BPD/NPD stepfather but my mother is the issue.

[Depression = 72% of members]

Hi All,

I post on the staying board as my husband is diagnosed BPD. However I am beginning to suspect that there is something PD wise going on with my mother/step father and I need some help trying to figure this out.

I am one of three siblings I am the eldest. When I was 12, my brother 9 and my sister 7 we come home from school one day and our mother was not there. My father was called home from work and was devastated - sobbing, searching, white as a sheet etc. Turns out my mother had been having an affair with one of my dads friends and they had eloped together. This man has now been my step father for 20 years and he also left a wife and two children in the same manner ( no warning just walked out leaving a very nasty note aimed at his then teenage daughter I later discovered).

We didn't see them for a few months I think then my mother came to visit us. After that we had visits with them every 2 weeks or so until I was about 15 when it became less regular. Up until the point of her leaving I remember my mother as being a nurturing parent. She spent time with us, hugged us and told us she loved us. We did activities together as a family and all was sort of normal from what I can remember.

Since she left my mother has steadily had less and less motherly contact with us. Oh she keeps in touch but isn’t there as you would expect your mum to be. She has indicated that my step father wants her full attention and if he doesn’t get it or she does something he doesn’t like he ‘punishes her’.  She has no contact at all with my brother – he has two children and she never sees them . My brother is hurt and very emotional he hasn’t done anything but my step father has painted him as ‘bad, lazy and irresponsible’ over the years (he is none of these things he is successfully self employed, in a relationship with a lovely woman and raising two nice children).

My mother keeps in touch and sees my children fairly regularly but always to her schedule and on her terms. She will spend ridiculous amounts of money on them but isn’t around for the small things that make a family. EG my children are 3yrs and 2yrs – on 22/12/13 she took them to a show probably aimed at about 10 year olds so not suitable but very expensive yet she hasn’t contacted them since. I called her twice and texted on Christmas day – no reply. I texted happy new year. She txt back the next day. I imagine my step dad is mad that my children didn’t appreciate the show enough (but they were bored as it was way over their heads) so has indicated to my mother not to be in touch with us.

I believe my step dad is BPD/NPD, however my real problem is with my mother. She consistently prioritises him over her children and grandchildren. If It’s a choice between upsetting him or me she will always upset me (ie the not calling me over Christmas which is one of so many examples I could give). When I try to talk to her she gets upset and says she loves us and she wishes she could be there more but ‘can’t’ or she goes all cold and hard and refuses to acknowledge anything I’m saying.

I am tired of always accommodating her and always feeling let down and sad about her. I can’t rely on her. When she is with my children she gives them all her attention and subsequently they love their Nanna. They don’t understand when she ‘disappears’ and they ask to go see her and I say we can’t just at the moment. They think I’m being mean by not agreeing to take them but the truth is she has stopped contact and I can’t get hold of her.

I want to say to her I see what my stepfather is. I see how he behaves and I know it is hard but I know that she could make boundaries and take some responsibility. I know this because my H is dBPD and I have had to do this. I made boundaries with my H and took a stand and became the leader in our relationship to protect my children and give them a good life as well as to make sure we could continue in our marriage. I am hurt that my own mother refuses to do this. I don’t know how to get over this.

The worst thing is she makes out like it’s normal and we’re all ok really. No mother I am not ok really. 

Maybe I shouldn’t have posted this on this board but I needed to get it out somewhere other people might understand and I would welcome suggestions  as to how to go about maintaining a relationship with my mother. To be honest I don’t care enough about my BPD/NPD step father to want to even think strategies for dealing with him. With my mother I feel a growing need to call her on her behaviour towards me but also towards her attitude/behaviour to my brother she has just abandoned him because my step father says so – I suppose I am afraid that if I do call her on her behaviour I will lose her completely. But part of me thinks who would be the biggest loser me or her?

[PeppermintTea]

Hi All,

I post on the staying board as my husband is diagnosed BPD. However I am beginning to suspect that there is something PD wise going on with my mother/step father and I need some help trying to figure this out.

I am one of three siblings I am the eldest. When I was 12, my brother 9 and my sister 7 we come home from school one day and our mother was not there. My father was called home from work and was devastated - sobbing, searching, white as a sheet etc. Turns out my mother had been having an affair with one of my dads friends and they had eloped together. This man has now been my step father for 20 years and he also left a wife and two children in the same manner ( no warning just walked out leaving a very nasty note aimed at his then teenage daughter I later discovered).

We didn't see them for a few months I think then my mother came to visit us. After that we had visits with them every 2 weeks or so until I was about 15 when it became less regular. Up until the point of her leaving I remember my mother as being a nurturing parent. She spent time with us, hugged us and told us she loved us. We did activities together as a family and all was sort of normal from what I can remember.

Since she left my mother has steadily had less and less motherly contact with us. Oh she keeps in touch but isn’t there as you would expect your mum to be. She has indicated that my step father wants her full attention and if he doesn’t get it or she does something he doesn’t like he ‘punishes her’.  She has no contact at all with my brother – he has two children and she never sees them . My brother is hurt and very emotional he hasn’t done anything but my step father has painted him as ‘bad, lazy and irresponsible’ over the years (he is none of these things he is successfully self employed, in a relationship with a lovely woman and raising two nice children).

My mother keeps in touch and sees my children fairly regularly but always to her schedule and on her terms. She will spend ridiculous amounts of money on them but isn’t around for the small things that make a family. EG my children are 3yrs and 2yrs – on 22/12/13 she took them to a show probably aimed at about 10 year olds so not suitable but very expensive yet she hasn’t contacted them since. I called her twice and texted on Christmas day – no reply. I texted happy new year. She txt back the next day. I imagine my step dad is mad that my children didn’t appreciate the show enough (but they were bored as it was way over their heads) so has indicated to my mother not to be in touch with us.

I believe my step dad is BPD/NPD, however my real problem is with my mother. She consistently prioritises him over her children and grandchildren. If It’s a choice between upsetting him or me she will always upset me (ie the not calling me over Christmas which is one of so many examples I could give). When I try to talk to her she gets upset and says she loves us and she wishes she could be there more but ‘can’t’ or she goes all cold and hard and refuses to acknowledge anything I’m saying.

I am tired of always accommodating her and always feeling let down and sad about her. I can’t rely on her. When she is with my children she gives them all her attention and subsequently they love their Nanna. They don’t understand when she ‘disappears’ and they ask to go see her and I say we can’t just at the moment. They think I’m being mean by not agreeing to take them but the truth is she has stopped contact and I can’t get hold of her.

I want to say to her I see what my stepfather is. I see how he behaves and I know it is hard but I know that she could make boundaries and take some responsibility. I know this because my H is dBPD and I have had to do this. I made boundaries with my H and took a stand and became the leader in our relationship to protect my children and give them a good life as well as to make sure we could continue in our marriage. I am hurt that my own mother refuses to do this. I don’t know how to get over this.

The worst thing is she makes out like it’s normal and we’re all ok really. No mother I am not ok really. 

Maybe I shouldn’t have posted this on this board but I needed to get it out somewhere other people might understand and I would welcome suggestions  as to how to go about maintaining a relationship with my mother. To be honest I don’t care enough about my BPD/NPD step father to want to even think strategies for dealing with him. With my mother I feel a growing need to call her on her behaviour towards me but also towards her attitude/behaviour to my brother she has just abandoned him because my step father says so – I suppose I am afraid that if I do call her on her behaviour I will lose her completely. But part of me thinks who would be the biggest loser me or her?

[Kwamina]

Hi PeppermintTea,

Your mother leaving like that must really have been devastating for you as children. I think you've come to the right board with your story. It's clear that your mother's erratic behavior is also already influencing your own children now. I can see why you find it so upsetting that your mother is unwilling/unable to stand up to your stepdad since you have been able to deal with your BPD husband. Unfortunately we can't control our parents, but we can work on boundaries with them. I get the feeling that you still want contact with your mother but are finding it very difficult dealing with her behavior. Maybe it's time to stop doing things according to her schedule and terms and instead set some firm and clear boundaries with her. This certainly won't guarantee that she'll change, but whenever she crosses the line and you show her the consequences at least she'll know that her bad behavior has a price. Now it seems like she believes she can do whatever she wants to do and get away with it. I hope this advice is helpful, I was raised by an uBPD mom so I know how difficult things can be when your parents don't treat you right. Take care.

[Moonbeam77]

Since she left my mother has steadily had less and less motherly contact with us. Oh she keeps in touch but isn’t there as you would expect your mum to be. She has indicated that my step father wants her full attention and if he doesn’t get it or she does something he doesn’t like he ‘punishes her’. 

I believe my step dad is BPD/NPD, however my real problem is with my mother. She consistently prioritises him over her children and grandchildren. If It’s a choice between upsetting him or me she will always upset me (ie the not calling me over Christmas which is one of so many examples I could give). When I try to talk to her she gets upset and says she loves us and she wishes she could be there more but ‘can’t’ or she .

I am tired of always accommodating her and always feeling let down and sad about her. I can’t rely on her.

I want to say to her I see what my stepfather is. I see how he behaves and I know it is hard but I know that she could make boundaries and take some responsibility... . I am hurt that my own mother refuses to do this. I don’t know how to get over this.

The worst thing is she makes out like it’s normal and we’re all ok really. No mother I am not ok really. 

To be honest I don’t care enough about my BPD/NPD step father to want to even think strategies for dealing with him. With my mother I feel a growing need to call her on her behaviour towards me but also towards her attitude/behaviour to my brother she has just abandoned him because my step father says so – I suppose I am afraid that if I do call her on her behaviour I will lose her completely. But part of me thinks who would be the biggest loser me or her?

I can really related to your post.  I think my father has NPD traits and started dating a uBPD about 3 years ago.  Since then his 3 children have all been painted black.  I know he gets punished for interactions with his children and grandchildren because many many times I get a phone call after an interaction and get verbally assaulted for an hour or so by my Dad.  

About 18 months ago I sent my father the book "Walking on Eggshells".  He read it, said it was a very good book.  He named his ex wife as possible BPD and said actually he could really relate to having BPD symptoms himself but said he didn't think his fiancée was represented by the book at all.  I felt so disappointed.  It seems so obvious to me.  Her fear of abandonment, impulsive behavior, her claim no one accepts her, her inability to hold a job, splitting, and etc. I felt my siblings and I could continue having a relationship with our father but we just needed boundaries and outlined expectations.  

She is very possessive of him.  It is difficult to even have a conversation with him because she directs his attention back to herself through being in his physical space (always sitting in his lap or constantly doing a full body hug) and touching/stroking him sexually when in the presence of his children and grandchildren.  I believe she also listens in on phone conversations.  I have tried to tell my father that it is her possessiveness of him that is making it difficult to even talk to him or have a relationship, he also goes all cold and hard and refuses to acknowledge anything I’m saying.  

There was one time he did acknowledge he has a hard time visiting with people when she is present because she is so possessive of him.  He then did go on to say he kind of likes her possessiveness.  I think it feeds into his NPD.  I have asked several times to negotiate and plan ahead visits having time alone with him and time with his fiancée present.  In the beginning he said he would like that.  Then several days later I would get a phone call with him raging about how we can't ever visit without her being present the whole time.  He blames the strained relationships with his children on his kids not accepting he is dating again.  

I don't know about your mother but my father is not motivated to take responsibility or have any boundaries.   The chaos of this relationship and the possessiveness fills his own emotional needs in a perverted way.  I believe my father is willing to let go of his relationships with his children and has in fact threatened to do so several times.  

Currently I am VLC, my sister is NC, and my brother is LC.  This love relationship has also strained his relationships with my father's own brothers and sisters.

I do feel very sad about this.  Trying to get him to "see the light" has not been very helpful in my case and appears to have only increased his resolve to not make any accommodations.

[PeppermintTea]

Thanks for the replies it's helpful to have some validation for my feelings with regard to my mother. I don't really discuss it much with my husband because his issues with his own parents are all consuming so when we talk about my situation it quickly gets round to how badly he was treated by his own parents. He tries his best to listen and understand but he isn't equipped to deal with other people's emotional problems.

Also whenever I talk about it I am aware that it might sound to someone who didn't know like I was making a big deal out of nothing - parents split up all the time, children have step parents all the time but I feel like the circumstances surrounding this event in my life and the way that my stepfather has subsequently treated me and my siblings and the influence he has had on my mother are something else. Well I say the influence he had on my mother because I am drawing the conclusion that she is the way she is towards us because of his behaviour towards her - but maybe she just didn't like us or want to be a mother anymore. I don't know because she won't talk about it and to behonest I don't know which option is worse.

My mother won't discuss the facts around her leaving us and I have never found closure around my feelings over this. I remember one conversation with her when I was a child and she said "I didn't leave you I left your father" - as if to say stop being such a baby and making drama out of this.

I was 12 and so confused - 'you're syaing you didn't leave us but I haven't seen you for months and you don't live with us anymore' - she never clarified for me.

I think you're suggestions are right I do need to find some way of setting boundaries with my mother but I just don't know what or how at the moment. I don't want to deprive my children of their Nanna because when they are with her she dotes on them - the downside is she jsut casts them aside when she feels like it.

I have some serious thinking to do on this.

PT

[Moonbeam77]

Also whenever I talk about it I am aware that it might sound to someone who didn't know like I was making a big deal out of nothing - parents split up all the time, children have step parents all the time but I feel like the circumstances surrounding this event in my life and the way that my stepfather has subsequently treated me and my siblings and the influence he has had on my mother are something else. Well I say the influence he had on my mother because I am drawing the conclusion that she is the way she is towards us because of his behaviour towards her - but maybe she just didn't like us or want to be a mother anymore. I don't know because she won't talk about it and to behonest I don't know which option is worse.

My mother won't discuss the facts around her leaving us and I have never found closure around my feelings over this. I remember one conversation with her when I was a child and she said "I didn't leave you I left your father" - as if to say stop being such a baby and making drama out of this.

I was 12 and so confused - 'you're syaing you didn't leave us but I haven't seen you for months and you don't live with us anymore' - she never clarified for me.

[Moonbeam77]

Peppermint Tea I feel for you because in my ways our story is similar.  I felt my father was a good Dad before my parents had divorced when I was 7.  Afterwards he could be rejecting according to how he was feeling or what was going on in his life.  Many times I stared out the window waiting for him to come pick us up for a visit when we were kids and he didn't show.  He was there when it was convenient for him.  When I was in middle school and high school the phone calls and visits got even more infrequent.  He would call once every couple of months and visits were every other holiday and part of the summer.  The unwritten rule was us kids were to act as if not calling or visiting when you say you will is ok and "normal".  During the visits it was difficult to be warm and loving toward him due to being let down so much and I think that lead him to be more rejecting.  I don't know about your mother but with my father I don't think he cared about how his behavior affected his children.  After failing to come for a planned visit or not showing for a big event there never was an apology or an explanation.  I feel like I am expected to play this same game again as an adult.  I don't want to play the game anymore. 

I also sometimes wonder if he doesn't like being a father and/or doesn't like his children.  I think my healing will come from letting go of the fantasy that I will have a warm, loving, reliable, supportive father.  He really wasn't that way after the divorce and he isn't that way now.  Having the emotional reactive uBPD fiancée in the picture only makes everything harder.

The way your Mother had the affair and left your father and her children behind was very selfish.  It was not fair that you had to go through that has a child and then to be expected to basically just get over it.  It also was not fair that after leaving her married she wasn't there for you physically or emotionally.  I am so sorry you are having to go through this! 

[PeppermintTea]

  I feel like I am expected to play this same game again as an adult.  I don't want to play the game anymore. 

... .   I think my healing will come from letting go of the fantasy that I will have a warm, loving, reliable, supportive father. 

Thank you Moonbeam,

The two bits I quoted above are things I have thought myself.

As a child I didn't dare question my mother to closely in case she completely disappeared and also I didn't want to upset her because I wanted her to like and love me.  I don't want to play this game anymore and what makes me mad with myself is ... I still want to get her to like and love me... . so I still don't really closely question her.

She has text me to see if she can come over to see the kids in 2 days time  and I have said yes. I want to have a conversation with her about how I feel but I think what will actually happen is that I will smile and pretend I am ok. Why can't I do this - I have a pathological fear of rocking the boat but why?

I really need to let go of this idea that she could be consistent, open and caring... . unfortunately for me I don't seem to quite be there yet, I keep all this hope.

[Kwamina]

I really need to let go of this idea that she could be consistent, open and caring... . unfortunately for me I don't seem to quite be there yet, I keep all this hope.

Yes, letting go of the fantasy mother is very hard indeed. She already abandoned you once when you were a child and if you let go of the fantasy mother now it's almost like you're being abandoned all over again. Accepting that my uBPD mom will never change is something I struggle with too. I've drastically lowered my expactations of her and that helps me better deal with her behavior, but it still hurts that she has never been and will never be a real mother. This kind of acceptance takes a lot of time so don't be too hard on yourself. Nobody wants to accept these kind of things about their own parents but unfortunately this is our reality. 

[SeekingHealing]

I totally can relate to how you feel!  Although my mom didnt leave us and it is my biological dad who most likely has BPD and they are still married.  Well, I do feel like they both left us when they moved out of state.  It is so frustrating and depressing that i cant have the relationship with my mom that i want to have.  But i am learning to let that go and focus on me and my DH and children.  I did ask her to read Stop Walking on Eggshells and told her she cannot let him know about it.  I just want her to read it and tell me what she thinks.  She said she would.  She has agreed with me and my brother all our lives that our dad is not normal,  she has self medicated with alcohol, but she is so enmeshed and at times makes excuses for him.   I know my dad wouldnt let her go to therapy, especially without him.  Im glad that so many people here have been able to do that.

Im so sorry that your mother left you, physically and emotionally. 

[PeppermintTea]

Wow thanks for the help folks. I feel like I was out for a bit of a pity party yesterday so thanks for hearing me out. What I have taken from this is that:

1) I need to decide what are my boundaries in terms of contact with my mother.

2) I need to then enforce them instead of doing whatever she wants

3) I need to have a conversation with my mother about her past actions and about my step father and his controlling PD like behaviour and how this affects me

4) I need to consider therapy to enable me to move past this hoping my mother will step up and move towards just accepting what she is.

5) I need to remember that my perception of events is valid - I'm not making a big deal out of nothing but I need to work it through and deal with it before moving on with my life.


Once again thank you all.

PT

[PeppermintTea]

I'm so annoyed with myself.

My mother came over the see the kids a couple of days ago and instead of having a conversation with her about how I felt about her lack of contact with us over christmas I have allowed myself to be railroaded into reading a poem at her and uBPD/NPD step father's wedding next month!

I don't even want to go never mind having to read a poem. My husband and children are not invited and I don't know anyone out of the other guests as they are all friends of step father. However if I don't go, apparently my mother will be able to have even less to do with me than she does now because my step father will perceive this as a selfishness or personal slight from me to him.

My sister was also at my house and mum asked her if she was coming she just said 'no mum you didn't invite my brother, neices, nephew, partner or son so no I don't feel like coming'. Mother then proceeded to sulk with her for the afternoon.

So as it stands my mother thinks I am going to the service and the party. I don't want to go at all.

I guess a compromise would be to go just to the service.

My family are not invited. My brother and his family are not invited. My sister (but not her family) is invited but won't go.

I feel like if I don't go and perform I will be punished. I also feel that if I don't go my step father will stop my mother from seeing my children. Should I just risk it and say what I feel and tell them I don't want to go or should I compromise for the sake of my children's relationship with my mum?

PT

[Moonbeam77]

I don't even want to go never mind having to read a poem. My husband and children are not invited and I don't know anyone out of the other guests as they are all friends of step father. However if I don't go, apparently my mother will be able to have even less to do with me than she does now because my step father will perceive this as a selfishness or personal slight from me to him.

My sister was also at my house and mum asked her if she was coming she just said 'no mum you didn't invite my brother, neices, nephew, partner or son so no I don't feel like coming'. Mother then proceeded to sulk with her for the afternoon.

I feel like if I don't go and perform I will be punished. I also feel that if I don't go my step father will stop my mother from seeing my children.

I was wondering how the meeting with your Mom went.  My uNPD father is engaged to the uBPD woman I have posted about.  I have often wondered who will be invited and if me or my family should go and what the consequences each choice would bring.  Who really wants to go and celebrate a union of craziness?

I personally like your sister's response. 

[PeppermintTea]

Do you know I was so proud of my sister when she said that. And jealous.

I wish I could say how I feel and what I would like to do without fearing the repercussions.

I feel that if I go I am letting down my family especially my brother but if I don't go that's it there will be no more mum in my life.

Feel very annoyed with myself and sad.

PT

[Kwamina]

Hi again PeppermintTea,

Sorry to read that you're feeling sad. I see that you're mostly blaming yourself for getting into this situation. Don't forget that uBPD parents are often expert manipulators and are extremely good in getting their children to do things they don't really want to do. I understand your fear of repercussions, that's how they program us to think. But what's the worst that can really happen? Reading your previous posts suggests that the worst already happened when she abandoned you when you were just a kid... . but guess what?... . you survived! It's admirable that you want your children to have a relationship with their grandmother. Keep in mind though that your children aren't even invited to the wedding, only you are. To me that says a lot about how your mother and stepfather view these relationships.

I too like your sister's response but I do believe you should be careful in comparing your response to hers because everyone is different. Maybe your sister came prepared for your mother's request and that's why she was better able to handle the situation. Also don't forget that you already wanted to discuss another big thing with your mother, her lack of contact with you over Christmas, so you already had enough on your mind. Asking you to read that poem probably got you off guard a little.

[Moonbeam77]

Kwamina, you were able to articulate well many of the same thoughts I was having.

Hang in there Peppermint Tea!