18 years and barely hanging on

[Woodchuck]

I found this website while seeking information about forgiveness and BPD.  I have suspected that my wife has been dealing with a personality disorder for several years.  While researching how to deal with someone that is constantly giving you the silent treatment about 8 years ago, I stumbled across the symptoms for NPD and as I read down the list everything suddenly seemed to make sense.  We had struggled for 10 years to make things work and I was excited that I found something that could be the answer.  In my excitement combined with my lack of knowledge, I took the info to her and you can imagine how that went over.  From that point, I started doing more reading and research, reading through the Walking on Eggshells book and Should I Stay or Should I Go book as well as a few others.  I have never addressed the personality disorder since then as I believe it is futile.  My wife is an RN and therefore believes that she can self diagnose.  She has gone to the dr on a few occasions and been prescribed an antidepressant which she did not tell me about until after she stopped taking after a few weeks.  She claimed that the meds did nothing but make her sick.  She has decided that her diagnosis is 'situational depression' and that is due to me and ways that I have wronged her.  Things took another interesting turn this week when she sent me a text message with a link to a BPD online test.  She told me that I should take it and see what I score.  She also informed me that she took it and the score she received showed that she did not have BPD.  I told her that the online tests were more or less a waste of time as they can be manipulated to give whatever results you want.  She told me that there is definitely something wrong with me and she based that on me being moody and communicating that I feel like I don't seem to fit in at work etc.  According to her that is not normal and a sign of BPD.  She went on to ask me what my biggest fear is and would not accept the answer that I don't really have a fear of anything at the moment.  She also communicated that I am definitely the problem and that if I want things to work that I need to be the one to change.  I told her that we both need to focus on ourselves and what we can do to change.  She replied that she couldn't do anything to change the way things were... .This is where we are at now... .Now on to how everything started, at least from my perspective... .

We met online in Dec 1998.  We both lived in different states but had a bit in common.  We both had four siblings and grew up being homeschooled.  We also found out that we grew up about 10 minutes apart from each other.  I found her while looking for people from my home town to talk to.  I had just joined the military and was a bit homesick.  We had a great friendship and she told me she had never been in a relationship with anyone and did not plan on getting married.  I did not have any romantic interest in her but enjoyed her friendship as she seemed to be a kindred spirit and could understand me due to our similar upbringing.  She was also very empathetic to the conflict that I had with my parents over joining the military and other life choices.  In fact that conflict seemed to form a strange but strong bond.  Within a few months, probably 4 or so, she told me that she had a confession and that she was very scared.  She told me that she was in love with me but didn't want to be in love with me.  She said she was scared to feel that way.  I was scheduled to be sent overseas for a year and took time off to see family before I left.  We met for the first time and spent a few hours together before I left for a year.  Shortly after getting settled in at my new location, she informed me that she either wanted a serious(romantic) relationship or no relationship.  She stated she did not want to play games.  I had been in a relationship with someone that had recently told me that they were ending things with me because they couldn't wait a year for me to return.  I did not want to lose her friendship and I found her very attractive both physically as well as her personality so I agreed to begin a romantic relationship with her.  We had spent a total of 10 hours or so of actual time together.  The rest of the time had been spent either chatting online or on the phone.  We decided to get married during my trip back at the halfway point of my year tour.  When we informed my parents, they did not approve at all.  They told her that I was not mature enough to get married etc.  (which was true as I look back).  Neither of us listened to what they had to say.  When both of our parents go together, her mother told my parents that it was pointless to try to tell her anything as she was going to do what she wanted to do.  We pushed through and planned the wedding.  She bore the brunt of my parents disapproval which could be quite harsh and overstepping their bounds.  As I look back now, almost 20 years later, I understand that their intentions were right and that is what matters.  I am the oldest child and they had never been through letting a child go as they grow up and had always been very strict and over protective.  I made it home for the wedding and was met with more conflict with my parents as they showed their displeasure.  The night before the wedding, I felt like I did not want to go through with the wedding and just wanted to leave.  I decided to stay as I did not want to let everyone down that had planned to attend.  The day of the wedding, my dad approached me and told me that from this point forward that we would have their full support.  That floored me.  After the wedding ceremony, we left for our honeymoon location which was a cabin in the woods.  After getting settled in, I decided to go for a walk as I felt overwhelmed with everything.  I did not tell her I was going.  I was gone for a few hours.  When I got back, she was furious with me for taking off without talking to her.  In her words I abandoned her in a strange place without any way to leave (the car had a manual transmission which she did not know how to operate).  I apologized and attempted to explain but she would hear none of it.  She eventually settled down and the rest of the time was mostly pleasant and uneventful.  The only other part that sticks in my mind is her response after we made love for the first time.  Her response was, 'That is it, that is what I waited for?'  That crushed me.  After the honeymoon, we settled down together in an apartment and everything was more or less normal.  We had our conflicts but life was overall good.  About a year into our marriage, I was selected to deploy to the Middle East.  While gone, she informed me that she wanted to have a baby.  She had been adamant up to that point that she did not want children.  That had been more than ok with me as I was scared of not being a good father.  I communicated several times that I was not comfortable with the idea but she told me that she wanted to have a piece of me to keep with her in the event that I died during a deployment (looking back, this was another fear of abandonment issue).  I eventually relented and we started to try for a baby when I returned.  The sex was amazing as she was very turned on by the idea of becoming pregnant.  Around this time, I do not recall if it was before or after having our son, I decided that the anger and resentment that I had been carrying around towards my parents was not healthy or beneficial for anyone and I chose to let things go.  When I informed my wife of this, she became very angry.  Today she will tell you that she was/is angry because she feels that I expected her to feel the same way, which to some extent is probably true.  She stated that she did not like my parents and did not want a relationship with them.  This combined with the arrival of our son is where things began to go downhill.  After our son was born, she became a different person in many regards.  She was very protective of him to the point that she was the only one that could take care of him.  As many fathers tend to feel, I felt a bit 'abandoned' as all of her attention was now on our son.  After several months, she finally agreed to go out for the night and leave our son with me. According to her, it was at this point that I abandoned her and left her to raise our son on her own.  The way that I feel is that I was not allowed to participate, that she viewed our son as hers and I was just kind of there.  On one occasion, my parents invited us to go out for a boat ride.  She did not want to go but I wanted to take our son.  She was completely against me taking him.  It would have been better for me to leave him with her, however I was tired of feeling controlled and decided to take him anyway.  This choice resulted in a large piece of wood being thrown through the windshield of our other car. Within a year, I was selected for a different assignment and she stated that she was going to stay where we had been, that she did not want to continue a relationship with me.  I did not want to lose contact with my son and attempted to convince her to go.  As time drew closer to move, she changed her mind and decided to go with me.  I threw myself into my new job and spent too much time at work trying to make an impression and fast track my promotion.  This made her feel abandoned yet again and understandably so.  We grew further and further apart.  We met with a few marriage counselors but nothing seemed to make anything better.  I met someone online in one of my college classes and we got to talking.  She lived in the local area and as we talked over a few weeks I opened up about how bad things were at home.  That obviously was a huge mistake.  We ended up meeting for coffee and then met a few more times to spend time together over the next week or so.  This resulted in sleeping with her.  I was immediately filled with guilt and remorse.  I cut off contact with her the next day and went to my wife and confessed what I had done.  She was understandably livid.  I did and always have taken 100% responsibility for my infidelity and have not even hinted at her bearing any responsibility for my actions.  No matter how bad things were or how done I believed our relationship was, there is no excuse or way to justify my actions.  According to her, she had planned to stay until our daughter was born (she was a few months pregnant) and then give her up for adoption and take our son and move back home.  She claims that she changed her mind because God visited her in a dream and told her to stay.  We went to several marriage counselors but none of them really helped.  Everything was ok until they told her that she needed to change something or look at something from a different perspective.  After that, all communication would be cut off with that counselor and we would look for a different one.  Throughout this time, things between her and I am my parents had never mended but only become worse.  It got to the point where she told me that I needed to choose them or her.  If I chose her, I would cease any contact with them forever.  I pushed back and told her that I did not feel that was right.  She eventually, relented a little and said that I could have monitored phone calls and emails with them and supervised visits in a neutral location.  I continued to push back and she told me that she would not monitor my emails or phone calls.  She justified this with the Bible verse that says that a man leaves his father and mother and cleaves to his wife.  I told her that I did not feel this was right and would never ask her to do anything like that.  She told me that I was selfish and that if I asked her to choose between me and our children and our children were over 18, she would choose me.  I told her that I would never put her in that position.  She eventually backed down after several months.  The ups and downs continued with most of the time being either down or somewhere in the middle.  As our son got to school age, I told her that I thought that we should put him in school.  She had taught him to read by the time he was around four and said that she could do a better job than a school and refused to entertain the idea.  The next year she agreed to put him in school but pulled him out after a few months due to believing that they were not doing a good job.  I had no say in the matter.  This school issue continued for several years.  I did what I could to help out with teaching them but was told that I was not supportive.  During this time, I also had control issues that I needed to work through.  I tried to stop her from leaving the house on more than one occasion.  At one point she tried to leave with the children telling me that she wanted to crash the car into a wall and die.  I called the police and they tracked her down and spoke with her.  They never came to the house and talked to me.  She now claims that she is the one that called the police and that is the reason that I was not selected for the law enforcement job that I applied for a few years later.  Things continued along the same path for the next few years.  I went on a few deployments and each time she would tell me that she wouldn't miss me but then change her tune after I was gone for a few weeks.  She had communicated that her love language was words of affirmation and I made a very concerted effort to try to meet this need.  During my last 6 month deployment, I made a goal of sending a card or letter every day and came close to meeting that goal.  I poured my heart out in many of them, apologizing for all all the mistakes I had made, going into very specific detail (4+ pages long) or listing out everything I appreciated or loved about her.  This made things more calm but I felt/feel like there was almost nothing in return.  I would not say that she never attempted or attempts to meet my needs but does so when it is convenient or benefits her or so it seems to me.  Months after getting back, she told me that my letters and words are worthless.  Fast-forwarding to the current day as the message length limit draws near, we are sleeping in separate rooms most of the time.  The first time I chose to sleep in a different room, she told me that it was very hurtful and that she felt abandoned.  I purposed not to do that again and told her that I would not.  During our next bout, I told her that I was choosing to sleep in bed with her because I loved her and wanted to respect her feelings.  Her response was that she did not care where I slept.  If I try to talk to her about anything when there is a disagreement, she tells me that she does not want to talk and wants to be left alone.  I ask for a time frame and she refuses to give a time frame.  We have gone weeks without talking.  I have expressed that the silence is extremely hurtful to which she replies that it is my fault and she is not responsible for my feelings.  She believes that I deserve all the hurt that I receive as consequences for my transgressions against her.  Instead of saying that she is sorry that she hurt me or the kids, her 'apology is that she is sorry that I/we choose to feel hurt or something along that line.  Either that or she is not sorry because whatever she said or did was because of something that was done to her and justified.  I went to our pastor a few months ago to seek counsel.  I did not tell her that I was going as I did not  want her to alienate herself from the church.  She ended up finding out and we both went and talked to him.  She voiced that me going and talking behind her back was completely wrong and that I was not to talk to anyone without her permission or being present.  For some reason, the pastor decided to ask me how I would feel if she died.  I responded that I had no idea, I hadn't really thought about it.  When he asked her, she immediately responded that she would feel relieved... .

[Woodchuck]

Just to finish up... .I expressed how hurtful that was.  I had/have struggled with suicidal thoughts for most of my life.  I have never acted on them but always sought help.  Her saying that though, made me want to act on it as it seemed that would make her happy.  She told me that it was my fault that she felt that way and that she was not sorry at all and that I was lying in my response to the pastor.  I told her that would not feel relieved if for no other reason than I don't want the kids to lose their mom.  That would be devastating.A few weeks after that she attempted to call my boss and my dr to tell them that I was suicidal when I had not said anything other than I wish that I could die so she could be relieved.  She claimed that she called them so that if I did hurt myself, she could have a clear conscience.  It feels more like she was clearing the way for me to hurt myself rather than really caring about me.    I will end things here.  I am sure there is a large amount that I have left out.  I know that this is only seeing one side of things and that she would probably paint a somewhat different picture.  I know I am not perfect and I have done things that I are extremely hurtful and that the damage from some of my choices may never be repaired.  However, I do not understand how we can make things work if the past, from the walk I took on our honeymoon to my affair are continued to be used as ammunition against me.  In my heart, I believe I want to leave but I do not want to leave my children and I do not want to make them have to choose between their mother and I.  I am worn out from not being able to get anything right except on rare occasions. I am tired of hearing that she does not need me or want me to do anything.  I am tired of hearing that if her wants or needs conflict with mine that hers take priority or that I have the wants or needs that I have because I want her to be like my mother.  I am tired of my wants or needs being invalidated to the point that I don't even ask for anything or if I muster the courage to, I feel guilty for asking.  I am tired of going from one counselor to another (probably close to a dozen now) and reliving the last eighteen years and nothing fruitful coming out of it.  I am tired of hearing that I don't do anything and that she does everything when in reality that is not even close to true.  I am the breadwinner and I also take care of all the finances, most of the grocery shopping and a good bit of the house work and all the house and vehicle maintenance.  I also get as involved as I can with the kids and their school etc.  None of it is ever enough.  There is always fault with it somehow.  I was diagnosed by my dr with a vitamin deficiency a few months ago and she prescribed some homeopathic supplements for me to take.  My wife, being a nurse, started doing her research and ended up telling me that the dr didn't know what she was talking about and that I should not listen to her but instead follow what she had found in her research online.  This is how most things with others tend to go.  She knows best based on her research or experience.  I am tired and feel lost and don't know what to do.  What makes it even worse is as I read more about personality disorders and see that I can relate to some of the symptoms, I have to wonder if maybe she is right... .maybe I do have a disorder

[Cat Familiar]

Hi Woodchuck,
Wow! You're dealing with a lot! You sound exhausted. We understand how difficult it is to have a spouse with a personality disorder. Have you read the info on the side bar to the right of this page?

There's a lot of great information on this site. It's really helped me with my marriage.

The question you're probably contemplating is whether or not you want to remain with your wife, and that's certainly a valid question. If you do, there's a lot to learn here about how to communicate in ways that soothe conflict and open communication channels. It's learning a different style than how we can talk with emotionally healthy people and it takes practice, but I can assure you it's worth it!

Please keep posting and read other people's accounts. You are not alone!

 
Cat

[Red5]

Hello and Welcome Woodchuck,

You have found a good and safe place to come to and vent your frustrations, as well learn more about BPD, and there is certainly a lot to learn.

As I read your post, I have to tell you, I can relate to each and every point you speak of, as it pertains to what you have experienced over the course of your entire relationship with your wife (pw/BPD suspected).

I know that’s a lot to say, but is the truth, I too have struggled through my entire marriage, as well the courtship phase… when I found BPDfam, I was at my last inch of rope, and I was ready to give it up, I had no idea of what to do, I was beaten down, and out of any sense of hope that anything could be salvaged.

But then I started to learn more and more about BPD, its causes (suspected), and the many facets of BPD behaviors that I was experiencing, yes, as I read your post, it’s like reading one of my very first posts here well over a year and a half ago now.

In fact, I made a list, a checklist as it were of what I was experiencing, and it resonates in my head again, after reading your first post here.

Here is a link to that post-> https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=304834.0;all

As I said, I have learnt so much here on this website, there are so many links, and things to read, as you have been doing it sounds like, that said, I think that you are now pretty knowledgeable in the aspects of BPD, and what it means to be in a relationship, marriage, long-term with a pw/BPD, either diagnosed or not.

Knowledge is huge, the more you learn, the more you will be able to deploy the tools to be able to survive in your marriage, whether you stay or go, that’s going to be up to you, and I can certainly understand about the responsibility of being a father, and a caretaker, provider to your children, there is a lot more to my story in this regards, I won’t go into now.

Just let me say in closing, that you are certainly not alone, there are countless people here who are going through the exact same thing as you in real time.

Keep posting, there will be others to come along to offer their support to you, and some sound advice as well.

In closing, I want to thank you for your service, not only in the military, but your service as it pertains to being a father, a husband, and taking care of your children, your family… I know that your path is not an easy one, and you have been “carrying this pack” for a long time now… I have walked this same path myself… also for many years now too, I too was in the service, for almost half my life, and I am fifty-two now… and what you wrote about deployments;… I can relate whole heartedly to that as well,

Take care Woodchuck, and keep on posting, and tell us more as you can,

Kind regards, Red5

[AskingWhy]

Woodchuck, I think Red5 gives a great look into the behaviour of what it's like to be married to a pwBPD.

Please come back and let us know your insights.  It's a safe place here to share and learn.

[Woodchuck]

Cat,
Thank you!  It is nice to not feel alone!  I have started to read many different articles on the site and have found them very informative.  Hopefully they are helpful.  I will keep posting as I have much more that keeps coming to mind.

Woodchuck

Hi Woodchuck,
Wow! You're dealing with a lot! You sound exhausted. We understand how difficult it is to have a spouse with a personality disorder. Have you read the info on the side bar to the right of this page?

There's a lot of great information on this site. It's really helped me with my marriage.

The question you're probably contemplating is whether or not you want to remain with your wife, and that's certainly a valid question. If you do, there's a lot to learn here about how to communicate in ways that soothe conflict and open communication channels. It's learning a different style than how we can talk with emotionally healthy people and it takes practice, but I can assure you it's worth it!

Please keep posting and read other people's accounts. You are not alone!

 
Cat

[Woodchuck]

Red,
I read through your post that you linked to and we do have quite a bit in common.  I am really hoping that the people and the info help with getting us on a good track but part of me feels that we are too far gone.  Only time will tell.  It is nice to see/hear that I am not the only one going through this.

Woodchuck

Hello and Welcome Woodchuck,

You have found a good and safe place to come to and vent your frustrations, as well learn more about BPD, and there is certainly a lot to learn.

As I read your post, I have to tell you, I can relate to each and every point you speak of, as it pertains to what you have experienced over the course of your entire relationship with your wife (pw/BPD suspected).

I know that’s a lot to say, but is the truth, I too have struggled through my entire marriage, as well the courtship phase … when I found BPDfam, I was at my last inch of rope, and I was ready to give it up, I had no idea of what to do, I was beaten down, and out of any sense of hope that anything could be salvaged.

But then I started to learn more and more about BPD, its causes (suspected), and the many facets of BPD behaviors that I was experiencing, … yes, as I read your post, it’s like reading one of my very first posts here well over a year and a half ago now.

In fact, I made a list, … a checklist as it were of what I was experiencing, and it resonates in my head again, after reading your first post here.

Here is a link to that post-> https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=304834.0;all

As I said, I have learnt so much here on this website, there are so many links, and things to read, as you have been doing it sounds like, that said, I think that you are now pretty knowledgeable in the aspects of BPD, and what it means to be in a relationship, marriage, long-term with a pw/BPD, either diagnosed or not.

Knowledge is huge, the more you learn, the more you will be able to deploy the tools to be able to survive in your marriage, … whether you stay or go, that’s going to be up to you, and I can certainly understand about the responsibility of being a father, and a caretaker, provider to your children, … there is a lot more to my story in this regards, I won’t go into now.

Just let me say in closing, that you are certainly not alone, there are countless people here who are going through the exact same thing as you in real time.

Keep posting, there will be others to come along to offer their support to you, and some sound advice as well.

In closing, I want to thank you for your service, not only in the military, but your service as it pertains to being a father, a husband, and taking care of your children, … your family … I know that your path is not an easy one, and you have been “carrying this pack” for a long time now … I have walked this same path myself … also for many years now too, … I too was in the service, for almost half my life, and I am fifty-two now … and what you wrote about deployments; … I can relate whole heartedly to that as well, …

Take care Woodchuck, and keep on posting, and tell us more as you can,

Kind regards, Red5