The constant projection and gaslighting UGH

[onthefenceagain]

This is a bit of my story mixed with a rant but also I am genuinely interested if anyone here is able to overcome these sorts of disagreements/situations I’m going to tell you about and actually get past them? We are doing the breakup dance at the moment. Keep trying to talk and it goes nowhere and he hangs up on me. This happens fairly frequently. Those of you who have figured out how to manage and communicate with your partner - I’m dying to know what you say because when I am in these heated moments with my uBPD I really struggle. Ive read every single book. I’ve read every single article. I lurk here. I have a therapist. I feel like I try everything that is suggested and nothing really seems to work. And then when the arguments escalate and he insults me further, the gloves come off and I end up saying the things you’re not supposed to say. I just can’t stand being accused of doing things I’m not doing and then being made to feel Like I’m crazy or unreasonable for not agreeing with or complying with whatever “need” he’s come up with. Loves to say everything is a “core need”.   My uBPD is very arrogant and thinks he knows it all. Not the sad sack type at all.  Never really apologizes or accepts responsibility for his part whatsoever.  Will not compromise.  He will not talk to me for a week and then contact me and be just as mad as he was the week before. Will not let anything go. Ever. He will generally charm after about five days of silence however it will usually be something like I miss you or I wish things could be different, never a full request for reconciliation.  I usually have to jump through a bunch of hoops to make that happen.

How on earth can you not be defensive when they are constantly accusing you of saying or doing the things they just did? ie: they leave when they just got mad at you for leaving. They are yelling at you because they said you are yelling.  He constantly says I “attack” him though he just finished saying how horrible I am . He loves to point out my defensiveness as being the issue all the time, and ignoring the actual issue like yesterday when he told me he went on tinder while we weren’t speaking last week. Or when he said I had to help him clean his house on Saturday after I worked a really intense physically demanding week and said no because I was exhausted. And said I think it’s actually pretty disrespectful and rude to ask me to clean anything on my day off when you know I have a very physically demanding full time job. Then he says I’m being defensive and goes on to defend himself  and give me some absurd reasoning as to why I should give up my day off to clean his house. 

Also I cannot stand being told that I am being confusing and nonsensical in my explanations as to why I came to any given conclusion: ie: if you first say that you want a relationship that is 50-50 equal partnership and then five minutes later say you want to  lead the relationship and that  I should be the one to sacrifice and do everything for him because I am more established in life - that those two things are contradictory. You can’t say you want a 50-50 relationship and then expect me to clean your house on a Saturday when I work a full-time job.  I mean does this sound strange to you forum folks? Are you confused? He says I string things together that are a stretch and that I have a weird way of thinking and a bad communicator.(which is basically describing himself) He continually tries to make me feel like I’m stupid or have something wrong with me. The reality is I am far more educated, older wiser and  successful.  I have lived a full life, I’ve traveled all over the entire world and I have succeeded and excelled  in every field I have worked in. I know there is no way I could’ve gotten this far in life being strange and confusing and difficult  and all the other ridiculous things he’s constantly trying to convince me that I am.   Sometimes I think it’s this overachiever in me that refuses to give up on the relationship because I want to figure out how to make it work like I have done with so many other things in life.  I just cannot stand the hypocrisy.  I am flat out insulted and appalled by the gaslighting.   I do not know what to say anymore. He will accept nothing other than a full admittance for my wrongdoings Or he wants me to say I will basically do whatever he says and live by his rules which I refuse to do because that is absurd!

I am exasperated!

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[jrharvey]

I dont really have any advice. Im sorry about that. I just wanted to say I feel everything you just said and more. Like reading what you said I could have written myself. All the things he does my wife does. All the things you do I do. your an overacheiver and wont give up, so am I. Sucks because Im also struggling but your not alone. Its crazy.

[Jabiru]

Hi onthefenceagain ::

Your post reminds me of this article. What do you think about it? Being with a pwBPD is a special needs kind of relationship, not for everyone. Some break up and some stay together. Many successful examples of both cases here on the site.

For my marriage, I made a boundary so that if things get heated (regardless from who), I say I need an hour to cool off and I'll return, then simply exit the room. Giving a specific time amount and sticking to the boundary are key as it shows the other your commitment to the boundary and your relationship.

[onthefenceagain]

Hi Jabiru

I totally get what you’re saying and that article makes perfect sense however the last time I tried just walking away from the argument he made a huge drama about me  leaving and being abandoned which he then turned into something he felt was grounds for breaking up and has lead me to where I am now in the break up dance.  We have been together for over three years and it had only gotten worse. I really do try to watch what I say until he insults me or disrespects me by doing something shady like going on tinder and then I feel like he deserves to be told off. I’ve been very clear about what I will and will not tolerate and he just continually does whatever he wants anyways. So that causes arguments.  He gets mad at me if I cry. he has little to no empathy for me when I am upset about anything even if it’s something unrelated to him. I am starting to feel like just my existence is his trigger, just by being alive.  I guess I keep clinging onto the good memories that I have and hoping somehow to get back to those times. I feel like he was a less rigid and cold.a few years ago.  He used to be more easy-going and warm.

[onthefenceagain]

I dont really have any advice. Im sorry about that. I just wanted to say I feel everything you just said and more. Like reading what you said I could have written myself. All the things he does my wife does. All the things you do I do. your an overacheiver and wont give up, so am I. Sucks because Im also struggling but your not alone. Its crazy.

It’s really wild how many of these stories I feel like I could’ve written myself also! Thanks for hearing me. Not being alone makes me feel just a little less crazy.

[zondolit]

This sounds very familiar and infuriating.

It feels very unnatural not to defend ourselves in such situations. I have learned not to JADE for the most part. What I've found helpful:

--Ask yourself "do I want to be right or effective?" Once I was able, through gritted teeth, to not defend myself under false accusation, I saw how it was strangely effective in diffusing the situation. Once you see that it works, you might be willing to keep trying it. Those first times may be the hardest. Self sooth by telling yourself you will end the conversation soon and treat yourself to something you like. (Walking away from--limiting--these "conversations" is essential in my experience even though it drives someone with BPD nuts.) Mindfulness skills are helpful in getting through this. So is being centered and well by taking good care of yourself (he'll likely be threatened by your self care so this is another struggle).

--Relieve the tension/madness/injustice you feel by talking with someone else about it afterward--someone you can just let loose with and who will be very understanding and supportive.

--Remind yourself that it is not about you. This is really hard and I often do not succeed but it's gotten easier over time. Think about how others (not your partner) describe you. Maybe ask a good friend, "Do you find me selfish/confusing/a poor communicator, etc.?" Give yourself permission to not believe anything he accuses you of. Ask yourself, "Are these accusations really his own fears and shame he is projecting on me?" Do not let yourself by isolated but surround yourself with other people who can be a reality check.

This all has to be balanced with you setting and holding limits for your own well-being and--the step I'm working on--confronting him with select issues.

All of this, for me, has had the effect of distancing me from my partner. Perhaps what you really want is a relationship where you can speak your mind freely. I'm not sure that is possible with someone with BPD/NPD.

[Cat Familiar]

He never apologizes or accepts responsibility for his part.
Will not compromise.
Will not let anything go.
Constantly accuses you of saying or doing the things he did.
Asks you to clean his house when you’re exhausted.
Tells you you are confusing and nonsensical.
Says you should sacrifice and do everything for him.
Says you have a weird way of thinking and are a bad communicator.
Wants a full admittance of your wrongdoings.
Wants you to do whatever he says and live by his rules.

I’m sure you could add more to this list.

What would you tell a friend if she told you her significant other is like this?

Frankly, it sounds like narcissism is perhaps more motivating his behavior than BPD.

What do you think?

[onthefenceagain]

Hi Cat familiar and zondolit-

Thank you both so much for taking the time to respond. I came here to get ideas and advice on how to stay together but the more I’ve been reading here and elsewhere I don’t even know if it’s possible.
You know I have flip-floppped back-and-forth trying to decide if it’s BPD or NPD? My personal therapist sees BPD more because he does express love and emotion for me and he does not treat his kid this way or his parents (who he cares for) and he doesn’t really cheat. Though he has gone on tinder a few times out of spite- never actually went on any dates or anything though.  I have a long previous history with a narcissist(covert though) and I am very familiar with narcissism and the main difference I can see imo is that my boyfriend now seems to have a lot of real feelings and doesn’t really lie about anything( like he believes everything he is saying whether or not it is accurate is a different thing ) And with the ex narc, every single word that came out of his mouth was a lie and I now know he never really had any feelings.  About anything.  Not just me. He was like a robot.  Also me and my current boyfriend did go to couples therapy a few times and the therapist spoke to me a few times privately  and said he thought there was probably something cluster B going on but he did not want to give a formal diagnosis because he said that’s not what he did. Although  one thing the couples therapist did do, which as far as I know you’re not supposed to do, is tell me that I should probably leave him because he’s never going to change and the only way anything will ever change is if I change

[onthefenceagain]

(Continued from above)

 I mean I 100% know what you’re saying. Everyone I know has told me that I should just break up with him and leave forever but I just can’t seem to bring myself to do it. When I was with the narcissist I did a lot of research and after a few years I did make some progress with him as far as communicating and keeping the peace but the  ex narcissist was less emotional/volatile than my boyfriend now. The narcissist just wouldn’t stop cheating and lying and triangulating and like I can’t deal with sharing so that was a dealbreaker for me.  I guess I’m hoping I can find the right combination of techniques like I did with the narcissist and make a little progress and then I won’t feel so hopeless. It’s just been rather discouraging lately because I feel like much of what I’ve tried hasn’t really worked.  I find a lot of the things that they say will resonate with BPD people only pacifies him briefly on the surface. Like I apologize and empathize and etc. and that gets him to at least speak to me again (because the silent treatment is like his favorite thing in the world to do) and then within an hour he just tears into me and start attacking me and telling me how horrible I am and how I caused him so much damage and “wipe him out”. Like he kind of just seems to accept my apology so the  door is now opened again to yell at me again.

Btw “ do you want to  be right or effective” is one of my favorites! And it’s something I think about frequently with my work colleagues and those sorts of situations. But I really struggle to live by this when I’m dealing with situations with my boyfriend because I feel like the only way to be “effective” with him is to pretty much blatantly lie that I agree with something I don’t agree with or that say I said some thing or did something I know I didn’t do or say and I really struggle with that.  Like if I have to pretend to be somebody else to get along with this person then what’s the point of having a relationship? Its like he really doesn’t love me then, he loves some made up pretend idea of me. I also get confused about placating or not placating and wether I should be rewarding bad behavior and I start to feel like all the various advice starts to contradict itself.   Like if I agree with something I don’t agree with just to end an argument and he leaves thinking he convinced me of something and now I agree with him,  isn’t that placating? I guess I am confused about when you should sort of pander to their nonsense and when you shouldn’t? Like I’m not going to sit there and be like oh yes honey you’re right I am a monster with poor communication skills and yes I definitely should clean your house every Saturday even though I work a full-time job … I dunno maybe I’m just not cut out for this. Dealing with the ex narcissist was actually easier.

[zondolit]

onthefenceagain,

Please do not apologize if you did nothing wrong. Do not pretend to agree if you do not. Do not clean his house when you need to rest.

Stay true to yourself even if this makes him angry.

My heart goes out to you.

[Cat Familiar]

We say “Don’t validate the invalid.”

Pandering, placating, agreeing when you don’t, lying rather than stating your true feelings, apologizing when there’s nothing to apologize for, agreeing when you don’t—these are all examples of validating the invalid.

By doing the above, you MAKE THINGS WORSE.

How will he ever trust you when you will say anything to make him quit behaving the way you don’t want him to behave?

And are you in this relationship to have a partner or to try and manage and manipulate him?

What do you have if you cannot be who you truly are with him?

[onthefenceagain]

Yes Cat familiar!

I don’t do these things!  but I feel like that would be the only way to “validate” him. Is to lie. Because when I say “I understand you feel frustrated” he immediately goes yeah but you still won’t  agree with me or you still won’t help me clean my house and has a tantrum and breaks up with me. so it makes me feel like the only way to make him happy and validate him is to tell him  yes when I mean no or would have to I agree when I don’t which I refuse to do.  And it’s These specific moments where I guess could choose to tell him what he wants to hear and I don’t, that causes a huge amount of drama. I would say the majority of our problems/breakups stem from me disagreeing or not complying with some ridiculous thing.   I wish I could tell you specifically because some of the things are soo ridiculous but I don’t want to reveal too much and give myself away.

[once removed]

would you say that feeling misunderstood is a trigger for you?

[onthefenceagain]

would you say that feeling misunderstood is a trigger for you?

Hi once removed-

Yes I would say being “misunderstood” is a trigger for me and that would be the mild “nice” way of putting it. It’s more like he misunderstands me on purpose. He tends to gaslight, accuse me of things that make no sense and makes up fake narratives about why i did this or that. It’s really bizarre.  As if I don’t know why I did or did not do something !

[once removed]

one of my biggest personal pet peeves is the way the term "projection" is thrown around these days.

usually, you have two people, accusing each other of things, deep in conflict, and often people mistake "projection" for what is really hypocrisy.

we all project, but people with bpd traits are a bit more prone to this. they read into others intentions, through a limited set of data; primarily their own personal experience.

and they believe it, because seeing your motives as different as theirs is very difficult.

believe me, i know that its frustrating, ive been there, but fighting that is not only banging your head against a wall, it puts you on the defensive.

he doesnt misunderstand you on purpose. his misunderstanding is his projection, and your feelings that its on purpose are yours. people with bpd traits have an inherent lack of distrust in others. in those moments, hes expecting the worst of you, and it makes sense, at least in the moment, to him. it used to infuriate me how my ex would accuse me of some nonsense, id tell her it was nonsense, and shed smirk and nod at me condescendingly.

the first step to becoming less affected by this is to emotionally step back and see it for what it is. once you do, you cant really unsee it, and believe it or not, it does get easier from there. but switching our responses from one that furthers the conflict can take a lot of practice. as someone who really has a big neediness when it comes to feeling misunderstood, i get how hard that can be. i still struggle with it to this day, in all of my interpersonal relationships, and none of them involve BPD.

a very good next step would be learning, and actively practicing not JADEing. have you heard of the concept?

[onthefenceagain]

a very good next step would be learning, and actively practicing not JADEing. have you heard of the concept?

Yes i read about it I can’t say I fully understand how to do it though.

Like for example What should I have said when he was demanding that I help clean his house every Saturday because he needs this routine in his life to be a success in life so if I don’t do it I must not want him to be successful- yes he actually said that-  obviously I said no I can’t commit to that Because I have a very physically demanding job and I’m very tired also no one is stopping you from doing your routine on Saturday. I’m just not doing it.  Of course I want you to be a success and there are other ways I can help you but not this.  Then I went home and left him to do his cleaning routine.

This did not go over well and has led to a three week long break Up dance.  The next day I came up with two compromises which I texted him and he said no to both of them. 

[Cat Familiar]

I would have just said “No” to the request that I clean his house.

If pressed for a reason, “No means no.”

It’s his house. If it needs to be cleaned, he can do it himself or hire someone to do it.

Like for example What should I have said when he was demanding that I help clean his house every Saturday because he needs this routine in his life to be a success in life so if I don’t do it I must not want him to be successful- yes he actually said that-  obviously I said no I can’t commit to that Because I have a very physically demanding job and I’m very tired also no one is stopping you from doing your routine on Saturday. (EXPLAINING)I’m just not doing it.  Of course I want you to be a success and there are other ways I can help you but not this. (JUSTIFYING) Then I went home and left him to do his cleaning routine.


He sounds like a very high-conflict person. JADEing (Justifying, Arguing, Defending, Explaining) with a person with BPD (pwBPD) is like pouring gas on a fire. Sure, if he’s not dysregulated, perhaps it can work at times. But if he’s upset, you are guaranteed to make things worse.

Simple refusals that offer no opportunity for discussion are best. No. I don’t want to. I’m not doing that. etc.

[onthefenceagain]

I would have just said “No” to the request that I clean his house.

If pressed for a reason, “No means no.”

It’s his house. If it needs to be cleaned, he can do it himself or hire someone to do it.

Like for example What should I have said when he was demanding that I help clean his house every Saturday because he needs this routine in his life to be a success in life so if I don’t do it I must not want him to be successful- yes he actually said that-  obviously I said no I can’t commit to that Because I have a very physically demanding job and I’m very tired also no one is stopping you from doing your routine on Saturday. (EXPLAINING)I’m just not doing it.  Of course I want you to be a success and there are other ways I can help you but not this. (JUSTIFYING) Then I went home and left him to do his cleaning routine.


He sounds like a very high-conflict person. JADEing (Justifying, Arguing, Defending, Explaining) with a person with BPD (pwBPD) is like pouring gas on a fire. Sure, if he’s not dysregulated, perhaps it can work at times. But if he’s upset, you are guaranteed to make things worse.

Simple refusals that offer no opportunity for discussion are best. No. I don’t want to. I’m not doing that. etc.

THANKYOU Cat Familiar! And all who have been responding. I truly appreciate all your input.

Now I get the JADEing.  He is def high conflict as you said. He does really like to talk and push buttons so this could be tough to pull off.  He frequently complains that I “shut him down” and don’t allow him to speak his mind when I do things like leave the room or his house or say I don’t want talk about something. 

Ok currently I have been getting the silent treatment for the past several days because we got into an argument on the phone. I called him to do something nice for him and he took it as an opportunity to attack me for something that happened the day before and I then attacked back. I managed to craft a text apology today which basically says I’m sorry for being harsh when we were arguing on the phone and  that has prompted him to respond.  However it’s def an antagonistic response. It basically says I hope you’re happy you expressed yourself. Do you really think you did anything wrong?

So how on earth am I supposed to respond to that?

[Cat Familiar]

He frequently complains that I “shut him down” and don’t allow him to speak his mind when I do things like leave the room or his house or say I don’t want talk about something.

What do you say to this? Any response from you other than “OK” opens the door to JADEing and from there, an argument. In addition, just offering your point of view is likely to invalidate him, causing him to double down on being forceful with his POV.

I called him to do something nice for him and he took it as an opportunity to attack me for something that happened the day before and I then attacked back.

It totally goes against human nature, but the way around this is to build such a thick skin that you don’t react to these attacks—therefore no argument, no apology needed.

Some people visualize these attacks as a toddler throwing a tantrum. That way it’s easier to just ignore it.

I know, it seems ridiculous to have to do this in a romantic relationship, but here you are…

I managed to craft a text apology today which basically says I’m sorry for being harsh when we were arguing on the phone and  that has prompted him to respond.  However it’s def an antagonistic response. It basically says I hope you’re happy you expressed yourself. Do you really think you did anything wrong?

So how on earth am I supposed to respond to that?

This is just an opportunity to open up a new argument. Why even respond at all?

[onthefenceagain]

Cat familiar  I had a feeling you were going to say don’t respond to that and I haven’t. I am not usually one to ignore texts, he usually is the one ignoring my texts so it will be interesting to see how this plays out.

I really do struggle with not reacting to the tantrums when they are personal attacks. It’s easy for me to walk out or ignore something that is stupid or makes no sense.   


Again thank you! Your examples and explanations make such a huge difference.

[once removed]

a lot of us develop responses that fan the flames of conflict.

the key to not JADEing is to begin to switch to a healthier response. it will take practice and patience, because the conflict style between the two of you is somewhat engrained. in the short term, changing your response might even provoke him to escalate.

it seems like youre asking two questions:

1. how to change your responses
2. how to take what he says/does less personally

when we feel attacked by a loved one, it feels personal. it is personal. the issue is how we react. you recognize that it gets you riled up and makes you feel defensive. it seems to me the first step is learning to become more mindful of that feeling, and your first instincts. when we are triggered, its hard to respond in a constructive way, and likewise, when our loved ones are triggered, its even harder for them to respond in a constructive way. that is where you lead.

we have a workshop here on circular arguments. theres a lot of overlap between JADEing and circular arguments. chances are if youre doing one, youre doing the other. https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=118892.0

but the thing is, you really need a multi-faceted approach that involves relationship maintenance, in order to create an overall healthier environment, and build trust.

[onthefenceagain]

Once removed-

You are correct. I am looking for ways to change my behavior because I realize that’s the only thing I can actually do. I can’t make the other person change. I have worked on this a lot with my therapist but she is not as  familiar with BPD as everyone here. the good news is though I was able to use everything that everyone here has been telling me to do last night. After I ignored the last text he sent that was snarky I waited a couple of hours and just reiterated what I had previously said about being sorry for speaking so harshly using the SET model. he snapped at me but then after about two hours, he apologized to me for snapping and then asked me if I wanted to go for a walk. We ended up talking for about four hours and because of all your help here I was able to not react to things that I would’ve normally reacted to and even got him to bend a little bit on his rigid ideas about things. He is very into being right and taking no blame and everything is my fault and doesn’t say sorry which is annoying BUT  it was productive. There were a couple of tense moments but there was no yelling or intense aggression.  We were able to clear up a few misunderstandings. And finally after 4 weeks of breakup limbo we decided to stay together.  Not JADEing really is is key with him.  It is really hard to do sometimes and goes against all your instincts as a human but if you just let him talk and wait till he’s done and go mmmhmm or “I can see that”  it seems to really keep him calmer. Considerably.  One thing that seemed to help me with not JADEing  is I was able to practice it in text first. We have a lot of text conversations and because they’re not sitting right there in front of you,you can more carefully think about what you want to say and that really helped me when I had to do it with him sitting in the room.  SET  also.

I think the thing that’s gonna be key for me is to keep learning and keep practicing and keep all of this in the front of my mind because what happens I find is we tend to have a good period of probably six weeks or so with no fighting and I forget everything because I haven’t really had to do it and then Surprise! A major argument over something absurd and I have forgotten everything. I feel like I need to put post-its all over to remind myself  

[onthefenceagain]

Once removed-

You are correct. I am looking for ways to change my behavior because I realize that’s the only thing I can actually do. I can’t make the other person change. I have worked on this a lot with my therapist but she is not as  familiar with BPD as everyone here. the good news is though I was able to use everything that everyone here has been telling me to do last night. After I ignored the last text he sent that was snarky I waited a couple of hours and just reiterated what I had previously said about being sorry for speaking so harshly using the SET model. he snapped at me which  I ignored but then after about two hours, he apologized to me for snapping and then asked me if I wanted to go for a walk. We ended up talking for about four hours and because of all your help here I was able to not react to things that I would’ve normally reacted to and even got him to bend a little bit on his rigid ideas about things. He is very into being right and taking no blame and everything is my fault and doesn’t say sorry which is annoying BUT  it was productive. There were a couple of tense moments but there was no yelling or intense aggression.  We were able to clear up a few misunderstandings. And finally after 4 weeks of breakup limbo we decided to stay together.  Not JADEing really is is key with him.  It is really hard to do sometimes and goes against all your instincts as a human but if you just let him talk and wait till he’s done and go mmmhmm or “I can see that”  it seems to really keep him calmer. Considerably.  One thing that seemed to help me with not JADEing  is I was able to practice it in text first. We have a lot of text conversations and because they’re not sitting right there in front of you,you can more carefully think about what you want to say and that really helped me when I had to do it with him sitting in the room.  SET  also.

I think the thing that’s gonna be key for me is to keep learning and keep practicing and keep all of this in the front of my mind because what happens I find is we tend to have a good period of probably six weeks or so with no fighting and I forget everything because I haven’t really had to do it and then Surprise! A major argument over something absurd and I have forgotten everything. I feel like I need to put post-its all over to remind myself  

[zondolit]

Great job not responding to the snarky text, using SET, and not JADEing! The tools do work!

[JP1214]

Did I write this post?? Lol. So glad I came across this thread. This is almost identical to my situation with my BPDh of almost 4 years. I’ve known he had BPD for about 2 years, but he was just officially diagnosed about 5 months ago. Most of the threads resonate with me (to some degree) about his behaviors and my feelings and reactions. But what you’ve described is uncanny (both his behaviors and my thoughts/feelings/reactions). I’m going to really focus on not JADEing. It’s so validating to know I’m not alone!

[kells76]

Hey JP1214, welcome to the site! So glad you found us, I hope you can breathe a sigh of relief and know you're among others who get it.

A new diagnosis can be a big deal. How is your H coping with that? Is he accepting of the diagnosis, getting targeted treatment (DBT), etc?

Focusing on not JADE-ing is a really, really solid place to start. JADE-ing can "work" with broadly normal relationships -- sometimes explaining what happened can help, there -- but when interacting with a pwBPD, it can blow things up. One of the key words that comes to mind from my time here is that it takes nonintuitive skills and tools to have the "least worst" possible relationship.

JP1214, whenever you feel up for it, please feel free to start a thread about you, your life, your situation, your challenges, anything you want some support and feedback on! We'd love to hear more and support you the way you need. Let us know if you have any issues starting a new thread.

Again, a warm welcome;

kells76

[zondolit]

kells76, I really appreciate you saying that some of the skills and tools that help are not intuitive. Some explaining is helpful in most of my relationships, but with my BPD/NPD husband I've learned to refrain from any explaining because it simply does not help and usually makes things worse. I don't think I would have ever figured this out without this forum saying "Don't JADE!"

[JP1214]

Thanks kells76,
I’m really glad I found this group. It’s tremendously helpful. He flip flops with accepting the diagnosis. It took him almost a year to accept his bipolar diagnosis and that his meds were actually helpful. So obviously any diagnosis that makes him feel “not normal” is difficult for him to accept.  He has a therapist who specializes in trauma and related disorders. She obviously very quickly diagnosed him. He actually thought I had been talking to his therapist behind his back to suggest or convince her of the diagnosis ( I had never spoken to this woman in my life, at that point).  He also has said that he wants me to stop asking or mentioning anything about BPD because he feels I am gaslighting him into thinking he has it. But other times he’ll bring up his  diagnosis and want to talk about it.

For some reason he refuses to do DBT at this point, or any targeted therapies really.He insists that he tried DBT years ago with a different therapist. But what he described didn’t sound like DBT to me. Which I told him. But he refuses to see it any other way right now.  He mostly just likes to talk about how messed up it is that all the traumatic things happened to him over his life… and it is. It’s kind of like he just wants coddling and validation. Not to look at and work on the symptoms that are actually causing him a lot of distress and instability in his life (and those around him).

Anyway, I agree that I can only change and control myself. And it is definitely nonintuitive to learn to react or not react in a “normal” way to mitigate a situation blowing up. But I’m grateful for the support and insights here!