Betrayal bonds or trauma bonds... childhoods of abuse...

[Our abuse recovery guide]

Having grave issues again with someone close to me, alot of broken promises that I doubted even initially (sort of that "knew better" feel), episodes of flashes of furious anger "explained away" and turned back on me as some issue of mine with taking things too "seriously," etc.

Always has time for a dozen other things than significant time with me.

I spell out, literally word for word, what would mean alot to mean between things we do together, things we talk about - it all gets lost in "I didn't get around to it okay?" and "It's all about what YOU want to do," while every last free hour or weekend day is spent on the repeated activities that have nothing to do with me, my interests, or who I am.

Saw something on the board index, in a post title, about trauma bonds, I thought it'd mean that when we know someone with similar histories we bond with that person, right?

It's nothing of the kind.  We bond alright... . but in a completely self-abusing, self-ABASING way.

Due to our history as targets of abuse, we can gravitate back to time with someone who glibly and almost knowingly admits to taking more than his or her share of us, never *changes* after apologizing seeminly expects reconciliation even if we are faltering and still hurt and unsure.

The things I read - betrayal bond, trauma bond, it's called both - I encourage any of you feeling whiplashed and alone by someone who claims to be your friend or even someone more substantial to read up on this... . there were too many good links to list them all and I am sure this site has references.

It will explain YOU, not the one taking advantage or hurting you or abusing you.  It will explain why YOU go back... . again and again.

Since we cannot change another person, explaining to someone over and over again about what we need or why something has hurt us, hardly registering it would seem (my person will even read as you try to express yourself, insisting that every word you're saying is understood and parroting back the last 30 seconds perhaps - but tuning me out completely and ready to defend doing so)... . this is what I need to finally do and understand.

Why do I think I have to keep strings attached to someone who is so damaged (all of this happened with FOO and I finally totally broke loose contact-wise) and so sociopathically hurting me - seeming to know when to come do me a great favor with my house or yard just as my feelings are wobbling away? like a radar that knows when to tweak me?

My question for my friends here is - when you are finally aware of what has happened to you in your FOO, and if you are or are not struggling with NC with them, do you have someone else as well who seems to be sucking you dry emotionally, battering you even, and yet you stay in contact and you make allowances and you make excuses both to yourself and to concerned friends?

Yo-yo style interactions - even so much as to say yesterday that the piles of things on the kitchen table almost fell on me as I tried to sit down two days ago, just need to make a cup of tea, and my god, the literally rotten food in the fridge that I thought was one of the dogs very nasty gas attack - and was told, "The three dogs don't mind."  Dismissed as part of the scenery almost asking, "Why isn't there a place ONE place for me to sit as often as I am here?"

Yet outside on porch, given the chance to ask about my day, what I did, how I'm doing, really basic dialogue, normal stuff, not hand-holding... . the cell phone comes out and calls are made... . I get up saying, Well the cup of tea was just what I needed let me get home and get clothes off the line... . "

Ignored until I really see I can go and do it civilly enough... . "Where you going?"

so explain again, well when I'm here and you start making calls the few times I get to be around you - what else should I do?

Cycle cycle cycle -

Is there anyone here who is so aware of the wrongness of it, but week after week keeps up just enough contact and rolls through regular tantrums and still does the self-scamming reasons why it's no big deal?

Why wouldn't I just pull the plug forever on such a connection?

How did any of you do it? This person isn't anyone I will be sharing my future with as far as a mate or partner... . I mean... . basic companionship is maddening enough... .

Slides on other stuff too, and I give phone #'s ahead of time, saying, This won't be a problem if you talk to this person this month instead of waiting... . doesn't pay taxes AT ALL but IRS out to wrongly place liens, etc... .

Grandiose feelings about community groups that need this person so much person makes waves and claims that they don't dare do x y or z as person is so vital, also knows where the bodies are buried kind of threat... .

Help. 

What are your experiences with people OUTSIDE your FOO whether you are pretty much clear of FOO via longterm NC or are working in LC for clarity etc?

I spend hours strategizing and then fall on my face when given chance to basically say, You suck, go away. 

[lucyhoneychurch]

Having grave issues again with someone close to me, alot of broken promises that I doubted even initially (sort of that "knew better" feel), episodes of flashes of furious anger "explained away" and turned back on me as some issue of mine with taking things too "seriously," etc.

Always has time for a dozen other things than significant time with me.

I spell out, literally word for word, what would mean alot to mean between things we do together, things we talk about - it all gets lost in "I didn't get around to it okay?" and "It's all about what YOU want to do," while every last free hour or weekend day is spent on the repeated activities that have nothing to do with me, my interests, or who I am.

Saw something on the board index, in a post title, about trauma bonds, I thought it'd mean that when we know someone with similar histories we bond with that person, right?

It's nothing of the kind.  We bond alright... . but in a completely self-abusing, self-ABASING way.

Due to our history as targets of abuse, we can gravitate back to time with someone who glibly and almost knowingly admits to taking more than his or her share of us, never *changes* after apologizing seeminly expects reconciliation even if we are faltering and still hurt and unsure.

The things I read - betrayal bond, trauma bond, it's called both - I encourage any of you feeling whiplashed and alone by someone who claims to be your friend or even someone more substantial to read up on this... . there were too many good links to list them all and I am sure this site has references.

It will explain YOU, not the one taking advantage or hurting you or abusing you.  It will explain why YOU go back... . again and again.

Since we cannot change another person, explaining to someone over and over again about what we need or why something has hurt us, hardly registering it would seem (my person will even read as you try to express yourself, insisting that every word you're saying is understood and parroting back the last 30 seconds perhaps - but tuning me out completely and ready to defend doing so)... . this is what I need to finally do and understand.

Why do I think I have to keep strings attached to someone who is so damaged (all of this happened with FOO and I finally totally broke loose contact-wise) and so sociopathically hurting me - seeming to know when to come do me a great favor with my house or yard just as my feelings are wobbling away? like a radar that knows when to tweak me?

My question for my friends here is - when you are finally aware of what has happened to you in your FOO, and if you are or are not struggling with NC with them, do you have someone else as well who seems to be sucking you dry emotionally, battering you even, and yet you stay in contact and you make allowances and you make excuses both to yourself and to concerned friends?

Yo-yo style interactions - even so much as to say yesterday that the piles of things on the kitchen table almost fell on me as I tried to sit down two days ago, just need to make a cup of tea, and my god, the literally rotten food in the fridge that I thought was one of the dogs very nasty gas attack - and was told, "The three dogs don't mind."  Dismissed as part of the scenery almost asking, "Why isn't there a place ONE place for me to sit as often as I am here?"

Yet outside on porch, given the chance to ask about my day, what I did, how I'm doing, really basic dialogue, normal stuff, not hand-holding... . the cell phone comes out and calls are made... . I get up saying, Well the cup of tea was just what I needed let me get home and get clothes off the line... . "

Ignored until I really see I can go and do it civilly enough... . "Where you going?"

so explain again, well when I'm here and you start making calls the few times I get to be around you - what else should I do?

Cycle cycle cycle -

Is there anyone here who is so aware of the wrongness of it, but week after week keeps up just enough contact and rolls through regular tantrums and still does the self-scamming reasons why it's no big deal?

Why wouldn't I just pull the plug forever on such a connection?

How did any of you do it? This person isn't anyone I will be sharing my future with as far as a mate or partner... . I mean... . basic companionship is maddening enough... .

Slides on other stuff too, and I give phone #'s ahead of time, saying, This won't be a problem if you talk to this person this month instead of waiting... . doesn't pay taxes AT ALL but IRS out to wrongly place liens, etc... .

Grandiose feelings about community groups that need this person so much person makes waves and claims that they don't dare do x y or z as person is so vital, also knows where the bodies are buried kind of threat... .

Help. 

What are your experiences with people OUTSIDE your FOO whether you are pretty much clear of FOO via longterm NC or are working in LC for clarity etc?

I spend hours strategizing and then fall on my face when given chance to basically say, You suck, go away. 

[appleman]

Lucyhoneychurch, I'm sorry you're having to deal with this.  I cannot say that I've had a similar situation I can relate to, but just some thoughts.

I know you dealt with a lot of pain from your parental unit and have spent a good part of your life recovering and trying to help yourself become mentally and emotionally healthy from that.  Well, we can't choose our parents, but we can choose our friends. Personally, before I met my wife I look back and so many of the women I dated needed "rescuing", or there was something in the relationship where I felt the pull to help them "fix" something in their lives.  That comes from being raised to be the one to "rescue" or "fix" things for Mom.

Could your case be a situation where in spite of all your frustrations, an ingrained programming of needing to fix things is prevailing over the need to have your own needs met? It's pretty selfish when someone you care about tunes you out when you express your needs. That's something a BPD parent does.

Think about that parental programming aspect of this again.  Are you falling into the trap of going along with the status-quo and accepting the abuse, because that's how you stay "safe"?   

Be well my friend.

[StarStruck]

Hi lucyhoneychurch -

I understand what you mean here, for me appleman has put that very clearly. Sometimes we are attracted to relationships that are similar to our FOO in a way of trying to reach the damaged parent/s through 'curing' the new relationship. Not being aware of this whilst we are growing up.

When I first started learning of personality disorders and how that related to my family... . what can I say it was an eye opener. With regards to patterns of thought towards friends it also gave me a new template. In the past I would be attracted to certain people then they would let me down in some way. I know understand these particular people had the issues I have learnt of. As soon as this   went off, I started to dismiss these friendships SS x

[lucyhoneychurch]

my dear friends, thank you so much!

I so know that I am in a constant state of "fixer" search... . and that's what I am trying to figure out what to stop doing.



I get so frustrated with myself.

Such a long winter for so many - I am anticipating some better thought processing as able to get outside -

You are very kind to read and help.   

Painting inside and working on a new bathroom with clawfoot tub and antique sink   

Please know how much your thoughts help me today.   

I think I struggle with walking away... . even now... . some part of me wanting to recreate family stuff that I've learned decades ago is so harmful.

My friend is so much like my father it's not funny.

Starstruck and appleman, thank you!

[StarStruck]

Question is... . what's the next step? are you accepting and going to work with 'it'? or going to think about giving yourself a fresh platform... . for YOURSELF... . not trying to lead

(try not to be frustrated with yourself; be gentle & listen to you)

[clljhns]

Hi Lucyhoneychurch,

I know exactly how you feel and I am so sorry that you are experiencing this right now. I have moved through a continuum of failed relationships which were marked by neglect, abuse, and disdain. At first, I had no idea that I was even a part of the equation. I just assumed that I had made a bad choice. It wasn't until after my second husband that I started to understand some of the reasons why I chose men and women in my life who were energy vampires. I was working so hard to please them, that it literally drained the life right out of me. I left these relationships initially because I was too tired to continue catering to their needs, and had no idea how to meet my own needs, let alone ask anyone else to do this.

I watched John Bradshaw's series on dysfunctional families, and thought I had a handle on things. It opened my eyes to the role I was assigned in my family. The Lost Child, and the rescuer, all in one. So, I went on to connect with people who could provide the same platform that I was comfortable with in an unhealthy relationship. I also went to therapy once I finally admitted that my childhood was really as bad as my siblings said.

I can't say that even the therapy brought me to a place where I had developed enough self-esteem and insight into myself that I did not attract another person who I married and I believe is an uBPD. This was a brief marriage in which I was financially, emotionally, and spiritually devastated.

However, I am doing more work to heal the wounds of my childhood. I thought it was enough that I recognized the trauma, and that it was enough that I had gone into therapy for more than a year. It wasn't for me. I still need to deal with the lasting effects of the abuse, which I have never fully done. I am very cautious about the people I come into contact with now and will not entertain man-babies anymore.

My greatest fear growing up was that I would be alone. This certainly began with the neglect from my mother and eventually watching my parents throw out two of my siblings. This cemented for me the fear that I would be alone, unless I did everything I could to please my partner. I am living alone for the first time in more than twenty years, and I am reveling in this new freedom!

I guess my point to you is that you have to find the underlying reason as to why you tolerate this kind of behavior. I certainly understand wanting to be appreciated and loved for who you are. I don't know that I have ever received this in a partner, and certainly never in my family. I know how difficult it is to try and understand why you would keep going back to the same situation. I agree with Starstruck and appleman that you might be trying to fix the relationship with your FOO through these new relationships. When I look back on my partners, I can point out characteristics they share with my FOO.

I wish you much peace and healing, and that you find the answers to all of your questions!