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Author Topic: Where are the words...  (Read 643 times)
Mind
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« on: January 27, 2013, 08:10:53 PM »

Why? Just why can't I tell him there is nothing more to do or say about our marriage? Why can't I get the words 'it's over' out? I am very confident and have had a moment of clarity where I know he can't get better. He isn't doing what both our Ts told him to do. He's back to stonewalling me this past week; silence. He took the kids to the birthday party his mom was throwing 'because I didn't give him one' and acted like it was this huge deal, talking out loud to the kids in front of me. I decided not to go, but there wasn't really an open invite to go anyway.

My T gave me a tip to say ' that our relationship is not going in a positive direction. We do have children we need to continue to love. At this point it is over. I'd like to look into mediation so we can move forward accordingly. '

He's threatened divorce our entire marriage. Is it just timing? Is it fear of the unknown?
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GreenTea
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« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2013, 11:39:04 PM »

I had gone over a similar dialogue with my T, but when I actually get to the reality of going through with it... .  I don't know if it's right or not. Clearmind gave me two links about enmeshment and boundaries on my recent thread. I had never heard of enmeshment before, but the more I read, the more I see this in our marriage. If I knew that he would be OK it would be easier for me to go through with this.  But I think that it's fear of the future, fear that this may not be the right thing to do. But again, that may be the effect of our enmeshment. I feel for you Sparkle! 
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Surnia
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« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2013, 05:59:52 AM »

I feel for you both! To be in the stage of "yes-no-fear-no" it is so hard! 

For me it was fear of the unknown and fear to take responsibility for my life. I was so used that somebody told me what is right or wrong, what I should have to do.

What helped me was the next attempt of my h to rage on me and telling me how I am the culprit and that I have to change... .  so I told him to move out into his workspace.
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“Don’t shrink. Don’t puff up. Stand on your sacred ground.”  Brené Brown
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« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2013, 08:10:28 AM »

GT- I haven't heard of enmeshment either until now.  I read the information but I'm still a bit unsure what it means and how it relates to our marriage.  I'll have to read it again.  Maybe the dialogue between my T and I was the first step to acceptance. Maybe I'm not quite ready or the situation isn't ready yet.  Maybe there needs to be a more clearcut incident for me, even though my decision is pretty much made up. 

For me, I am at the stage where I know this is the right thing for me to do. I I don't have any doubts whatsoever that this isn't the right decision now. He wrote me the email saying he doesn't want to hurt me.  I accepted it. Once again, I tried to believe it.  We had the talk a few weeks ago.  He said he has a problem.  He could hardly look at me.  He looked like he was in pain for the first time.  HOWEVER:  It all started again and he raged twice at me tried to hurt me in the past two weeks.  After I opened up to him. That is my sign that this will never change.  I am confident that this is my sign that I need to move forward without him in order to find happiness. I finally told my dad over the weekend.  He was very receptive to the situation and very supportive, as he went through this with my mom.   I felt a bit of comfort knowing he is there for me. Then there is fear.  Fear of what I will be going through.  Will I be okay? I feel strong at times but there are times I need someone to tell me that I'll be okay. 

Surnia: Maybe that's what needs to happen for me. Maybe there needs to be another incident.  I am certain it will happen.  I almost feel as if things are building up.  The past two episodes happened, and I was forced to face my feelings and emotions that this really is over.  I cried, I sobbed, my heart felt like it was torn into a million pieces. 
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schwing
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« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2013, 06:55:08 PM »

Why? Just why can't I tell him there is nothing more to do or say about our marriage? Why can't I get the words 'it's over' out? I am very confident and have had a moment of clarity where I know he can't get better.

I don't know you or your relationship.  I only know my own past BPD relationship, so I'll tell you why it was hard for me... .  and maybe some of my experience will ring true for you.

The way I related to my xBPDgf was not adult to adult.  It was more like child to adult.  And in the beginning when I was falling in love, it was like we were both children.  But over the years, I related to her as a parent to a child.  I worried about her (too much).  I did not have confidence in her (over some things).  And I felt obligated to her, like if I left her she would be in some kind of distress.  It did not help that she would reinforce these kind of thoughts.  She told me how much she *depended* upon me.  She made me feel bad whenever I placed any other obligation or responsibility ahead of my obligation/responsibility to her.  Even though she was an adult woman, I very much did not relate to her as such.

And when she was in a dark place, I felt that if I loved her enough, she could get through it.  Even weeks after she dumped me flat on my arse, I was more worried about her and what she might be going through, than I was about my own distress.  It was a sobering realization.  For months I kept expecting her to fall apart and run back to me... .  except she didn't.  The only person who saw her as a wounded child, was me.

It is hard to "abandon" a wounded child.  Especially if that "child" keeps screaming "don't leave me!"  But the truth is, they are not children.  They are more than capable to seeing to their own needs than we are able to so, than they are willing to admit, even if the means by which they fulfill themselves is not healthy.

Do you see your husband as a capable, resourceful adult man who is capable to taking care of himself if you should leave him?  Are you willing to put your own emotional needs ahead of his, just this once?

Maybe you aren't willing to give up the "idea" of what marriage means to you?  That if you say "it's over" this means you are giving up on some ideal that you've always believed in?  Well I would argue that whatever that ideal is, he failed meeting that ideal long before you ever considered giving up on it.

He's threatened divorce our entire marriage. Is it just timing? Is it fear of the unknown?

He's threatened divorce your entire marriage because he has a disordered fear of abandonment.  Abandonment is what happens when you are left behind, not when you leave.  If he leaves, if he abandons, then he's avoided his fear.  If you make the choice, if you "leave" instead of him, then this is his fear.

If you make the choice, then you can go under your terms.  If he makes the choice, then I fear he will not be nearly so considerate as you.

Best wishes, Schwing
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myself
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« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2013, 08:17:12 PM »

Schwing, great post. I wish I would have read this when I was struggling with my own decision to leave the relationship. I probably did read posts similar to this, it just took until I was actually ready to make the choice. I needed to be sure, because once I went out there, that was it. I'd live by it. I saw it as a door I'd go through, and once I had I could not go back (This was a brand new door, not one I'd be 'recycling' through). I didn't want to hurt the other person, but could not continue being hurt. After all that time, effort, and love, I didn't want to give up, but the other person wasn't really there most of the time, was more negative than positive, and that wasn't helping bring out the best in me. As I stepped back and learned to set some boundaries while healing, the choice was made. While I was changing for the better, she was making it worse. I didn't accept her projections anymore, which in itself ended the relationship. When I saw the light, so to speak, that door was gone. I'd gone through it. Now to just keep going.
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Mind
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« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2013, 07:39:53 AM »

Schwing: Thanks for replying.  I agree that it seems like dealing with him is like adult to child.  I think children act better than him. He's in his own world most of the time.  He can take care of himself.  He functions at work fine. I am ready to put me first, my needs first ahead of his for once. And I see that it's more than okay to do that!

If you make the choice, then you can go under your terms.  If he makes the choice, then I fear he will not be nearly so considerate as you.

I am slowly starting to see this in many ways. There will be a point I will know that enough is enough.

Myself: Great post too. I completely understand.  I need to feel ready when the choice is made.  I've spent many months feeling very numb to this all and I feel I'm finally accepting. I have spent so much time with this 24/7, trying to hang on and make things better.  He isn't there for me emotionally. He isn't there for me verbally, to talk.  He isn't here for me at all.  As soon as I set boundaries and started to show him my strength, he didn't like that.  What made me realize I'm at this point was when I started to see that he isn't fighting for me, for us, for our family.  He just isn't and he will never. I like your symbolism with the doors.  Once I go through this door, I won't be looking back either.
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