BPD and paranoid delusions

[dacoming]

All, looking for help on how to handle this.  It's been going on for most of the marriage (21 years) but it's getting more and more intense.  She's always had paranoid thoughts about me cheating and has dreams where she wakes up angry with me.  We've gotten to the point where those don't really go anywhere.

Now for the last several years, she has delusions that I'm doing malicious things to her all the time.  For example, about a month or two ago, I was downstairs watching TV.  Afterwards, I came upstairs to go to bed.  I don't remember all of the details but I remember it was dark.  I got closer to her to see if she was sleep which it appeared she was (or so I thought because she was faking).  Since I thought she was sleep, I went to my daughter's room across the hall to kiss our granddaughter goodnight and came back in and got in the bed.  She jumped up and asked me what I was doing over by her table.  She had her drink and other things on there and accused me of either doing something to her drink or "trying to make her think I was."  Again, I don't remember messing with anything on her table but if I did, I'm sure I told her the night it happened and I definitely would not try to harm her.  Fast forward to yesterday, she brought this up again, accusing me of having malicious ways and needing to "change and become closer to God."  We were getting along really well and have been for the last month or so but out of the blue, she brings this up again.  A couple nights ago, I found an open pack of her cigarettes downstairs in the kitchen drawer while looking for some ketchup packets and brought them to her.  She refused to smoke those, fearing that was odd and something was done to the cigarettes to harm her.  That night and last night, these issues escalated with her threatening to "slaughter" me or harm me because she thinks I'm doing things to her.  She got extra mad because I will not "admit to my wrongs" and continue to be a "compulsive liar."  She told me that if anything else comes up to make her think I'm trying to harm her, she's going to do something to me and it's going to be "big" since she doesn't know how to "do little stuff."  Both nights, I ended up sleeping downstairs.

I'm not sure how to handle this.  It's dangerous to be with someone who is always thinking bad things about you, especially when you have not done any of the things they are accusing you of.  I feel very uncomfortable in my own home.  When anything of hers comes up misplaced or damaged or anything, she blames me (although she has a chronic history of misplacing her things).  Funny thing is she always makes this statement when she can't find something: "I always know where my stuff is or how much of anything I have... .you had to do something" or words to that effect.  Last week I was sitting on the couch, minding my own business.  Her purse was sitting on the edge of the couch.  She looked and saw that it was open and accused me of snooping though her purse.  I did not even touch that purse but she overtalked me accusing me of the opposite.  The kids were in the room.  Weekend before last, I found her bottle of artificial tears on the floor by the bed.  I picked it up and put it on her table.  Later on, she was looking for it and I gave it to her as I remembered it was on the floor earlier.  She started ranting, claiming that there was more in the bottle than she remembered... .someone must have put some water or something else in the bottle to try to mess up her eyes or something.  I told her I would go to the store and buy a new bottle, which I did immediately.  This stuff happens all the time.  I'm trying to avoid touching anything of hers again!  If it's on the floor, I will walk right past it.

Does anyone have suggestions on how to deal with or respond to these issues?

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[Mutt]

Hi dacoming,

I'm a little concerned about her statement that she's going to do something to you. To answer your question I can see how one would be walking on eggshells with the accusations, I would say that you didn't touch, take or move whatever, say it once, I'd suggest to not JADE. I'd also suggest to learn to depersonalize the paranoid delusions.

[RedPill]

Hi Dacoming,
I really feel for you in your situation. I had similar experiences with my stbxuBPDw accusing me of secret affairs, bugging her phone, hacking her computer, and more. Unfortunately, I fell into the trap of responding with JADE (Justify, Argue, Defend, Explain) which went predictably nowhere; you cannot prove a negative. At the time I was just so flabbergasted at these off-the-wall paranoid fantasies that the defense mechanisms just came spilling out. Finally, when hit with accusations during couples counseling our therapist admonished me saying, "When you defend yourself, you LOSE!" It wasn't until I learned more about BPD and where these accusations may be coming from (and started closely reading this board) that I began to develop some tools to begin establishing boundaries to non-engage with these accusations.

I'd like to second what Mutt said and advise you to be careful. As far as depersonalizing, try to remember that these delusions don't actually have anything to do with YOU. Perhaps protect yourself by getting a small digital audio recorder? How old is your wife? Is she on any medications?
--
Hang in there mate,
RP

[flourdust]

These paranoid delusions sound pretty serious and a potential sign of deeper mental illness. Is your wife seeing any kind of therapist?

[dacoming]

Hi Dacoming,
I really feel for you in your situation. I had similar experiences with my stbxuBPDw accusing me of secret affairs, bugging her phone, hacking her computer, and more. Unfortunately, I fell into the trap of responding with JADE (Justify, Argue, Defend, Explain) which went predictably nowhere; you cannot prove a negative. At the time I was just so flabbergasted at these off-the-wall paranoid fantasies that the defense mechanisms just came spilling out. Finally, when hit with accusations during couples counseling our therapist admonished me saying, "When you defend yourself, you LOSE!" It wasn't until I learned more about BPD and where these accusations may be coming from (and started closely reading this board) that I began to develop some tools to begin establishing boundaries to non-engage with these accusations.

I'd like to second what Mutt said and advise you to be careful. As far as depersonalizing, try to remember that these delusions don't actually have anything to do with YOU. Perhaps protect yourself by getting a small digital audio recorder? How old is your wife? Is she on any medications?
--
Hang in there mate,
RP

Thanks for your post.  She is 46 and not on any pysch meds.  She takes pain meds and other health related stuff.  This morning when I woke up, she was awake already.  She commented how she woke up in a lot of pain and I said I hate that she had to wake up in pain like that all the time or something to that effect.  She told me I said "It'll be alright" or words to that effect.  I told her I did not say that.  She accused me of routinely forgetting what I say and do and suggested I get some help.  She said either something is mentally wrong with me or I've a compulsive liar, going on and on about it for several minutes until I walked into the bathroom to get ready for work.  At this point, I'm really bothered because I KNOW what I said but she does this to me all the time.  When I got dressed, I kissed her goodbye and she complained about me not communicating after she brought up a serious issue.  At this point, I didn't know what to say so I turned to walk out.  When I deny I have a problem, she gets upset and it goes on.  I'm mad at this point and felt the best option was to just leave.  I had nothing positive I could say.  So she turned the whole thing around into me not communicating and disrespecting her by not talking to her and refused to address the issue she brought up in the first place.

[dacoming]

These paranoid delusions sound pretty serious and a potential sign of deeper mental illness. Is your wife seeing any kind of therapist?

Thanks for your post.  She is not seeing anyone.  As she sees it, I'm the one with deep rooted mental problems and need help.

[dacoming]

Hi dacoming,

I'm a little concerned about her statement that she's going to do something to you. To answer your question I can see how one would be walking on eggshells with the accusations, I would say that you didn't touch, take or move whatever, say it once, I'd suggest to not JADE. I'd also suggest to learn to depersonalize the paranoid delusions.

Thanks for your post.  I'm trying really hard not to take these things personally but the things she says to me makes it so hard at times.  Plus she includes the kids in it. 

[flourdust]

Thanks for your post.  She is not seeing anyone.  As she sees it, I'm the one with deep rooted mental problems and need help.

Do you think she might be agreeable to a mutual pact for both of you to see therapists? It's probably good for you, and it could get her the diagnosis and help she needs.

[dacoming]

Do you think she might be agreeable to a mutual pact for both of you to see therapists? It's probably good for you, and it could get her the diagnosis and help she needs.

I've tried multiple times, she refuses.  Her reasoning is I would get in there and "lie as I always do" and I should start being a man and stop looking for a counselor to help me solve all of my problems without me making an effort to fix myself.  Basically, I'm the problem and when I don't validate her false accusations, I'm lying.  And seeking counseling is being less than a grown man or adult.  I've given up on that because it seems to be another way to criticize and put me down as a man.

[ortac77]

Damned if you do, damned if you don't - you really cannot win in this situation.

My pwBPD has been seeing a therapist but apparently I am 'colluding' with the therapist and the therapist is believing my 'lies'. As I have only met the therapist once this is a crazy accusation. Needless to say he now does not attend the therapy. I think the reality is that he is struggling to deal with facing up to BPD and the tools that DBT has been teaching him - a great pity!
Ironic given that when he started he carefully explained to me how he understood 'therapy avoiding behaviour'.

These paranoid thoughts do seem to happen with this disorder. In his case I don't think the random way he takes/doesnt take the antipsychotics prescribed by his psychiatrist is a large part of the problem.

I am currently getting the silent or passive aggressive treatment, this happens periodically - after being accused of all sorts of paranoid accusations - either I am having sex with random people, that I am planning to harm him, that I am up to 'something' etc, etc.

Delusions are a part of this disorder, I suspect that there is also quite a lot of projection happening as well given that he has been engaged in lots of 'internet' sex and tried to get me into trouble at work (luckily they understand that he is mentally ill).

Having worked quite separately with my own therapist I have been working hard on avoiding the FOG and establishing clear boundaries. I think the current behaviour is because I will not engage with these accusations beyond a simple statement that they are not true.

Careful though of threats to you - I have been physically abused in the past - be sure you keep yourself safe

[Pugman]

Almost identical situation here. Married for 8 years. My wife has said exactly that about therapy, for me on my own or for her. I am constantly "forgetting" everything... .because she is making it up as she goes. It's been getting worse, which makes me wonder if I am contributing, or perhaps enabling too much. I try and validate without validating the delusions... .primarily by focusing on the feelings instead of the facts. But I can say that I get completely frustrated sometimes and just want to scream. Usually if I take a time out and read some of the posts here, my mind calms and I remember it's the disease that's talking, not her. The other challenge I face, is that because of her delusions, and how "evil" I am (when she gets into that state), her only source of feeling in control is to threaten divorce. I remember the first time she was "divorcing me" was after we'd been married for 3 months. Since then it happens at least once a month, normally 2-3 times a month. Oddly enough, every time she says it, it feels like it really could be the time. I've been learning to cope however. Unfortunately I don't have much advice, but I do understand what it feels like.