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Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse... Have you considered that being critical, judgmental, or invalidating toward the other parent, no matter what she or he just did will only make matters worse? Someone has to be do something. This means finding the motivation to stop making things worse, learning how to interrupt your own negative responses, body language, facial expressions, voice tone, and learning how to inhibit your urges to do things that you later realize are contributing to the tensions.
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Author Topic: Do you guys still have dreams of the pwBPDex?  (Read 756 times)
rotiroti
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« on: July 30, 2015, 12:53:10 PM »

Do you guys still have dreams or nightmares about your exes?

They're definitely happening less frequently, I had the first one in a long time last night and wanted to share the experience --


In the dream she was happy, laughing, and was so happy to see me. Me, on the other hand, had a smile but felt really distant and sad.

I know that dreams are just dreams, but it's also comforting to have my subsciously telling me about how unhappy I was in the r/s. It was extremely good timing, I was actually posting on the staying board yesterday wondering if I could salvage a friendship with my ex-fiancee.
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« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2015, 02:38:28 PM »

Funny you should post this today, as I had a dream last night about my exBPD.  It had been a few weeks, so it was unnerving.

I went back to work, where we met, to get my classroom ready.  The last time I was there was the day after I saw her for the last time and a week before she discarded me.  So, everything was a trigger.  When I sat at my desk and ate lunch, I almost expected to look up and see her sitting where she always sat. 

In my dream, she had come back to work (not possible, as she's moving across the country soon and has no job) and was covering a class for me because I had a meeting.  We hadn't seen each other or spoken to each other since she discarded me, and I just had this need to contact her.  So, I e-mailed her and asked her to make sure that she took attendance and wrote it down.  In my dream, I just kept checking my e-mail all day, hoping to get a reply from her.  I never did. 
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« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2015, 03:04:13 PM »

Hey Never-

I dreamt about my ex daily for maybe 9 months, different situations but always the same theme: she's off with some stud and totally dissing me, full color dreams too, the intense ones, where the rest of mine are in black and white.  I choose to believe our brain is busy re-making sense of the world when we're asleep and dreams are a peek into the process, and one day my dreams with her in them stopped entirely, rewiring done.  She hasn't made an appearance in a dream in a long time, last night's was my bookkeeper naked in my hot tub, which is back to 'normal', so we're good.  I say let them happen and they'll stop when they're supposed to, and any info you get from them is a bonus.
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rotiroti
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« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2015, 03:56:41 PM »

Excerpt
... .last night's was my bookkeeper naked in my hot tub, which is back to 'normal', so we're good.

Laugh out loud (click to insert in post) Laugh out loud (click to insert in post) Laugh out loud (click to insert in post) Laugh out loud (click to insert in post) Laugh out loud (click to insert in post) Laugh out loud (click to insert in post) Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2015, 12:59:03 PM »

2 years out here, and once in a while he makes a cameo in a dream.  The dreams help me measure where I am in my healing process.  They used to send me into a funk, or upset me.  Now I'm not triggered and I don't feel the need to write about them in my dream journal.  I had one about a week ago that helped me realize that I've had lingering feelings of guilt about leaving him.  Life isn't easy for him.  I want him to be okay, and happy.  In the dream, he was getting help and working on his issues.  I sure felt a sense of relief the next day.  I felt like a big weight on my shoulders had lifted.  Nice dream... . 
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« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2015, 05:10:52 PM »

Funny thing about dreams, how they seem so real but aren't. Can't the same be said about our experiences?

The person you fell in love with... .Was that a projection of the subconscious?

When they discard us, who are they discarding? We're still here.
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blissful_camper
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« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2015, 06:35:39 PM »

Funny thing about dreams, how they seem so real but aren't. Can't the same be said about our experiences?

The person you fell in love with... .Was that a projection of the subconscious?

When they discard us, who are they discarding? We're still here.

Interesting question.  Here's an idea though it could be flawed:

Are they discarding themselves, or parts of themselves? 

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rotiroti
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« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2015, 06:47:53 PM »

blissful_camper,

I yearn to have that similar dream! What I struggle with most these days are feeling the guilt that I left someone who was hurting. I know that I am not responsible nor am able to fix that, but you know how it  is. It's hard to know someone who once shared a love is sad and suffering somewhere (or perhaps they are not!).

Excerpt
Are they discarding themselves, or parts of themselves?

That's an interesting twist. Especially for us exes who have become triggers, we could be representations of some of their internal disappointments.

Happy Friday all! It's a beautiful summer night and it's going to be a full moon :D
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« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2015, 07:16:30 PM »

Funny thing about dreams, how they seem so real but aren't. Can't the same be said about our experiences?

And what we call reality when we're awake, what if that's really a dream?  What if transcendence happens the trance ends?  Hmmm... .

 

Excerpt
The person you fell in love with... .Was that a projection of the subconscious?

Good call there; we fell in love with a projection that was mirrored back to us.

Excerpt
When they discard us, who are they discarding? We're still here.

A borderline attaches to feel whole, to complete themselves.  It's a 'perfect' attachment, a reenactment of the symbiotic bond they had with their mother.  We all do that to an extent, although as most people detached from their mother they developed a 'self' of their own, still one that misses that initial bond, but a self nonetheless; a borderline never does that, so when the 'perfect' attachment proves imperfect and the emotions skyrocket, time for another attachment, another shot at 'perfect'.  And repeat.
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rotiroti
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« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2015, 07:29:25 PM »

Funny thing about dreams, how they seem so real but aren't. Can't the same be said about our experiences?

And what we call reality when we're awake, what if that's really a dream?  What if transcendence happens the trance ends?  Hmmm... .

 

(queue grateful dead music)




f2h2, what was your one 'ah-ha' moment when you realized the attachment behind BPD?
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« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2015, 07:33:25 PM »

My dreams are so obvious.

I dream of what I am suppressing.

I have dreams of him... .often when I am "forgetting" him in real life.

I have dreams of my SD.  This disturbs my emotions greatly.
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« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2015, 08:09:47 PM »

And what we call reality when we're awake, what if that's really a dream?  What if when transcendence happens the trance ends?  Hmmm... .

f2h2, what was your one 'ah-ha' moment when you realized the attachment behind BPD?

Wasn't really a moment, more of a process: as I read about the behaviors exhibited by borderlines they described my ex to a tee, so I knew I was onto something, and then I read the clinical side of how what started as order became disorder in early development, and that explained why she does what she does.  None of that helped with the emotional side, but the confusion vanished immediately, which was one piece of detachment, a welcome one.
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« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2015, 08:47:23 PM »

blissful_camper,

I yearn to have that similar dream! What I struggle with most these days are feeling the guilt that I left someone who was hurting. I know that I am not responsible nor am able to fix that, but you know how it  is. It's hard to know someone who once shared a love is sad and suffering somewhere (or perhaps they are not!).

Excerpt
Are they discarding themselves, or parts of themselves?

That's an interesting twist. Especially for us exes who have become triggers, we could be representations of some of their internal disappointments.

Happy Friday all! It's a beautiful summer night and it's going to be a full moon :D

Yay, full moon! 

It's really tough to leave someone behind who's hurting.  I worried a lot after the b/u because the environment he was in wasn't all that healthy.  I worried he would worsen.  Yep, I totally get the feelings of guilt. 

I'm wishing you a similar dream. :-)

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« Reply #13 on: August 02, 2015, 11:51:20 AM »

I still dream about my exBPDbf, 16 months out. The main difference now is how the dreams affect me. They no longer leave me feeling sad or angry or guilty or much of anything.

What I struggle with most these days are feeling the guilt that I left someone who was hurting. I know that I am not responsible nor am able to fix that, but you know how it  is. It's hard to know someone who once shared a love is sad and suffering somewhere

 I understand the guilt. You're absolutely right that you aren't responsible or able to fix your ex's pain or disorder. But it does hurt. It's important to try to reframe how we view this sense of helplessness and guilt. Instead of looking at it as "I left someone who was hurting" - it becomes "I ended an unhealthy relationship." Unhealthy relationships are unhealthy for both parties.

It's perfectly understandable to be sad about knowing that a loved one is suffering. Let yourself be sad about that. But don't take on the burden of unrealistic responsibility. I know it's hard, but it's not fair to you to keep feeling guilt over something completely out of your control.

The person you fell in love with... .Was that a projection of the subconscious?

Good call there; we fell in love with a projection that was mirrored back to us.

disorderedsociety, very insightful observation. As h2h said, in most cases we fell for an idealized projection that was mirrored back to us.

I'm shamelessly (and lazily) self-quoting because I don't think I could say it this morning better than I said it here.  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)

[Your core traits] provide a foundation for your "false self" - which is more about the manifestations of these traits to the world, and in relationships.

We all have different facets of ourselves that we show to different groups of people. It's self-protection as well as adapting to society, community, and different situations. As long as all of our facets are authentic reflections of our core values and needs, we can be healthy and happy.

Often, though, we have parts that don't necessarily reflect this... .familiar patterns that maybe aren't the healthiest for us personally... .sometimes we're not even entirely sure what we need or value. Not because we're not whole people underneath, but because we've not taken the time and effort to explore ourselves. Maybe we've been getting along just fine. Maybe we haven't, but we still haven't delved deeply enough into ourselves to change it.

Being people who have a core Self (unlike a borderline), our "false selves" are less like masks put on to hide blank faces and more like armor/weapons that protect our inner selves. They're tied to who we are and who we want to be. There are good, healthy parts there that we should keep and build on - and there are parts that don't serve us well, and in fact prevent us from living authentically. Part of the rebuilding process is deciding which parts to keep and which to discard, in favor of realizing who we really are and living in such a way to honor that.

Your "false self" is individual to you - a complex narrative constructed since your earliest experiences. But for people who get involved with borderlines, they're usually along the thematic lines of rescuer/fixer, understanding-driven, or narcissistic. It's very possible this particular "false self" hasn't popped up in such full force since its initial creation, way back in childhood - borderlines are really the perfect partners to bring them out. A relationship with a self-disordered person forces this deconstruction. That's both the reason for the sheer ego- and soul-shattering devastation, and the gift of these relationships.

How do you know what your own "false self" is? Your BPD relationship will show you.

A borderline partner mirrors an idealized version of this "false self" in the early stages of the relationship. (Along with the love-bombing and other BPD methods of ensuring a fast bond.) And then, when that "false self" is devalued and discarded by the borderline - and you realize that what's always worked for you in the past is no longer working - you are eventually stripped of this protective self.

Look at what you were shown, in its fullest glory, in the beginning. Look at what stopped working for you. Look at who you were when you were at your most stripped and vulnerable. The answers to who you are lie there.
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« Reply #14 on: August 02, 2015, 12:43:40 PM »

Nice Happy!  That one's suitable for framing, and thanks for quoting you.

Often, though, we have parts that don't necessarily reflect this... .familiar patterns that maybe aren't the healthiest for us personally... .sometimes we're not even entirely sure what we need or value. Not because we're not whole people underneath, but because we've not taken the time and effort to explore ourselves. Maybe we've been getting along just fine. Maybe we haven't, but we still haven't delved deeply enough into ourselves to change it.

And adding to that, it's very beneficial to discover what our values are, and how we order them, prioritize them.  If we've never looked before it can be very enlightening, some we didn't know we had, some we knew we had but don't know where they came from, some are in conflict with others, some are not serving us, some are in the wrong order.  Just poking around a little can be profound.  Now that I've looked, I've decided my first 4 values, in order of importance, are:



  • Health and Vitality


  • Love and Acceptance


  • Courage


  • Integrity




And yes, I realize the first two are combos, and that's because I say so, it fits for me.  And it's important for me to realize those are goals and areas of focus, not hard and fast rules, so I get to cut myself some slack when I'm not living in accordance with them, which also usually means I'm indulging in a false self.

What are your top ones peeps?
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SummerStorm
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« Reply #15 on: August 02, 2015, 07:19:51 PM »

Terrible nightmare about my exBPD last night.  She had a complete psychotic break and was diagnosed with having just about everything imaginable.  Schizophrenia, BPD, DID.  You name it, she had it.  In the dream, I tried to talk to her, but there was just nothing there.  She was nothing, just a mess of disorders.

I woke up with a racing heart and a sick feeling in my stomach.  It was such a vivid dream.
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« Reply #16 on: August 02, 2015, 07:38:11 PM »

Terrible nightmare about my exBPD last night.  She had a complete psychotic break and was diagnosed with having just about everything imaginable.  Schizophrenia, BPD, DID.  You name it, she had it.  In the dream, I tried to talk to her, but there was just nothing there.  She was nothing, just a mess of disorders.

I woke up with a racing heart and a sick feeling in my stomach.  It was such a vivid dream.

Yeah, I've had those Summer.  Did it mean anything to you and/or did you learn anything?
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disorderedsociety
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« Reply #17 on: August 02, 2015, 09:05:22 PM »

[Your core traits] provide a foundation for your "false self" - which is more about the manifestations of these traits to the world, and in relationships.

We all have different facets of ourselves that we show to different groups of people. It's self-protection as well as adapting to society, community, and different situations. As long as all of our facets are authentic reflections of our core values and needs, we can be healthy and happy.

Often, though, we have parts that don't necessarily reflect this... .familiar patterns that maybe aren't the healthiest for us personally... .sometimes we're not even entirely sure what we need or value. Not because we're not whole people underneath, but because we've not taken the time and effort to explore ourselves. Maybe we've been getting along just fine. Maybe we haven't, but we still haven't delved deeply enough into ourselves to change it.

Being people who have a core Self (unlike a borderline), our "false selves" are less like masks put on to hide blank faces and more like armor/weapons that protect our inner selves. They're tied to who we are and who we want to be. There are good, healthy parts there that we should keep and build on - and there are parts that don't serve us well, and in fact prevent us from living authentically. Part of the rebuilding process is deciding which parts to keep and which to discard, in favor of realizing who we really are and living in such a way to honor that.

Your "false self" is individual to you - a complex narrative constructed since your earliest experiences. But for people who get involved with borderlines, they're usually along the thematic lines of rescuer/fixer, understanding-driven, or narcissistic. It's very possible this particular "false self" hasn't popped up in such full force since its initial creation, way back in childhood - borderlines are really the perfect partners to bring them out. A relationship with a self-disordered person forces this deconstruction. That's both the reason for the sheer ego- and soul-shattering devastation, and the gift of these relationships.

How do you know what your own "false self" is? Your BPD relationship will show you.

A borderline partner mirrors an idealized version of this "false self" in the early stages of the relationship. (Along with the love-bombing and other BPD methods of ensuring a fast bond.) And then, when that "false self" is devalued and discarded by the borderline - and you realize that what's always worked for you in the past is no longer working - you are eventually stripped of this protective self.

Look at what you were shown, in its fullest glory, in the beginning. Look at what stopped working for you. Look at who you were when you were at your most stripped and vulnerable. The answers to who you are lie there.[/color]

Wow, good info there. I think the relationship with my BPD mother created a false self that carried over to my relationship with this ex. I always felt like I was the parent when I was a child, and my ex wanted me to have children with her, but I didn't really want that deep down. Obligation kept me there as fear did when I was a kid and had to live at home.

So my question is... .If they meet someone that presumably doesn't have any false sense of self (which, the replacement very well might) how will their relationship be? Because she didn't seem crazy all the time, but I haven't quite sorted out what was manipulation and bs on her part yet.
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« Reply #18 on: August 02, 2015, 09:43:18 PM »

Terrible nightmare about my exBPD last night.  She had a complete psychotic break and was diagnosed with having just about everything imaginable.  Schizophrenia, BPD, DID.  You name it, she had it.  In the dream, I tried to talk to her, but there was just nothing there.  She was nothing, just a mess of disorders.

I woke up with a racing heart and a sick feeling in my stomach.  It was such a vivid dream.

Yeah, I've had those Summer.  :)id it mean anything to you and/or did you learn anything?

I think it stems from her deciding on NC and not giving me a reason why.  The last time I saw her was when she was in the behavioral care unit.  The last time I didn't hear from her and then didn't see her was the day she was rushed to the hospital.  I could have lost her that day.  The last text I had from her before her goodbye text was "Ok." I've also never gotten to express to her how she's hurt me.  In the dream, I try, but I can't because it's like it's not even her anymore.
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So when will this end it goes on and on/Over and over and over again/Keep spinning around I know that it won't stop/Till I step down from this for good - Lifehouse "Sick Cycle Carousel"
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« Reply #19 on: August 02, 2015, 10:02:09 PM »

Terrible nightmare about my exBPD last night.  She had a complete psychotic break and was diagnosed with having just about everything imaginable.  Schizophrenia, BPD, DID.  You name it, she had it.  In the dream, I tried to talk to her, but there was just nothing there.  She was nothing, just a mess of disorders.

I woke up with a racing heart and a sick feeling in my stomach.  It was such a vivid dream.

Yeah, I've had those Summer.  :)id it mean anything to you and/or did you learn anything?

I think it stems from her deciding on NC and not giving me a reason why.  The last time I saw her was when she was in the behavioral care unit.  The last time I didn't hear from her and then didn't see her was the day she was rushed to the hospital.  I could have lost her that day.  The last text I had from her before her goodbye text was "Ok." I've also never gotten to express to her how she's hurt me.  In the dream, I try, but I can't because it's like it's not even her anymore.

So that tells me your brain is looking for closure, and it will find it, you'll know when the dreams stop.  That's also why I think the closure we give ourselves is the most powerful.
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rotiroti
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« Reply #20 on: August 02, 2015, 10:27:05 PM »

@Nihilist, thank you for that thoughtful response! I still struggle to see the 'false self' theory in practice and it helps to see it explained.

FH2H,

That's a good list. I think I would put "love and acceptance" as my one value that I can apply to just about all aspects to my life.

--------

I had another dream yesterday. It was weird:

1. It was the beginning of August and I was reminded by a kind and gentlevoice that life always moves forward. I have a huge licensing exam coming up in 2 weeks and I think it was my subconscious telling me to kick out the funk and get down to studying! I don't think that would be possible without you guys on here.

2. I dreamt that I had a daughter who I was very proud of. Righteous, smart, and lovable. I was also reminded that I was a good father... .

the thing is I don't have any kids. Whatever those 2 dreams meant, it left me in a good place!
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