Invalidation

[Depression = 72% of members]

Not sure I can articulate this. Well, I've been think

[steelwork]

Not sure I can articulate this. Well, I've been think

[steelwork]

Sorry--just lost a huge post. Anyhow, been thinking about this letter from a yr and a half ago

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=293728.0

And realized so much of my pain was from being told how to feel (i.e. I had no right to feel blindsided), and told how I DID feel. He said I'd left him dangling but he'd "seen it for what it was" and "wasn't buying it anymore."

I remembered other times he'd done that: kept bringing up a conversation for years--the one in which he'd declared himself "all in," and insisting that my eyes had"gone dead," revealing my feelings. Actually, I was struggling and tortured and in love, but he denied this. I once found something he'd written about that day where he made me into a dead-eyed monster, and when I confronted him , he said he'd written it to "make himself feel better" - i.e. splitting.

Even his idealization hurt. Because he wasn't seeing me for who I was.

I struggle so hard with validation of my feelings due to complicated FOO issues.

I just got that this aspect of the r/s and breakup was EXTREMELY painful and triggering for me.

Does this make sense?

Sorry--typing on phone.   

[steelwork]

I guess not. Yeah, this is pretty specific to my upbringing, I suppose. But I basically go through life questioning my right to feel this way or that way, and I feel like such an odd duck, and I don't know. The fact that I never got a chance to say, "Hey, I am not the a-holeyou're saying I am--all that was about me being paralyzed by my emotional problems"--that's really keeping me stuck. I might actually have to write a letter and send it, because I feel so misunderstood.

[Herodias]

I understand how you can feel like this, but I don't think there is any point to sending letter of how you feel anymore. It is good to vent it here, but he would just be confused by it at this point. It doesn't matter to him anymore I hate to say... .too much time has gone by. Unfortunately we are still trying to untangle the mess we were in and they just go off and try and forget about it... .they don't want to remember or feel what they had or did to us, I believe.  You are feeling like an odd duck, because he was an odd duck- he was trying to make you feel odd. I swear, they rub off their disorder onto us to a point. It' s ok to feel... .Mine made me feel like I was controlling. I still get upset thinking I was... .the fact is, I was trying to control someone that was out of control- Like a parent. Of course he thought I was controlling- He wanted to do whatever he wanted and I was supposed to be ok with it... .See what I mean? He was trying to make me feel bad for how I felt. Any normal person would feel the same way I did. He just wants me to take the blame and make me feel bad if I will let him. Sometimes I do. Just as a friend said to me- "why are you trying to make him out to be normal?" They just are not. You cannot get him to understand or care how you feel. It's all about them. If you reach out now, you are just going to get hurt again or sucked back in... .are you looking for a recycle?  It sounds to me he was projecting allot of his feelings on you. I think they sense we feel a certain way and they turn it into reality for them. It's not true, but they won't accept any other possible thought on the matter. This is where DBT training comes in... .they need to understand that sometimes people are thinking differently than they perceive it to be.  With out that, your efforts are in vain. It is very painful I know. We see what happened very differently. They were not as attached as us in a normal way. They can easily attach to someone else. Flit back and forth to different people... .I really believe this. Mine just said, too much has happened for us to be together right now. I think he thinks I will get over it easily. I wish I could.

[steelwork]

No, not looking for a recycle. Really not. Just want to say my piece.

Damn, and I guess I want to take back my right to my feelings... .I don't even know. Maybe I want an apology. Hahahahaha... . 

[Herodias]

I got an apology... .let me tell you, a little apology from a person that lies doesn't mean a thing. He told his parents that he knows he treated me awful and he will always regret it... .really? Or was that just for them to hear... .I think that is the case. Trust me... .you will feel better with no contact than if you test the waters again and drown. Keep yourself in the one up position or you will take another hit to your ego. Ours are very fragile now. Take care... .

[once removed]

Even his idealization hurt. Because he wasn't seeing me for who I was.

I struggle so hard with validation of my feelings due to complicated FOO issues.

I just got that this aspect of the r/s and breakup was EXTREMELY painful and triggering for me.

Does this make sense?

certainly it does. not to minimize how it effects you uniquely, but no one likes to be invalidated. especially since ive learned about validation, i notice how triggering it can be to feel invalidated, hell, its a huge pet peeve to hear or read someone invalidate someone else even if im not involved. i JADE in my head, like crazy. i suspect if it were me in your shoes, thats exactly what id do, for an extended period of time, and correcting the record (i hate to feel misunderstood) is an urge/anger id feel intensely. i could tell myself all day that its one persons opinion and that it doesnt define me, or that its one persons distorted opinion; it wouldnt help until it actually sank in. i suspect, the more you grow, and build the future you dream of, the more it will sink in.

so i think youve made an insightful, and valuable connection, as it sounds like you spent a great deal of this relationship being invalidated. and yes, even idealization can make a person feel objectified - it tends to make me uncomfortable. we want to be loved for who we are, all of who we are. 

[WoundedBibi]

Sorry--just lost a huge post. Anyhow, been thinking about this letter from a yr and a half ago

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=293728.0

And realized so much of my pain was from being told how to feel (i.e. I had no right to feel blindsided), and told how I DID feel. He said I'd left him dangling but he'd "seen it for what it was" and "wasn't buying it anymore."

I remembered other times he'd done that: kept bringing up a conversation for years--the one in which he'd declared himself "all in," and insisting that my eyes had"gone dead," revealing my feelings. Actually, I was struggling and tortured and in love, but he denied this. I once found something he'd written about that day where he made me into a dead-eyed monster, and when I confronted him , he said he'd written it to "make himself feel better" - i.e. splitting.

Even his idealization hurt. Because he wasn't seeing me for who I was.

I struggle so hard with validation of my feelings due to complicated FOO issues.

I just got that this aspect of the r/s and breakup was EXTREMELY painful and triggering for me.

Does this make sense?

Sorry--typing on phone.   

It does make sense.

I was told how to feel as a child. Or how not to feel.

His idealization made me feel uncomfortable. The devaluation started as soon as the relationship did (for me, I think the relationship started earlier for him).

And when his attempt to recycle me didn't go his way because I put up boundaries he back pedaled and said I didn't know what love was anyway. And explaining it was pointless.

And after the attempt at friendship went sour because I needed closure and he turned it into a smear campaign and full blown vendetta to get me isolated, and after he was stupid enough to get his ass fired and went into full narcisstic collapse he put up a blog and wrote I am a dead-eyed monster with an empty heart (he also devalued his friends on it but either they have not read it, or forgiven him or have let it pass).

Apart from the very start it was invalidation all the way.

I know I did some too after we were over, a stupid remark about shoes, as I didn't know how to respond anymore and had gone into defensive mode. Still wrong.

[steelwork]

Thank you for your responses. I think you are right, BH: he would be confused by that kind of communication at this point, and probably if he had the capacity to see it from my perspective he would have already. Our history is set in stone, and it is written to comport with his feelings (which, of course, = facts).

Whenever I become sure I want to contact him to get something off my chest, a day or two later I'm glad I didn't. This is a very good thing to remember. Ultimately, over time, it matters less and less to me what he thinks, even if there are occasional spikes of caring about it.

All of which is to say that I'm in a somewhat better place today. If he needs to think I was playing games with him in order to move on, well, I guess that's what he needs.