Never knowing

[odaat]

I'm not sure why im posting. I found my own growth and recovery from my own alcoholism but it has not helped deal with her.

She is my mother. I accept she is not and was not well. I cannot save her. I cannot help her. I always knew there wasn't something quite right but not until I left home and fell apart myself that I truly figured out that she was not well. I never knew what it was until she coined the words herself "borderline personality disorder"

Of course she wasn't admitting to having it. No. The closest person in her life, my grandmother, heard her doorbell ring a few years ago. She gets to the door and on the step is a letter. The letter was probably the most cruel thing I had ever seen her write. And I'd seen a lot.

When I tried to find out what had happened I think I already knew that the situation was hopeless.

Today you were her best friend. Tomorrow - you were evil, threatening, not to be trusted, dangerous. For years I would try to reason with her but this was the last straw.

In detail she described herself. She said she had spoken with a psychiatrist (apparently on a saturday night?) who had diagnosed my grandmother as having borderline personality disorder.

WHAT? is that even a real thing? I look it up. I could diagnose my grandmother as having whatever disorder would be the OPPOSITE of BPD!

I read. I couldn't believe it. My mother described herself except she blamed her mother. When I tried to speak up. That was it. I was next. Cut off.

It was sort of a relief. Of course I felt guilt, I'd been well trained to feel guilt for everything that had gone wrong in her life. It was my fault. I was an evil child. I was worthless. I didn't care, ad infinitum.

Not too long as I tried to defend my grandmother I got a knock on the door. It was the police. She told them I was stalking her and threatening to kill her.

I live 390km away.

Tonight as I reflect on how I've recovered from my own struggles with things I'm not growing any more. I'm stuck. I found recovery from alcoholism through others suffering the same. But with this... . how do you explain that you genuinely did not have to do anything wrong to get punished? How do you explain being beaten without doing ANYTHING without sounding like a spolied brat who just wants to believe the world is to blame?

How do you explain a mother who showed her love by giving us an excellent education and travel experiences - but who's only consistency was that she was inconsistent. You never knew when she would snap. Or who would be the target. Birthdays, mothers day, christmas were guaranteed disaster. They may start well but at some point within the 24 hours she would flip.

If you gave her a gift 9 times out of 10 she would set it on fire and you would be sleeping in the yard again. If you didn't give anything, you were an ungrateful, evil b*t*h who she should've left to die. I don't know.

so much. I read about other's experiences and realise that there are others out there. Not just emotional teenagers filled with hormonal angst and a feeling like the world and their parents hate them, but actual grown ups who genuinely had a parent so unwell and so harmful that you realise you are not alone.

[Kwamina]

Welcome to our online community odaat

I read about other's experiences and realise that there are others out there. Not just emotional teenagers filled with hormonal angst and a feeling like the world and their parents hate them, but actual grown ups who genuinely had a parent so unwell and so harmful that you realise you are not alone.

Indeed, you are not alone. Many of our members know what it's like to have a mother with BPD and how this can affect you. I am sorry to hear that you find yourself struggling with what your mother has done to you and perhaps is still doing to you.

Before I go into this further I first do want to compliment you on your recovery from alcoholism That's a very important leap forward and now that you've made that progress it might be somewhat 'easier' to address the issue of your mother and how she has affected you.

You mention being stuck. In what ways do you feel stuck? Is it that you find it hard to talk to people about what you've been through and how you experienced things? In what areas do you feel your growth has slowed or perhaps even halted?

When your mother sent your grandmother that letter, it seems she might have been projecting her own inner turmoil and negativity onto her. I am sorry your mother told the police those things about you, I can imagine how unsettling that whole experience must have been for you. How did the police react to your explanation for what was really going on? What happened after this?

Today you were her best friend. Tomorrow - you were evil, threatening, not to be trusted, dangerous.

The behavior you describe here sounds very much like 'Splitting'. Are you familiar with this term? Here's an excerpt from a workshop we have here about this subject:

Splitting refers to a primitive defense mechanism characterized by a polarization of good feelings and bad feelings, of love and hate, of attachment and rejection.

Splitting is a powerful unconscious force that manifests to protect against anxiety. Rather than providing real protection, splitting leads to destructive behavior and turmoil, and the often confused reactions by those who try to help.

You can view the entire workshop here: BPD BEHAVIORS: Splitting

Take care

PS. Nice avatar by the way  The colors of a nation!

[isilme]

Hi there.  I just wanted to say welcome to BPD Family.  It's not happy you had to find this site, but a good thing you did.  It's helped me a lot in multiple fronts in my own life and it helps survivors of BPD families find a good place for validation of their own experiences.  It's really hard to share this with peers without (rec]ognized) PDs in their family.

But with this... . how do you explain that you genuinely did not have to do anything wrong to get p

Short answer - you don't.  You can't make anyone believe or accept this.  The only person you can change is you.  That's a big first step.  In a way it's a lot like Alanon tells family members they can't force their loved one to stop substance abuse (my mom abused prescription meds).  You cannot, through anything you do, change the warped thinking of a person who has created their own reality to allow them to hide from shame. 

What you CAN do is set boundaries of what behavior and treatment you will and won't accept, and plan how you will deal with the crossing of those boundaries.  This is not to change the other person's behavior, but your reactions to it.  If your mom is yelling at you on the phone, ell her goodbye, you will talk later.  This is to "take a break" and protect you, not punish her, no matter how she sees it. 

Many of us have been brought up "parentified", being told we, the children, existed to fulfill the emotional needs of our parents.  As a child, how could any rational person expect you, a developing human being, to be able to do that?  It's the parents' job to nurture US.  BPD warps that.  It trains us to be codependent, only able to be happy if mom and/or dad are happy.  If mom/dad are not happy, it must be our fault, because mom and dad said so, and for a child, mom and dad are the ultimate authority long before teachers and others step in. 

Also a pwBPD can have many conflicting views about you in rotation, from good one minute to bad the next - there is no middle ground.  If you are 'mean' right now, you have always been mean, because that is the current truth.  If you are 'good' right now, likewise.  So you end up in spirals of guilt when you are told you're a terrible child, even if you are the only one trying to keep in contact, visit, etc.

I know all of us at one time or another have ideas, dreams, or hopes for a time when we can convince our pwBPD that they are the ones acting irrationally.  But you often can't ever do that.  You can learn to validate their feelings, even if you do not agree.  You can learn ways to avoid escalating arguments.  You can learn how to feel confident you are allowed to your own sanity and feelings, and there is nothing wrong with telling Mom to be nice or you'll have to get off the phone.  There is nothing wrong with trying to be honest about this with others in the family, but be aware that they have lived with the warped thinking for a long time, too, and might not be able to let go of it.  Give yourself permission to be upset about this, to mourn things you missed out on from the result of this.  Work on seeing what you need to do for you to feel healthier about this. 

[odaat]

Before I go into this further I first do want to compliment you on your recovery from alcoholism That's a very important leap forward and now that you've made that progress it might be somewhat 'easier' to address the issue of your mother and how she has affected you.

Thanks. It wasn't until I sobered up I realised just how messed up things were. I always knew they were... . different... . but I didn't fully appreciate just how bad.

You mention being stuck. In what ways do you feel stuck? Is it that you find it hard to talk to people about what you've been through and how you experienced things? In what areas do you feel your growth has slowed or perhaps even halted?

I sobered up just after I turned 21. I'm 31 now. There was so much growth the first few years. Realising just how much I believed the reality my mother created. Now, well, now there aren't so many changes. Maybe thats just how life is.

When your mother sent your grandmother that letter, it seems she might have been projecting her own inner turmoil and negativity onto her. I am sorry your mother told the police those things about you, I can imagine how unsettling that whole experience must have been for you. How did the police react to your explanation for what was really going on? What happened after this?

I thought, somehow, maybe the police would see what we were talking about when my brother sister and I tried to get her help months beforehand. We asked the police to do a welfare check. Which meant they drove by knocked on the door and left. They said she wasn't home. She told the few family members who she still talks with that I had the police break in her door and she would sue me for the damages. Needless to say it wasn't real. But they said that I had to prove she was doing harm to herself or others for them to step in.

It is hard because she is an alcoholic too. Even when she didn't drink for a while, the behaviour continued but not so bad.

"Splitting" - interesting, thank you. I think she knows inside that it is her that is doing the behaviour. She described herself so well but directed it towards the only family member she had managed to be close to.  No warning signs. Or at least none that were obvious to any of us!

PS. Nice avatar by the way  The colors of a nation!

It is the flag of Suriname. Where I am half the year.

[odaat]

What you CAN do is set boundaries of what behavior and treatment you will and won't accept, and plan how you will deal with the crossing of those boundaries.  This is not to change the other person's behavior, but your reactions to it.  If your mom is yelling at you on the phone, ell her goodbye, you will talk later.  This is to "take a break" and protect you, not punish her, no matter how she sees it.  

Also a pwBPD can have many conflicting views about you in rotation, from good one minute to bad the next - there is no middle ground.  If you are 'mean' right now, you have always been mean, because that is the current truth.  If you are 'good' right now, likewise.  So you end up in spirals of guilt when you are told you're a terrible child, even if you are the only one trying to keep in contact, visit, etc.

I was the first of the children to be disowned. Because I finally stood up. The guilt - I know it isn't based on reality. Or not world reality. Just her reality. It is hard not to feel guilt. My husband will tell me to look at the evidence - he doesn't understand why I ever even attempted to keep in contact.

I know all of us at one time or another have ideas, dreams, or hopes for a time when we can convince our pwBPD that they are the ones acting irrationally.  But you often can't ever do that.  You can learn to validate their feelings, even if you do not agree.  You can learn ways to avoid escalating arguments.  You can learn how to feel confident you are allowed to your own sanity and feelings, and there is nothing wrong with telling Mom to be nice or you'll have to get off the phone.  There is nothing wrong with trying to be honest about this with others in the family, but be aware that they have lived with the warped thinking for a long time, too, and might not be able to let go of it.  Give yourself permission to be upset about this, to mourn things you missed out on from the result of this.  Work on seeing what you need to do for you to feel healthier about this.  

As a parent it has become apparent I share in many of her traits. I dont think I am BPD at all but I certainly share many traits - almost like instilled habits.  

Thanks for the welcome!

[Demeter]

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As a parent it has become apparent I share in many of her traits. I dont think I am BPD at all but I certainly share many traits - almost like instilled habits. 

Thanks for the welcome!

I think that is the hardest thing right now for me.  I have been NC for 5 years. My daughters are becoming teens. And it is hard for me to balance out my fears and behaviors. I have a great therapist right now and that helps!

[Kwamina]

Hi again odaat

I was the first of the children to be disowned. Because I finally stood up. The guilt - I know it isn't based on reality. Or not world reality. Just her reality. It is hard not to feel guilt. My husband will tell me to look at the evidence - he doesn't understand why I ever even attempted to keep in contact.

We have an article here that I think you might find interesting. It's about fear, obligation and guilt, here's a short excerpt:

... .fear, obligation or guilt ("FOG" are the transactional dynamics at play between the controller and the person being controlled.  Understanding these dynamics are useful to anyone trying to extricate themselves from the controlling behavior by another person and deal with their own compulsions to do things that are uncomfortable, undesirable, burdensome, or self-sacrificing for others.

Would you say your mother used fear, obligation and/or guilt with you when you were a child in order to control you? You can read the entire article here: Fear, Obligation and Guilt (FOG)

As a parent it has become apparent I share in many of her traits. I dont think I am BPD at all but I certainly share many traits - almost like instilled habits.  

Could these traits or habits you see in yourself perhaps be the reason you feel that you're stuck now? What traits do you feel you share with your mother?

Many of the adult children of BPD parents on this board find themselves struggling in their adult lives with BPD-like behaviors. Often it isn't BPD but learned BPD-like behaviors and/or coping mechanisms that you developed as child but don't serve you that well anymore now you're an adult. Fortunately through hard work these learned behaviors can also be unlearned or at least better managed. The first step in achieving this is recognizing and acknowledging the BPD-like traits you see in yourself. And guess what? That's exactly what you are doing here so I would definitely say that you've taken the first step in getting 'unstuck'!