Do they not know they are setting us up to be hurt?

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

Why do they insist that they will never leave you, when that is impossible? My ex would repeatedly tell me that she wasn't going anywhere. I even started an argument at one point in time doubting she loved me (should have listened to my gut) and she went on for days ensuring me that she loved me. She would do anything to convince me that she wouldn't leave.

Do they not have any memories of their past relationships? Do they not remember they felt this way 1000 times before and it didnt work out? Is there any empathy in there at all?

I can understand having a fear of being alone, but I don't know what the point is of making promises you know you can't keep, even when they aren't needed at all. Its like she had to make me think she wasn't going anywhere, even when early in the R/S and I didn't mind.

[Schermarhorn]

Why do they insist that they will never leave you, when that is impossible? My ex would repeatedly tell me that she wasn't going anywhere. I even started an argument at one point in time doubting she loved me (should have listened to my gut) and she went on for days ensuring me that she loved me. She would do anything to convince me that she wouldn't leave.

Do they not have any memories of their past relationships? Do they not remember they felt this way 1000 times before and it didnt work out? Is there any empathy in there at all?

I can understand having a fear of being alone, but I don't know what the point is of making promises you know you can't keep, even when they aren't needed at all. Its like she had to make me think she wasn't going anywhere, even when early in the R/S and I didn't mind.

[greenmonkey]

speaking from my experience - my ex had no real memories apart from the fabricated memories she made up in her own head of how our relationship was as to the reality that she lived.

She also had t be the victim - and she could do no wrong - everyone else was the bad one and she took no responsibility for her own actions and subsequent demise of any relationship.

I believe she was aware how much hurt and damage she was causing, but her immaturity meant she could not comprehend the outcome and how much the hurt actually hurt as it was not about her.

She made promises she could never keep to her young son of 11, which was bad enough, her life was full of regrets because she was always looking for her next shiny new toy and was incapable of adult relationships and the the fact it is about give and take as she could only take everything and then destroy that person as much as she could.

Her memory as she described it was cotton wool and she was numb incapable of feelings.

[soar]

This question is currently chewing me up as it's my ex's birthday today.

I completely relate to what greenmonkey said - always playing the victim and taking no responsibility for her actions. My ex exactly.

It's so dreadfully painful for me though. I felt so close to my ex at the time and she's gone on to hurt me... so badly. It's absolutely shameful and all I ever wanted her to do was take responsibility but she can't and it's a horrible truth that I'm struggling to accept.

It always confuses me how these people can clearly relate to pain but they dish it out like there's no tomorrow, it's so conflicted... .i guess it's mental illness and that's that.

[Loosestrife]

I think BPDs do love and feel an awful amount of guilt for the pain they cause, but they are on autopilot to get their own needs met... .a bit like a 3 year old.

[FannyB]

They have a tendency to re-write history to avoid feeling shame for their actions. For example, my ex finished with me. When we got back together that was re-written as me finishing with her!    By that maxim, I would guess that all past relationships are re-written to absolve themselves of responsibility and to blame break-ups on their partner's imperfections.  This perpetuates the victim mentality and allows them to treat you as 'the one' whilst conveniently forgetting that they've been down this path before. As Loosestrife said - just like a 3 year old.

[balletomane]

This question is currently chewing me up as it's my ex's birthday today.

I completely relate to what greenmonkey said - always playing the victim and taking no responsibility for her actions. My ex exactly.

It's so dreadfully painful for me though. I felt so close to my ex at the time and she's gone on to hurt me... so badly. It's absolutely shameful and all I ever wanted her to do was take responsibility but she can't and it's a horrible truth that I'm struggling to accept.

It always confuses me how these people can clearly relate to pain but they dish it out like there's no tomorrow, it's so conflicted... .i guess it's mental illness and that's that.

My ex's birthday was a couple of days ago. It was hard. I hope you're feeling OK.

I used to feel that if only my ex could see what he'd done to me and say sorry, I would be able to start healing. I needed that recognition of my hurt. I didn't want him to blame himself or feel guilty - I accepted that it was the result of his mental distress, I had no judgment for him, I just wanted him to see how I was feeling and to understand why I hurt. But he couldn't.

He didn't just want me to understand his behaviour, he wanted me to see his behaviour as completely normal and fine. He could be compassionate to me (in fact, he can be the kindest, gentlest person you've ever met), but only when the pain came from some source other than him. For a while I pretended that the PTSD-type difficulties I had developed from our relationship were just depression that had appeared for no clear reason, because that way he was kind to me. Learning that he never would recognise his role in my pain, much less say sorry for it, was a very bitter thing. But it also galvanised my healing. I couldn't sit waiting around for that apology for any longer. As hard as it might be, I have to get better without any contribution from him.

Sometimes I think people with BPD have trouble realising that more than one person can be in pain at a time. My ex seemed to feel that if he was hurting, I couldn't be. Maybe he just didn't have the emotional capacity to imagine my pain as well as bear his own. He also could not seem to see the hurtfulness in his own behaviour. During our breakup I told him that sometimes I am terrified of him and what he'll say next. He exploded, saying that I was pretending to be afraid of him in order to trap him with guilt and make him feel worse. Later he insisted that I had taken all his vicious remarks and cruel behaviour 'out of context'; it hadn't really been like that. Most of these incident he didn't even remember. (Eventually he accused me of making them up.) It's hard to avoid hurting someone if you honestly can't even see why your actions would be hurtful, or you just forget about them once the incident is over.

[SGraham]

I do believe they understand how they are hurting people. My ex used BPD tumblr posts to articulate why she was discarding me. They followed:

1. Falling in love with someone and one day feeling nothing and having to hurt them.

2. When we alienate someone it is often involuntary, please don't take it personally, it is an odd self defence mechanism.

3. Not being emotionally available for loved ones because its to triggering.

4. Being able to drop all feelings for someone who, moments before, meant the world to you.

So i can't speak for anyone else but i truly believe my ex did know that i was going to get hurt and im sure she felt bad about it, that's why she alienated my to the degree she did, it was a way for her to avoid the shame.

[reflection]

Do they not have any memories of their past relationships? Do they not remember they felt this way 1000 times before and it didnt work out? Is there any empathy in there at all?

I think BPD sufferers idealize which lead them to believe that their current relationship is the one that's going to end up like they've fantasized. I think my ex really believed we would be together forever. Slowly though I think she realized how different and difficult reality was and instead of facing the pain and dealing with it like an adult she had to remove herself from the shattered image to avoid the pain. There's quote from the movie Dodgeball uttered by Vince Vaughn that goes "if you don't have expectations then you will never be disappointed." I love that quote because I find it hilarious and true. I think for BPD sufferers their expectations are so unreasonably high that when they are not met they are so hurt / disappointed that they can't tolerate the pain and must run.

[blissful_camper]

My ex felt much guilt about the pain he had caused others.  He hadn't processed those experiences and many events, decades later, continued to haunt him. I cannot imagine living like that each day.  While he openly expressed he was afraid of hurting others, I feel that his need to have his needs met drives him to do what he feels is required for his survival.  He pursues what he feels he needs, and I think that he genuinely hopes that his relationships will last.

[Loosestrife]

it's a path of self destructions for self deception on a quest to live the fantasy fairy tale. They know they shouldn't take us with them but they get so lonely and we are willing followers!  I will always have a bit of hope my ex does the work and comes back but I know that's my fantasy. In the mean time I will move on and rebuild my life.

[rotiroti]

Do they not have any memories of their past relationships? Do they not remember they felt this way 1000 times before and it didnt work out? Is there any empathy in there at all?

I think BPD sufferers idealize which lead them to believe that their current relationship is the one that's going to end up like they've fantasized. I think my ex really believed we would be together forever. Slowly though I think she realized how different and difficult reality was and instead of facing the pain and dealing with it like an adult she had to remove herself from the shattered image to avoid the pain. There's quote from the movie Dodgeball uttered by Vince Vaughn that goes "if you don't have expectations then you will never be disappointed." I love that quote because I find it hilarious and true. I think for BPD sufferers their expectations are so unreasonably high that when they are not met they are so hurt / disappointed that they can't tolerate the pain and must run.

BPD in a nutshell & a dodgeball quote? Awesome!

What you said also goes with that SGraham wrote above you. Splitting can occur suddenly and a pwBPD can have insight that something might be wrong with them. Either case we get discarded for the time being

[apollotech]

I feel that his need to have his needs met drives him to do what he feels is required for his survival.  He pursues what he feels he needs, and I think that he genuinely hopes that his relationships will last.

That ^^^^ is how I see it. I don't think that a pwBPD gets into a relationship with malicious intent to hurt the other party. I think, as blissful says, like all of us, they enter relationships hoping for the best. Unfortunately for all involved, the disorder often dictates an undesirable outcome; the disorder, not the person, "sets up" both people for failure.

[JohnnyShoes]

Possibly ... Projection ?

When they say "I will never leave you"... .

What they are really wanting is for the Non to say that they will never leave THEM.

[Mutt]

Hi Schermarhorn,

I even started an argument at one point in time doubting she loved me (should have listened to my gut) and she went on for days ensuring me that she loved me. She would do anything to convince me that she wouldn't leave.

I can see how it would be confusing when our ex would try to convince us when we would feel doubt.

Others have said 3 year old and splitting and a pwBPD are emotionally arrested around that age and I think that the person can also exaggerate their feelings like a young child would with dichotomous thinking or black and white thinking. You were split white when she went on for days.