So scared for me and our kids

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

You have all warned me about the extinction burst. And you were right there would be more. When I was away for Easter we messaged each other on Skype, I wanted to talk about the kids as for six months now it has been day to day management, depending on how much he wants to collaborate. I said I felt now I had made the decision to leave it would be hard to go back. This led to an abusive email about how I should give the car back etc... .   about money and material things... .   then when I got home and went to pick up the kids, my daughter said he had gone mad, he had piled up all that was left of my stuff on the garden path, and was walking back into the house. He shut the door, leaving S 9 and D 11 to help me load my stuff into the car.  So cruel, mean, hateful, completely abusive to me and the children.

I dont respond, just drive away. The next day I send an email about the next few days childcare, and he replies 1. Arent you clever 2. Life is all about rules and timetables 3. Ring mynfather and tell him you are never coming back so I can see your work of destruction is complete.

I know. I shouldnt let him see the kids, but they will want to see him. I am dependent on him to help with the kids as he works shifts and I work a long way from home, in the city. The kids want him to collect them not a nanny.  I should go for a court order, but am terrorized about what he will do next, especially to the children. Going to court will turn him into a mad axeman.

Time to go back to a shrink for me I think. And forget about expecting him to collaborate on parenting.

[Cmjo]

You have all warned me about the extinction burst. And you were right there would be more. When I was away for Easter we messaged each other on Skype, I wanted to talk about the kids as for six months now it has been day to day management, depending on how much he wants to collaborate. I said I felt now I had made the decision to leave it would be hard to go back. This led to an abusive email about how I should give the car back etc... .   about money and material things... .   then when I got home and went to pick up the kids, my daughter said he had gone mad, he had piled up all that was left of my stuff on the garden path, and was walking back into the house. He shut the door, leaving S 9 and D 11 to help me load my stuff into the car.  So cruel, mean, hateful, completely abusive to me and the children.

I dont respond, just drive away. The next day I send an email about the next few days childcare, and he replies 1. Arent you clever 2. Life is all about rules and timetables 3. Ring mynfather and tell him you are never coming back so I can see your work of destruction is complete.

I know. I shouldnt let him see the kids, but they will want to see him. I am dependent on him to help with the kids as he works shifts and I work a long way from home, in the city. The kids want him to collect them not a nanny.  I should go for a court order, but am terrorized about what he will do next, especially to the children. Going to court will turn him into a mad axeman.

Time to go back to a shrink for me I think. And forget about expecting him to collaborate on parenting.

[lockedout]

As bad as he is to you; you need to consider whether or not he's a danger to the kids. Unless there's potential for harm to them, mentally or physically, it would likely be wrong to deny access to them. You don't have any more right to do that than he does. Him acting like a big baby doesn't really qualify. Also, if you end up in court for divorce, everything you do no will count either for or against you later. It seems like the kids don't have any fears or reservations about seeing him and at their age they're old enough to know when to say no. 

Now if you're trying to set up time sharing and he's being a jackass about it, simply document those types of responses. If he doesn't tell you when he wants to see them, hang on to them until he doesn't without specifically denying it. That will be viewed in court as him blowing off your attempts to get him to spend time with them. If you deny, he's going to simply deny any conflict and accuse you oof not letting him see them out of malice.

[Cmjo]

Thanks for your reply.

Actually I would really never want to stop him seeing the kids, there is just a bird on my shoulder saying, having read so many bad stories here, when would it reach the point when I should? Some of my friends over the last few months have said "maybe it would be best for the kids if they dont spend too much time with him right now".

So I will follow your advice, if they want to see him they can... .   as has always been the case. If he wants to see them and it is not disrupting plans we have made... .   he can.

The kids are 9 and 11, they can decide, and there are many good times with their dad that outweight the bad times.

So when does emotional abuse become so bad that I should object to him spending time with them? Calling my daughter a spy for ringing me to say he is being horrible to her? Stopping speaking to her? Saying "adieu" (implying goodbye forever) to her when he is annoyed about something? Yes most of the abuse is towards her, not our 9 year old son. Splitting - but it hurts our son too as it is confusing for him.

Again after good advice on here, I do talk to them both, saying mummy left because I did not agree with his behaviour, and I was hurt. I say if they feel hurt by what he says or does they have to understand he has an illness, although he denies it. He cant help himself. They need to be strong and know he does love them, and remember they are very special and mummy is here anytime they want to alk about it. That if they dont want to see him they have to be strong enough to say that too... .   (although he would then I assume start being abusive with them). They need to know that mummy had to make a stand, that this behaviour should not happen in a loving relationship, that they shouldnt let a life partner treat them like that. I hope they dont grow up to be as needy as I was when I met him and make the same mistakes.

But hell I am so much stronger now... .   !

[lockedout]

I would caution you on using the work "illness" with them. They may have better filters around him than a youger child would, but they're still young enough for him to pry it out of them. The problem with BPD is that it's usually not only denied by the person who has it, it's also seldom diagnosed. In the US, it isn't covered by insurance. A mental health professional who want to get paid won't even admit to the possibility. I had raised the issue once with my therapist when we were doing marriage counseling at the time. I made a point to show up a little early and run it by him. He said that it wasn't possible that she could have it. He looked in his textbook and came to the conclusion that because she could hold down a job, didn't have a drug problem or suicidal tendencies, and because she didn't jump from one relationship to another that she was ruled out. I don't think insurance had much to do with it; although he's a nice guy, I don't think he's a very sharp therapist. If you run assertions through the kids that he has an "illness", which BPD isn't (it's a personality disorder), you could be facing the music for it in court.

What you need to do is to take the high road. Don't say ANYTHING negative about him to or in front of the kids, even if he does. Be courteous and diplomatic with him, even if he isn't, especially if one of them comes to you and tells you they don't want to be around him. Try to keep communication in writing as much as possible and document everything that occurs outside of normal routine. As much as he may have hurt you or his recalcitrance in assuming any personal responsibility goes, it's not their problem. Over time the kids may start to wonder why you're keeping your cool, while he's doing nothing but bashing you. But leave it up to them.

[Whichwayisup]

Your words ae really resonating with me Lockedout,

I am  continuing my approach to my kids by simply pointing out that we can all control how we behave and just because other people behave in certain ways, doesn't mean that we should... .   All of the reading I have done suggests that whilst we are aware of the illness, there's no benefit in disclosing this to anyone other than our own support network. 

Even tho I am grieving the loss of a loving wife and our future together, the children can still have their mother, we cannot take that away from them but can only guide them to greater understanding of what is considerate and appropriate in the majority of day to day exchanges.  One of the things we never seemed to tell them is how they will always have love regardless of what they do... .  

We have to put our trust in the kids, they may not see the truth today but there's always a tomorrow... .  

Whichwayisup