Do pwBPD idealize other people outside of perspective lovers?

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

I ask this question because over the years of off and on separation from my wife.  When she left if it wasn't for the next prospective lover, she also seemed to attach to people who had children.  My wife desperately wanted children after abandoning her first born and leaving her with her ex-husband (before me), but that's a whole other story.  I noticed that if she didn't have another lover lined up, she either moved in with friends that had young children or spent a lot of time with friends that did.  When I would see her, she would often have long conversations about her friend's children, while having little to say about the friend them-self. 

During our first separation she spend almost everyday with a single mother friend who had two children under 10 and she seemed to really connect with the youngest girl.  After about a year, she suddenly disconnected from this friend and spent no time at all.  The extremes were strange to me, so I constantly asked about it over the years, as to what happened. My wife never had an answer.  One day the friend/co-worker had a going away party and my wife didn't go, but I did.  I finally got to ask the friend what happened.  She couldn't answer it either, but she made the commit that, "Sometimes I felt XXXX (my wife) was really at my house to see my kids, more than me." <hear the thunder crash in the background>

We had two more separations after that. Both times she ran to another friends house, who was married with two children.  She seemed to be really attached to their two year old daughter and same thing, she would talk none stop about this kid.  It seemed, especially the second time that she really targeted this family.  She made an excuse to leave me suddenly, ran to their house and told  them a sob story, they were short on money and welcoming of what seemed like free child care and she moved in with them for eight months.  After that she moved out. Although they were her world it seemed during that time (wanted little to do with me most of the time) and she was fully enthralled in their lives and activities, she seldom has seen them since.

Now she has found a boyfriend who is a single father sharing split custody and has recently posted pics of all three of them together.  I honestly don't know much about this newest situation, as we are not on speaking terms and I'm trying to detach. As I'm writing this, I never thought about all of the kids are girls and her only child was a girl.

Just wanted to know the thoughts from anyone and their experiences on this subject.

[RealizationBPD]

I ask this question because over the years of off and on separation from my wife.  When she left if it wasn't for the next prospective lover, she also seemed to attach to people who had children.  My wife desperately wanted children after abandoning her first born and leaving her with her ex-husband (before me), but that's a whole other story.  I noticed that if she didn't have another lover lined up, she either moved in with friends that had young children or spent a lot of time with friends that did.  When I would see her, she would often have long conversations about her friend's children, while having little to say about the friend them-self. 

During our first separation she spend almost everyday with a single mother friend who had two children under 10 and she seemed to really connect with the youngest girl.  After about a year, she suddenly disconnected from this friend and spent no time at all.  The extremes were strange to me, so I constantly asked about it over the years, as to what happened. My wife never had an answer.  One day the friend/co-worker had a going away party and my wife didn't go, but I did.  I finally got to ask the friend what happened.  She couldn't answer it either, but she made the commit that, "Sometimes I felt XXXX (my wife) was really at my house to see my kids, more than me." <hear the thunder crash in the background>

We had two more separations after that. Both times she ran to another friends house, who was married with two children.  She seemed to be really attached to their two year old daughter and same thing, she would talk none stop about this kid.  It seemed, especially the second time that she really targeted this family.  She made an excuse to leave me suddenly, ran to their house and told  them a sob story, they were short on money and welcoming of what seemed like free child care and she moved in with them for eight months.  After that she moved out. Although they were her world it seemed during that time (wanted little to do with me most of the time) and she was fully enthralled in their lives and activities, she seldom has seen them since.

Now she has found a boyfriend who is a single father sharing split custody and has recently posted pics of all three of them together.  I honestly don't know much about this newest situation, as we are not on speaking terms and I'm trying to detach. As I'm writing this, I never thought about all of the kids are girls and her only child was a girl.

Just wanted to know the thoughts from anyone and their experiences on this subject.

[Turkish]

My mother was a "waif-rescuer" literally.  I was the first Waif, as she rescued me from foster care by adopting me.

She moved a few families,  down on their luck, into her house when I was little.  Everyone got along splendidly until the breakdown. It confused me. The last was in reverse,  and she moved is from California to Texas to live with two guys to start a new life.  That lasted 2.5 weeks before they kicked is onto the streets of Houston. We slept in the car one night,  in a Datsun B-210, with 10 Llassa Apsos, a small litter of puppies beneath my feet.  Spent the next night in a homeless shelter, then drove back to California  (one other night in the car on the way). I was 13, the summer before I entered high school. 

After I moved out on my 18th birthday,  my mom would find "proxy daughters" who were single mothers.  I once made the mistake of commenting, "'Jane' is kind of a flake." My mother jumped down my throat. A year later, my mom said,  "you know,  Jane is kind of a flake."

My mom hooked me up with another single mother at her work. The woman was nice on the phone, laughed at my jokes. The blind date was a disaster there was a cultural issue here where the woman was extremely pressured by her family not to date outside of her culture at risk of being disowned even though the baby daddy from the same culture was a beater and cheater.  Yeah. Major. My mother was trying to rescue her by using me as a proxy.

There was another family who lived on her property. That "daughter" split from the father of their child, then slashed the head of a bf with a knifeb in a drunken rage.  Did at least 5 years in state prison. Went back to my mom to use her and my mom still had trouble asserting boundaries. 

There was another family of gypsy-like people (my mother later referred to them as Travelers though ethnically they were not,  but behavior-wise they kind of were). I thought age was going to disown me for that woman and her kids.  This was a year before I met my uBPDx, about 2006. Same as 1980: it turned almost overnight.  The 14 year old kid raised a hammer on my mom.  They called the cops.  His mom,  which i found out later was really his older sister,  was at a loss,  too. My mom called me (120 miles away) to rescue her.  I got a "posse" of my friends to strongly encourage them to move out.  The young woman was pulling a Single White Female (like the movie), "I know my rights as a tenant!" We didn't break any laws or threaten,  but were firm that they had to leave. That lady was BPD-Ish, too. My mother's attachment was not only her,  but grandkids which made her feel valued. I had failed her up unto this point.

In the past 5 years, there have been more idealization and the opposite.  Which brings me to my ex... .

My mom wanted to bond with her in the same way,  but my ex was very close to her mother.  My T would chastise me here on using the term "enmeshment" because that implies a pathology,  but it really was that.  My ex all but telegraphed and even told me without using that term.  My mother and my ex never hit it off from the beginning.  My ex didn't need a mother figure.  My mom couldn't grasp this.

At the core of BPD is the need to be valued (feel loved). This is no different from any of us,  but with a pwBPD, this desire cuts so deep emotionally, that they can overlook obvious red flags like my mother (and me), and the abandonment fears result in splitting idealized entities black based upon perceived abandonment or devaluation. It gives rise to the tumultuous relationships.

[RealizationBPD]

Turkish,

Thank you for taking the time to tell your story.  This topic is one of the most mind blowing parts of this horrible journey I have taken. This women's sudden need to chase the next sporadic fantasy.  The lover is an easy thing to make sense of, but the other people--in my BPD's case, pwChildren is perplexing. 

[roberto516]

I believe I've seen it as well. She really idealized her yoga. As for people any spiritual guru, doctor, motivational speaker or her therapist. They could do no wrong. I remember I'd tell her something and she'd dismiss it. Then her therapist would say it or she'd hear it at a training she went to and she'd come back praising the person for the insight they gave her. I can't make it up .

I'm not sure if that's the same as idealizing in the sense of how they idealized us in the beginning. But I see the similarities.

[HopinAndPrayin]

My understanding is yes, the ID&:) is not reserved just for the current lover.  With my STBXHwBPD, he did this with his father, his sister, friends, bosses.  It's not optional.  It's a function of how their brain is formed.  It's the black and white thinking of a child because their brains have not evolved past the development of ~3 year olds.  No judgment with that statement, just MRI feedback.

I forget where I read this, but there's also something about children not yet having their own fully formed personalities that also attract BPDs. The BPD can be idealized by the child and because there is no conflict with another full personality in the child, the BPD can feel more "attachment" (and less conflict at having to resolve personality differences).  The "attachment" isn't really attachment in the way nons experience it.  My guess is I found that in something about BPD mothers, which I also have.  Funny how childhood experiences prime you for adult repetition, perhaps because we can't recognize that it is not healthy without a frame of reference for healthy?

[flourdust]

I've seen the black and white thinking in other relationships. My ex would idealize friends, co-workers, and bosses, especially when they were new to her. They were just as easily split black, which led to bitter breakups with friends and serious problems (and firings) in her work environments.

[roberto516]

I do have a story about the work area split black which I think could paint a picture (at least in my situation). One of our coworkers who was in our little circle of friends had let it be known that he had been talking to our former coworker, her ex. She got very mad at him and basically bullied him until he unfriended the ex. Another one our coworkers changed her profile picture (it was my ex and her in it). My ex bullied her into changing the picture back. And I didn't see any   there .

One day our boss made it known that a specific type of email had to be sent by 2:30 pm. My ex then sent a bunch of emails after that time. Our boss, who wasn't the most patient human being with her anger, told my ex to never do that again. I still remember when we met at her place after work and she immediately blocked our boss on facebook for it.

Now that I think about it I remember some of our  nursing department began to dislike her .

Last one . When she moved to another location with our company her new boss was not as lax as our former boss. He expected her to be on time, leave on time, not take long lunch breaks, not be on the phone at work, etc. She battled him for so long on that passive aggressively. She told me early on how she had a conversation with him and told him "I don't think I can work here. I don't think I can do it, etc. etc." Guess what happened? He eased up a little bit on his boundaries. But until he did that, and even when he stayed firm with some, she really didn't like him at all. One of her other coworkers there apparently made a playful joke to my ex. My ex then called me frantically crying in her office saying that her co-workers were making fun of her and she "hates it here". This led to that person giving an apology to her the next day. I can't imagine what that tiny office she worked at really thought of her.

Then after the end of the relationship I made a foolish comment that I was debating moving in with one of our former coworkers (who is gay) because he had just bought a house and the rent he was offering was cheap. Her response? Unfriended him and another coworker (who I had told her early on let me know that we might not be a good match). When we got back together for the recycle  she made some comment about "Everyone needs a gay friend. I had (insert coworkers name) as a friend. But you (meaning me) ruined that."

Sorry for the rant. Thought I'd give a detailed/hindsight explanation of what I witnessed with painting black for me.

[Tattoobunny]

Hi. I found this also, the black white thinking, in my case my x would, what looked like idolisation but in fact was all about controle. He would meet some one and practically move in with them, constantly talk about them, they couldn't do wrong. When asked what was so special about said person the reply would be "they listen to me" , that translates as I can manipulate them to do what I want them too. He would even let it slip that he nearly got them were he wants them,when asked what does that mean the reply ,they listening to me and doing what I say.
His last friend he idolized ,on a night drinking at ours. He came out with a sex bord game and asked his new buddy if he wanted to play it, obviously he said no and we both pointed out that its for couples and you don't ask ya mate to play sex games. I'm still very confused on that one and obviously I was not allowed to bring it up.