Experience with EMDR?

[T0M]

Hello all.

My GF with BPD suggested she would undergo EMDR therapy. My GF is undiagnosed and I never told her I think she might have BPD. And she never mentioned it to me.

But our problems keep on piling up and she is constantly spiraling down in to depression and feelings of emptiness.

Maybe she discovered herself she might have BPD (she is a therapist herself  ) but is afraid to tell me. But besides from that, does anyone have good experience with EMDR?

thanks all

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[Cat Familiar]

It got me over my fear of heights, but other than that, no. I did have a friend who had trauma from his combat experience and he said it helped him.

[drumdog4M]

Cat Familiar,

Would you please elaborate on your experience with / feelings related to EMDR specifically in relation to detaching from a relationship with a pwBPD and/or attachment issues. My therapist just recommended it for me, and I am open-minded but skeptical.

Any insights you have would be appreciated. I'm sorry if I'm posting this on the wrong board but figured it was appropriate to reply to your post, even though my relationship has ended. Thank you.

[Cat Familiar]

I did EMDR when I was taking care of my elderly BPD mother, with whom I’d had so much conflict when I was younger. I hadn’t been around her much until my father passed away and I realized that her dementia was starting to make her unable to take care of herself. Being around her was extremely stressful, so I went to therapy for that reason.

I remember the dramatic effect it had on my fear of heights, but now that I think back, it also helped me emotionally detach from her frequent verbal assaults on me.

It was a non-cognitive way to process unneeded amygdala response to an external stimulus. My therapist used eye movements, while some use sound, or a kinesthetic technique. At the time I didn’t see how a non-verbal therapy would regulate an emotional response to a circumstance, but it worked.

[drumdog4M]

Thank you for your response. I'm glad that it was helpful for you.

[Rev]

I did EMDR when I was taking care of my elderly BPD mother, with whom I’d had so much conflict when I was younger. I hadn’t been around her much until my father passed away and I realized that her dementia was starting to make her unable to take care of herself. Being around her was extremely stressful, so I went to therapy for that reason.

I remember the dramatic effect it had on my fear of heights, but now that I think back, it also helped me emotionally detach from her frequent verbal assaults on me.

It was a non-cognitive way to process unneeded amygdala response to an external stimulus. My therapist used eye movements, while some use sound, or a kinesthetic technique. At the time I didn’t see how a non-verbal therapy would regulate an emotional response to a circumstance, but it worked.

Cat has done a great job of getting down to bottom line. (as she usually does)

I'd add that EMDR works as a non-verbal regulation tool precisely because the trauma is unprocessed and likely sometimes.

And I would add that for someone with BPD it would be a good start. I say "good srart" because when symptoms come down there's room to work on core issues.

With pwBPD - a goal is to build a more solid emotional foundation upon which healthy relationships can evolve.

Ergo - EMDR can be an important part of a more global therapeutic plan.

Rev

[I Am Redeemed]

I have done EMDR periodically for over three years in order to process a lot of trauma. I've also used it to help me get over intense anxiety of specific situations. The way it works is that my T asks me my level of discomfort about a particular memory or situation and we identify the negative message associated with that (for example, "I'm not good enough"). Then we will identify the positive message we want to target (to make it "feel true"). For example, the positive message might be "I am valuable and my voice matters".
The T then has me hold two buzzers, one in each hand, close my eyes, and call up the image of the distressing thought/memory. I feel the buzzers pulse, alternating left and right, and my brain may start thinking of images, phrases, feelings, etc. When she stops, I tell her what came to mind and she says "go with that". So I do. I don't even have to talk about the distressing memory in detail, which is why I like it.

After doing that a few times, the memory gets processed. Sometimes the level of distress goes down to a 0, sometimes a 2 or 3, and she will ask if I think I can get it down any further. It's my choice to try or not.

EMDR has gotten me over many distressing memories that kept coming up as intrusive thoughts and rumination. The reason it works is because it is created a new neural pathway in the brain that does not get "stuck" on the negative message of the memory.

However, my T has said that while EMDR can work to help pwBPD process trauma, it is not effective for the personality disorder itself, because the pwBPD believes the negative core message while people without BPD do not.

[Riv3rW0lf]

I've been curious about EMDR. The therapist I found is specialized in trauma (over 35years), and it is one of the tools in his toolbox... So I mentioned I would like to try it in our last meeting and he said : "I am not sure yet if this will work for you. EMDR can sometimes make things worst and we need to be sure about what to desensitize before going in. " For all I know, he might never wants to try it with me... But it's ok because I have been improving since meeting with him, so I decided to trust him. It might have to do with the fact I dissociated so much, I don't have many memories... Just feelings and heartaches.

After he told me that, I researched it a bit more, and indeed, it does not work for everyone and can make things worst if wrongly used. I read horror story about therapists who ONLY use EMDR without caution, and some people end up feeling wrecked. I confirmed it with my stepmother, who is a psychologist. I asked about EMDR and her answer was :" if rightly used, it can be a good tool." Meaning there is a bad way to use it too...

 For cPTSD for example, it seems it is not that useful (which I also read in "The body keeps the score"), BUT works wonder for certain type of people ...so depending on the nature of the trauma, EMDR could actually be counterindicated, even if it does work for many people.

It made me wonder if ... Maybe a good therapist will not just go to EMDR straight away, upon request, but will really take the time to assess your wife, who she is, her trauma... A therapist should be carefully chosen, they aren't all equal.

[drumdog4M]

Thank you all for your opinions regarding EMDR. To be clear, I am not envisioning it to my ex-pwBPD. Rather, it would be for me to help recover from some of the trauma associated with the relationship and maybe issues associated with my childhood (e.g., anxious attachment) that made me susceptible to the relationship in the first place. Part of my hesitation about it is because I experienced a lot of smaller traumas rather than specific major traumas which would be easily identifiable and "reprogrammed."

I'm not sure I am actually suffering from cPTSD versus the cumulative effects of emotional abuse and the roller coaster nature of being pulled in, pushed away, discarded, and replaced.  However, I don't think I have PTSD. I am getting the the sense that EMDR is more effective with PTSD from major traumatic events, which are easily identifiable.

Unfortunately I'm having to pay for therapy out of pocket, so it's expensive. Honestly, the boards and resources here have been significantly more helpful, healing, and validating than a year's worth of talk therapy.

Thanks again everyone.

[I Am Redeemed]

I have found EMDR to be helpful with "smaller traumas". I do have cptsd and while EMDR may be super effective for a singular trauma, I have found that for complex trauma it does help, though certain "themes" keep coming up in association with different memories or situations.

My T mixes EMDR with CBT and a family systems approach. She's also trained in Low Energy Neurofeedback which for me reinforced the neural pathways the EMDR created.

Traumatic stress doesn't have to be cptsd, so I think working with a trauma therapist with a variety of tools can be helpful, even without an official trauma disorder diagnosis.

[drumdog4M]

Thank you! I really appreciate your thoughts.

[Riv3rW0lf]

Thank you all for your opinions regarding EMDR. To be clear, I am not envisioning it to my ex-pwBPD. Rather, it would be for me to help recover from some of the trauma associated with the relationship and maybe issues associated with my childhood (e.g., anxious attachment) that made me susceptible to the relationship in the first place. Part of my hesitation about it is because I experienced a lot of smaller traumas rather than specific major traumas which would be easily identifiable and "reprogrammed."

I'm not sure I am actually suffering from cPTSD versus the cumulative effects of emotional abuse and the roller coaster nature of being pulled in, pushed away, discarded, and replaced.  However, I don't think I have PTSD. I am getting the the sense that EMDR is more effective with PTSD from major traumatic events, which are easily identifiable.

Unfortunately I'm having to pay for therapy out of pocket, so it's expensive. Honestly, the boards and resources here have been significantly more helpful, healing, and validating than a year's worth of talk therapy.

Thanks again everyone.

If your therapist suggested it after meeting with you and talking with you, then chances are this could work for you. I hope my message did not rebuff you. I was answering T0M.

I realized recently I am going into therapy like I go to school... I want high grades, to succeed, and I viewed EMDR as the fast way toward that. I think my therapist saw right through my perfectionnism and is putting the breaks on, and truly he probably knows better than I do, so I am glad he is being cautious.

What I meant is there is a big difference between someone asking to undergo EMDR and a therapist suggesting EMDR to clients he/she knows.

I think you can trust your therapist in knowing what approaches would work for you.