Does BPD get worse if not treated?

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

I was just wondering if BPD could manifest itself if not treated... could it cause other problems, get worse?

[Banshee]

I was just wondering if BPD could manifest itself if not treated... could it cause other problems, get worse?

[Turkish]

I was just wondering if BPD could manifest itself if not treated... could it cause other problems, get worse?

That's a broad question... . could you be more specific?

I became the biggest trigger for my uBPDx (well, the situation of being in a mature r/s with two little kids, a mortgage, two careers... . ). It got way worse after D2 was born. So she ran, and seems to be doing well now. So in this case, her BPD traits receded. She told me she was actually expecting the worse, and a huge emotional storm after she left me (with the inference that it was ok, and she would get through it somehow, self defeating talk, like she had no control). I keep as LC as I can as a co-parent, but I think she is doing ok for now. I'll actually have to spend time with her in the morning looking at schools for S4. The new, younger, immature guy isn't as triggering, apparently. She is having the fun as a half time mom that she wanted to have with me, but I wasn't going to abandon our kids to do that. Partying, clubbing, and feeding her love addiction are coping mechanisms that keep her negative emotions at bay. Perhaps my replacement is more on her emotional level, whereas I was obviously the Parent/Father to her. Based upon the writings I found from her to him, I'd say my assessment is accurate. Very junior high schoolish. So let her be happy for now. She'll never have to have as 3 dimensional r/s as she did with me with anyone every again. If that's all she can handle, and if it keeps her relatively emotionally stable as the mother of my children, then that's ok.

I am pretty sure she quite counseling, but I won't ask.

[Banshee]

That's a broad question... . could you be more specific?

Does it get worse with age ,could it cause another illness  along with BPD?

I became the biggest trigger for my uBPDx (well, the situation of being in a mature r/s with two little kids, a mortgage, two careers... . ). It got way worse after D2 was born. So she ran, and seems to be doing well now. So in this case, her BPD traits receded

Your reply is kinda what I'm asking... Do you think she could get to the place she was with you with the new guy?

I'm just wondering if it can be like alzheimer's?

[Turkish]

That's a broad question... . could you be more specific?

Does it get worse with age ,could it cause another illness  along with BPD?

I've read that it can lessen with age. We get members here, however, who have the opposite experience with both mates and parents.

I became the biggest trigger for my uBPDx (well, the situation of being in a mature r/s with two little kids, a mortgage, two careers... . ). It got way worse after D2 was born. So she ran, and seems to be doing well now. So in this case, her BPD traits receded

Your reply is kinda what I'm asking... Do you think she could get to the place she was with you with the new guy?

The same situation? No. He's immature even for his age, and unless his family has money, they'll never be able to afford a home. She also "fixed" herself to never have kids, so that burden he will never have to bear, being a father (at least with her). Though she has grown in some ways through this experience, or more aware of her abandonment issues and the like, shes' reverted to what is comfortable. Still, two bfs before me, the one guy she totally idealized like she is the current one (I never got that, I never bought into the teen romance  that she tried to play on me at first), she drove away due to her anger issues. When we were still talking about my replacement back in October, she said that he had already noticed her anger, and asked her about it (I guess this is where I failed, I shut down and didn't want to deal with it due to my FOO issues). So one could say that BPD is still in there (of course, she's resisted therapy for years, only just now delving into her childhood issues), her anger may have been more easily triggered by him due to the stress of still living in the house with me and the kids. I perceive her temper with the kids has lessened. So I have accepted that their r/s could last quite a while, especially if they don't move in together. She wants the unrestrained (and unprotected, foolishly, since the guy was already sleeping around on campus) sex and the fun on her off-mom time, and she's getting it. Coping. It may be what she can handle. That's my radical acceptance of the situation for now. The storm will come later, I am sure, but I am enjoying some peace for the first time in years. Being a parent to S2 and D2, rather than also D32.

I'm just wondering if it can be like Alzheimer's?

While there is mostly likely differences in brain structure due to living so long with the PD (we'll leave aside where it "spontaneously" arises in otherwise healthy families, because that does happen), I'm not sure that it is deterioration, per se. It's an emotional regulation disorder, among other things. They feel the same emotions we do, but more intensely, and often uncontrollably. What helped me detach more, and I can't believe I didn't realize this until the last month, is that love is also an emotion. I was too focused on the anger and depression, and missed the obvious. She couldn't control her love. She told me near the end, "what if this happens again?" And "maybe this had to happen." She was telling me that she had no control over it.

[corraline]

In the case of my ex, he is 61 and has been doing alot of therapy including emdr. I did not see alot of positive change in the three plus years i was with him.  In fact he got worse especially at the very end.    If they are being treated effectively I would imagine that their coping skills would help them deal with their disorder.

I would imagine that a professional who understands BPD may have a better answer than myself.

[Banshee]

Thank you all so much... it makes more sense to me now... I guess watching him get angrier  and pulling away more often I thought it was getting worse.

but with what Turkish said if you become their major trigger it could possibly make the BPD more intense, on the other hand corraline said her ex got a bit better with age.

Perhaps Just like each individual  person with BPD is different... so is their intensity  ... hope I understood that correctly...

Thank you dearly

[Turkish]

Thank you all so much... it makes more sense to me now... I guess watching him get angrier  and pulling away more often I thought it was getting worse.

but with what Turkish said if you become their major trigger it could possibly make the BPD more intense, on the other hand corraline said her ex got a bit better with age.

Perhaps Just like each individual  person with BPD is different... so is their intensity  ... hope I understood that correctly...

Thank you dearly

Yes, the disorder lies on a spectrum, and some here were attached to people who would likely be sub-clinical. My BPD-lite mom, for example, who is diagnosed with depression (all but incapacitating, I would say), and is a massive hoarder, which indicates fear of loss (there is that attachment thing again). We tend to demonize many of our Exes, and in some of the extreme cases, I think that is justified. But its good to step back when we are able from our own pain and realize that they are people, too.

[Ihope2]

Perhaps this depends on a lot of other factors, such as:

* How dysfunctional was the pwBPD's childhood on a scale from 0 - 10 (a lot of abuse, invalidation, emotional / physical harm done to them)?

* How much self-awareness and insight does the pwBPD have on a scale from 0 - 10 (moments of clarity? Or completely defensive and unreasonable and believing they are always right and others always wrong?)?

* How dysfunctional has their adult life been to date, how much further trauma and damaging experiences have they been involved in, for eg.  major substance abuse, involvement in crime, involved in highly dysfunctional and inappropriate relationships, prostitution, etc?

* Perhaps there is also a spectrum of light through mild to moderate and severe BPD?  It would obviously take more to be treated for severe BPD than light BPD?

In my own experience with my almost exBPDh, I also think that I became a major trigger for him to go into full-blown BPD behaviours, feelings and thoughts most of the time.  I started getting the idea, that he would actually be better off without me in his life, in fact, without anybody close at all.  The closer and more intimate he gets with a "love object", the more his BPD flares up and takes over.  When he can just operate on the surface of life, and have superficial interactions with people who remain acquaintances, and are willing to listen to his ' "down and out" ex-heroin addict come clean' story and give him donations and encourage and praise him, then I think he manages to cope a lot better.  When he is in a close relationship, I think his "toxic shame" about himself, his conviction that he is a "bad person" and a failure at everything, gets activated.  It must be unbearable for him to have to suppress this toxic shame on a daily basis.  I could see that it was tearing him apart in our short-lived marriage. So much so that he landed up in a psychiatric hospital three times within 11 months.  Ostensibly because he was going "manic" (he was also diagnosed with Bipolar Mood Disorder).  But, I think he was unable to bear his intense fluctuating emotions of shame, fear, abandonment, self-loathing, anger, rage, sadness, etc.  And being in a close relationship with me was activating all these feelings for him.

I don't think he was ready to face any of it.  What he did tell me of his life story and his childhood was horrendous stuff, filled with abuse, torture, incest, humiliation... .

So, in the case of my almost exBPDh, I kind of think he will be "better off" not being in a close, adult relationship with anyone.  If he can continue drifting through life, making acquaintances and relying on charity, and not having to step up to the plate and have adult relationships, where things are 50 -50, I think he will just drift along in his own world and not get better, but not get any worse.

[Lucky Jim]

Fair question, Banshee.  In my experience, BPD can get significantly worse over time.  I can't say whether treatment could have alleviated my BPDxW's symptoms, because she repeatedly dropped out of therapy when the tough issues came up, citing some silly excuse such as she didn't "like" the therapist after initially singing his/her praises (typical BPD black and white thinking).  Undoubtedly I was a "trigger," but so were all the others with whom she got into conflicts: neighbors, honest friends, landlords, etc.  In my observation, the effects of BPD were definitely heightened in the latter years of our marriage.  LuckyJim