He asked me to "fix" things...

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

As some of you may know I am LC with my xpwBPD.  We don’t see each other but occasionally exchange a text or two.  I’ve rejected all recycling attempts since last January.  LC works for me.  In fact, with every conversation we have I receive further validation in terms of I “finally” made the right decision to leave him; that he is seriously disordered, still in denial and will never get well.  In the meantime, I continue to work on my own personal stuff like codependency, detachment issues and the fact that I am a nurturer and fixer.

During our last little texting session he mentioned two things.  Keep in mind that he is in total denial and refuses to believe he is disordered in anyway despite the fact that he meets the Borderline criteria with flying colors, is ADD, is addicted to Rx pain meds, marijuana and alcohol.  First, and this is a direct quote, “Give my T access to yours if u wanna fix it you will!  So. Bye”  I have not responded to that request as I am not a “fixer” anymore.  I cannot help him fix himself and I can no longer to fix the relationship nor will I try.  What I can do is try to fix myself.  I am committed to concentrating on myself, healing and moving on with my life.  If he needs things fixed he needs to fix himself first.

Secondly, he finally hinted as to where he was receiving therapy.  Turns out this is a mental health facility and only treats patients in crisis who have been referred to them via an emergency room or a health professional.  I believe he is in some sort of outpatient program.  I'm not sure how long he's been there.  My therapist is the former director of this world renowned hospital.   She’s in private practice now and works with family members or loved ones of PD individuals.  I asked him what he did in therapy; have they told you their concerns, have you had an MRI, are you in DBT therapy?  No answer, of course.

So, my question is and I welcome all kinds of advice is:  Would it be a wise idea for me to allow his therapist to talk to mine?  He has no idea who my therapist is.  I really don’t have any qualms about it and feel if it helps him in some way that would be a good thing.  Again, I have no intention of recycling this relationship as is and am not even sure if or how much I even love him anymore.  On the other hand, I sometimes think that if he is in the appropriate program, accepts and is committed to working on his disorder with an experienced professional I may be open to "meeting"  the healthier him some day. 

[LilMissSunshine]

As some of you may know I am LC with my xpwBPD.  We don’t see each other but occasionally exchange a text or two.  I’ve rejected all recycling attempts since last January.  LC works for me.  In fact, with every conversation we have I receive further validation in terms of I “finally” made the right decision to leave him; that he is seriously disordered, still in denial and will never get well.  In the meantime, I continue to work on my own personal stuff like codependency, detachment issues and the fact that I am a nurturer and fixer.

During our last little texting session he mentioned two things.  Keep in mind that he is in total denial and refuses to believe he is disordered in anyway despite the fact that he meets the Borderline criteria with flying colors, is ADD, is addicted to Rx pain meds, marijuana and alcohol.  First, and this is a direct quote, “Give my T access to yours if u wanna fix it you will!  So. Bye”  I have not responded to that request as I am not a “fixer” anymore.  I cannot help him fix himself and I can no longer to fix the relationship nor will I try.  What I can do is try to fix myself.  I am committed to concentrating on myself, healing and moving on with my life.  If he needs things fixed he needs to fix himself first.

Secondly, he finally hinted as to where he was receiving therapy.  Turns out this is a mental health facility and only treats patients in crisis who have been referred to them via an emergency room or a health professional.  I believe he is in some sort of outpatient program.  I'm not sure how long he's been there.  My therapist is the former director of this world renowned hospital.   She’s in private practice now and works with family members or loved ones of PD individuals.  I asked him what he did in therapy; have they told you their concerns, have you had an MRI, are you in DBT therapy?  No answer, of course.

So, my question is and I welcome all kinds of advice is:  Would it be a wise idea for me to allow his therapist to talk to mine?  He has no idea who my therapist is.  I really don’t have any qualms about it and feel if it helps him in some way that would be a good thing.  Again, I have no intention of recycling this relationship as is and am not even sure if or how much I even love him anymore.  On the other hand, I sometimes think that if he is in the appropriate program, accepts and is committed to working on his disorder with an experienced professional I may be open to "meeting"  the healthier him some day. 

[thinkingthinking]

To be completely honest with you, I see absolutely no value in having your therapists talk, and think your therapist would tell you the same.  You have completely different issues that you are working through, but both come down to being able to independently love and value yourself before being in a relationship with another person.

I say this as someone that was in a manipulative relationship for a very long time, and just encourage you to be very careful of the emotional manipulation that may pull you in.  Take care of yourself first!

It is a difficult journey, and honestly it is sometimes lonely. But you can get through it!

[talithacumi]

... . I am not a “fixer” anymore.  I cannot help him fix himself and I can no longer to fix the relationship nor will I try.  

But here you are - checking into where he only hinted he was getting counseling, speculating on what brought him there/what kind of program he might be in/how long he's been there, and wondering if you should allow his therapist to talk to yours on the off chance it might help him.

It's normal to be worried/concerned when someone we love is in crisis, having problems, and acting out in some of the ways you've described. And it's hard to resist the temptation/desire to want to do something to make that stop for both of you. But the crisis/problems are his, and acting out like he does is probably the only way he's learned how to maybe get it to stop. He's entitled to do that. You're entitled not to respond/reinforce that pattern anymore - for him and, most importantly, for yourself as well.

It took me a long time to separate my ex-upwBPD's problems from my mine. To see that my problem, in a case like this, was how uncomfortable I was with my own feelings: the stress and anxiety that accompanies being worried/concerned, of course - but also the guilt, shame, and self-doubt of having finally put my own needs/desires/safety ahead of his, set some boundaries, and left him to deal with all the problems I knew he had all by himself for a change.

It's hard, I know, but if possible, find a place where you feel really safe and just try to sit with/allow yourself to actually feel all those things.

If nothing else, at least notice how often and how insistently your thoughts keep shifting back to fixing the cause of the problem so you don't have to feel them - and ask yourself why it's so obviously not okay for you to just feel those things.

As to whether or not it's a good idea to allow his therapist to talk to yours - that's entirely up to you. So long as you don't think it will negatively effect you in any way, I don't see why it should matter although you might want to talk with your therapist about how it maybe possibly could before you make a final decision.

In the meantime, I continue to work on my own personal stuff like codependency, detachment issues and the fact that I am a nurturer and fixer.

So do that. Keep the focus on yourself. That's all I'm saying.

You're doing a great job!

[learnedthehardway]

My advice, don't have any contact at all.

You need to get better on your own. By carrying on with your own life you send the message that his behavior will drive people away. And having any contact, even through therapists, I don't feel will help you, only create more focus on him.


I understand where your coming from, but it is best to detach yourself... .

[Pecator]

I don't see this as keeping connected. These would be two health professionals consulting.

If your therapist is good and trustworthy, you can let her/him make that decision. I would leave it to them and not worry.

just a personal perspective. I know my T would make a better decision re something like this far better than I could.

And, WOW, you seem to be on an incredible path! congrats to you. I really appreciate how you address your own issues, especially how you embrace your codependency. It helps me to hear others speak well of that. I am trying to embrace it myself, but still a bit too defensive!

[LilMissSunshine]

Thank you Learnedthehardway n thinkingthinking.  I was leaning that way.  But... . I'm still so confused about this "request".

And Pecator, such wise words and thanks for the compliments.  I'm trying so hard!  And, yes I waiver between the two posts above and exactly what your thoughts are.

Talithacumi... . do you think even considering this on my part is "fixing" or "helping".  Do you think there is a difference between the two?  I believe I've come a long way in separating our "issues", perhaps not?  Ugh!

[talithacumi]

No, I don't think even considering all this is you fixing/helping him. Not at all.

I think you've decided, committed yourself to, and are trying really hard not to do that anymore - which is not only a huge, wonderful, very positive step for you to be taking, but also why you're having trouble deciding what to do about the request he made.

My post was intended to point out some of the more insidious patterns of thinking/reacting that led me - and maybe you - to be a fixer/helper in the first place - and to offer alternatives that might be more supportive of you as a person and the changes you're trying so hard to manifest in yourself right now.

The only right answer is the answer that's right for you. You're doing the best you can. Analyzing the pros/cons. Asking for advice. Considering your options. I have no doubt, once you make a decision, that it will be the right one for you in that moment, at that time - and, for that reason, regardless of what you decide, you'll have my support.

Big cyberhug.

- TC

[Skip]

LC works for me.  In fact, with every conversation we have I receive further validation in terms of I “finally” made the right decision to leave him; that he is seriously disordered, still in denial and will never get well.

This has to be confusing for both of you... . lots of mixed messages and push and pull from both sides... . fighting, blaming, recycling, splitting, establishing conditions to recycle, more fighting, negotiating, etc

After many ignored texts on my part I finally responded with the conditional, "get yourself into therapy for  your addictions and PD, or we have nothing left to talk about".  So much more but that's the jist of it.

Is he doing what you asked for?

Having coordinated professional oversight probably makes sense at this point - sparing and negotiating for 5 months is a long time - maybe the therapists can oversee the next communications or reconnection via a supervised joint session.  Having oversight to keep the conversations constructive and honest makes sense.

Whether you try again or end it forever, the way you both have been communicating is not healthy or constructive. Right?

Why not try something different?

[ugghh]

Breslin,

The "request" sounds like a classic Charm move - he is trying to guilt you into taking ownership for his behavior.

In fact, with every conversation we have I receive further validation in terms of I “finally” made the right decision to leave him; that he is seriously disordered, still in denial and will never get well. 

That is clear thinking on your part, which I am sure is much easier without the entanglement of the relationship.  You said you are seeing a counselor on your own and it sounds like making good progress.  I will revert to a metaphor I have used before, that of being on a plane and putting on your own oxygen mask before you put one on your child.  If you are trying to put on his mask before yours is secure there is a great chance that neither of you will be able to breathe.

I have struggled mightily with my stbx uBPDw and her threats of suicide.  Like yourself and many members of this board I too am a fixer/helper.  May I ask what you would do if your best friend had a brain tumor with a 1% chance of survival?   Would you offer to perform brain surgery?  Yes I am being purposely dramatic.  However I think odds of a non-professional truly helping a BPD are probably similar.  In my case I have had to accept that my stbx may indeed act on one of her many threats of suicide, and I have also had to accept that ultimately she owns that behavior and not me.