Do I have an recourse when he skips parenting time?

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

Every week when we come to pick up/drop off day I have so much anxiety. My dBPD ex seems to make it intentionally difficult. Today is a perfect example.

Our pick up time is at 9 am at a predesignated location. Every single time, he is late. Not just a few minutes, usually an hour or more. Today he texted me at 8:55 and said he would be there "in a little bit" but he didn't give an exact time frame. I had to be at work shortly after drop off so I was obviously upset and irritated. He refused to answer my phone calls and FINALLY, at 930, answered my texts and said he would be there in a few mins. He pulled into the parking lot, watched me get out of my car and walk into the building for our exchange, then he pulled out and drove off. He then said he hadn't seen me or my car, even though I had told him through text and voicemail that I was waiting for him.

He then said he was running errands and couldn't get our son until later on. I had my mom come meet me and take the little one so I could head to work and she ended up meeting my ex for pick up almost two hours after the agreed upon time. The time is even designated in our custody paperwork, my ex got to choose the location for pick ups so it isn't out of his way. It's  just so frustrating that I don't seem to have any recourse for him not showing up on time! He gets to mess with me and basically terrorize my life but if I keep our son from him for ANY reason then I'm the anti christ.

Last week he agreed to take our son for 4 days while my daughter and I were out of town. He changed his mind literally the day before we were leaving and said he would only take our son if I agreed to amend the custody paperwork THAT DAY (this was 6pm on a Friday), I had to give him money and agree to spend one last night with him (I'm engaged to someone else and he is insanely jealous). I declined and ended up just taking my son out of town with me and my daughter instead of fighting with my ex. He then cried foul and said that I had kept him from being able to utilize his parenting time.

I can't deal with this for the rest of my life. Does it ever get better? Will he ever just stop acting like this and start caring about what he is doing to our son?

[Stuffie]

Every week when we come to pick up/drop off day I have so much anxiety. My dBPD ex seems to make it intentionally difficult. Today is a perfect example.

Our pick up time is at 9 am at a predesignated location. Every single time, he is late. Not just a few minutes, usually an hour or more. Today he texted me at 8:55 and said he would be there "in a little bit" but he didn't give an exact time frame. I had to be at work shortly after drop off so I was obviously upset and irritated. He refused to answer my phone calls and FINALLY, at 930, answered my texts and said he would be there in a few mins. He pulled into the parking lot, watched me get out of my car and walk into the building for our exchange, then he pulled out and drove off. He then said he hadn't seen me or my car, even though I had told him through text and voicemail that I was waiting for him.

He then said he was running errands and couldn't get our son until later on. I had my mom come meet me and take the little one so I could head to work and she ended up meeting my ex for pick up almost two hours after the agreed upon time. The time is even designated in our custody paperwork, my ex got to choose the location for pick ups so it isn't out of his way. It's  just so frustrating that I don't seem to have any recourse for him not showing up on time! He gets to mess with me and basically terrorize my life but if I keep our son from him for ANY reason then I'm the anti christ.

Last week he agreed to take our son for 4 days while my daughter and I were out of town. He changed his mind literally the day before we were leaving and said he would only take our son if I agreed to amend the custody paperwork THAT DAY (this was 6pm on a Friday), I had to give him money and agree to spend one last night with him (I'm engaged to someone else and he is insanely jealous). I declined and ended up just taking my son out of town with me and my daughter instead of fighting with my ex. He then cried foul and said that I had kept him from being able to utilize his parenting time.

I can't deal with this for the rest of my life. Does it ever get better? Will he ever just stop acting like this and start caring about what he is doing to our son?

[Nope]

Does it ever get better? Yes. But only because your reactions to the behaviors change. You can sort of reign the BPD parent in but only if you are willing to go back to court.

If I were in your situation I would talk to a lawyer. I don't know what the rules are where you are buy in my case the parent with the child only has to wait one hour unless they are notified by the other parent that something is making them late. Without notification, after an hour of waiting the parenting parenting time is forfeited.

Document everything. Save texts that you send saying he is late. Save his responses. Since the time he is supposed to be there is in the paperwork he may be in contempt of court. If his lateness is effecting your ability to be on time for work then that is a real problem that the court should address.

[ForeverDad]

If I were in your situation I would talk to a lawyer. I don't know what the rules are where you are buy in my case the parent with the child only has to wait one hour unless they are notified by the other parent that something is making them late. Without notification, after an hour of waiting the parenting parenting time is forfeited.

Document everything. Save texts that you send saying he is late. Save his responses. Since the time he is supposed to be there is in the paperwork he may be in contempt of court. If his lateness is effecting your ability to be on time for work then that is a real problem that the court should address.

In my county the published exchange window was 30 minutes before forfeiture of the parenting time unless the other parent called with a valid reason for arriving late.  I sometimes called my ex when there was traffic congestion due to inclement weather or rush hour, road closure forcing a detour, etc.  Even then I was only 5-10 minutes past the time window.  The latest county guideline emphasizes promptness without giving specifics but an officer has since told me it is still considered 30 minutes.

Quite likely your county does have a time range for exchanges after which you can depart.  However, you better have documentation that you were there because you can be sure he will claim you never arrived while he was waiting.  When courts hear he-said and she-said, it will likely be seen as largely unsubstantiated and because ex missed his parenting time you could risk the judge making a decision favoring him.  (More than once it's been commented here that a judge has said, "I don't know what the truth is but this is my decision... ."  That's why you need documentation.

Strategy, it's a hassle but it can build documentation, some of it without the ex even knowing you're documenting... .hint: you do not need to warn him you're documenting.  The days of information sharing - except parenting information - ended with the marriage.

• Drop offs... .Since many of your exchanges are at a police station, see if you can go into the station when you arrive so the officer knows you were on time.  Then if ex hasn't arrived by the time you've waited a reasonable - in my county it's 30 minutes if the other parent hasn't called - then ask the officer to make a log or report when you arrived, ex didn't arrive with XX minutes and you then left with the child since the exchange failed.



• Pickups... .If he is the one with your child and is to bring him back, then arrive on time, be sure the officer knows you are there and when, wait for your child, then if ex took a long time to arrive, let ex leave then ask the officer to make a report that ex was XX minutes/hours late.

Having police reports will be documentation the court will accept much more easily than almost anything else and especially unsubstantiated he-said, she-said.

[Matt]

I had to give him money and agree to spend one last night with him (I'm engaged to someone else and he is insanely jealous).

Do you have this in writing?

[Stuffie]

I had to give him money and agree to spend one last night with him (I'm engaged to someone else and he is insanely jealous).

Do you have this in writing?

Yes. It was all through text message and I save all of our conversations.

[ForeverDad]

Structure is good for children.  It is not unreasonable for you to ask your ex to abide by the terms of the parenting schedule.  While some exceptions will occur and adjusts can be made to accommodate specific events, this should not be a consistent issue.  The problem with making concessions too often is that your boundaries - "we must follow the order" - get weakened.  Maintaining good boundaries is an issue nearly every member here faces who is a parent.  If we are reasonable and let the schedule be changed (good), such as for a later exchange, then the other's sense of entitlement or need to control expects it to be allowed in the future (not good).  So there need to be consequences if your reasonableness is abused.

What are possible consequences for him?  Two come to mind.  First is that you determine what your local policies are for how long or until when you must wait for him to receive the children and then when he doesn't arrive and doesn't give good reason for a delay then you document that you waited and then you can go.  Probably that would be when he doesn't arrive for a pick up.  Second is that you can file for Contempt of Court.  Probably that would be when he returns your children late.

Long term, ponder where the order could be improved, so you know to ask for certain changes the next time you're in family court.  Common weaknesses in orders are where they are vague, a pwBPD can see that as an invitation for reinterpretation.

[Matt]

I had to give him money and agree to spend one last night with him (I'm engaged to someone else and he is insanely jealous).

Do you have this in writing?

Yes. It was all through text message and I save all of our conversations.

I would show that to an attorney.  If he literally said, "I won't work this out with you unless you spend the night with me and give me money.", that's very wrong and maybe illegal.  It certainly shows he isn't putting his parenting responsibilities first.  He probably shouldn't be having unsupervised parenting time.

[ForeverDad]

I had to give him money and agree to spend one last night with him (I'm engaged to someone else and he is insanely jealous). I declined... .

Do you have this in writing?

Yes. It was all through text message and I save all of our conversations.

I would show that to an attorney.  If he literally said, "I won't work this out with you unless you spend the night with me and give me money.", that's very wrong and maybe illegal.  It certainly shows he isn't putting his parenting responsibilities first.  He probably shouldn't be having unsupervised parenting time.

I agree, this is wrong, the relationship is Over, all that remains is the parenting.  Only the parenting.  Period.  You don't even have to agree to be together while one or the other is parenting.  The only times when ex-sposes being together is proper or somewhat unavoidable is in public settings such as at a school event, after-school activities, sports children are participating in, various celebrations (if invited), etc.

[Matt]

I had to give him money and agree to spend one last night with him (I'm engaged to someone else and he is insanely jealous). I declined... .

Do you have this in writing?

Yes. It was all through text message and I save all of our conversations.

I would show that to an attorney.  If he literally said, "I won't work this out with you unless you spend the night with me and give me money.", that's very wrong and maybe illegal.  It certainly shows he isn't putting his parenting responsibilities first.  He probably shouldn't be having unsupervised parenting time.

I agree, this is wrong, the relationship is Over, all that remains is the parenting.  Only the parenting.  Period.  You don't even have to agree to be together while one or the other is parenting.  The only times when ex-sposes being together is proper or somewhat unavoidable is in public settings such as at a school event, after-school activities, sports children are participating in, various celebrations (if invited), etc.

It's weird, creepy, perverse, and maybe dangerous - he's trying to control you and get you to do things that you should only do because you choose to.

I think a psychologist would advise the court, "This man is not mentally healthy enough to be around a child without supervision."

[ForeverDad]

I had to give him money and agree to spend one last night with him (I'm engaged to someone else and he is insanely jealous). I declined... .

Do you have this in writing?

Yes. It was all through text message and I save all of our conversations.

I would show that to an attorney.  If he literally said, "I won't work this out with you unless you spend the night with me and give me money.", that's very wrong and maybe illegal.  It certainly shows he isn't putting his parenting responsibilities first.  He probably shouldn't be having unsupervised parenting time.

I agree, this is wrong, the relationship is Over, all that remains is the parenting.  Only the parenting.  Period.  You don't even have to agree to be together while one or the other is parenting.  The only times when ex-spouses being together is proper or somewhat unavoidable is in public settings such as at a school event, after-school activities, sports children are participating in, various celebrations (if invited), etc.

It's weird, creepy, perverse, and maybe dangerous - he's trying to control you and get you to do things that you should only do because you choose to.

I think a psychologist would advise the court, "This man is not mentally healthy enough to be around a child without supervision."

From what I've seen, family court often seems to split adult behaviors apart from parenting behaviors.  So even though he made grossly inappropriate or coercive terms, the court could see this as adult behavior and not see it affecting his parenting behavior.  Like two opposite people in one?

Court may see his being lax about exchanges as a bigger issue parentingwise than his objectionable last minute terms.  That is, court may say his demands on you are issues for you and he to deal with outside the scope of parenting.  Maybe I'm wrong, I'm no lawyer or therapist, just my observation.

he is insanely jealous... .I declined and ended up just taking my son out of town with me and my daughter instead of fighting with my ex. He then cried foul and said that I had kept him from being able to utilize his parenting time.

Likely court will have to step in if - no, when - he continues crossing the line.  (And he will.)  In this case, taking your son with you was the right thing to do, he left you with no alternative, hopefully if it ever comes up in court the judge will see it the same way.  But court sees parenting time simplistically as an important thing so have documentation that you did try but he sabotaged.

[Matt]

From what I've seen, family court often seems to split adult behaviors apart from parenting behaviors.  So even though he made grossly inappropriate or coercive terms, the court could see this as adult behavior and not see it affecting his parenting behavior.  Like two opposite people in one?

Court may see his being lax about exchanges as a bigger issue parentingwise than his objectionable last minute terms.  That is, court may say his demands on you are issues for you and he to deal with outside the scope of parenting.  Maybe I'm wrong, I'm no lawyer or therapist, just my observation.

This is no doubt correct, up to a point.  What I don't know is, what's that point?

For example, if he made a violent threat against you, in writing, that is certainly something I would take to the police, and also show to the family court right away.  I'm pretty sure that wouldn't be dismissed as "only" adult behavior.

But whether this behavior falls outside that line or not I can't say.  My guess is, if the court was aware of it, the judge would take it very seriously.  Your lawyer might also know if it is a crime to ask for money or favors in exchange for custody issues.  It might be appropriate to have your lawyer talk to a prosecutor and see what is best to do.

[GaGrl]

But whether this behavior falls outside that line or not I can't say.  My guess is, if the court was aware of it, the judge would take it very seriously.  Your lawyer might also know if it is a crime to ask for money or favors in exchange for custody issues.   It might be appropriate to have your lawyer talk to a prosecutor and see what is best to do.

It sounds like extortion to me.

[Matt]

But whether this behavior falls outside that line or not I can't say.  My guess is, if the court was aware of it, the judge would take it very seriously.  Your lawyer might also know if it is a crime to ask for money or favors in exchange for custody issues.  It might be appropriate to have your lawyer talk to a prosecutor and see what is best to do.

It sounds like extortion to me.

Yeah, kinda, huh?  (That's why I asked if it was in writing.)

I don't know if a prosecutor would take action in a situation like this.  But when someone's behavior crosses over into criminal stuff, it seems like the court might take note, even if it's "adult" behavior that doesn't directly impact the child.

In my case, we had a post-divorce dispute - I needed to move to another town in the same state for work, and wanted to take the kids, so I offered to pay for my ex to move too, but she refused, and threatened court if I took the kids without her permission.  We tried a court-appointed mediator, but got nowhere, til I listed the crimes I knew she had committed, and said that if we couldn't resolve it soon, I would have to file a motion in court, and I would be required to disclose all that I knew, including those crimes.  She immediately agreed to what I had proposed, rather than face the risk of being criminally charged.

I think your ex might accept a settlement too - maybe supervised visitation and no direct contact with you - rather than face criminal prosecution.

Things are different in different places.  Even where I live, I don't know how this would play out, but I would certainly talk with my attorney about this - specifically about the extortiony-looking aspect - if it's not literally a crime, it's certainly very controlling behavior - and see what options there are.

[Stuffie]

But whether this behavior falls outside that line or not I can't say.  My guess is, if the court was aware of it, the judge would take it very seriously.  Your lawyer might also know if it is a crime to ask for money or favors in exchange for custody issues.  It might be appropriate to have your lawyer talk to a prosecutor and see what is best to do.

It sounds like extortion to me.

Yeah, kinda, huh?  (That's why I asked if it was in writing.)

I don't know if a prosecutor would take action in a situation like this.  But when someone's behavior crosses over into criminal stuff, it seems like the court might take note, even if it's "adult" behavior that doesn't directly impact the child.

In my case, we had a post-divorce dispute - I needed to move to another town in the same state for work, and wanted to take the kids, so I offered to pay for my ex to move too, but she refused, and threatened court if I took the kids without her permission.  We tried a court-appointed mediator, but got nowhere, til I listed the crimes I knew she had committed, and said that if we couldn't resolve it soon, I would have to file a motion in court, and I would be required to disclose all that I knew, including those crimes.  She immediately agreed to what I had proposed, rather than face the risk of being criminally charged.

I think your ex might accept a settlement too - maybe supervised visitation and no direct contact with you - rather than face criminal prosecution.

Things are different in different places.  Even where I live, I don't know how this would play out, but I would certainly talk with my attorney about this - specifically about the extortiony-looking aspect - if it's not literally a crime, it's certainly very controlling behavior - and see what options there are.

This is so ridiculously frustrating. I feel so belittled when he demands sex from me. There were many instances before I met my fiance that my exBPD would offer to come help with our son and then start being suggestive and inappropriate in front of my 4 year old. He would rub up against me and stuff like that. If I moved away from him or asked him to leave he would tell me I owed him for helping with our son. It was insane.

He has attempted suicide twice and I have record of both accounts, he has been in a psych ward, suspended from work for testing positive for meth, been in drug counseling, etc, etc, etc. But nothing seems to hold up enough in court to get his rights diminished or anything. And I keep having to deal with his inconsistent parenting time. Ugh.

I honestly worry about my child being in his care. It terrifies me to think that at any point one of my ex's drug addicted buddies could barge in, pumped full of drugs, and hurt my son.

I love my son but I wish I had never met this man.

[Matt]

The key may be documentation.

I think during the legal process - if you decide to file a motion to change custody - you would be able to subpoena his medical records, if they are relevant.  Just having a history of problems doesn't disqualify someone from being a parent, but if he has serious issues, and he's not in treatment, that could be relevant.

In many states, it's legal to audio-record conversations, and that might be admissible in court - ask your attorney.  For example, if you are trying to talk to him about the child, and he is demanding sex, an audio recording of that might get the court's attention.

About drugs, again, having a history of substance abuse doesn't mean he can't be a good parent, but if he is currently using illegal drugs, even once in a while, or abusing alcohol, that might be very relevant.  You could ask the court to order both parents to take random drug tests, and let the chips fall where they may.  (I say "both parents" so you can show that you're willing to be held to the same standards.)  Where I live, there is a place called TASC, which routinely does these tests - my son is a recovering addict and I've taken him there - it's carefully supervised so the results are probably very accurate.  Even a single positive result could make a big difference in the case.

You can probably also find his criminal history online, for free - where I live, you look on the county court's web site, and look up somebody's exact legal name, and you can find every time they were charged with anything in that county.  If he has some DUIs, for example, that might be relevant, or there could be something else that you aren't even aware of.

One approach might be to assemble the evidence you have, and also make a list of other stuff you might be able to get, like his medical records.  And show it all to your attorney, and ask what your options are, based on the documentation you have plus what you can get during the legal process.  Your attorney might be able to advise you about what the court is likely to do;  for example, is the court likely to agree if you ask for supervised visitation only?