What would you do?

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

Just to give you some background... .My BPD ex and I have been broken up little over a month, we have a 16 month old daughter so NO CONTACT isn't an option. We've worked out a verbal spit custody agreement that has been going rather smoothly despite the difficult and sudden breakup. My ex cheated on me with a guy that she's now madly in love with (I know typical)

My replacement (for lack of a better word) or rebound is now staying at her mothers house (where my ex is currently living) but I've yet to see him. Apparently my daughter has grown quite fond of him as well and I will eventually meet him because I'm always over there.

Question: How should I treat this guy?

I'd like to slap him silly, warn him, let him know his existence makes my blood boil and I don't approve of him spending as much time with my daughter as I do but I would never do anything to jeopardize my relationship with my daughter or cause drama.

He's a shy & seeming nice guy who has apparently never had a girlfriend before. I don't plan on shaking his hand but I don't want to ignore him either.

[BrokenFamily]

Just to give you some background... .My BPD ex and I have been broken up little over a month, we have a 16 month old daughter so NO CONTACT isn't an option. We've worked out a verbal spit custody agreement that has been going rather smoothly despite the difficult and sudden breakup. My ex cheated on me with a guy that she's now madly in love with (I know typical)

My replacement (for lack of a better word) or rebound is now staying at her mothers house (where my ex is currently living) but I've yet to see him. Apparently my daughter has grown quite fond of him as well and I will eventually meet him because I'm always over there.

Question: How should I treat this guy?

I'd like to slap him silly, warn him, let him know his existence makes my blood boil and I don't approve of him spending as much time with my daughter as I do but I would never do anything to jeopardize my relationship with my daughter or cause drama.

He's a shy & seeming nice guy who has apparently never had a girlfriend before. I don't plan on shaking his hand but I don't want to ignore him either.

[peiper]

Smile and be cordial.  You'll come out ahead that way.

[BrokenFamily]

That's the plan, I'm a bit curious to see the guy in person.

She's very attractive and from what I've seen (pictures on facebook) he isn't.

Also he has no car, lives with his mother and makes minimum wage.

The whole thing boggles my mind and eerks me to the bone!

[fromheeltoheal]

Best to remember that your ex is the one who cheated, and channel all your emotions that way.  Plus, if she does exhibit BPD traits we know what this guy is in for, and if it's his first relationship he may be scared off women for life; that's pretty brutal.  I say focus on your daughter and channel all the crap at your ex.  Take care of you!

[BrokenFamily]

I still tell her I love her, it's only been two months and I do still love her our beautiful family and all the fond memories. She's re-written history and only seems to remember the bad times while failing to realize the bad times were as result of her explosive temper, false accusations and name calling. I keep it mostly about our daughter in an effort to keep the peace but once again tonight I apologized for my reactions and practically pleaded with her to realize how much I love my family and would never do anything to jeopardize it. I stopped myself there as not to provoke or upset her but considered telling her that her new relationship is only based on her need to love and feel loved because of the emotional vacuum of love she misses and needs from me our daughter and the life she had. She's coping the best way she knows how and as much a think it's the worst thing for my daughter right now I love her unconditionally and will always be there for her as the mother of my child for the rest of my life. It just breaks my heart that she thinks this is a better option than fixing our BrokenFamily. She would rather jump ship than admitting she has a problem and facing the fact that her temper and up and down emotions/  mood swings and delusional thoughts tore our family apart. Below is a quote I read prior to writing this and it did somewhat influence my thought pattern so I figure I'll leave it here.    


quote author=Oliolioxenfree link=topic=216084.msg12363048#msg12363048 date=1387853766]To answer the question originally posed it's easy because they bury their feelings.  Most people who overlap or jump into a rebound do so to bury their feelings and feel better about themselves .  They feel like ok if someone else is interested it MUST not be my problem and it must be the fault of the other party.  They don't learn a damn thing from their relationships but rather bury feelings and go on the rebound.  But like all rebounds those feelings come up and manifest in new ways with the new partners.  

It's a coping mechanism it has nothing to do with the one they left but rather their own insecurities of being alone.  Overlappers learn nothing and therefore they are doomed to repeat the mistakes over and over again.  It's easy because it's the cowardly way out, a way to avoid responsibility and the pain of doing the healing work it takes to look within and form healthy relationships.  They are disordered and it's the obvious and often most common outcome for them, to our detriment .  :)on't think it's you.  It hurts and that sucks because you feel like you meant nothing but know it's not true.  The faster they replace you and move on the more you had a hold on them , the more you triggered them.  You did mean something and your replacement will face the same fate.  Be thankful they set you free, and be thankful they showed you how disorder they are.  They just gave you closure

Never for a second be fooled by their ability to move on so quickly,  all it means is that they cannot be without your companionship and will run to the next victim who is there at the right time right place.   Overlappers learn nothing and one day your replacement may find that they are overlapped too.  That I promise [/quote]
I second Moonie. That is an excellent summary I may save to read now and then. Thank you. If I were as juvenile as my x, I might even post it on FB... .I block her, but we have mutual friendsand some of her family, so probably not. [/quote]
I agree. It's funny how deep down we suspect this is what is happening, but it helps to read it to make it more real.  So thank you.  I think from the original question we can also ask ourselves:

a)if they cannot be alone it means that WE were the replacement at some point. How much do we know about THAT? I unfortunately have very little to go on.  He told me he'd been single for a while, but also kept mentionning ex girlfriends, so I obviously didn't believe what he said, or just didn't know WHAT to believe.

 

b)why are we so hurt by being replaced/cheated on/left for someone else? Having read a lot on these boards, that seems to be many people's breaking point... .I admit, for me it was a breaking point. I felt humiliated, when he cheated with two different women.  Then betrayed when he moved on to the replacement.  It's almost like it's worse than all other forms of abuse... .but why?[/quote]
In my case I found this out to be true. I thought the others were just replacing me and that I was the main one but what I found out I was just one in a string of many. He is Very good at making you feel special. He pulls put all the stops but in a way that doesn't make it feel over the top even though it really is.

I have now pieced together that he was working on me while in another relationship and he started working on others while with me. He loves that new admiration from a new source. He thrives on it. He eventually became immune to my supply. It just does not have the same effect over time as fresh new shiney supply.[/quote]

[BrokenFamily]

I still tell her I love her, it's only been two months and I do still love her our beautiful family and all the fond memories. She's re-written history and only seems to remember the bad times while failing to realize the bad times were as result of her explosive temper, false accusations and name calling. I keep it mostly about our daughter in an effort to keep the peace but once again tonight I apologized for my reactions and practically pleaded with her to realize how much I love my family and would never do anything to jeopardize it. I stopped myself there as not to provoke or upset her but considered telling her that her new relationship is only based on her need to love and feel loved because of the emotional vacuum of love she misses and needs from me our daughter and the life she had. She's coping the best way she knows how and as much a think it's the worst thing for my daughter right now I love her unconditionally and will always be there for her as the mother of my child for the rest of my life. It just breaks my heart that she thinks this is a better option than fixing our BrokenFamily. She would rather jump ship than admitting she has a problem and facing the fact that her temper and up and down emotions/  mood swings and delusional thoughts tore our family apart. Below is a quote I read prior to writing this and it did somewhat influence my thought pattern so I figure I'll leave it here.    


quote author=Oliolioxenfree link=topic=216084.msg12363048#msg12363048 date=1387853766]To answer the question originally posed it's easy because they bury their feelings.  Most people who overlap or jump into a rebound do so to bury their feelings and feel better about themselves .  They feel like ok if someone else is interested it MUST not be my problem and it must be the fault of the other party.  They don't learn a damn thing from their relationships but rather bury feelings and go on the rebound.  But like all rebounds those feelings come up and manifest in new ways with the new partners.  

It's a coping mechanism it has nothing to do with the one they left but rather their own insecurities of being alone.  Overlappers learn nothing and therefore they are doomed to repeat the mistakes over and over again.  It's easy because it's the cowardly way out, a way to avoid responsibility and the pain of doing the healing work it takes to look within and form healthy relationships.  They are disordered and it's the obvious and often most common outcome for them, to our detriment .  :)on't think it's you.  It hurts and that sucks because you feel like you meant nothing but know it's not true.  The faster they replace you and move on the more you had a hold on them , the more you triggered them.  You did mean something and your replacement will face the same fate.  Be thankful they set you free, and be thankful they showed you how disorder they are.  They just gave you closure

Never for a second be fooled by their ability to move on so quickly,  all it means is that they cannot be without your companionship and will run to the next victim who is there at the right time right place.   Overlappers learn nothing and one day your replacement may find that they are overlapped too.  That I promise

I second Moonie. That is an excellent summary I may save to read now and then. Thank you. If I were as juvenile as my x, I might even post it on FB... .I block her, but we have mutual friendsand some of her family, so probably not. [/quote]
I agree. It's funny how deep down we suspect this is what is happening, but it helps to read it to make it more real.  So thank you.  I think from the original question we can also ask ourselves:

a)if they cannot be alone it means that WE were the replacement at some point. How much do we know about THAT? I unfortunately have very little to go on.  He told me he'd been single for a while, but also kept mentionning ex girlfriends, so I obviously didn't believe what he said, or just didn't know WHAT to believe.

 

b)why are we so hurt by being replaced/cheated on/left for someone else? Having read a lot on these boards, that seems to be many people's breaking point... .I admit, for me it was a breaking point. I felt humiliated, when he cheated with two different women.  Then betrayed when he moved on to the replacement.  It's almost like it's worse than all other forms of abuse... .but why?[/quote]
In my case I found this out to be true. I thought the others were just replacing me and that I was the main one but what I found out I was just one in a string of many. He is Very good at making you feel special. He pulls put all the stops but in a way that doesn't make it feel over the top even though it really is.

I have now pieced together that he was working on me while in another relationship and he started working on others while with me. He loves that new admiration from a new source. He thrives on it. He eventually became immune to my supply. It just does not have the same effect over time as fresh new shiney supply.


Welp I went and sent her this after promising I wouldn't talk to her about anything but the baby for now on:

 

I'm sorry if it upsets you but I love you  

I really thought the other day I picked you up crying , gave you a hug & I held your hand and told you it was going to be okay that you'd consider couples therapy or talking to someone about your explosive temper and the fictitious stories you created about me and how badly you treated as result of the lies you made up in your head about me (the missing salad a girl I must have been having sex with ate)(the cigarettes I never even saw that you accused me and your best friends of plotting to take from you) and all the other accusations you made that were completely false about me , I was so happy I hugged you when I proved the dvds weren't takin by a random girl I was having sex with, cause I thought then you'd realize and talk to someone about it to get the help you need.

You and our daughter had a happy safe home with mommy and daddy that loved eachother and her a few months ago and look where we are now?

I wanted so bad to give her a chance at having the daddy and mommy married and working together to give her the best life possible.

You blocked me on Twitter so you can't even read all the messages of you saying:

"I will love you no matter what. I don't want you to change anything because you are amazing. Me and S are the luckiest girls in the world. She has you as a daddy and i have you as a boyfriend. The girl you spend the rest of your life with is one lucky girl. im getting really bad anxiety again my life was crazy before i met you and it got a little crazier but thank god my anxiety didn't come back and destroy me i just don't know what to do without you guys... .i don't want to go out and drink dude... .or even go out, I can't even function. This isn't easy for me."

Losing me our daughter; which you didn't lose WERE STILL HERE and we love you more than anyone in the world , You need to feel loved and appreciated by someone and (this new guy) just happened to be there; But no two people in the world love and need you more than me and our daughter

Your BrokenFamily Baby & I love you ! **More than anyone else ever can

[CareTaker]

BrokenFamily, geez, my heart goes out for you and your daughter. I can imagine your pain, and I now know why I left the relationship even though I loved my ex. I just could not have that baby she so desperately wanted. Something was just telling me not to do it.

Reading your story, really brings peace to my heart. And I am so thankful that I took all the abuse, and paid all the bills, yet I never crossed that border and made my ex pregnant.

It has been 2 months of b/u for me, and was replaced within 2 weeks. I still have an off day, but really feeling much better now. Thanks to you guys on this forum.

I don't have advice for you, but your post really did it for me. Words like yours, make me feel proud of my 6th sense and speeds up the recovery knowing I am not the loser in my relationship.

Keep reading and writing on this forum. The people here are amazing and like me, you too will find your answer.

God bless

[BrokenFamily]

I was replaced the following day, after being told she was the happiest she's ever been and love me more than she's loved anyone ever. I'll never regret my daughter but I do regret she is in the circumstances she is now.

[fromheeltoheal]

I'm so sorry you're going through all of this Broken, it is very painful.  You found this site for a reason, and I haven't read your whole story, but this post sums it up it seems.  Borderlines have and unstable sense of self, which you may have noticed, but telling you she loves you and then packing up the next day is to the extreme.  Borderlines also feel everything intensely, and the love she was expressing, 'more than she's loved anyone ever' could have been very triggering for her, and she dealt with it in a way that may have seemed like the only option; there's a point in a relationship with a borderline where we stop being the soother to the emotions and become the trigger, which has nothing to do with us.  Standard borderline here, take what you need and leave the rest if it doesn't fit.  Also, there's the push/pull dynamic, where a borderline wants to merge with someone to feel whole, but once they do they feel engulfed, like they'll lose themselves, so they push us away, only to feel abandoned, and then repeat. 

There's a discussion about borderlines as parents in an article on this site that may have something useful: https://bpdfamily.com/content/why-we-struggle-in-relationships

Hang in there man, and take care of you and your daughter!

[Mutt]

We've worked out a verbal spit custody agreement

BrokenFamily,

I'm sorry to hear about your family.

You need to look at the big picture. Things can change on a dime with an ex with BPD. You cannot take her word on a verbal agreement. Think about your D. You need to get a court ordered custody agreement.

Your putting too much trust in her with a verbal agreement. Why haven't you got a legal separation agreement? Or start mediation or a consensual court order?

[ForeverDad]

Sadly, you can't reason with someone who isn't listening to you.  Likely all your efforts would be sabotaged - or even used against you - by her emotional perceptions/baggage of the ending/ended relationship.  Typically all ended relationships are blamed on the other person, that's her Denial, the Blaming and Blame-Shifting.

She's an adult, she's allowed to live her life her way, right or wrong.  You can't try to change or help her because it's possible such efforts could be claimed in court that you are a "controller" or even an "angry controller".  So if she doesn't want to listen, you better not try to make her listen.  The only exception is if she were to start therapy, diligently apply it in her life and do so for years, often a perceptive and emotionally-neutral professional can make progress toward recovery if the person sticks with and consistently applies meaningful therapy.  Around here those are very poor odds.  Since you can't change her, at least not for long, focus on what you can change (yourself) and affect (your parenting).

When you go to family court remember that it likely won't try to change her either, they generally deal with people as they are.  For that reason you should document her poor behaviors both as insurance to defend yourself and as basis to seek as much parenting time and authority as possible.  For most of us the courts ignored efforts to get a diagnosis, didn't want us to "play doctor" and dealt with the parents based partly on their policies and rules and partly on the behaviors and behavior pattens.  You are wise if you do the same, focus on her poor behaviors.  The courts will pay more attention to the parenting behaviors and so don't get stuck talking about her adult relationship behaviors.

[BrokenFamily]

Full custody is a future goal of mine because my daughter is in the same dysfunctional house where my ex learned this behavior. Given my current financial condition and an overwhelming work schedule it just isn't possible at this time. Her mother is becoming frustrated waking up at 7am to care for our daughter while her daughter sleeps till noon but would never admit to it in court. Soon after the baby was born her mother made a comment that she was "so excited to have another opportunity to raise a child and do it right this time." My ex wasn't but I was offended by this statement and asked her what she meant but that. Her response was "My daughter can't even take care of herself let alone a child." She was right I was burning the candle at both ends not sleeping for almost a year working full-time, being up at 7am to care for our child, paying all the bills and taking care of our home while my ex slept late and woke up angry. I know her plan is to seek full custody but it's only because she see's our daughter an an object that she wants, not a daughter she is willing to be there for and care for. I own the clean stable home where my daughter has lived in since the day she was born, I've taken her to every doctors appointment and provide her health care. I also purchased all her toys, clothing and food since the day she was born and have no criminal record. My ex has been institutionalized, fired from every job and lives with 4 active alcoholics that all have rage issues and criminal records. My daughter is without a room a bed and has no sleep schedule when she's there. Unfortunately the back log of custody hearings in our city is over a year unless DHS gets involved. I fear calling them will create an impossible environment for my daughter and even more stress.   

[Loveofhislife]

Broken--from a person who worked in our child welfare system, I firmly believe no child should be subjected to abuse. I'm so sorry that it's your daughter, and if you feel that she is at risk of any abuse; I would advise that you get DHS involved. I'm sure that you're so full of hurt and denial and disbelief at this point, but your D's safety is paramount, and from your description , it doesn't sound like a very safe environment to me. Do you have a trusted therapist? Where I live, a licensed counselor (or even a daycare worker) has a compulsion by law to report abuse. Your not reporting it, in some cases, could be considered neglect. I'm really, really sorry for what you're going through.