Advice, or maybe just a need to voice

[Megan24]

A week ago, I lay in bed with my partner and she asked me why I didn't want to move away with her. We've been together for just over five years and have bought a home together. She asked whether it was because of the kids. I knew it was foolish to answer her but she assured me it was okay. So, in a moment of weakness and deep emotion, I said yes. That was enough. She escalated so that the weekend was pretty bad. She wasn't going to forgive me for putting my children first. Real lesbians don't have children and you love your children more than me. I'm not important in your life. I'm not your life; I'm an add-on. The predictable words I have become accustomed to over the years.

Then this weekend. She lay there looking at me. I said to her - I know you want me to talk to you about what I said but I am not ready right now. I felt this was the safest course of action because we rarely manage to get out of the bedroom of a Saturday morning without ruminations for three, four, five hours. I honestly didn't know what to say to her because her hatred of my children (and the whole notion of children) is extreme.

The weekend erupted from there. Hit, slapped, punched, locked in the bedroom, cornered, thrown on the lounge, grabbed in inappropriate places etc etc. I would cry and it would get worse. I would cower and I would be verbally abused. The screaming, the rantings, the ravings. She has this dialogue she wants me to say to her - she says it will calm her down. I've read the books and know there are things you can say to say you have heard what the BPD partner has said, so they don't feel dismissed. But hers is very specific and it usually involves something along the following lines; You must find it hard that ... . You must find it difficult ... . You must find it ... . and if I have to say something that I don't believe to be true, it is worth it to calm her, so she says. Even if it means accepting blame or fault for something I don't believe to be true.

It is then even further complicated form there because she has personalities that are real to her - a child (who is BPD), a boi (who, she says, manages her out of control behaviours) and the woman. Complicated because I am supposed to know who I am talking to and even though one says something - the boi had told me that I didn't have to talk to her until I was ready and that she knew it might take time - but the child wasn't in agreeance with that. She flits between these personalities - they take over her life and I am supposed to flow with them.

On the weekend, she damanded answers which, as I said, weren't safe to give because she had already worked out what an appropriate answer would be and it wasn't necessarily the answer - or explanation - I wanted to give. It escalated when I asked (after much bullying and emotional pushing to speak - from her) - would my children be welcome to visit. I don't want to see them any more than I see them now - which is maximum twice a year, maybe three times  - was her answer and I lost it. I took my ring off and told her it was over. She exploded and the physical assaults got worse.

I could go on and on but the tears will start, as they are now, if I do. She knows she is seriously mentally ill but when not in a BPD state, she is a beautiful person who I love dearly. She takes minimal medication and does not seek therapy any longer - did it for a brief period a year or so ago. I don't know how to deal with this. I love my children but I am in love with her. She doesn't accep that. To her they are more important than she is. When I try to explain that love takes many forms, she says it is not what she needs - that she needs to be the most important person in my life and that I need to put her above anyone and everyone else.

I am all confused right now but I will post this for the time being, hoping for advice or just ears cause I can't talk to anyone. Please   

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Rockylove]

 

Holy cow!  I'm sitting here with tears in my eyes thinking about what you've said.  It's such a difficult thing to deal with, especially when we've seen the "beautiful" side of our SO and know that it's within them somewhere. 

My concern here is that you are experiencing physical and emotional abuse and that's NOT OK.  She is trying to control what you say to soothe her and not ok... . that's not your job.  She is trying to isolate you from your children or anyone else that you may love and that's not ok.  She's expecting you to read her mind (know which of her personalities you are communicating with) and that's not ok!  She's manipulating you into a co-dependent position and you're allowing it and that's not ok.

I don't want to sound harsh in this.  I really don't think you want anyone here to blow smoke up your butt either... . you are in an abusive situation... . but you can change that.  Have you read through the lessons, tools, etc?  There are many things that you can start doing right away to make positive changes in your situation, but it's for YOU... . not for her.  Above all, you need to be safe and enjoy a comfortable relationship with your children.  Although she may want your life to be consumed by her needs, wants, etc... . that's not how life is and expecting you to fulfill her fantasy is unrealistic. 

I hope today is a better day for you and that you can find some solace in knowing that you're not alone in this... . we are all here for you and want to support you on your path to being the best version of you that there is

[yeeter]

Hi Megan,

 

You are in an abusive relationship.  Both physically, and emotionally.

DV is NOT ok.

Have you reached out to your local DV hotline?  They are there to provide help and services for these exact types of situations.  They understand whats going on, and can give advice and guidance to protect and help you in your long term recovery.

  More hugs.  You situation is NOT acceptable, and is destructive to your physical and emotional health.  Please take care of yourself, by calling and getting some support and help.  

Here is the number:

www.thehotline.org/

[Megan24]

Thanks for the advice. I am so confused. I keep thinking - is this what it is always going to be like? I have no-one to talk to. I feel so alone, so isolated. Work is my only escape - the only place in my life where I feel as if I have any control. I'm the boss here, so I can't even bond with someone enough to talk. My doctor is her doctor. It is so hard.

That doesn't mean I am going to give up. It is just hard. As a child, I was sexually abused. I feel like my entire life has been more than one person should have to cope with and I try to be strong, not to be a victim, to have stength and resilience, but sometimes, like now, as I am crying, my resolve is weakened.

When my partner found out she had BPD, it was almost like she succumbed to it. Life before hadn't been easy but we had periods of respite - periods where we did things and 'lived'. Now, every day is about BPD. Every single day. She wakes up talking about it, she goes to bed talking about it. Everything is justified under the heading of BPD. No-one has anything worse than her. She says that no-one knows her better than she knows herself which, on one level, is probably true, but on the level I live with, she doesn't see a true version of reality and therefore herself. I do this because I am BPD. I respond this way because I am BPD. I have to do it this way because I am BPD. We have to live our life this way because I am BPD I create my personalities because I am BPD. I have BPD therefore we both have it. Everyone around her (according to her) has a mental illness, but hers is the worst.   

When I said last time that there is a really specific dialogue that must be used, that's no understatement. She says that I never use the language - her very specific language. That the books say I should use it, which they obviously don't, but how do you get around that when, in her head, it has become her mantra? IT IS LIKE SHE HAS WRITTEN HER OWN TEXT BOOK ON BPD AND SHE IS THE SELF-PROCLAIMED EXPERT ON EVERYTHING TO DO WITH IT. If a book says something slightly different, she says that I only look for things that suit me.

Her need for very specific language has made me a nervous wreck and I struggle to deal with it.

Are personalities common to BPD sufferers? I am all over the place - probably just like my head is right now.

[Rockylove]

I keep thinking - is this what it is always going to be like?

When my partner found out she had BPD, it was almost like she succumbed to it. I do this because I am BPD. I respond this way because I am BPD. I have to do it this way because I am BPD. We have to live our life this way because I am BPD I create my personalities because I am BPD. I have BPD therefore we both have it.

Understand that it will always be like that if you allow it to be like that.  She sounds like my oldest sister... . "I own all of my ailments and now I have an excuse for all of my bad behavior" to which I say bull pucky!  Own what you will, but you are not a disease or ailment.  One is responsible for one's actions regardless of what ones "got."  A diagnosis doesn't mean that they don't have to take responsibility for what they do.  She is using it as an excuse to control you and that's not OK!

We are all here for you.  You can message me if you feel like having a private conversation.  I'll be there for you!  You are not alone, my friend!

[waverider]

You are too enmeshed and need to pull away so there is physical space. as long as you are this closely tied to her you will not be able to make objective decisions about anything, as there is no normality to benchmark your existence against. Just a sense of it being wrong but with no clear priorities as to how to go about fixing it.

When my partner found out she had BPD, it was almost like she succumbed to it. Life before hadn't been easy but we had periods of respite - periods where we did things and 'lived'. Now, every day is about BPD. Every single day. She wakes up talking about it, she goes to bed talking about it. Everything is justified under the heading of BPD. No-one has anything worse than her. She says that no-one knows her better than she knows herself which, on one level, is probably true, but on the level I live with, she doesn't see a true version of reality and therefore herself. I do this because I am BPD. I respond this way because I am BPD. I have to do it this way because I am BPD. We have to live our life this way because I am BPD I create my personalities because I am BPD. I have BPD therefore we both have it. Everyone around her (according to her) has a mental illness, but hers is the worst.   

I recognize this, my partner has a tendency to wear the badge of her various ailments and act them out even more and use the excuse of it's not me it is the disorder. I tend not to engage into those discussions neither to agree nor disagree.

Having and enforcing the bottom line boundary of not staying around for abuse is your first step. Until you have established this you will have no power to do anything else.

[Megan24]

Thank you for the advice. I am trying so hard to work this through. I thought I was getting somewhere yesterday and it all fell apart today. I know you can't reason with a BPD but that makes it so hard. I need to stop and think cause I am doing my head in right now. I need clarity of thought - thoughts that will support me in knowing how to move forward - not move away from her, but move forward. She had worked herself into such a state of needing an exact dialogue that it is getting past the point of ridiculous. Can a BPD 'create' a worse version of BPD? I know that sounds like a silly question but, like I said earlier, it is like she has created the crutch, and whether it's a healthy crutch or not it is the crutch she is determined to use.

I know I am going on and on, but I am trying so hard to think clearly and when I write, the thoughts have a chance of unravelling form within my head. 

[Rockylove]

I know I am going on and on, but I am trying so hard to think clearly and when I write, the thoughts have a chance of unravelling form within my head. 

I'm the same way.  It seems to flow differently when I write so I write~~A LOT!  Keep posting, asking questions and writing your feelings.  Journal.  Write to us.  You'll find that soon you will have clearer thoughts and some things will make sense.  We're here for you!   

[Megan24]

Thank you for that. I didn't get much sleep last night - another night in BPD mayhem and when we left for work this morning, a child was leaving our home, not the adult partner with whom I thought I was sharing my life. Are different personailities normal for a BPD? The counsellor she was seeing a while back, albeit briefly, said that my SO had created these personailities to support her, to help her cope. Well, to me, it seems that these personailities are now controlling her life to the detriment of all of us.

My weekend. It was a long weekend and I had planned to go to work to catch up on things that had fallen behind. I was going to do it the first day, have a day at home and then, if necessary, do it the third day so the fourth day could be at home together. I had spoken to her about it several times. She knows that sometimes I just need to sit in the privacy of my office when no-one is there and just focus. She said I hadn't mentioned it. I went but the angry messages started and continued. By the evening, she had settled. The next day we had a good day. But she said that she been a boi all day and that bois need to be rewarded with sex and that I should have known that.The next day was again tough going but I hung in there. That night we made love. It was good and spontaneous. The next morning she was escalating again but we got through the couple of hours and made love again. We spent the afternoon out and when we came home, we were both in a good place.

That evening, she finally lay beside me and looked into my eyes. She said that I looked depressed. Was I depressed? I said I wasn't. She then said that my eyes looked dead but given what had taken place the weekend before, she could understand how I might be feeling. She asked me to talk to her. She said it was okay, just to talk. I said that I had to shut down a part of myself to look after my emotions but that I was getting there. That was enough - there was an immediate response. I talked to her as calmly as I could about how good the day had been and that that was such a positive. She got angry and said she wanted to go to sleep. And then she told me I had rejected the child. That I shouldn't have said that to the child and that I didn't love the child in her, nor did I want to spend time with the child. Before she had escalated, when she was initially asking me how I was feeling, I had said that all conversations didn't have to be full-on emotional ones. That was another part of what I did wrong, from her perspective. She said that the child in her was emotional and wanted to talk deeply. As an adult I would question whether a real child would need to speak so deeply, but maybe that's me not understanding her needs.

Like I said at the beginning - am I missing something? Is it 'normal', or not uncommon, for BPD people to have different personalities? The flipping between these 'people' is extremely hard to deal with, little alone understand. It's like you can't believe or trust anything she says because the other part/s of her will refute it by saying, that was the boi speaking, the child is different etc etc.         

[Rockylove]

Is it 'normal', or not uncommon, for BPD people to have different personalities? The flipping between these 'people' is extremely hard to deal with, little alone understand. It's like you can't believe or trust anything she says because the other part/s of her will refute it by saying, that was the boi speaking, the child is different etc etc.         

Although I'm no expert, I don't know that to be a common BPD trait.  I don't think that people who are seriously mentally ill are as aware of the dysfunction of their illness as your gf.  They seem to know that they are somehow "different" and the rest of the world is crazy.   I'm not sure that she isn't conning you.  She is definitely good at manipulating you have finally awakened to that~~and now you can stop it.  She may rebel, but for your own safety and sanity, it's important. 

I don't want to sound harsh or judgmental.  I'm telling you what the situation looks like from my perspective. 

You aren't going to change her, especially since it seems she's taking such pride in being dysfunctional.  All the love, patience and radical acceptance isn't going to amount to a hill of beans if she's constantly playing you like a cheap fiddle.  We can be extremely close to another person and feel as though we know each others thoughts, but reality is that we cannot read minds.  She's expecting you to be so absorbed in her person that you think like her which is in itself a bit crazy.  From what you've said this has been her M.O. in other relationships as well.  Her actions seem very calculated and that's a bit scary. 

I'm naturally an optimist and can be a bit of a Pollyanna at times, but something about this feels very, very wrong to me.  Please be careful.

[briefcase]

Acutal, different personalities?  This is not typical of BPD in my experience here.  Does she have multiple personality disorder?  Or is this something that she just uses to explain the moods she feeling in the moment?     

[Megan24]

The personalities appear real to her but I just don't know anymore. When she is a child, she actually talks like a child, acts like a child but, as I said, often her reasoning is somewhere else. To me, it is like a game that has got out of hand and it has become real to her. I guess I know all of what is taking place right now is not right but I don't know how to approach her in regards to it. I appreciate everything I am being told here - it helps a lot. I am not an unintelligent woman, and when I step away from the immediacy of the situation, I know something is terribly amiss but, that said, I love her dearly and I know she loves me. I don't want to give up on her. She said she would get help. Whether that eventuates or not is a different kettle of fish. 

When I read all the symptoms of BPD, it seems unquestionable that I am reading about her - she fits it to a 'T'. Her narcissism makes it all the worse because she 'knows' it all and no-one else knows her better than she does. No-one knows what she needs better than she does. But when she succumbs to her deep emotions and cries in my arms, she begs me to 'help' - she confesses that she is scared of the intensity of her mental wellbeing. She knows she is not in touch with reality. She knows her behaviours are bordering on psychotic. Her counsellor told her (with me present) that I was neither her counsellor nor her mother and that she shouldn't expect that from me - but when she is BPD, that's exactly what she wants. 

I am being cautious - I want to help her as best as I can.   

[Megan24]

   It has been suggested that personalities are not common amongst BPDs - if I read the posts correctly. The counsellor said the same thing. She suggested that they were coping mechanisms. When a BPD breaks with reality, is it common/uncommon, for their behaviours to become almost psychotic. She says that when she loses it, she has absolutely no control over what she does. As an observer, it appears as if she goes through a cycle and nothing can interrupt that cycle, whether the cycle lasts for an hour or so, or a day or so.

I am at a point where I need to understand my reality. What is normal and what is not normal. What control she does have and what control she doesn't have. What is deliberate manipulatation and what is part of the disorder.

[Rockylove]

What is deliberate manipulatation and what is part of the disorder.

As I said before, I'm no expert.  I don't know that her therapist isn't being bamboozled~~sociopaths are very good at what they do~~manipulate.  I'm not saying she is a sociopath, but it's possible.  Just be careful and stay safe.

[yeeter]

Im not sure it matters whether her manipulation is intentional or not.  Manipulation is manipulation.

I found her referral to 'the child' as a bit strange, and that she seems to want to feed that child a little concerning.  You shouldnt feel compelled to play along, it sounds almost like an acknowledgment on her part that part of her has never grown up emotionally, but at the same time an indication that she isnt interested in tackling it as an issue.

I am at a point where I need to understand my reality. What is normal and what is not normal.

Worthwhile work to do!  How will you approach this?  (there have been a number of comments shared already suggesting that some of the behavior in your relationship is NOT normal, is NOT healthy, and you need to protect yourself and establish your own strength).  Its going to take work and time - do you have other people/friends that you engage with regularly to help ground you?