Diagnosis + Treatment
The Big Picture
Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde? [ Video ]
Five Dimensions of Human Personality
Think It's BPD but How Can I Know?
DSM Criteria for Personality Disorders
Treatment of BPD [ Video ]
Getting a Loved One Into Therapy
Top 50 Questions Members Ask
Home page
Forum
List of discussion groups
Making a first post
Find last post
Discussion group guidelines
Tips
Romantic relationship in or near breakup
Child (adult or adolescent) with BPD
Sibling or Parent with BPD
Boyfriend/Girlfriend with BPD
Partner or Spouse with BPD
Surviving a Failed Romantic Relationship
Tools
Wisemind
Ending conflict (3 minute lesson)
Listen with Empathy
Don't Be Invalidating
Setting boundaries
On-line CBT
Book reviews
Member workshops
About
Mission and Purpose
Website Policies
Membership Eligibility
Please Donate
October 31, 2024, 11:32:18 PM
Welcome,
Guest
. Please
login
or
register
.
1 Hour
5 Hours
1 Day
1 Week
Forever
Login with username, password and session length
Board Admins:
Kells76
,
Once Removed
,
Turkish
Senior Ambassadors:
EyesUp
,
SinisterComplex
Help!
Boards
Please Donate
Login to Post
New?--Click here to register
Depression = 72% of members
Take the test, read about the implications, and check out the remedies.
111
BPDFamily.com
>
Relationship Partner with BPD (Straight and LGBT+)
>
Romantic Relationship | Detaching and Learning after a Failed Relationship
> Topic:
Are you struggling with cognitive dissonance?
Pages: [
1
]
Go Down
« previous
next »
Print
Author
Topic: Are you struggling with cognitive dissonance? (Read 514 times)
Want2know
Retired Staff
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 2934
Are you struggling with cognitive dissonance?
«
on:
March 29, 2014, 09:54:20 AM »
There is an Aesop's fable that is a good example of cognitive dissonance, something I think many of us struggle with in the aftermath of our break ups. Here is that fable:
"One afternoon a fox was walking through the forest and spotted a bunch of grapes hanging from over a lofty branch.
"Just the thing to quench my thirst," quoth he.
Taking a few steps back, the fox jumped and just missed the hanging grapes. Again the fox took a few paces back and tried to reach them but still failed.
Finally, giving up, the fox turned up his nose and said, "They're probably sour anyway," and proceeded to walk away.
"
Cognitive dissonance is a term that was developed by Leon Festinger, a social psychologist, that can be generally summed up as the inconsistency in internal thought/feelings which makes one psychologically uncomfortable, and will motivate the person to try to reduce the dissonance (inconsistency).
So, in the situation of the fox, he desired those grapes and when he realized he couldn't have them, he criticized them in a way that made him feel like they were nothing that he really wanted, in the end, thereby reducing the internal inconsistency between his desire for the grapes and the reality that he wasn't able to get the grapes.
How this pertains to our situations here with our pwBPD is similar. We had a desire to be in a healthy relationship with our pwBPD. We realized that this was not possible after all of our attempts, and in the end, spend so much time speaking poorly of our exes, placing blame, which creates a lot of negative energy for ourselves.
Understanding BPD is one thing. It can help us better understand human behavior, in general, and how we might make better decisions regarding relationships in the future. Spending energy on disparaging or blaming our ex's seems to keep one stuck, even though it may reduce the cognitive dissonance we feel.
This stuff is hard, I know. I was in a 4 year relationship that was difficult to move on from. It's been almost 3 years now since that ended, and one of the key things that has helped me move through the Stages of Detachment (to the right of your screen) was to stop spending so much time thinking of him as faulty and instead look at it as a learning experience. No more pointing out his flaws, no more energy spent on being angry at his actions.
Are you ready to do this?
Logged
“The path to heaven doesn't lie down in flat miles. It's in the imagination with which you perceive this world, and the gestures with which you honor it." ~ Mary Oliver
fromheeltoheal
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: Broken up, I left her
Posts: 5642
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #1 on:
March 29, 2014, 10:46:14 AM »
Good topic W2K. My own processing has gone through several stages: first, the relationship itself was dissonant cognitively; the reality of it was not matching up to my ideal of it, my hopes and dreams, although I thought it did at one point, and that dissonance was extremely uncomfortable. Then that discomfort and anger motivated me to leave. Then, as I detached and learned about the disorder, my thoughts aligned with reality, they became cognitively consonant. Then the realizations that I had been in love with a fantasy that didn't exist, she has a mental illness, and I was totally blind were shocking to me, dissonant, so to deal with it initially I blamed her and got pissed off, also a natural response to abuse, then, in an attempt to make my cognitions consonant once again, I shifted the focus to me, what I can learn from the experience, why I got in the relationship to begin with, what does a healthy relationship look like, how do I stay more present in the future. Sometimes I do better at those than others, sometimes my behaviors are more consonant than dissonant with my cognitions.
To me the entire thing is a matter of reframing, what we make things mean, the danger being in when we make something mean something that it just clearly isn't or doesn't to feel better, a warped reality, as opposed to just reinterpreting something in a way that serves us.
Logged
Surnia
Retired Staff
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: 8 y married, divorced since 2012-11-22
Posts: 3900
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #2 on:
March 30, 2014, 01:05:24 AM »
When I am the fox in some situations, my blaming goes often like this: Those stupid grapes. They are doing it
on purpose
, not being ripe yet. What they think who they are? They have to be ripe when I am around. (Gosh, written down, this sounds quite narcissistic  
I am struggling sometimes too when I am the grapes and the fox is sitting there, blaming me. "Yes, he is right, I am a really sour cultivar of grapes." or "You are wrong, fox, I am one of the best grapes around there."
And so I am missing an excellent possibility for validation... . and I am fueling the fox's frustration or my negative self-talk.
Logged
“Don’t shrink. Don’t puff up. Stand on your sacred ground.” Brené Brown
waver
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic Partner
Relationship status: married for 20 years
Posts: 36
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #3 on:
March 30, 2014, 01:18:45 AM »
This is really interesting!
Logged
Want2know
Retired Staff
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 2934
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #4 on:
March 30, 2014, 08:30:33 AM »
From what I've read, the primary ways to resolve the dissonance, per the theory, are generally summarized as these:
Excerpt
- Altering the importance/value of of the conflicting belief
- Emphasize a new belief that supports your behavior
- Changing your behavior all together
Using an example that we probably all can relate to:
Belief
: I wanted my relationship to work, I was willing to do more to make it work... .
Behavior
: I mock the person's character now that they have left.
Using the three ways of reducing dissonance as mentioned above, here are possible outcomes:
Change the behavior all together
: “Accept your true feelings of loss - don't mock the grapes ”.
Alter the importance/value of the belief
: “As much as I want to hold the relationship, I need to embrace that this is a chapter in my life that is closed and it's greatest value is in what I can learn from it to build the next relationship."
Emphasize a new belief that supports the new behavior
: “I see that I was a inappropriately and wrongly held onto a broken relationship with a very broken person for some dysfunctional reasons of my own. ”
As I see it, the disparaging remarks about our ex's and the placing blame occurs because we are upset with ourselves for staying in the relationship for so long, going against what we value. If this realization is missed, and one remains stuck in the anger/blaming mode, it's not going to help you move on.
When I started looking more into cognitive dissonance, it was an eye opening experience. I can see myself doing this often. Sometimes it just takes a bit of awareness to see the light.
Logged
“The path to heaven doesn't lie down in flat miles. It's in the imagination with which you perceive this world, and the gestures with which you honor it." ~ Mary Oliver
fromheeltoheal
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: Broken up, I left her
Posts: 5642
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #5 on:
March 30, 2014, 09:08:01 AM »
Quote from: Want2know on March 30, 2014, 08:30:33 AM
As I see it, the disparaging remarks about our ex's and the placing blame occurs because we are upset with ourselves for staying in the relationship for so long, going against what we value. If this realization is missed, and one remains stuck in the anger/blaming mode, it's not going to help you move on.
I think the anger/blaming goes both ways. Anger towards someone who was abusive in many ways is a healthy, appropriate response, as is blaming the abuser, and of course anger/blaming ourselves for staying longer than we should have is at least an equal part of it. And you're right, as we shift our focus and behaviors away from the relationship and make them consonant with our values, the focus naturally shifts to us, and as we gain experience moving forward with consonant beliefs and behaviors, we begin 'moving on'.
Logged
Skip
Site Director
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 7031
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #6 on:
March 30, 2014, 09:26:19 AM »
This is an interesting observation... .
As I understand cognitive dissonance, we are all very sensitive to inconsistencies between actions and beliefs. When it happens, we are compelled, maybe even desperate to resolve the inconsistency.
Simple enough. But when we resolve the inconsistencies, are we "the Fox", one who lies to himself to mask his own shortcomings, or do we hold ourselves to a higher standard?
Change beliefs
According to Richard H. Hall, PhD, perhaps the simplest way to resolve dissonance between actions and beliefs is simply to change your beliefs. You could, of course, just decide that smearing/mocking is o.k. This would take care of any dissonance. However, if the belief in emotional / intellectual honesty and integrity is fundamental and important to you such a course of action will be uncomfortable in itself. Our basic beliefs and attitudes are pretty stable and we can go this route for a while, but if we have these beliefs, it eventually catches up to us.
Change actions
A second option would be to make sure that we never do this action again. So, you may say to yourself that you will stop the mocking. However, aversive conditioning (i.e., guilt/anxiety) can often be a pretty poor way of learning, especially if you can train yourself not to feel things. Plus, you may really benefit from facing he action that’s inconsistent with your beliefs. So, the trick would be to get rid of this feeling without changing your beliefs or your actions, and this leads us to the third, and probably most healthy, method of resolution.
Change perception of action
A third and more complex method of resolution is to change the way you view/remember/perceive your action.
Studies show that the greater the inconsistency, the harder it will be to advance to "Change perception of action".
Logged
arn131arn
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: living apart
Posts: 826
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #7 on:
March 30, 2014, 07:03:28 PM »
My sister told me something when my relationship with my son's mother first ended. This post made me go back to that... . she said,
"You are not grieving the loss of the relationship, you are grieving what the relationship never was."
There are times I get triggered, and I get angry at her, but most of all, lately, I've been angry at me. There is a voice (the fox) inside my head that tells me, "She wasn't worth it. She never was. She ruined you. Ruined your dreams, you don't need her anyway, then it's followed by the word dummy."
These triggers happen less frequently now; but when they do, I start ruminating, pining, and place her back on that pedestal. When I found out about my replacement and in the beginning, I did talk really bad about her. I was told to let go with dignity and I have tried to stop the bad mouthing. I can see the most beautiful thing that ever happened in my life, came from her- my (8) yr old son. Then, I can see that 5 year old little girl with the little boy haircut who was verbally abused by her mother and neglected by her father, and I can come to a place of compassion and love.
I miss the girl I planned marrying one day. I know I will always love her in some kinda way. But I am grateful because I have so many more ripe grapes to feast on today then I ever had while with her. Double edge sword, I guess
Logged
nomadicsoul
Offline
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Posts: 6
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #8 on:
March 30, 2014, 09:47:51 PM »
Great post! Right before I signed my lease I became afraid, uncertain etc. Then I said to myself but I talk bad about her. A man should not talk bad about his wife as much as I do... . I got out of the car and went into the rental office and signed. Its a strange journey.
NS
Logged
willy45
Formerly "johnnyorganic", "rjh45", "SurferDude"
Offline
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 762
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #9 on:
March 31, 2014, 12:06:26 AM »
Really good post. Made me think a lot.
I'd like to posit another reason though for the blaming and anger which I think fits in this cognitive framework. What if the blame and anger is just repressed cognitive dissonance. That is, we felt it during the relationship when things where deeply, deeply wrong. Then, instead of being able to express these things with our partners and have them be heard, we were blamed, gaslighted, accused, guilt tripped and otherwise manipulated. I know for me, if I brought anything up, I got either 'why can't you be nice to me' or 'well, you do this' or 'why haven't you done' or 'if you hadn't done this, then I wouldn't have had to do that'. There was never any resolution. Just a lot of anger and hurt.
So, maybe this anger and blaming isn't such a bad thing. Those emotions are still in there. Maybe it is a way of getting them out. I know for me, I didn't have the tools or the understanding to be able to really identify what was wrong or what was going on. I was just so confused all the time that I just kind of took it. My ex was very convincing and screamed the fight out of me. I just gave up. And I took it. And yes. That pisses me off. And sure, I stayed. But she was the one raging and screaming like a lunatic.
I know it is good to let go of these feelings eventually. I know that blame needs to go away in time. But, maybe it serves a purpose in the short term. Maybe it is a way to express those feelings that couldn't be expressed before. Maybe it is a way of reliving the past and starting to bring that cognitive dissonance back into alignment. And, once aligned, then they can be set free.
Just a thought.
Logged
Want2know
Retired Staff
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 2934
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #10 on:
March 31, 2014, 12:52:41 AM »
Quote from: willy45 on March 31, 2014, 12:06:26 AM
I know it is good to let go of these feelings eventually. I know that blame needs to go away in time. But, maybe it serves a purpose in the short term. Maybe it is a way to express those feelings that couldn't be expressed before. Maybe it is a way of reliving the past and starting to bring that cognitive dissonance back into alignment. And, once aligned, then they can be set free.
I think looking at the basis of our anger can help us understand there is a problem where action needs to take place, ie. exiting the relationship, as in the example above. In this way, it is an important part of getting us to where we need to be in resolving the underlying issue.
To continue to be angry and blame anyone other than ourselves shows lack of awareness and understanding. The beginning stages of detachment are there to help us uncover what the issues are that we may need to change. So, in that light, anger is a part of the process. The point being, if you stay there too long, and continue to be angry and blame, it may resolve your dissonance, but will it move you forward?
Logged
“The path to heaven doesn't lie down in flat miles. It's in the imagination with which you perceive this world, and the gestures with which you honor it." ~ Mary Oliver
willy45
Formerly "johnnyorganic", "rjh45", "SurferDude"
Offline
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 762
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #11 on:
March 31, 2014, 01:36:35 AM »
I guess in a way, I think it does. I know for me, I was always the one accepting blame for everything. I had to. There was no other way to have stayed. And I didn't really know about any of this BPD stuff, I didn't know anything about boundaries, and I didn't really know anything about emotional abuse. So, yeah. I think it does serve a purpose. For me, it isn't about blaming someone else entirely. Not at all. But, it is about trying to reclaim my sanity by understanding HER part in it because I was never allowed to do that in the relationship. It was always me. I was the one who always got blamed. So, I think it is part of the healing process to look back and retrack history. My T said that something required for mental health is to be able to form a cohesive story about the past and about our selves. One thing that you bring up here is how cognitive dissonance is the undoing of that coherence and how this undoing is so damaging to the self and to esteem. I constantly had to undo myself by saying exactly the kinds of things you wrote. For example, I would say to myself: "I am not the kind of person who would stay in a relationship with someone who will rage at me so badly that I would hide under the bed". Now, when that happened once, it was a blow. When it happened twice, it was worse. When it happened again, I don't know what was going on. I lost all balance and sense of self. And when I accepted that I was to blame for that, then everything goes haywire.
So, for me, the blame isn't about how my ex ruined the relationship. It is about shifting the sands back in time to a place where I was. It is a way for me to say: HEY! THAT IS NOT OK. YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO DO THAT. AND YOU ARE TO BLAME FOR YOUR BEHAVIOR. I think by doing that, it helps to reestablish a sense of self, a sense of self that was lost during the relationship because of all the abuse.
Yes. Of course this doesn't mean not taking any responsibility for not leaving. Of course. I don't think anyhow here is stoked to have stayed. To me, that's the easy thing. The hard thing for me is to regain my sense of self. And part of that is rejecting the blame I accepted during the relationship and throwing it back to the person who was really responsible.
When lying under the bed hiding from my ex, what else could I have done? That was my way out. I couldn't react. I could leave. Where would I go? Sleep on the street? I couldn't tell her to stop, that would make it worse. I didn't want to just lie there in bed. I wanted her to go away. And that's what I did. Did it hurt me. Yes. Long term? I guess. My FAULT? NO WAY. I just rolled over while I was asleep. So, I do think it is healthy to heap blame. Like I said, maybe not forever. At some point we must all let go and say "who cares, let's move on from this unfortunate episode". But, I do think it is very, very dangerous to try to take responsibility for these behaviors. Isn't taking responsibility for these behaviors the EXACT reason why we stayed? Should we take some time to deflect that? Purge ourselves of the gaslighting and blame shifting and OWN the fact that we were not to blame?
One other thought... .
Maybe it is different for people who left vs. people who stayed. I left my ex. I left in her in a pretty state. And I feel incredibly guilty about (both my own stuff and residual and continual blame from her). For me, when I look back at all the things I put up with, it is time for me to blame her for her behavior. It is way for me to say... . hey, Willy, you put up with a lot that was not your fault. She could not take responsibility for her behavior, so you left and set the bridge on fire when you did for a reason. And yes. It is HER fault for not treating you well and for being abusive. She is to BLAME. Not me. I tried to stick it out. What I need to work on is boundaries, because yes, I stayed for way, way, way too long. But her behavior it NOT MY FAULT.
I guess what worries me about this post it that what kept us stuck in the relationship was the over acceptance of blame (at least that's what seems to be a pattern). Not really venting that back at the abusive partner might just as easily keep us stuck because then we are continuing the abuse cycle in our own minds. Seems like dangerous territory.
Logged
Samsara121
Offline
What is your sexual orientation: Gay, lesb
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 31
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #12 on:
March 31, 2014, 04:33:43 AM »
Quote from: Want2know on March 29, 2014, 09:54:20 AM
(... . ) instead look at it as a learning experience. (... )
Are you ready to do this?
Thank you for this nice topic. I'm now 1 month NC with my upwBPDex.
I can relate to it but more during the r/s. I was feeling that something was wrong, mainly with what she would tell me at the beginning, fancy sentences that sounded awkward in the context and mainly hard to believe.
But yet, I was negotiating with myself and "normalizing" those words.
Now in hindsight, it feels like I was curious to know more about her and at the same time my exhaustion was giving me the reality
.
My anger was triggered by the
Triangulation
with "friends" she would continuously flirt with and who openly flirt with her. Now of course I miss her presence and at the same time I'm relieved she's not getting in contact with me. I'm working hard everyday to understand what made me follow that r/s path. It's a painful journey to go to look at my r/s with my mother and father, cognitive re-actualization is needed there too!
The next stage for me is to trust my feelings and be more assertive with them. And detect the "negotiation process" between my feelings and my thoughts. It's a daily management
I bless this short r/s with my ex- for it has giving me the strength and will to go learn more about myself. Sometimes I blame myself, but then work on be compassionate also for my own sake. That's very new to me, to aim compassion to myself, and it feels great!
Logged
Want2know
Retired Staff
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 2934
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #13 on:
March 31, 2014, 07:14:20 AM »
Quote from: willy45 on March 31, 2014, 01:36:35 AM
When lying under the bed hiding from my ex, what else could I have done? That was my way out. I couldn't react. I could leave. Where would I go? Sleep on the street? I couldn't tell her to stop, that would make it worse. I didn't want to just lie there in bed. I wanted her to go away. And that's what I did. Did it hurt me. Yes. Long term? I guess. My FAULT? NO WAY. I just rolled over while I was asleep. So, I do think it is healthy to heap blame. Like I said, maybe not forever. At some point we must all let go and say "who cares, let's move on from this unfortunate episode". But, I do think it is very, very dangerous to try to take responsibility for these behaviors. Isn't taking responsibility for these behaviors the EXACT reason why we stayed? Should we take some time to deflect that? Purge ourselves of the gaslighting and blame shifting and OWN the fact that we were not to blame?
Willy, it's tough stuff, I know.
Without taking this thread too far off course regarding the topic and into your personal situation, I do want to say that you may think you didn't have choices, at the time, when in fact you did. There are a variety of ways how you could have responded. What you chose was what you thought was the best choice for you, at the time. Now, when you look back on it, you see much more than what you did then. It's all a part of the discovery process that we go through after our break ups - this is healthy.
Cognitive dissonance is a theory that digs into thought patterns. Understanding our behavior and the thoughts we had during our relationship and after is a part of the detachment process. If we don't take a look at what we were thinking, at the time, we are going to have a hard time progressing through the stages. It takes time and working with a therapist is a good thing. I would encourage you to bring this topic up with your T the next time you visit them.
Quote from: Samsara121 on March 31, 2014, 04:33:43 AM
I bless this short r/s with my ex- for it has giving me the strength and will to go learn more about myself.
Good to hear.
As is said many times here, each person in the relationship is responsible for their own behavior. If we look back at our own behaviors and cannot see a different path that we could have taken, we may very well repeat the same behavior going forward. Using the theory of cognitive dissonance can help explain options so that we can make better choices that align with our values on a day to day basis.
Logged
“The path to heaven doesn't lie down in flat miles. It's in the imagination with which you perceive this world, and the gestures with which you honor it." ~ Mary Oliver
fromheeltoheal
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: Broken up, I left her
Posts: 5642
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #14 on:
March 31, 2014, 10:28:03 AM »
Quote from: Want2know on March 31, 2014, 07:14:20 AM
I do want to say that you may think you didn't have choices, at the time, when in fact you did. There are a variety of ways how you could have responded. What you chose was what you thought was the best choice for you, at the time. Now, when you look back on it, you see much more than what you did then. It's all a part of the discovery process that we go through after our break ups - this is healthy.
I just got major flashbacks around this. In the beginning I was setting good boundaries, bringing up things that were issues for me, seeing multiple options in situations, and at some point, or probably gradually, I gave all that away and became reactive. Needy, susceptible, longing, I went into defensive mode, trying to get back where we were. Why did I do that?
One major reason is the relationship moved way too fast, I got in deep emotionally before we really knew each other; again, that neediness opened the door to having boundaries busted. An adjustment I've used since is to slow way down, use share-check-share, open up a little and notice what I'm getting, and some relationships haven't got off the ground as a result, a good move.
But you know what? It's OK to be a little insecure, especially in significant relationships, in fact some people find it an endearing quality. I'm not going to change who I am, expressing vulnerability is courage in action, and the only piece that would have helped would have been to notice what I'm getting and shut it down early if it turns out I was expressing that vulnerability to someone who doesn't have my best interests at heart. What else matters? I've decided to let fly with who I am, notice what I'm getting (that's new), and remove people who aren't accepting and supportive. Also, biggie, also new, don't make the assumption that I'm the one doing something wrong when someone doesn't respect that vulnerability; if someone isn't going to treat me with respect and accept me the way I am, that's OK, just move on to those who will, and that says nothing about who I am.
Logged
Skip
Site Director
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 7031
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #15 on:
March 31, 2014, 12:18:46 PM »
Quote from: fromheeltoheal on March 31, 2014, 10:28:03 AM
One major reason is the relationship moved way too fast, I got in deep emotionally before we really knew each other; again, that neediness opened the door to having boundaries busted.
Good observation, fromheeltoheal. You are on the right track and delving into the "Change perception of action"
Let me push it forward a bit. Would you agree with all (maybe most) of this or some derivation of this upedit of your comments?
One major reason is that I moved way too fast, I got in deep emotionally before we really knew each other; again, that my neediness opened the door to my accepting destructive behaviors that I knew I shouldn't accept and that I were not improving despite my efforts to resolve them.
1. In the future I will not not allow myself to become needy in a relationship - I need to
learn
understand the difference between a dependent relationship and building and interdependent relationship and there are important aspects of this at every stage in a relationship. I see this now. This last relationship helped me realize that I did not have a good grasp on what a healthy relationship is.
2. Growth and self-awareness in relationships often comes from the partners challenging each others. I need to
develop
solid communication and relationship skills needed to make these challenges constructive, not destructive on my end. How I handle adversity in the relationship is a critical factor to success. I see this now. This last relationship helped me realize that I didn't understand how to be emotionally intelligent and not get caught up in drama.
3. I need to know when to let go and be strong enough to do it - even the best relationship can have make a wrong turn and encounter insurmountable challenges. Some relationship can be salvaged. Some can't. I see this now. This last relationship helped me realize that good mental health means I must
be stronger
and willing to make some very hard decisions.
Logged
fromheeltoheal
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: Broken up, I left her
Posts: 5642
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #16 on:
March 31, 2014, 02:52:12 PM »
Quote from: Skip on March 31, 2014, 12:18:46 PM
Quote from: fromheeltoheal on March 31, 2014, 10:28:03 AM
One major reason is the relationship moved way too fast, I got in deep emotionally before we really knew each other; again, that neediness opened the door to having boundaries busted.
Good observation, fromheeltoheal. You are on the right track and delving into the "Change perception of action"
Let me push it forward a bit. Would you agree with all (maybe most) of this or some derivation of this upedit of your comments?
One major reason is that I moved way too fast, I got in deep emotionally before we really knew each other; again, that my neediness opened the door to my accepting destructive behaviors that I knew I shouldn't accept and that I were not improving despite my efforts to resolve them.
1. In the future I will not not allow myself to become needy in a relationship - I need to
learn
understand the difference between a dependent relationship and building and interdependent relationship and their are important aspects if this at every stage in a relationship. I see this now. This last relationship helped me realize that I did not have a good grasp on what a healthy relationship is.
2. Growth and self-awareness in relationships often comes from the partners challenging each others. I need to
develop
solid communication and relationship skills needed to make these challenges constructive, not destructive on my end. How I handle adversity in the relationship is a critical factor to success. I see this now. This last relationship helped me realize that I didn't understand how to be emotionally intelligent and not get caught up in drama.
3. I need to know when to let go and be strong enough to do it - even the best relationship can have make a wrong turn and encounter insurmountable challenges. Some relationship can be salvaged. Some can't. I see this now. This last relationship helped me realize that good mental health means I must
be stronger
and willing to make some very hard decisions.
Thanks Skip. Learn, develop, be stronger. Yep, that's where I'm at.
Honestly I went into the relationship to be 'saved', to have someone, a very experienced someone, take care of me emotionally, not the best stance to take I now realize, and also honestly, the relationship never had a chance from day 1, although I forged ahead anyway, focusing on making it work with her. Turns out it was unworkable.
I'm still confused about the line between needy and turning to someone for emotional support. I think I know what a healthy relationship is or should be, granted I got lost in that last one, but getting, and giving, emotional support is one of the reasons we get into relationships, and maybe each partner is needy some of the time and that's OK. Dunno, still processing, but I do know I never would have gotten my needs met in that last one.
Be stronger. Fck. Always be stronger. I gave that relationship 120% and still got my ass kicked, of course she's disordered and it never would have worked, but just how fcking strong do I need to be all the time? The right relationship will make me stronger, is my hallucination, and the wrong one will kick my ass. I don't have a problem helping someone when they need it, do it frequently, and when is it OK to turn to someone for support? Obviously being all take and no give is unhealthy, I wouldn't do that anyway, and that last one was all give and no take on my part, also unhealthy. I got lost for a while in that relationship, maybe 5 months, but there was a point where I'd had enough and I took my power back, demanded a much more equal partnership, and the relationship ended immediately; she was having none of that. I see that as health and strength the long way around, but I got there eventually. Stronger. Dammit.
Thanks for the post.
Logged
Conundrum
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 316
Re: Are you struggling with cognitive dissonance?
«
Reply #17 on:
March 31, 2014, 03:06:41 PM »
Many good points. I'm unclear whether my perception regarding dissonance is correct, but for me the primary dissonance occurred after many years of being with her. It was when I realized that the prior relatively stable long-term relationship was no longer stable. It was very difficult to wrap my mind around that dissonant feeling, because (at first) it seemed unfathomable. By accepting that the disorder manifests itself in such a specific manner, enabled letting go of illusion, which at that time was the desire for a certain type of attachment with her.
That dissonant feeling left when I accepted her for who she is. When untreated and on substances--she is an unstable, impulsive woman, but still endearing and often protective of our former relationship. She's someone who I happen to know very well. Simply a kaleidoscope person, and not necessarily traditional relationship material. It helped me greatly to harmonize that dissonance, because shaming her, or being a hater gets to be a drag.
She's very quirky. For example, after not speaking with or seeing her for a couple of months, she texts asking to come by late this past Saturday night, and gives me these gifts of little beaded animals she's been creating when tweaking. What can one say to that? It's almost child-like, and her way of showing she's thinking about me.
Harmonizing the dissonance with radical acceptance (for me) are conjoined.
Logged
Want2know
Retired Staff
Offline
Gender:
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 2934
Re: Are you struggling with cognitive dissonance?
«
Reply #18 on:
March 31, 2014, 06:27:05 PM »
Quote from: Conundrum on March 31, 2014, 03:06:41 PM
Harmonizing the dissonance with radical acceptance (for me) are conjoined.
What you did was take in new information regarding the disorder and change your perception. That is a good example of resolving your dissonance in a mature, healthy way. One of the primary goals of our site is to use it as a learning tool to improve your emotional well-being. It sounds like you are on the right path.
Logged
“The path to heaven doesn't lie down in flat miles. It's in the imagination with which you perceive this world, and the gestures with which you honor it." ~ Mary Oliver
DreamGirl
Retired Staff
Offline
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner’s ex
Posts: 4016
Do. Or do not. There is no try.
Re: Cognitive Dissonance: The Fox and the Grapes
«
Reply #19 on:
March 31, 2014, 07:21:04 PM »
Quote from: willy45 on March 31, 2014, 01:36:35 AM
She is to BLAME. Not me. I tried to stick it out. What I need to work on is boundaries, because yes, I stayed for way, way, way too long. But her behavior it NOT MY FAULT.
I guess what worries me about this post it that what kept us stuck in the relationship was the over acceptance of blame (at least that's what seems to be a pattern).
As part of the Healing Process, there is validity in saying the other person's behavior is "not our fault".
I also think it's important not to let the pendulum swing entirely the other way and say that the issues in the relationship were
"ALL her fault".
That kind of thinking is the same [faulty] thinking that lent you to repeat to yourself the mantra
"this is ALL my fault".
I don't think the absence of your accountability is the answer in this and very well may be the same kind of thinking.
It's OK to be mad. It's OK to start taking inquiry about what role she played and which parts you played. It wasn't all your fault. It wasn't all her fault either though. This kind of blame shifting isn't a very helpful coping skill.
I watched a marriage bootcamp show recently where both relationship partners assigned blame in different issues within the marriage (communication, financial, attention, validation, etc.) - most couples were very busy pointing fingers and in some instances, some were accepting the responsibility. At the end of the exercise, the lesson that the therapist revealed - to everyone's surprise - was that
all
the responsibility of the issues in these failing relationships were
equally
distributed to both parties.
It's not black and white (since it can not possibly be my fault then it must be hers), so we must find ourselves in the greyer areas. Otherwise we are thinking like "the Fox" here, blaming it on the sour grapes. Another way of not doing the hard task of facing our very own failures.
It's about stepping outside these feelings of hurt (and the coping skill of blame) and recognizing the role of both parties in the relationship. Not just the one that's easier to criticize.
Logged
"What I want is what I've not got, and what I need is all around me." ~Dave Matthews
Can You Help Us Stay on the Air in 2024?
Pages: [
1
]
Go Up
Print
BPDFamily.com
>
Relationship Partner with BPD (Straight and LGBT+)
>
Romantic Relationship | Detaching and Learning after a Failed Relationship
> Topic:
Are you struggling with cognitive dissonance?
« previous
next »
Jump to:
Please select a destination:
-----------------------------
Help Desk
-----------------------------
===> Open board
-----------------------------
Relationship Partner with BPD (Straight and LGBT+)
-----------------------------
=> Romantic Relationship | Bettering a Relationship or Reversing a Breakup
=> Romantic Relationship | Conflicted About Continuing, Divorcing/Custody, Co-parenting
=> Romantic Relationship | Detaching and Learning after a Failed Relationship
-----------------------------
Children, Parents, or Relatives with BPD
-----------------------------
=> Son, Daughter or Son/Daughter In-law with BPD
=> Parent, Sibling, or In-law Suffering from BPD
-----------------------------
Community Built Knowledge Base
-----------------------------
=> Library: Psychology questions and answers
=> Library: Tools and skills workshops
=> Library: Book Club, previews and discussions
=> Library: Video, audio, and pdfs
=> Library: Content to critique for possible feature articles
=> Library: BPDFamily research surveys
Our 2023 Financial Sponsors
We are all appreciative of the members who provide the funding to keep BPDFamily on the air.
12years
alterK
AskingWhy
At Bay
Cat Familiar
CoherentMoose
drained1996
EZEarache
Flora and Fauna
ForeverDad
Gemsforeyes
Goldcrest
Harri
healthfreedom4s
hope2727
khibomsis
Lemon Squeezy
Memorial Donation (4)
Methos
Methuen
Mommydoc
Mutt
P.F.Change
Penumbra66
Red22
Rev
SamwizeGamgee
Skip
Swimmy55
Tartan Pants
Turkish
whirlpoollife
Loading...