How far of lying will she go?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

My undiagnosed BPD ex told me she was raped years ago.   And went through therapy for years over it.  Shes "okay" now but has nigbt terrors.  She also went through a chance bout a few years back.   

She still has the cancer and is still fighting it while it's contained.  We stop see in eachother a few months ago because she is going through lots of issues and chemo.   

I know through this "space" she started seeing an ex bf.

Now I heard recently that she stopped chemo (her hair is still all there)


I mean... . this girl went through a lot. 

I mean is it possible a lot of these can be lies? 

Or some?

I do know I have caught her in some lies in general. 

What do u all think?   Sounds like too many issues for one person?

[LuckyNicki]

My undiagnosed BPD ex told me she was raped years ago.   And went through therapy for years over it.  Shes "okay" now but has nigbt terrors.  She also went through a chance bout a few years back.   

She still has the cancer and is still fighting it while it's contained.  We stop see in eachother a few months ago because she is going through lots of issues and chemo.   

I know through this "space" she started seeing an ex bf.

Now I heard recently that she stopped chemo (her hair is still all there)


I mean... . this girl went through a lot. 

I mean is it possible a lot of these can be lies? 

Or some?

I do know I have caught her in some lies in general. 

What do u all think?   Sounds like too many issues for one person?

[Ihope2]

It is difficult not to cast aspersions on someone's character and level of truthfulness, if they have been caught out in lies before.

Often in my case with by BPD SO, I thought that he was bending the truth to make it fit better for him.  But that is still a lie. Or he would talk about something in a very vague and loosely-connected way, to lead me to believe something was a certain way, when I later on found out it was not like that at all. But it is a "mind games" type of thing, because then in the end, you start doubting yourself, whether you really heard things the way you thought you did, whether it was you that misunderstood something they said, etc.  Bottom line is, the person with BPD does not communicate openly and clearly.  Very often they also seem to mumble something to themselves, and you are meant to know what they are on about, or even supposed to hear what they are saying. When you ask them to repeat themselves and talk louder, they act as if you have just confronted them and are angry at them!

My BPD SO once had me convinced that a medical doctor had suggested that he could possibly have contracted tuberculosis, which unfortunately is a disease that is still very much rife amongst the poorer people in this country.  This was on a Friday, and he said he was due to go back to the doctor on the Monday for further tests.  I was in a state of high alarm all weekend, as TB is very infectious and is a notifiable disease. I was already thinking that I have to go and have myself tested too and inform all those with whom I had been in contact.  I went to his doctor and spoke to her the following week, and she denied ever having mentioned anything about TB!  He just had  a chest infection and she had given him antibiotics for this!

In my experience, my BPD SO was always either very vague, ambiguous or economical with the truth.  The end result often is the same as a person who lies outright to you about something.

Where there is smoke, there is fire... .

[12BarBlues]

The act of lying requires two things... . The lie itself and someone who believes it.

That being said I would expect there to be no end to size of the story you might hear. Echoing Ihope2, truth to a BPD is very cloudy, often changes as time goes on, and usually isn't the whole story as you or I may see it or remember it. Its all a play for your sympathies or to manipulate your beliefs and perceptions of the liar.

[Ihope2]

I also still wanted to add that I do believe that many people with BPD or other personality disorders have been through trauma and abuse in their lives.  I think I believe everything that I was told happened to my BPDh really did happen to him:  the childhood physical, emotional and sexual abuse from various family members, the incest, the bullying and sexual and physical abuse at the schools he went to, etc.  I seem to think that the level of BPD dysfunction is correlated to the level of abuse and neglect in their FOO.  

[Mutt]

My undiagnosed BPD ex told me she was raped years ago.

   

It could be that you were not paying enough attention to her at the time. She said she was raped to get your attention, she may be trying to create drama as well.

[Split black]

My undiagnosed BPD ex told me she was raped years ago.   And went through therapy for years over it.  Shes "okay" now but has nigbt terrors.  She also went through a chance bout a few years back.   

She still has the cancer and is still fighting it while it's contained.  We stop see in eachother a few months ago because she is going through lots of issues and chemo.   

I know through this "space" she started seeing an ex bf.

Now I heard recently that she stopped chemo (her hair is still all there)


I mean... . this girl went through a lot. 

I mean is it possible a lot of these can be lies? 

Or some?

I do know I have caught her in some lies in general. 

What do u all think?   Sounds like too many issues for one person?

All I can tell you is that with mine... . if there is a template for this ... . eh disorder, is that pathological lying and deceiving are like breathing to them. I hold every single thing suspect that came out of her pie-hole this past year. Everything. My ex skank's lies were hard to detect because there was usually a molecule of truth in every sentence.  I would wager that 10% of anything she said was true. Meaning 90% was some distortion of history. This doesn't account for " withholds " ... .   withholding behavior I will never know about.

[GreenMango]

Well those are scenarios are difficult to prove or disprove.  Could it be a lie?  Sure.  Could it true? Yes not all chemo causes complete hair loss and rape happens unfortunately.

It is not uncommon for a person with BPD to be impulsive and make poor decisions tha. put themselves at risk.  Read the parenting board ... . Many parents are struggling with witnessing their children repeatedly make self destructive choices or endangering themselves.  As for cancer... . It's an equal opportunity disease.  It affects many folks.

The bigger question could be is do you want people in your life that lie?  If not why the emotional discomfort in letting them go?

[Split black]

The bigger question could be is do you want people in your life that lie?  If not why the emotional discomfort in letting them go?

Nons and Bdp'ers all lie. Everyone lies. If someone were to say that they have never lied is a liar. However... . the distinction... . in my humble opinion is that abusive women and men... . that live on the cluster B disorder spectrum ... . lie like their is no tomorrow. That kind of lying... . yeah... . time to let go.

[blissful_camper]

My estimate is that 80+% of what my ex said were lies.

He lied to people-please.

He lied to obtain sympathy from others.

He lied to gaslight others.

He lied to rewrite history in his mind when what he did was in conflict with how he perceived himself (self soothe).

He lied to achieve self-serving goals.

[HappyNihilist]

I think it depends on the person, really. I'm not sure that outright lying is necessarily a defining trait of BPD. Some people lie a lot. I was friends with a pwBPD who was a pathological liar. My exBPDbf was not.

That doesn't mean, of course, that they're exactly truthful, either.

Often in my case with by BPD SO, I thought that he was bending the truth to make it fit better for him.  But that is still a lie. Or he would talk about something in a very vague and loosely-connected way, to lead me to believe something was a certain way, when I later on found out it was not like that at all. But it is a "mind games" type of thing, because then in the end, you start doubting yourself, whether you really heard things the way you thought you did, whether it was you that misunderstood something they said, etc.  Bottom line is, the person with BPD does not communicate openly and clearly.  Very often they also seem to mumble something to themselves, and you are meant to know what they are on about, or even supposed to hear what they are saying. When you ask them to repeat themselves and talk louder, they act as if you have just confronted them and are angry at them!

In my experience, my BPD SO was always either very vague, ambiguous or economical with the truth.  The end result often is the same as a person who lies outright to you about something.

This is my exbf to a T.

I would never call him a liar. He could be pretty darn honest, actually. (I verified enough to feel comfortable that the basics were absolutely honest.) But I often felt like I didn't have the full truth. And the mindgames... . oh, god. I never was entirely sure of where I stood with him. (What way is that to live?)

The description of the mumbling-asking to repeat-rage cycle actually made me laugh out loud, because I can't even begin to count how many times we went through that.

And yes, the bottom line is that pwBPD don't communicate openly and directly. I wouldn't necessarily doubt things they present as facts about their lives/pasts, but I wouldn't believe everything they ever said, either.

In the end, all that really matter is how it all applies to and impacts YOU. If your exgf lied about being raped, for example, does that affect you in any way?

[LuckyNicki]

I'm sure the rape is real because it seems that's where all her issues came from.  

It's all the other things I suspect.  I spoke to a girl that is in the medical field.  

Awhile ago, my ex after a fight messaged me 3 days later when we were at NC sayin that she may be pregnant.  I asked her what made her think that?  She said she "may have missed birth control".  Classic line to pull me back.  

Another time when I went NC for about a few days, she messaged saying "I just went through my first chemo session",  again that pulled me back in.  

The friend in the medical field said that if she has ovarian cancer, she should not be taking "birth control pills".  And if she's taking shots, which she should be, she would not "miss".  

Anyways, that's besides the point.   After the fog has been lifted, I'm a little shocked that that I now wonder whether her cancer situation is real.  This kinda freaks me out to know she may potentially be lying about these things.   *shrug*

Only time will tell.  So I was wondering if they would go about making these types of crazy lies.  

I mean i know people lie in general, but to lie about these types of things is just awfully sick to me.

I'm not sure what to believe if one day we find out that she's in "remission".  or that the cancer is just gone.  I would not know what to think... .

[Tolou]

Mine confessed after 5-6 months that she lied about having cancer, to try and get me back... . She said, "I was desperate, you must think I'm a 3 year old", she had just began a 3 day a week intensive therapy and asked me if I wanted to hangout... . I said no, I felt like such a fool for believing she had the cancer, I wanted to help her, but I chose to stay away... . I'm 9 months N.C.

They can and will lie about anything if it is to their benefit, they will even deny a lie, because after a while, it becomes some of their truth, since they've lied so much. I Can only speak for the person I knew though, but people in general will and do lie.

[Ihope2]

I also think it is all part of their poor executive function in the brain.  The thinking process is distorted and they are unable to hold a consistent and logical thread.  Their impulsiveness and emotional dysregulation also makes them blurt out stuff on the spur of the moment, and maybe after the fact, when they get confronted with what they said, they feel ashamed and they deny it, or try to explain in all away?

This doesn't explain the big issues though, like lying about having a terminal illness.  That to me is a total sign of emotional immaturity and desperation for attention at any cost. I liken it in my mind to attempted suicide (the type of attempts that are used to garner some attention from those around them, ie. "if you leave me I am going to swallow some pills!".  Only difference is, claiming to have cancer is like saying "I am busy dying, but it is not at my own hands, it is an act of god".  This is probably meant to make you feel even more sorry for her.  The utter tragedy of it, this poor soul is suffering from mental illness, AND now she has been struck down with some terminal illness... . Because of her emotional immaturity and poor executive functioning, she doesn't think about how it will go down once she is found out to have lied about it.  She will probably construct even more smoke and mirrors around it then, to say "But the doctor sounded like he had diagnosed me with cancer", or "It's not my fault that I was mislead to think that I have cancer", or some immature reason like that.

I often think of a little, frightened child of about 6 or 7, who lies about something to avoid some sort of horrible consequence... . Their brain is not mature enough to understand the moral implications behind telling  a lie.  It is a quick-fix solution to avoiding punishment.

[LuckyNicki]

Mine confessed after 5-6 months that she lied about having cancer, to try and get me back... . She said, "I was desperate, you must think I'm a 3 year old", she had just began a 3 day a week intensive therapy and asked me if I wanted to hangout... . I said no, I felt like such a fool for believing she had the cancer, I wanted to help her, but I chose to stay away... . I'm 9 months N.C.

They can and will lie about anything if it is to their benefit, they will even deny a lie, because after a while, it becomes some of their truth, since they've lied so much. I Can only speak for the person I knew though, but people in general will and do lie.

wow, at least you got a confession.  I know my ex will go to the grave to maintain her credibility.

[Tolou]

Lucki Nicki... .

To be honest, the confession, hurt me. I wasn't completely shocked that she lied, I had talked to a close friend of mine who had been helping me through the whole break-up and she put it this way.  If she does have cancer, it's not my fault.  Nor can I make the cancer go away, I am not a Dr.  The guilt I was feeling was, if she does have it, I wanted to be there to help.  But I had told her, I care about you, I want you to ger help, but it can't be me, I am not in the right mind-state and cannot help you.  She said she was in stage 3, and wasn't going to get treatment, she was going to let it spread and just die.  I agonized over whether or not I should go to help, I am happy I didn't. But finding out she lied mafe me think, what else has she lied about? If capable of lying about something like this.  It was a relief to know she didn't have cancer, I wouldn't wish that upon anyone, but she never even said sorry for it... . I felt like she held it against me for not being there for her for a sickness she never had? Very wierd, very sad.

Ihope2... .

The suicide threats are bad too, mine used them as, 3 actual attempts, but the many threats for my attention and etc... . Made my life so on edge, the texts, the threats, voicemails calls, showing up at my home lethargic from actually swallowing who knows how many of what pills... . I couldn't live like that anymore, I never had an anxiety or panic attack until I met this woman (girl) I should say... . horrible, the deciet makes you doubt everything, and when you cannot trust someone, why be with them?

[LuckyNicki]

So sick.


I went through similar anxiety that you had.  Mine used it to hold me hostage while also saying "I dont want u to go through this".  Then would later tell me the same thing ur girl said "I should just let the cancer spread".

She kept telling me she should just stop chemo. 

I had so much anxiety over all this because I was in love with a person that wants to give up and die...  

Then later she uses our non title relationship to bring in a ex bf into the picture.   

I dont get it.  Both of our ex's must be BPD, its gnarly how they are similar.

My ex apparently is off chemo now.   I dont know what to believe.   

I kn ow it hurts you but if she told me she lied about it, id be able to move on so much easier.  Granted it'll be with hatred but I can eventually get over that.

My circumstance within the last few months is knowing im going NC with a person that is going through cancer bout and chemo. 

I know she despises me for it  and thinks im selfish but she doesnt know I know shes been with her exbf.   I wanted to be there for her so badly but she wont let me but proceeds to tell me she loves me etc.

[SWLSR]

Yes they lie.  they lie all the time they live a lie.  they usually r lying to u from the begining they have an exit strategy from every relationship based on morelies which is why few relatuonships ever work out.  they will throw anyone under bus also.

[numb_buddha]

Dishonesty is par for the course with BPD in my experience, despite what the literature might suggest (offering people false hope I believe). The mirroring phase itself is deceptive. They have literally misrepresented themselves to you. They are not at all that person. I do understand why, of course, though it isn't much consolation when you've been in a relationship with such a person. Without an identity, I felt my ex was literally trying on identities - assembling a toolkit of traits over a lifetime from those she admired for one reason or another.

Her obsession with going to Bali and leaving it all behind? This was likely the dream vacation spot of someone she was/is close with.

Her "love" of the water and SUPs? I strongly believe that this, too, was borrowed as an interest from friends.

Her various maladies that I never seemed to see any physical evidence for, namely Lyme disease? Not only were they attempts at garnering sympathy but, also, borrowed from elsewhere I would wager. No doubt some friend or loved one had that.

I also have a working theory that she told me about Lyme, PTSD and her hysterectomy so early on because, once she showed me her true colors, she'd need an explanation that might explain the behavior (and all three of these could... . ). On that note, she used to tell me that the woman she lived with thought in black and white - literal BPD language. It was projection. She told me this early on to demonstrate how she remains friends with exes but that this woman would cut her out of her life completely, that she could never just remain friends. It turns out that's my ex to a T, not the woman she lived with. Projection, projection, projection... . that was the mantra of my relationship. It was unbelievable how every single thing she disliked about others she literally engaged in or was guilty of herself.

Aside from this - with my exBPDgf, the lies were predominantly lies of omission (the list is endless). Her method of avoiding confrontation was usually to end communication, and I was the frequent beneficiary of the silent treatment.

More on projection... .

Once she gave me the, "You can't bull**** a bull*******" line, trying to suggest I'm a dishonest person because my livelihood depends largely on donations (religious publishing and documentary film-making dependent on Kickstarter). I'll never forget the look on her face when I stated that her saying that was revealing, because I'm not being dishonest at all. It just taught me that she's a "bull*******." By then I''d long known of the BPD so I just kept watching projections fly one after the other in those days.

It's weird. Looking back, the only time I feel she was ever truthful with me about the stuff that matters is when she'd appear meek and her voice would become nearly inaudible. These were almost always times when I'd hear something like: Why do you want to be with a crazy girl like me?" or, if she told me how terrible an ex was or how things ended well and amicably between someone, she said, "I treated so-and-so like s***."

[Tolou]

If she is choosing to tell you all of this but then say she doesn't want you there? what can you really do?  Best thing to do is leave her be on her own path, pray for her, if you believe in that, and if choose to, help when she asks... . It is difficult to care for someone but be able to help them, but sometimes people need to help themselves.

[LuckyNicki]

Thanks tolou

So far that is the path I am currently taking. 

I just get the sense she wants me there without admitting.

The last time I talked to her I told her she can call me when she needs me and she said "I rather commit suicide before calling you".  Then proceeds to tell me that I wasn't there when she needed me most (during nc).  And then later says she didn't need me there. SO CONFUSING!

BUT yeah, im trying to move on right now.  But the illnesses keeps staying in the back of my head.

[Tolou]

working on yourself is the best thing you can do... . It's the best thing I did, some people need a therapist for that and some don't.  Regardless, this is individual will find a way to survive and tell her sad stories to others to gain sympathy, and once her mask is revealed, theres no more hiding who she really is.  Just because someone has been through certain things in their life doesn't give them the right to going life hurting other people, especially the ones who care for them most.  This person will not give the recoprocal of the love and attention and things you deserve from the relationship, that alone a healthy relationship.  It;s not your responsibility.  Keeping N.C. is the best thing I did, in a way it feels harsh, and of course they will spin it against us... . But you don't need that stress in your life, there are so many people you find healthier and happier relationships with, you just have to look for it and work for it.  Love doesn't just come that easy, and if it does, there are strings attached... . be careful and mindful of your needs and intentions... .

[Split black]

Yes they lie.  they lie all the time they live a lie.  they usually r lying to u from the begining they have an exit strategy from every relationship based on morelies which is why few relatuonships ever work out.  they will throw anyone under bus also.

This is spot on. I was amazed at the depth and density of her lies, deception and juggling. And at the end of the day... . she smeared me to important people in my life, lying and re-writing history... . for absolutely no reason what so fu*king ever. It was like some alien took over her body, but she is a total stranger to me,... . unrecognizable dead pin point pupils.

[Split black]

Dishonesty is par for the course with BPD in my experience, despite what the literature might suggest (offering people false hope I believe). The mirroring phase itself is deceptive. They have literally misrepresented themselves to you. They are not at all that person. I do understand why, of course, though it isn't much consolation when you've been in a relationship with such a person.

There is a template... . and this is part of it. Its absolutely surreal... . and no amount of sexual intensity is worth it... . was worth the confusion and anxiety.