It... ended

[Beware of Junk Psychology...]

Me and my uBPDxgf broke up 5 weeks ago, and were NC for 3 weeks until today.

I received and e-mail from her, telling me to stop bothering people asking about how she was doing (thats all I did), and we got into another argument where she threw every nasty way of making me feel worthless she could.

A couple of hours later she says she wants to have an honest conversation(despite being a little drunk, ), and proceeds to clarify she never did cheat on me, despite having thousands of opportunities and wishing she actually did have the guts to do it, because I didnt respect and lied to her (although she did hook up with a guy from her college two days after we had a fight and she had blocked me everywhere, but she "doesnt have to explain herself for something she did when she was single, heh". And that she does hate me, and is with someone else... .two guys, actually. And they know each other. She moved on to an open relationship.

That was it, she played with me making me believe she was cheating on me, to move on and actually be with two men at the same time? I began to feel sorry for them, sharing their girlfriend with another guy, basically having no pride, or whatever it is that takes someone to agree to it (thats just how I feel about ORs in general, though).

On a side note, she did suggest an OR when we were first starting our r/s.

She said I was describing me, and, yes, I was so eager to please her I f*ucked with myself, but I never agreed to such thing. I said that, for the good of both of us, it would be better if we kept at least LC, as I dont enjoy arguing with her.

And I did tell her, as someone who worries about her, to look into BPD. She did, but of course didnt care or didnt "fit".

Ended with wishing her nothing but happiness, to which she replied she'll be "happy as long as she's not with me".

Now I know she probably wont be happy with anyone, and I doubt she truly is happy now.

[Forteventur]

Me and my uBPDxgf broke up 5 weeks ago, and were NC for 3 weeks until today.

I received and e-mail from her, telling me to stop bothering people asking about how she was doing (thats all I did), and we got into another argument where she threw every nasty way of making me feel worthless she could.

A couple of hours later she says she wants to have an honest conversation(despite being a little drunk, ), and proceeds to clarify she never did cheat on me, despite having thousands of opportunities and wishing she actually did have the guts to do it, because I didnt respect and lied to her (although she did hook up with a guy from her college two days after we had a fight and she had blocked me everywhere, but she "doesnt have to explain herself for something she did when she was single, heh". And that she does hate me, and is with someone else... .two guys, actually. And they know each other. She moved on to an open relationship.

That was it, she played with me making me believe she was cheating on me, to move on and actually be with two men at the same time? I began to feel sorry for them, sharing their girlfriend with another guy, basically having no pride, or whatever it is that takes someone to agree to it (thats just how I feel about ORs in general, though).

On a side note, she did suggest an OR when we were first starting our r/s.

She said I was describing me, and, yes, I was so eager to please her I f*ucked with myself, but I never agreed to such thing. I said that, for the good of both of us, it would be better if we kept at least LC, as I dont enjoy arguing with her.

And I did tell her, as someone who worries about her, to look into BPD. She did, but of course didnt care or didnt "fit".

Ended with wishing her nothing but happiness, to which she replied she'll be "happy as long as she's not with me".

Now I know she probably wont be happy with anyone, and I doubt she truly is happy now.

[musherx]

Some people are outstanding at savaging your soul. I'm sorry. I hope you can keep NC, and your probably right. She'll never be happy.

[unicorn2014]

Foreventur I am very sorry you went through this.  :'(

Do you see the side bar?

Attachment leads to suffering

Detachment leads to freedom

Have you heard of al-anon? That's where I first learned about detachment when I was in a relationship with an alcoholic. It took a very long time to sink in.

Have you ever read any Buddhist teachings? Detachment is a very prevalent idea in that philosophy .

What would you say you learned from this whole experience ?

[Forteventur]

Foreventur I am very sorry you went through this.  :'(

Do you see the side bar?

Attachment leads to suffering

Detachment leads to freedom

Have you heard of al-anon? That's where I first learned about detachment when I was in a relationship with an alcoholic. It took a very long time to sink in.

Have you ever read any Buddhist teachings? Detachment is a very prevalent idea in that philosophy .

What would you say you learned from this whole experience ?

Thank you, I've read the links from the sidebar.

I feel so stuck, though. I feel that if I let go, detach, I'll never see or hear from her again.

Despite definitely not agreeing with her new relationship (not that's anything of my business, those are her choices - but I still worry about her), and generally considering it a red flag (as many others she had displayed or outright told me), and knowing that our relationship wasnt healthy, I would probably not hesitate much to go back to her again as of now.

Despite saying she hates me, saying that I was disrespectful to her and I lied to her, I feel as if there were so many things I wanted to tell her. I know I'm not perfect and I'm well aware I have a few traits of BPD myself, though the diagnosis was discarded.

I feel she deserves to hear that, yes, I lied to her. I lied because I was so utterly afraid of losing her (the irony) I wanted to avoid any conflict, I wanted to appease her more than anything. I already told her I was sorry for suggesting she had BPD, I understood how disrespectful that had sound.

I felt so guilty for saying her I would do something and not keeping my word that I, in my mind, deserved any kind of awful treatment and outright abuse (which I didnt consider abuse, but actually justified, fair behavior after disappointing her) she threw at me. I told myself I deserved getting blocked, having my privacy invaded, ignored, yelled at, devalued, mocked, name-called, that I deserved to hear "dont touch me" when I tried. I barely got angry when she implied she had someone else! I felt scared, threatened by competition. I thought I had been so bad to her I tried so hard then to convince her I loved her, to convince her to stay, that I could change and be a better person for her, that I would do anything - only to have my pleas crushed by her saying that "in two weeks he had proven to already be better than me." Even if she now says she never cheated on me. I dont know whats true.

What I've learned... .I feel as if I lost a big part of my identity when she left. I dont know what I like, who I truly am, who I was before her, I can only feel my depression crawling back in: that's who I was for some time, too, my illness, until she showed up.

I know I have co-dependency traits. I know I sacrificed myself for her and I'd do it again. I have to find what makes me feel so attracted to her kind of girl, I have to find some self-worth, confidence and self-esteem. I have to convince myself that a common, respectful, healthy relationship would not be "boring" as I think it would, but would be the right thing.

I have been going to therapy for two and a half years already, and never really addressed it except for feeling guilty for other people's problems.

Sorry, I guess, for the rant. Ugh.

[C.Stein]

I know I sacrificed myself for her and I'd do it again. I have to find what makes me feel so attracted to her kind of girl, I have to find some self-worth, confidence and self-esteem. I have to convince myself that a common, respectful, healthy relationship would not be "boring" as I think it would, but would be the right thing.

I think the place to start is deciding you will NEVER sacrifice yourself to her or go back to her if she calls.  You need a firm boundary here IMO.  

In the later months of my relationship I am almost 100% sure my ex was having an affair with my replacement (put it all together just recently).  How far it went I do not know, but regardless she crossed a boundary and there is no coming back across under any circumstances regardless of how much I love her and want her back.

She had the opportunity to be more, to fix the damage she had done, but she choose to be less and run to another man.   This is not a person I want to be in a relationship with.  Do you really want to be in a relationship with someone like your ex?

[Forteventur]

I know I sacrificed myself for her and I'd do it again. I have to find what makes me feel so attracted to her kind of girl, I have to find some self-worth, confidence and self-esteem. I have to convince myself that a common, respectful, healthy relationship would not be "boring" as I think it would, but would be the right thing.

I think the place to start is deciding you will NEVER sacrifice yourself to her or go back to her if she calls.  You need a firm boundary here IMO.  

In the later months of my relationship I am almost 100% sure my ex was having an affair with my replacement (put it all together just recently).  How far it went I do not know, but regardless she crossed a boundary and there is no coming back across under any circumstances regardless of how much I love her and want her back.

She had the opportunity to be more, to fix the damage she had done, but she choose to be less and run to another man.   This is not a person I want to be in a relationship with.  Do you really want to be in a relationship with someone like your ex?

Oh, I know.

See, I thought I had boundaries, but I guess I dont know how/am probably too scared to enforce them and cause conflict and make her leave - that's what feeling extreme guilt did for me. It's either that or she's immune to them. After I found out she had my passwords, I complied and let her continue doing so because, if I didn't, she'd use it to say I was hiding things from her (though when she would go through my phone and find nothing, it'd be because I had already hidden everything, she said, and of course I could barely do the same).

I don't know, I tell myself that and at the same time I feel powerless, despite knowing it's a matter of perseverance and willingness. My rational mind tells me it would be extremely unhealthy, not to say stupid, to go back to her had she made contact, and the heart doesnt want to let go of her, it paints her as infinitely more interesting. Meh

[C.Stein]

I know man, the conflicting feelings are unbelievably difficult to deal with.  I'm dealing with them too, but I have that firm boundary in place and that will never change. 

[Forteventur]

I know man, the conflicting feelings are unbelievably difficult to deal with.  I'm dealing with them too, but I have that firm boundary in place and that will never change.  

She has no regrets, though, so I cant hold that against her. She is 100% right and certain that I caused everything by lying and the entire blame is on me, she has no reason to make contact. She clearly said she hates me a lot despite "thinking about me sometimes" and that she really doesnt want me back, so I doubt I'll even hear from her again, so really I could do would be to go after her.

[C.Stein]

She has no regrets

With my ex, she always had some way to justify or excuse her behavior.  Whether she blame me or something else.  The really infuriating thing she did was when she would redefine certain things so what normally would be unacceptable, would be acceptable (in her eyes).  This allowed her to feel like she didn't do anything wrong, thus avoiding culpability.   It's a lot easier to avoid feeling guilty when you believe your actions were not wrong.

[OutOfEgypt]

I feel so stuck, though. I feel that if I let go, detach, I'll never see or hear from her again.

I know right now you feel like you would go back given the chance, but give it time.  Give it time to heal, and give it time to consider (and work through, if you have a therapist) why it is that you would want to return to a relationship with a person like that.  If there is one thing we all seem to share in common, it is that, at least for a time, we had a destructive pattern, ourselves, of being addicted to a person who will let us close only to hurt us and push us away.  My ex was the same way.  She would get me to let me guard down, to let me in, and then she would use that as an opportunity to hurt me again.  Every time.  Life has to be better than that, no?

[Forteventur]

I feel so stuck, though. I feel that if I let go, detach, I'll never see or hear from her again.

I know right now you feel like you would go back given the chance, but give it time.  Give it time to heal, and give it time to consider (and work through, if you have a therapist) why it is that you would want to return to a relationship with a person like that.  If there is one thing we all seem to share in common, it is that, at least for a time, we had a destructive pattern, ourselves, of being addicted to a person who will let us close only to hurt us and push us away.  My ex was the same way.  She would get me to let me guard down, to let me in, and then she would use that as an opportunity to hurt me again.  Every time.  Life has to be better than that, no?

I will, I have been going to therapy for two years now.

My T asked me what I thought made me so attracted to someone who constantly puts me down, who doesnt recognize me or my efforts, etc, but I shrugged.

(Combine that to that self-critic mentality and you know the result.)

Do you think it would be of any worth to try and explain to my ex the reasoning behind my attitudes, mainly the 'lies' I had told - of committing, promising, to something she demanded of me and failing?

Despite thinking she would answer me with a fit of rage or saying how she doesnt care and hate me, I feel that it would give me a little bit of closure, perhaps.

[OutOfEgypt]

Do you think it would be of any worth to try and explain to my ex the reasoning behind my attitudes, mainly the 'lies' I had told - of committing, promising, to something she demanded of me and failing?

Despite thinking she would answer me with a fit of rage or saying how she doesnt care and hate me, I feel that it would give me a little bit of closure, perhaps.

Personally, I think it wouldn't be.  You have to make your own closure, internally.  I know that we crave that closure, that we get to explain things to them, and there comes to be some kind of abiding peace and "farewell" about it all, but I think it's a myth.  Every opportunity spent trying to talk to my ex or explain things was really just an open door to allow her back in, with bad results.  It's like an addiction, for real.  Wanting things to make sense, wanting that closure or peace, wanting it all to be better in some way, is part of the addiction.  And each time we bite that hook we find ourselves unsatisfied... .and wanting more.  That annoying sense of dissatisfaction, like a puzzle piece that won't fit, is normal... .because this person is not.  But in my experience (and I think others would agree) the process of trying to explain things or get answers from them is an exercise that only prolongs our healing.  This unfortunately isn't like a romantic drama or romantic comedy movie where you can have a heart-to-heart and walk away on pleasant and understanding terms.  I've never known it to happen with a person with BPD.  It's always left with lingering, until *we* cut it off.

You can try, but be prepared that it may not give you the lasting closure you want.  You may feel better for a moment, but it will likely leave pending questions still... .or keeping her coming back to haunt you.

[Forteventur]

Do you think it would be of any worth to try and explain to my ex the reasoning behind my attitudes, mainly the 'lies' I had told - of committing, promising, to something she demanded of me and failing?

Despite thinking she would answer me with a fit of rage or saying how she doesnt care and hate me, I feel that it would give me a little bit of closure, perhaps.

You can try, but be prepared that it may not give you the lasting closure you want.  You may feel better for a moment, but it will likely leave pending questions still... .or keeping her coming back to haunt you.

Yeah, I know I was advised against it, but I did it. It didn't go well.

After calling bull___ on me because if it wasnt for sheer disrespect for her, it was because of a pure lack of shame that I lied.

Then, of course, she called me a repulsive human being because of my views, with which she disagrees and some which I've never claimed to hold, and a sexual fantasy she also wanted to realize (she came to me and said she wanted it too) and which she also liked. Of course she'll never say it, she's actually holding that against me, to attack me.

At least I think I've realized that waiting for her to make contact again is pointless, hopeless. I'm the scum of the world, in her own words, a repulsive and disgusting human being and I make her sick, so she went to talk to someone who was worth the air they breathe and proceeded to ignore me.  :|

[OutOfEgypt]

"scum of the world"  ha

For me, one particular moment of breakthrough was when I became willing to be considered the worst man, and worst lover, on the planet for the sake of leaving that relationship.  I'd rather suck in bed and be a pathetic excuse for a man than be with *that*.