Reality check for Wife

[Cole]

Long story short, dBPDw moved out two weeks ago this Saturday. Spent almost every day here after work and texting how much she misses me and still wants to "date". I have started responding to text with business only replies associated with co-parenting and money and making myself unavailable when she stops by to drop off kids, etc... .

We have established separate bank accounts, and are maintaining a joint account with the idea we will both put money into it for shared bills, such as tuition and clothes for the kids. Unfortunately, she keeps taking money out for her living expenses, as she cannot afford to live on her own. So, today I am closing that account. Not sure what she is going to do, but as my T said, it was her choice to move out and take resources away from the family, so she will have to figure it out.

She told me last night that the reason most of her things are still here is she expected this to be a temporary move while she tries to get healthy. Now that I have cut off the money, she is angry and says she will get the rest of her stuff out.

Not sure if this is an anger/rejection response to me trying to pull away or because financial support is gone her true motive is coming out.
   

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Lost in space 20]

How long have you two been together? Is this the first time she has moved out?

[Tattered Heart]

I think this is a wise smart move. Proud of you. You're getting it. You're putting yourself and your family first. SHe can move out if she wants, but you don't have to support her while she does it.

So, couple of questions:

1) What is your personal value statement in regards to this decision? This is important so when you begin to have regrets about it, this value statement will help you stick to what you need to do for you.

2) Are you going to be willing to stick to your resolve if she decides to move everything out? How will you respond to that?

3) Will you allow her to continue keeping her stuff at the house? Will she be able to come and go as she pleases?

[Mutt]

Hi Cole,

Not sure if this is an anger/rejection response to me trying to pull away or because financial support is gone her true motive is coming out.

I agree with you, I think that she's lashing out, a pwBPD have dependency issues, they depend on others for things that they really should be doing for themselves. I'd also like to add that you have Fear in FOG.

[Cole]

1) What is your personal value statement in regards to this decision? This is important so when you begin to have regrets about it, this value statement will help you stick to what you need to do for you.

2) Are you going to be willing to stick to your resolve if she decides to move everything out? How will you respond to that?

3) Will you allow her to continue keeping her stuff at the house? Will she be able to come and go as she pleases?

She responded a few minutes ago that she did not want to move out permanently, that this was to be a "wake up call" to make me as angry at my family as she is. My thought that this is no different than a child holding her breath until she gets the candy bar at the store is proving to be correct.

Yes, I am more that willing to stick to it if she moves the rest of her things, though I doubt she will. I have had it with the BPD games. She can move out all the way or realize that her anger and fear of rejection are damaging everyone and get it under control. She has gone down this road before, got over it, and then been very healthy for about 18 months.

She has a legal right to come and go. (Before anyone responds with "change the locks!" it is a big no-no according to attorney).  However, she has stopped doing that over the past few days and has been staying at her apartment while sending me text as to how lonely she is. And calling then hanging up then sending a text saying she accidentally butt dialed me. BPD self-punishment to elicit a rescuer response. Not my circus, not my monkeys.

[Cole]

Hi Cole,

I agree with you, I think that she's lashing out, a pwBPD have dependency issues, they depend on others for things that they really should be doing for themselves. I'd also like to add that you have Fear in FOG.

Yep. She is the most inept highly intelligent person I know. She can quote a book she read 20 years ago or tell you everything you never wanted to know about healthcare billing, but cannot figure out how to take care of her own affairs such as bills, schedule, vehicle maintenance, etc... .

I am willing to help her with those things, as she does not have the ability to do so. But only in the context of a secure marital relationship. If she wants to be on her own (I don't think she really does) then she will have to figure it out. 

[Cole]

How long have you two been together? Is this the first time she has moved out?

She took everything she owns and moved out forever in 2015.

To answer an ancient question that has plagued philosophers for centuries, "forever" is 16 days.

She moved back and was very healthy for about a year and a half until the BPD cycle came back around.     

[Tattered Heart]

She responded a few minutes ago that she did not want to move out permanently, that this was to be a "wake up call" to make me as angry at my family as she is. My thought that this is no different than a child holding her breath until she gets the candy bar at the store is proving to be correct.

I agree. As you begin to enforce your boundary more she will begin to act out a little more and more hoping that you will give in. It's called an extinction burst.

She has a legal right to come and go. (Before anyone responds with "change the locks!" it is a big no-no according to attorney).  However, she has stopped doing that over the past few days and has been staying at her apartment while sending me text as to how lonely she is. And calling then hanging up then sending a text saying she accidentally butt dialed me. BPD self-punishment to elicit a rescuer response. Not my circus, not my monkeys.

Good job seeking an attorney's advice on this. When she texts you saying she is lonely, what do you say?

I know it's hard to ignore what I call junk behavior (calling and hanging up trying to get a response out of you). Man, I feel so happy for you. It's like a switch clicked and you are empowering yourself. I'm sure it hurts, but you can clearly see that the hurt that comes from the constant push and pull was greater than the hurt from her moving out.

[Mutt]

I am willing to help her with those things, as she does not have the ability to do so. But only in the context of a secure marital relationship. If she wants to be on her own (I don't think she really does) then she will have to figure it out. 

That makes sense.

[Tired_Dad]

She took everything she owns and moved out forever in 2015.

To answer an ancient question that has plagued philosophers for centuries, "forever" is 16 days.

She moved back and was very healthy for about a year and a half until the BPD cycle came back around.    

Cole, there is something very powerful here for you to consider for your own ongoing health, the health of your family and even the health of your spouse. It's the recognition of the cycle of BPD.

Outburst, irrational action, inability to sustain the irrational choice, regret, need to be rescued, rescue, return, stability, need to do something as nothing can just be OK, outburst... .rinse and repeat.

It is good that you can see the cycle and make rational choices. I would recommend to write down for yourself, and for you to see only, what your limit is to remind you of your truth when everything goes into chaos again.

[Cole]

I agree. As you begin to enforce your boundary more she will begin to act out a little more and more hoping that you will give in. It's called an extinction burst.


Good job seeking an attorney's advice on this. When she texts you saying she is lonely, what do you say?

I know it's hard to ignore what I call junk behavior (calling and hanging up trying to get a response out of you). Man, I feel so happy for you. It's like a switch clicked and you are empowering yourself. I'm sure it hurts, but you can clearly see that the hurt that comes from the constant push and pull was greater than the hurt from her moving out.

Very familiar with extinction bursts. We have been down that road several times.

I am responding, "Sorry you are lonely, but this was your idea." This results in angry outburst that she only did this because my entire family is mean to her, never liked her, etc... .Yet, she refuses any options to solve this issue herself. Took Skip's advise to set up a meeting with her and my brother, but she refuses to do so or anything short of me telling him she was going to kill herself, it is his fault, and hate him for the rest of my life.  

She text several times today that she has to stay at the office late to work on personal stuff since she does not have a computer or WIFI at apartment. (After an entire month still has no utilities set up. BPD commitment... .)This was a hint to get me to ask her to come here to work, but I am not taking the bait. Either grow up, move back, and take care of your responsibilities to your husband, children, and home or stay away.

That makes sense.

Thank you, you just reinforced what my T had to say about it.

[Cole]

Cole, there is something very powerful here for you to consider for your own ongoing health, the health of your family and even the health of your spouse. It's the recognition of the cycle of BPD.

Outburst, irrational action, inability to sustain the irrational choice, regret, need to be rescued, rescue, return, stability, need to do something as nothing can just be OK, outburst... .rinse and repeat.

It is good that you can see the cycle and make rational choices. I would recommend to write down for yourself, and for you to see only, what your limit is to remind you of your truth when everything goes into chaos again.

\

Know the cycle very well. I have been able to slow it down and even stop it in the past. I am seeing a T who specialized in working with spouses of MI folks, particularly BPD and bipolar. He is teaching me things I can do to help her, which in turn helps me and the kids. 

[isilme]

Sadly, we have to be willing to let them fall on their faces when necessary.  I had to let H "fail" for years by letting him choose to (or not to )finish school, let him deal with the fallout from not attending school OR working (he got tired of being looked at as a deadbeat). 

We try as often as we can to shelter them from consequences.  Sometimes, we do it because things like not paying bills affect us, too.  And sometimes we give in to try to keep them happy and from facing the realities they have shown they usually can't manage well.  But they won't learn to do si if we never give them the chance to fail (or succeed). 

Good job on setting the boundary about closing the account, and being able to call it on the whole family-makes-her-sad issue. 

[Cole]

Sadly, we have to be willing to let them fall on their faces when necessary.

We have to remember they are like children on many levels. But we also have to respect them as adults, which is like walking a greased tightrope while jugging squirrels.

So, when they fail, there is the instinct to pick them up and tell them it is alright (child) vs keeping quiet and letting them learn from their mistake (adult).

W came over last night to use the computer. She needs to set up an event for our daughter and our daughter's needs come before any disagreements we have.

I went up to the bedroom to read while she did her work. Then I heard her storm out. She called and was mad I did not spend time with her. I reminded her that it was her idea to move out, which really made her mad.

We are close to her understanding the boundary that I am not going to play the one-foot-in-one-foot-out of the marriage game. We will see where it goes from here.