Getting dumped by a boyfriend with BPD (continued from first thread)

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

Quote from Sadly:

"I might not be much help but so many of the things you have mentioned I can relate to. My ex says horrible hurtful things to me but if I reply he goes off the wall ballistic and point blank refuses to listen to me. Sometimes but not often he will say he understands and is sorry but they are few and far between. Unfortunately I am a seriously messed up human being because of all this, struggle with my emotions and although I can't nderstand why I still love him and stand back as if I am on the outside looking on and being  horrified as he humiliates and hurts me. This weekend after he had a punishing go at me and I got upset he told me it sickened him to see tearfilled eyes and shaking hands and if I was going to carry on like that everytime he talkedto me then there was no point in going on. When I agreed he shut up. Please, if you are not seriously emotionally involved then stop now. It breaks my heart to think of others suffering like I am even though there are so many. Please think very carefully before you go back to him if he initiates it. I would give anything to be able to deal as rationally as you are doing with his and your own issues. You should be very proud of yourself. Yourself is the key word! I haven't got myself at the moment, I have lost me, please hang on to you. Love  and strength, Sadly. xx Empathy"

I felt like I kept sawing pieces of myself off so that I could fit into the girl-shaped hole in his life, because he refused to accommodate me.  It's been a week, but it's like I'm trying to remember who I was before I modified myself to avoid triggering him.

Thanks.  I have had some pretty bad relationship experiences before so I know what it feels like to throw all your pennies down the well and never get your wish.  I guess it's lucky for me that I had a real sense that something was wrong in the first few weeks of the relationship, and because of that, never really enjoyed the idealization/honeymoon phase.  I almost deliberately caused our fight because I knew our relationship would not survive it, and I couldn't keep on dodging the issue and placating him to make it work.  I was literally physically sick from the anxiety of anticipating a fight with this man during the relationship, and when he left, I felt an immense sense of relief.  I am lucky that I never fell totally in love with him.

I also had the benefit of seeing a really strange dissociative episode early on which really disturbed me.

I am still really interested in people's opinions on whether or not he will come back to me.  I tend to think he will, but he is also somewhat narcissistic and stubborn and may want to avoid any discussion of what went wrong in the relationship.  I currently believe that is his main motive for blocking/avoiding me -- he is avoiding accountability even though it seems like he might still be in love with me.  He has to be hurting a lot because his parents are deceased and he's pretty much alone in the world; I was his everything.  I always wanted to be someone's everything, but not in such a warped way.  

I know I'm vulnerable, though.  I know that there's some part of me that is still in love with him, and that if he wanted me back, it would be hard to say no.  I am trying to tell friends and family what happened so that they can check me, and I'm trying to get myself in a relationship with someone else.

In the meantime, this guy told a lot of people that his ex-girlfriend was going to make him a sex slave and then kill him.  I sure do wonder what he is saying about me.

[GreenEyedMonster]

Quote from Sadly:

"I might not be much help but so many of the things you have mentioned I can relate to. My ex says horrible hurtful things to me but if I reply he goes off the wall ballistic and point blank refuses to listen to me. Sometimes but not often he will say he understands and is sorry but they are few and far between. Unfortunately I am a seriously messed up human being because of all this, struggle with my emotions and although I can't nderstand why I still love him and stand back as if I am on the outside looking on and being  horrified as he humiliates and hurts me. This weekend after he had a punishing go at me and I got upset he told me it sickened him to see tearfilled eyes and shaking hands and if I was going to carry on like that everytime he talkedto me then there was no point in going on. When I agreed he shut up. Please, if you are not seriously emotionally involved then stop now. It breaks my heart to think of others suffering like I am even though there are so many. Please think very carefully before you go back to him if he initiates it. I would give anything to be able to deal as rationally as you are doing with his and your own issues. You should be very proud of yourself. Yourself is the key word! I haven't got myself at the moment, I have lost me, please hang on to you. Love  and strength, Sadly. xx Empathy"

I felt like I kept sawing pieces of myself off so that I could fit into the girl-shaped hole in his life, because he refused to accommodate me.  It's been a week, but it's like I'm trying to remember who I was before I modified myself to avoid triggering him.

Thanks.  I have had some pretty bad relationship experiences before so I know what it feels like to throw all your pennies down the well and never get your wish.  I guess it's lucky for me that I had a real sense that something was wrong in the first few weeks of the relationship, and because of that, never really enjoyed the idealization/honeymoon phase.  I almost deliberately caused our fight because I knew our relationship would not survive it, and I couldn't keep on dodging the issue and placating him to make it work.  I was literally physically sick from the anxiety of anticipating a fight with this man during the relationship, and when he left, I felt an immense sense of relief.  I am lucky that I never fell totally in love with him.

I also had the benefit of seeing a really strange dissociative episode early on which really disturbed me.

I am still really interested in people's opinions on whether or not he will come back to me.  I tend to think he will, but he is also somewhat narcissistic and stubborn and may want to avoid any discussion of what went wrong in the relationship.  I currently believe that is his main motive for blocking/avoiding me -- he is avoiding accountability even though it seems like he might still be in love with me.  He has to be hurting a lot because his parents are deceased and he's pretty much alone in the world; I was his everything.  I always wanted to be someone's everything, but not in such a warped way.  

I know I'm vulnerable, though.  I know that there's some part of me that is still in love with him, and that if he wanted me back, it would be hard to say no.  I am trying to tell friends and family what happened so that they can check me, and I'm trying to get myself in a relationship with someone else.

In the meantime, this guy told a lot of people that his ex-girlfriend was going to make him a sex slave and then kill him.  I sure do wonder what he is saying about me.

[Sadly]

Isnt it sad that we have to go through these bad relationships and hurt and then think "oh well I am wiser now" and then do it again? I think you are doing amazingly well. It sounds like you are thinking of making a choice? Carry on nc and eventually get over him or love him enough to be with him and try and help him heal, which of course is putting yourself up for a lifetime of BPD unhappiness? Is that where you are at right now. For me I am planning my escape but removing myself hundreds of miles from temptation wont diminish the love and hurt I feel, it will give me distance from seeing him daily and hopefully remove myself from temptation. Dunno when life got so flipping complicated, actually I do, the day I met who I thought was my real love Onwards and upwards GEM my friend, last week I was almost suicidal so I guess I have moved on a step:) xx

[GreenEyedMonster]

Right now I love him again and it is harder.  I miss the physical connection especially.

Since he has deemed me an evil, desperate stalker, he's removed himself from our group of friends too, and I feel bad that he is sitting at home alone when he could be out and seeing people.  I'm trying to get a mutual friend to call him (and act like it has nothing to do with me) and make a point of personally inviting him back to the group and acting like our breakup was no big deal and I'm fine.  I'm hoping that if someone downplays his guilt and culpability, his defense mechanisms will also take a rest and maybe we can at least be friends.

Whether someone is "black" or "white" seems to be a direct result of whether or not that person is a threat to the pwBPD's ego, so my strategy is going to be as little of a threat as possible.

And for my own sanity, I'm still going to pursue other people.

[GreenEyedMonster]

Another random thought.

He claimed his last conversation with his previous ex consisted of her breaking their engagement.  He used to talk about her "discarding" him because she had used him as an "emotional supply" and that she is the one who lost interest in him.  Pot calling the kettle black much?

I still think it's interesting that he talked about her constantly -- almost every time I saw him -- and defended her if I attacked her.  I think that he never really mourned her either, and still had some feelings under there somewhere.

If he talks about me half as much as he talked about her, the next girl will dump him just for that!

[GreenEyedMonster]

I'm just talking to myself here, but why the heck not . . .

My BPD ex actually gave me a reason for the breakup that could change in the future.  Is he keeping the option open just in case?

He also left a very valuable (read: several hundred dollar) personal item with me.  I tried to tell one of his friends on FB that I had it, but the friend blocked me.  He also has some belongings of mine.  Is it true that these people leave things like this "unfinished" so that they have a reason to contact you later?

I felt like it was pretty clear that he didn't really want to leave me, just wanted the anxiety to stop.

Having one of those "want to be recycled" days.  Sigh.

[SGraham]

My BPD ex actually gave me a reason for the breakup that could change in the future.  Is he keeping the option open just in case?

He also left a very valuable (read: several hundred dollar) personal item with me.  I tried to tell one of his friends on FB that I had it, but the friend blocked me.  He also has some belongings of mine.  Is it true that these people leave things like this "unfinished" so that they have a reason to contact you later?

Yeah i think thats probably a pretty safe assesment. It still confuses me how they can push us away and yet what to remain on the outskirts of our lives, like an ominous threat that could re enter our lives at any moment.

[Sadly]

Ominous threat that could re enter our lives. what a brilliant description. Mine wants to be friends, and I have been trying but its not working for me because of the feelings I have for him. We have a comfortable life and I give a great deal, he gives I suppose as much as he can but has no respect for me or my home. He is greedy and selfish whereas once upon a time he would have to use his words "taken a bullet for me" I think he is just hanging on because he doesnt want his life to change until he finds someone else. I have stopped telling myself it is because he loves me really and once over this stage will want me again. I have no respect for myself either. Its weird because even though we are "not partners anymore" he still thinks he can dictate what I wear, say, think, feel? I hurt so much and am as lonely with him as without him. The only thing that is going to save me is to move as I appear to have the willpower of a dead fly when it comes to him. I cant even have a recycle day as he doesn't want me anymore. He just wont let me go as I am serving a purpose and I am still being pathetic. I know that somedays I am a crying wreck and others like today I am a bit stronger and can deal with it slightly better. It always helps when he is horrible and cruel as it helps me move forward and away but it is so hurtful. Hang on to the worst memory of hurt he dealt you love and hopefully the recycle wish day will pass quickly. xx

[Lis2606]

Another random thought.

He claimed his last conversation with his previous ex consisted of her breaking their engagement.  He used to talk about her "discarding" him because she had used him as an "emotional supply" and that she is the one who lost interest in him.  Pot calling the kettle black much?

Wow my ex did this too! He said he dumped his last ex because she constantly accused him of checking other girls out. But he constantly accused me of looking at other men? I'm now wondering if it was the other way round

[GreenEyedMonster]

There was also a pervasive sense of me being "too good" for him in the relationship, and toward the end, I could tell that this was cropping up.

Me:  Advanced degree, intelligent, long career, good income, no debt, clean house, domestic skills, reasonably attractive, well-dressed, courage to pursue him, well-traveled, wonderful family, 12-year relationship in my past.  I'm 30.

Him:  Advanced degree, intelligent, lacking full-time employment, living at or below poverty level, heaps of debt, horrifically messy house, couldn't even make a pot of coffee, not very attractive, dressed out of the grocery store, attracts women using pity ("I just can't meet 'the one' . . . sigh", very sexually inexperienced, has hardly traveled anywhere, estranged family, and his longest relationship in the past was 6 months.  He's 40.

I liked his intellect and his personality very genuinely.  Those are the most important things to me in a partner.  I was not just taken in by the idealization -- I fell for him long before he began that.

He complains that he only meets "crazy" women, and I assume that by that, he means codependent.  The thing is, the pity method of attracting women, where you go on and on about how abused and wronged you've been and how lonely you are, attracts exactly this demographic.  Healthy, confident women run the other way.  He played the victim card about his last relationship so frequently and openly with me that it was very clear that he defined himself by it (and wasn't really even over it).  I highly doubt that he will attract anyone as healthy as I was using his current tactics.  In fact, he will be lucky if he attracts anyone at all.  He met his previous (and only other) girlfriend in a mental health support group.  That says it all, doesn't it?

I could sense his growing unease that he had little to offer me and I would get sick of him soon.  It was starting to come out in subtle hostilities, like trying to one-up me at things.  In a way, I think he was waiting for me to expose some fatal flaw that would save him being rejected.  When the opportunity arose, he wasted no time.

For my part, I'm still trying to figure out how this plays into a potential recycle.  Sometimes I think he will avoid recycling me because I am out of his league.  Sometimes I think he will recycle me for exactly this reason.  The fact that my "clinginess" clearly showed that I was not ready to discard him shows that there might be more here to harvest.  I was a very stable and non-chaotic source of validation for him, his own fears aside.  I never criticized him for any of the things I listed above, and in fact I was very accommodating and understanding about all of them.  I was always encouraging, never critical.  Not everyone will be so kind.

Engulfment fears are really just a variation of abandonment fears, when you think about it.  Engulfment is basically the sense that there is an ultimatum in the relationship -- "Give me all of yourself or I will leave you."  I think with my exBPD, he was starting to sense that ultimatum, that everything he had might not be good enough for me.  The minute I dared suggest it, he was off and running.  The problem is that he will never be enough for anyone in his current state.

In this particular relationship, the breakup was much more pre-emptive than the last, as if he is even more sensitive now to the signs of impending rejection than he was before.  I wonder if he will feel like he pulled the trigger on this one too soon.  It will be hard for him to paint me as a villain because that takes a lot of interpretation and, frankly, lying on his part.  Like I said, I wonder if his feeble attempt at an "amicable" (and somewhat fluid) breakup reason actually paved the way for his recycling me.  Sometimes I think that he is way too proud to try that, and other times I feel a definite sense of being "saved for later."  I could feel his regret already in the breakup message, so I am sure that he is busy right now finding reasons to hate me so that he doesn't have to think about what he lost.  But just wait.  When he gets out there and goes after other women, he will become keenly aware of what he lost, because he'll never find anything like this again.

Meanwhile, he has cut himself out of our group of friends and his band is breaking up.  Basically, his life is imploding.

Some days I want to be recycled, and some days I don't.

[GreenEyedMonster]

I am watching him frantically try to replace our group of friends by going to events with other people.  I think the loneliness is hitting.  I think the whole lot of us are "painted black" right now.

[GreenEyedMonster]

He keeps finding new and creative ways to block me online, because apparently I am "stalking" him.  Has he not noticed that I've made no attempt to contact him?  I have reached the point of finding this funny, because it is so far removed from reality.

[GreenEyedMonster]

I am like a giant broken bleeding heart tonight.

exBPD stayed home from a party he was going to attend.  He does that sometimes -- backs out at the last minute.  He has bad social anxiety and showing up to things alone is hard for him.  He told me when we were in a r/s that it was so much easier for him to show up knowing someone was there with him.  I would have gone . . . I would have killed to be there with him . . . and now we are both sitting here alone.

[SGraham]

I am like a giant broken bleeding heart tonight.

exBPD stayed home from a party he was going to attend.  He does that sometimes -- backs out at the last minute.  He has bad social anxiety and showing up to things alone is hard for him.  He told me when we were in a r/s that it was so much easier for him to show up knowing someone was there with him.  I would have gone . . . I would have killed to be there with him . . . and now we are both sitting here alone.

In sorry to hear you are hurtin gem, god i know regret is tough. Hang in there.

[GreenEyedMonster]

Thanks for the response, SGraham.  It feels good just to be able to share with people who understand how I feel.

Right now I am stuck in this mode where all I can remember are the good times, and I would give my left hand to have them back.  I remember during the relationship, my exBPD said that if he got angry at people, it would take a week to come back down from that emotion.  It's been about three weeks since the breakup.

I feel like if he is wandering around feeling lonely, it's only a matter of time before his abandonment fear trumps his engulfment fear and I get painted white again.  I don't know how to brace myself for this.  I almost think I'm one of those people who will need to do a second round before I get it.

[Sadly]

its a form of madness isnt it? I know, lets put our hand in the fire and get burnt. Of course it will burn us, so why oh why are we prepared to do this ? I surely dont know but having exactly the same thoughts as you are if thats any comfort.  x

[GreenEyedMonster]

Today I got a nasty letter the mail today with a list of all the people he thought I had contacted about him to try to get us back together.

One of them had disappeared from social media a few days ago, vanished entirely.  Now I know why.  He must have scared the hell out of her.

It's becoming more and more plain to me that, when you scratch the surface, he's a monster underneath.  I was scared of him all this time for a reason.

He used to talk about this fantasy he had of killing his ex-girlfriend.  I'm wondering how scared I should be.

[Suspicious1]

Oh no . Sorry to hear this has happened. I do think trusting your instincts are the right thing to do, and while I'm sure he'll leave you alone if you stay away now, I think if your instincts were to fear him while you were with him, they are well worth listening to.

Even so, I'm sure it still hurts. I know that awful state were you can only remember the good times and want them back so badly.

[GreenEyedMonster]

. . . . and while I'm sure he'll leave you alone if you stay away now, I think if your instincts were to fear him while you were with him, they are well worth listening to.

He was over a year out of his relationship with his exgf, no contact whatsoever, completely gone, and in a relationship with me, and STILL shared homicidal thoughts about her with me on more than one occasion . . .

[whitebackatcha]

He was over a year out of his relationship with his exgf, no contact whatsoever, completely gone, and in a relationship with me, and STILL shared homicidal thoughts about her with me on more than one occasion . . .

Wow, that really is disturbing... .

[GreenEyedMonster]

You're telling me.  I had this guy in bed with me.  He knows where I live, where I work, what car I drive . . .

It's almost as if people's very existence is a trigger for him.

He said that his exgf should have no human rights, and he talked about fantasizing about hunting her (and her kind) like animals.

*shiver*

[SGraham]

You're telling me.  I had this guy in bed with me.  He knows where I live, where I work, what car I drive . . .

It's almost as if people's very existence is a trigger for him.

He said that his exgf should have no human rights, and he talked about fantasizing about hunting her (and her kind) like animals.

*shiver*

Holy sht! I knew this guy had problems from your stories but thats scary. Well i normally i sign out with best wishes, but stay safe seems more apropriate now.

[GreenEyedMonster]

And he's super careful to make himself look all above board and like I'm the crazy one when he "documents" anything.  Of course his thoughts on his ex aren't in writing, but his accusations against me are.

It is just wild to me that he is still telling me what to do even though the relationship ended.  His desire for control clearly runs pretty deep.

[GreenEyedMonster]

I am celebrating my release from this situation with one final post on my story thread.  I am convinced, given the way he sadistically keeps trying new ways to cause me pain, that he is indeed more narcissist than BPD.

1. Self-centered. Her needs are paramount. For sure.  He only seemed to notice my needs as a means of continuing the relationship.  They definitely came second.

2. No remorse for mistakes or misdeeds. I got a genuine apology once, but mostly things like, "I'm sorry you feel that way."  He didn't seem to realize that it was even possible to offend me.

3. Unreliable, undependable.  He was very punctual, but often used "keeping commitments" as an excuse to ignore my needs.  Two-edged sword here.

4. Does not care about the consequences of his actions.  I noticed at the beginning that he seemed "reckless" with the relationship.  He didn't seem to care if he was taking too much, or impressing me, or if I were thinking about dumping him.  Really, he seemed cocksure and bulletproof.

5. Projects her faults on to others.  Yeah, I was the one whose "mental illness" was so intolerable the relationship had to end.  I was the one who was "emotionally abusive" and "childish" and a whole host of other things.

6. Little if any conscience.  If he didn't have one, he did a good job pretending on this one.

7. Insensitive to needs and feelings of others. Yes, definitely.  He would fail to notice when I struggled to carry things, or when I might want something to eat or drink.  He would pay lip service to my needs to perpetuate the relationship, but his didn't have much staying power.

8. Has a good front (persona) to impress and exploit others.  Not really.  This is why he has such a hard time finding "supply."  Though he does talk up his values and beliefs a lot, even though he doesn't stick to them.

9. Low stress tolerance. Easy to anger and rage.  Yes.  He would bottle it up sometimes, like when losing at a board game, because he knew he had a lot at stake.  But you could tell that losing and being bad at things really bugged him on a deeper level.

10. People are to be manipulated for her needs. Manipulation wasn't necessarily overt -- it was more like he took what he wanted and hoped no one would challenge him.

11. Rationalizes easily. Twists conversation to her gain at other’s expense. If trapped, keeps talking, changes the subject or gets angry.   YES!  He was a rationalizer extraordinaire.

12. Pathological lying.   Not that I know of.  But maybe about his ex.

13. Tremendous need to control situations, conversations, others.   YES.  He would state his opinions in a way that left little room for others to comment, and his plans were always a done deal by the time I knew about them.

14. No real values. Mostly situational. I didn't know him long enough or see him in enough situations to say.

15. Often perceived as caring and understanding and uses this to manipulate.   YES.  He portrays himself as patient, understanding, thoughtful, loyal to those he cares about, etc.

16. Angry, mercurial, moods.  Yes.

17. Uses sex to control.  Yes, I'd say so.  It was the one "activity" that we could really enjoy together where there didn't seem to be constant tension.

18. Does not share ideas, feelings, emotions.  YES.  If I asked about his deeper feelings, he'd get really uncomfortable and tell me to change the subject.  He shared more than I would have expected, though.

19. Conversation controller.   See above statement on making others feel foolish about their opinions.

20. Is very slow to forgive others.   Well, hell will freeze over when he forgives me.  I knew him to hold grudges over minor things for more than 20 years.

21. Secret life. Hides money, friends, activities. I suspected so, but I can't say conclusively.  There were definitely parts of his life that were important to him that I never saw.

22. Likes annoying others. Likes to create chaos and disrupt. Needs strong emotions to survive.  Not that I know of.

23. Moody - switches from nice girl to anger without much provocation.   Somewhat.

24. Repeatedly fails to honor financial obligations. I know he had a lot of debt, but I don't know how much.  He overused his credit card for years, had poor cash flow, spent money on luxury items before important priorities, and didn't seem interested in doing jobs "beneath" him just for the money.

25. Seldom expresses appreciation.  For sure.  This was one of the first  .

26. Grandiose. Convinced she knows more than others and is correct in all she does.   Not necessarily, but in his chosen professions or areas of expertise, he took a lot of pride in knowing more than people who were older or more experienced.  He would always inflate his job title from his previous job.

27. Lacks ability to see how she comes across to others. Defensive when confronted with her behaviour. Never her fault.   Yes.  Absolutely.  He didn't seem to understand that refusing to accommodate me would result in the termination of our relationship. 

28. Can get emotional, tearful.   He said he used to cry, but lost the ability at some point.

29. He breaks his woman’s confidence to keep her dependent.  Not that I know of.

30. Needs threats, intimidations to keep others close to her. Nope.

31. Sabotages partner. Wants him to be happy only through her and to have few or no outside interests and acquaintances.   Not that I know of.  But I didn't have many hobbies or activities that took me away from him for long.

32. Highly contradictory.   YES!  So much this.

33. Convincing. Must convince people to side with her.  Yes. 

34. Hides her real self. Always “on."  This one is tough for me to say.

35. Kind only if he's getting from you what he wants.   Yes, I'd say this is accurate.

36. He has to be right. He has to win. He has to look good.   Yeah, I'd say so.  Very competitive, even with himself.

37. He announces, not discusses.   YES!  This was one of the major factors in ending our relationship.  I was never consulted about major activities that affected my life.

38. Does not discuss openly, has a hidden agenda.  If he had a hidden agenda, I didn't know about it.

39. Controls money of others but spends freely on herself.  I was careful not to share much financial background with him, and I was far more responsible than he was, so there was little to criticize. 

40. Unilateral condition of, "I'm OK and justified so I don't need to hear your position or ideas"   Yes, definitely.  My previous boyfriends loved discussing my opinions with me.  This one, not so much.

41. Always feels misunderstood. Not that I knew of.

42. Does not listen because she does not care.  This was selective.  He'd listen "emphatetically," but fail to internalize many of the needs and wants I articulated in a way that would allow him to act on them later.

43. His feelings are discussed, not the partners.  Feelings weren't his favorite subject, any which way.

44. Is not interested in problem-solving. Unable to solve problems because that would mean facing herself.   YES.  Another major factor in our break-up.  The relationship was perfect or it was sh--.  It might mean criticism if we discussed problems, so there had to be no problems.

45. Very good at reading people, so she can manipulate them. Sometimes called gaslighting. Yes.  He was pretty much an empath.  He claimed he could read all my feelings in my eyes.  And he definitely gaslit me.

46. Jealous.  Surprisingly, no.

47. Double standards.  Yes.  If I "kept score" with anything in the relationship, I'd get blasted, but he was allowed to.  If I went somewhere without him, that was bad, but he could do it.  There are more examples.

I feel remarkably happy and free tonight without him in my life.  He can go back where he came from, because Satan misses him! 

It's like the old saying.  Everyone brings joy to my life . . . some by entering it, and some by leaving!

[SGraham]

That's awesome gem! it's refreshing whenever someone on these boards can look back with such clarity. I've always thought there is a certain power in understanding. Haha plus that adage you used is a great way of looking at it.

[GreenEyedMonster]

The way I look at it, anyone who enjoys my suffering and wants to contribute to it has no place in my life.  That is the bottom line.

And lots of good things have happened to me because he left.  I think he did me a favor!

[SGraham]

Well i have to say i wish i could have as much conviction and confidence as you gem. Good for you though!