Are there red flags about us?

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

I'm with you, Infared. There's little to no 50/50 in most of the stories here.

When any r/s falls apart, one person is usually more the reason why.

These aren't normal interactions. The dishonesty, for one, is entrenched.

BPD is hungry for relationships. It devours them and sh!ts them out. Again and again and again. It can't help it. And it also chooses not to.

Being honest with ourselves shows us who we were, are, and can be.

If you're sure you did your best, you did. Be proud of that. Keep doing it.

[myself]

I'm with you, Infared. There's little to no 50/50 in most of the stories here.

When any r/s falls apart, one person is usually more the reason why.

These aren't normal interactions. The dishonesty, for one, is entrenched.

BPD is hungry for relationships. It devours them and sh!ts them out. Again and again and again. It can't help it. And it also chooses not to.

Being honest with ourselves shows us who we were, are, and can be.

If you're sure you did your best, you did. Be proud of that. Keep doing it.

[Tausk]

I'm with you, Infared. There's little to no 50/50 in most of the stories here.

When any r/s falls apart, one person is usually more the reason why.

These aren't normal interactions. The dishonesty, for one, is entrenched.

BPD is hungry for relationships. It devours them and sh!ts them out. Again and again and again. It can't help it. And it also chooses not to.

Being honest with ourselves shows us who we were, are, and can be.

If you're sure you did your best, you did. Be proud of that. Keep doing it.

And this is where I disagree with you and Infared.

Yes, our exes were manipulative, lying, con artists whose actions are sociopathic.  But I need to take equal responsibility because I invited the Disorder into my life.

Example:  If I walk into a blind alley in a very dangerous part of the city, in the middle of the night, and I start to yell that I have a lot of cash on me... .Whose fault is it that I was robbed.  

Same thing with being swindled.  Swindlers will tell you that they don't just target everyone. They target people who want what they have to offer.  And then it's just a matter of mirroring, projection and execution.

My ex mirrored my idealized self, projected what I believed to be love, and I invited the Disorder into my life.

It's like Vampires.  They can only come in when invited.  

I invited the Vampire in.  But I can rescind that invitation.

[myself]

It's like Vampires.  They can only come in when invited.  

I invited the Vampire in.  But I can rescind that invitation.

Did you know she was a vampire when you let her in?

That sounds truly ghastly. Why would you have done that?

I didn't. When I started to see it, I tried making sense of it.

Tried to help her, because I loved and cared for her.

Tried to get out, but found I was addicted.

Looked in the mirror, saw I wasn't one myself, and finally woke up.

I also didn't go looking to get mugged. It was more of an ambush.

You may have played more of a role in your r/s troubles than others.

Every story here is different, despite certain similarities.

[Tausk]

It's like Vampires.  They can only come in when invited.  

I invited the Vampire in.  But I can rescind that invitation.

Did you know she was a vampire when you let her in?

That sounds truly ghastly. Why would you have done that?

I didn't. When I started to see it, I tried making sense of it.

Tried to help her, because I loved and cared for her.

Tried to get out, but found I was addicted.

Looked in the mirror, saw I wasn't one myself, and finally woke up.

I also didn't go looking to get mugged. It was more of an ambush.

You may have played more of a role in your r/s troubles than others.

Every story here is different, despite certain similarities.

Absolutely true.  But the fact is that by the time all the really bad stuff was occurring, I should have been gone literally years ago.   But I chose to stay.  And my growth and self respect and understanding comes from determining why I chose to stay.

Why I let myself lose myself to the Disorder.  Why I invited the Disorder into my life. 

No, I did not know it was the Disorder.  But I was vulnerable to the Disorder for some very distinct reasons.   The patterns on this board are so disturbingly similar.  And the prescribed behavior for recovery is self reflection. 

So I have to assume that my recovery also fits the patterns and follow the advice. 

Otherwise, I remain a victim for the rest of my life.  And in reality, I was a volunteer. 

Altruistic/Closet Narcissism is still Narcissism.  But it can be treated. 

Be well.

T

[Caredverymuch]

It's like Vampires.  They can only come in when invited.  

I invited the Vampire in.  But I can rescind that invitation.

Did you know she was a vampire when you let her in?

That sounds truly ghastly. Why would you have done that?

I didn't. When I started to see it, I tried making sense of it.

Tried to help her, because I loved and cared for her.

Tried to get out, but found I was addicted.

Looked in the mirror, saw I wasn't one myself, and finally woke up.

I also didn't go looking to get mugged. It was more of an ambush.

You may have played more of a role in your r/s troubles than others.

Every story here is different, despite certain similarities.

Myself, this is very much my story. Almost word for word.

[myself]

None of us are 100% victim, or unaccountable.

But also, vulnerable doesn't always equal culpable.

Self reflection is key. And then of course the follow through.

[Caredverymuch]

None of us are 100% victim, or unaccountable.

But also, vulnerable doesn't always equal culpable.

Self reflection is key. And then of course the follow through.

More good insight, myself. And to go from being vulnerable, as our ex's so heavily portrayed themselves to be, to us here being left culpable for our caring is hard.

[Tausk]

None of us are 100% victim, or unaccountable.

But also, vulnerable doesn't always equal culpable.

Self reflection is key. And then of course the follow through.

Vulnerable doesn't always equal culpable.  But in my case is it at least partially responsible.  My lack of self esteem often is reflected in my desire to help.  

If I can rescue, I am worthy.

If I can rescue and be loved, I am worthy of being loved.  

And this is part of the pain of being abandoned.  

I have to move to point of:  I am worthy of being loved.   No conditional "if" in the front of that statement.

I don't believe that we are that far apart.  I just know for me, and by observing others on the board,  taking a "victim" position on this board is one of the maladaptive modes of ex partners that keeps us stuck.  

Many partners don't recovery from the interaction.  Their lives are forever damaged by the Disorder.  Being a perpetual victim is a possible consequence.  And even dabbling in self pitying victimology can be very dangerous for me.  I can easily move into that mode, because that relieves me of the responsibility of leaning into my pain.

Boo Hoo... .I can't do anything about my pain because it was all her fault.

And to rephrase, No didn't know that she was a Vampire when I invited her into my life, but I sure as heck knew that she wasn't real.  And deep down I knew that she had no reflection in a mirror, because she was the mirror.  

I was just so lonely that I was willing to believe the fantasy had come to life.  Just like my child fantasies.  

[Turkish]

What are red flags... .those a propective partner might see in us? Most, if not all, of us, are Rescuers, even white Knights. Our bonds with pwBPD are understandable. Mine was not the first, though the only new I'll ever have kids with.

So is it anything obvious? No. Not really. I've been told by healthy women that I'm "good with girls."  maybe.

Speaking for myself, I've always been attracted to unhealthy women. I exorcised them from my life, then met uBPDx, and forgot. Entered into the typical r/s which we all know.

So what is my  ?

Nothing obvious at all. My mm recently revealed to me that she was unofficially diagnosed with BPD over 20 years ago. Mind. Blown.

I wish she had told me that years ago, but it may have made no difference.

Can I split? Yes. Do I rescue like my mom still does unhealthy people? Yes. Or at least I did for years. You know what you know, and don't know what you don't know

I know now, in spades. I thought I knew myself, and was aware, but I really wasn't. I am now.

Where do I go from here?

[Tolou]

I know I cant predict the future, so there was no way I knew what storm was ahead when I met her, BPD or not.

However, when knowing and seeing and choosing to remain in the relationship, that lies all within me, if I project the blame on someone else, how does it make me different?

How can I expect someone to be sorry or say sorry, when they never have>? Or to take responsibility for something, that they do not believe is their fault?

No one held a gun to my head to stay or go, luckily for me, I walked after 6 months. I couldn't see myself living that way any longer, nor do I believe she would have made it, as she came close to actually completing her 3rd of 3 suicide attempts in less than 6 weeks because I feel she knew, I would walk away, she was right!

I am far from happy about the ultimate demise of what I wanted things to be and what occured, but I am content that I tried very hard with all my heart and limited knowledge of what was going in that time and place to just be there and help, yet it was not working, couldn't get through.  That was the problem, the disconnect, no longer will I attempt to make something rational out of something that is irrational.  Redflags, yeah, I have some, who doesn't?  But the white flag was most important for me, not for giving up, but just surrendering to this and realising if you need to change so much of who you are, filter every thought or word, and ultimately lose the ideal of who you see yourself wanting to be or trying to become, then your not with the right person, and that is okay!

[Narellan]

Red flags about ourselves. YES! One of the first statements my exBPD made about me to a friend was " Narellan is really vulnerable ATM isn't she?" It was like a sixth sense. He was very intuitive and preyed on my vulnerability. His last date a couple of weeks ago was with a woman i know just separated from her husband also and extremely vulnerable. It's what he seeks. He then photographs his " subjects" telling us how beautiful we are and builds our self esteem which has suffered due to the failed marriage.

[Infared]

It's like Vampires.  They can only come in when invited.  

I invited the Vampire in.  But I can rescind that invitation.

Did you know she was a vampire when you let her in?

That sounds truly ghastly. Why would you have done that?

I didn't. When I started to see it, I tried making sense of it.

Tried to help her, because I loved and cared for her.

Tried to get out, but found I was addicted.

Looked in the mirror, saw I wasn't one myself, and finally woke up.

I also didn't go looking to get mugged. It was more of an ambush.

You may have played more of a role in your r/s troubles than others.

Every story here is different, despite certain similarities.

Absolutely true.  But the fact is that by the time all the really bad stuff was occurring, I should have been gone literally years ago.   But I chose to stay.  And my growth and self respect and understanding comes from determining why I chose to stay.

Why I let myself lose myself to the Disorder.  Why I invited the Disorder into my life.  

No, I did not know it was the Disorder.  But I was vulnerable to the Disorder for some very distinct reasons.   The patterns on this board are so disturbingly similar.  And the prescribed behavior for recovery is self reflection.  

So I have to assume that my recovery also fits the patterns and follow the advice.  

Otherwise, I remain a victim for the rest of my life.  And in reality, I was a volunteer.  

Altruistic/Closet Narcissism is still Narcissism.  But it can be treated.  

Be well.

T

I will agree that these situations are complicated... .and that we all have a part in the dance, no doubt... .but I will not agree that a murder victim is always responsible for his/her own death.

Lies and deception were definitely not a part of my side of the story.

[Ihope2]

I believe there are cases where one person is lying, cheating and deceiving and the other person has no idea.  I can see where it would be hard to do an inventory of your own behaviors and beliefs in that situation.  I find though, that more frequently there is an issue with both people in the relationship.  A BPD persons behaviors may be easier to see in a lot of cases but usually the Nons behaviors feed into or fit perfectly with those of the BPD.  I think they can be described and thought of as interlocking wounds. 

I grew up with what I presume to be a BPD mom and some sort of PD dad.  I have some of the behaviors of a person with BPD and some of a NON.  neither are healthy and neither make for good relationships IMO.  Even after I went through some pretty rigorous therapy and studied myself and BPD behaviors and learned all the red flags, I still got myself involved with a guy who I think had BPD or possibly NPD.  I discovered that being aware of red flags in other people behaviors was important, but it was vital to be aware of my own tendencies and behaviors when in any kind of relationship but especially one of intimacy. 

I do not really care what someone else does, I can deal with that. I can spot a red flag and a person with BPD or BPD tendencies fairly easily.  It is what **I** do and how I respond to those behaviors that I need to watch out for.  That is what I worry about and need to be extra watchful for.

Things like making excuses, filling in blanks based on my bias of my partner, Trying so desperately to see the good things and being patient and waiting for the other person to recognize what they did or said was wrong.  Wanting to be happy and being willing to sacrifice myself for someone else who is not willing to do the same regardless of how much I want them to.  Somehow shrinking down and making myself small so my partner will not be embarrassed by a mistake or whatever.  I look at my non behaviors as being very arrogant and controlling just as I do BPD behaviors. 

Very few people are immune and very few people are walking around without baggage or red flags sticking on them. Another thing I believe is that what is important is **how someone deals with their own baggage** in a relationship.  A person may have a history full of red flags, but has learned to deal with and cope with them quite well.  So make note of the red flags, but focus on your own responses. 

I totally relate to this.  I hope that I can learn to deal with my own baggage in a healthy way from now onwards,and that I will not have to be in exile in the relatonship desert forever, after my most recent short-lived, highly dysfunctional marriage to a BPD man ended in divorce.  Yes, there are red flags about me and they have been there most of my life.  I would certainly understand someone questioning my behaviours in this marriage.  The instant attraction, marrying him in a heartbeat, taking on all his complications.  Taking him in as a homeless, penniless, unemployed person.  Taking on his medical costs.  Sponsoring him money, depleting my life savings for him.

Putting up with punishing, negative, accusing, resentful behaviour towards me.  Taking the emotional abuse.  And still thinking I was doing good.

I take ownership of it all.  I understand it all so much better now, and I forgive myself for it all.  I have made huge losses and huge gains out of this failed relationship.

[irishmarmot]

Once I accepted ownership of my role in the relationship is when I truly started to heal.  I was then able to let go and begin to detach.  It is a long process but I am at a point where the thought of her does not interfere with my happiness on a daily basis.  That is a good thing.  There were plenty of red flags in the 5 months she in my life.  I consciously entered into her insanity.  That is her life.  My life is returning to normal and I am more aware of my own FOO issues.  I am seeing a woman now for about 3 months and there are no red flags.  But I am taking it slow realizing there is no such thing as an instant relationship.