patterns of lying and cheating throughout her life. She is not happy inside. I tried my best but I cannot fix her. No one can. She can only change herself. She does not want to. And that is not my fault. I can only make changes within me."

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Joy6

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« Reply #68 on: January 03, 2017, 09:57:34 AM »

I was reading this as a way to self reflect and begin healing. I just admitted to my husband last night that I was an abused child. I have never acknowledged it. I think by accepting my childhood as "just the way it was" has kept me feeling guilty and accepting responsibility for all family relationships. Im ready to be free of guilt, shame and fear of putting myself first in anything.
One way I see I haven't forgiven myself is in the fact  I take on the responsibility of everyone's happiness and well being as if it depends on me. I constantly struggle with what people think. I basically never put my own needs or feelings in the equation when dealing with people. If I do I instantly feel selfish or at fault. Any advice for this?
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